Plants and mold and bacteria, oh my! (was: Re: Cigarette Smok...

[Guest guest]

,

Your comments are timely about ozone and mold. Let me send you to

California Air Resources Board and California Assembly Bill AB 2276 Air

Cleaning Regulation that limits the ozone generated by air cleaning devices in

order to protect public health. http://www.arb.ca.gov/research/indoor/aircleaners/aircleaners.htm

Moffett

From:

iequality [mailto:iequality ] On Behalf Of gary rosen

Sent: Tuesday, December 05, 2006

5:50 PM

To: iequality

Subject: Re: Plants

and mold and bacteria, oh my! (was: Re: Cigarette Smok...

There is absolutely no scientific evididence that I have seen that

ozone is useful in mold remediation. If there are any scientific studies

to the contrary, please give me the references and I will review.

Rosen, Ph.D.

Re: Plants and mold and bacteria, oh my! (was: Re:

Cigarette Smok...

In a message

dated 12/5/2006 4:46:32 PM Eastern Standard Time, po.youngcomcast (DOT) net writes:

Group,

Look at

the pictures. This is what high concentrations of ozone will do to stachy

and asp. When you use enough UV ozone generators and PPE, you can achieve

this safely.

Pam Young

GP Air

Restoration of Medallion Healthy Homes

Pam,

What do high concentrations of ozone do to the seals in those double pane

windows, and how do you know? Don't good things get oxidized along with

the bad things?

Are you saying that there is good ozone and bad ozone depending on how it is

generated, or that the by-products of corona discharge generated ozone cause

problems that " pure " ozone doesn't cause?

Steve Temes

Need a quick answer? Get one in minutes from people who know. Ask your

question on Yahoo!

Answers.

[Guest guest]

Pam,

You seem to be suggesting that ozone is

non-corrosive.  Please go over the chemistry

for me because that doesn’t jive with what I learned. I’m sure

I’m just confused.  While you may

be right that some forms of ozone generation are likely to generate less oxides

of nitrogen, I don’t see how an unstable hyper-oxide does not cause oxidation. 

So what does happen when ozone is in

contact with metals, or window gaskets? 

I’d love to see some of your equations.

I am one that believes there are limited

applications for ozone in this industry and have used it several times in very

specific applications with positive results.  

Mark Doughty

Plants and mold and bacteria, oh my! (was: Re:

Cigarette Smok...

Steve,

Yes, your statement regarding good ozone and bad ozone is correct in

that corona discharge created ozone also produces nitrogen oxides

which create the corrosive effects, however

" clean ozone " via UV

generation does not produce the same nitrogens.

As far as the window seals, depending upon what they are made of,

pure rubber products exposed to high concentrations of ozone for

extended periods of time are still subject to some oxidation.

However, with our collective experience of Medallion Healthy Homes

companies, we have never had an issue with window seals, computer

products, or any other type of appliance when following the

methodology for treatment. We do not have any written proof, other

than 6 yrs. experience and follow up with customers for satisfaction

of our services.

Pam Young, Co-owner and assistant to

Gerald Young

GP Air Restoration of Medallion Healthy Homes

1-

>

> In a message dated 12/5/2006 4:46:32 PM Eastern Standard Time,

> po.young@... writes:

> > Group,

> >

> > Look at the pictures. This is what high concentrations of ozone

will do to

> > stachy and asp. When you use enough UV

ozone generators and PPE,

you can

> > achieve this safely.

> >

> > Pam Young

> > GP Air Restoration of Medallion Healthy Homes

> >

> Pam,

>

> What do high concentrations of ozone do to the seals in those

double pane

> windows, and how do you know? Don't good things get oxidized along

with the bad

> things?

>

> Are you saying that there is good ozone and bad ozone depending on

how it is

> generated, or that the by-products of corona discharge generated

ozone cause

> problems that " pure " ozone doesn't cause?

>

> Steve Temes

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks ,

While we are on the subject ...

We recommend the new variable speed Trane air handlers for many of our jobs. Trane makes a product called CleanEffects which is an ozone based air purifier that the AC sales guys push hard. It integrates with the new air handlers. CleanEffects produces ozone and we do not permit it to be used for any of our clients. Trane does not publish any scientific info on the units on their web site. They just say the ozone level is very low compared to the outside. That may be just marketing hype. But in any event we nix the CleanEffects.

Rosen

Re: Plants and mold and bacteria, oh my! (was: Re: Cigarette Smok...

In a message dated 12/5/2006 4:46:32 PM Eastern Standard Time, po.youngcomcast (DOT) net writes:

Group,

Look at the pictures. This is what high concentrations of ozone will do to stachy and asp. When you use enough UV ozone generators and PPE, you can achieve this safely. Pam YoungGP Air Restoration of Medallion Healthy HomesPam,What do high concentrations of ozone do to the seals in those double pane windows, and how do you know? Don't good things get oxidized along with the bad things?Are you saying that there is good ozone and bad ozone depending on how it is generated, or that the by-products of corona discharge generated ozone cause problems that "pure" ozone doesn't cause?Steve Temes

Need a quick answer? Get one in minutes from people who know. Ask your question on Yahoo! Answers.

Want to start your own business? Learn how on Yahoo! Small Business.

[Guest guest]

Dear Pam, What I find quite interesting in the procedures you cite is that after 45 minutes with the fans on you find the ozone has decayed to a very normal and permissible level. Do you have any references that might suggest what the decay might be without the fans? I thought it significant the recent California studies [dated may 5th] showed all indoor machines they tested showed a satisfactory decay within a half hour of being turned off to pose no human hazard. I know of the good reputation of your company since adopting only machines that are not corona generators. Gibala Re: Plants and mold and bacteria, oh my! > (was: > > Re:> > > Cigarette Smok...> > > In a message dated 12/5/2006 4:46:32 PM Eastern Standard Time,> > > po.youngcomcast (DOT) net writes: > > > > > > > > > Group,> > > > > > > > > Look at the pictures. This is what high concentrations of ozone > > will do to> > > stachy and asp. When you use enough UV ozone generators and PPE, > > you can> > > achieve this safely.> > > > > > Pam Young> > > GP Air Restoration of Medallion Healthy Homes> > > > > > Pam,> > > > > > What do high concentrations of ozone do to the seals in those > > double pane> > > windows, and how do you know? Don't good things get oxidized > along > > with the> > > bad things?> > > > > > Are you saying that there is good ozone and bad ozone depending > on > > how it is> > > generated, or that the by-products of corona discharge generated > > ozone cause> > > problems that "pure" ozone doesn't cause?> > > > > > Steve Temes > > > > > > > > > _____ > > > > > > Need a quick answer? Get one in minutes from people who know. Ask > > your> > > question on Yahoo!> > > > > <http://answers.> > > <http://answers.yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTFvbGNhMGE3BF9TAzM5NjU0NTEwOARfcw> >> > yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTFvbGNhMGE3BF9TAzM5NjU0NTEwOARfcw> > MzOTY1> > > NDUxMDMEc2VjA21haWxfdGFnbGluZQRzbGsDbWFpbF90YWcx> Answers.> > >> >>

[Guest guest]

Pam,

Contact Steve Spivak

through ASCR. I believe their technical assistance phone is .

Contact Eugene Cole through Brigham

Young University.

Moffett

From:

iequality [mailto:iequality ] On Behalf Of totsietoo

Sent: Sunday, December 10, 2006

6:18 PM

To: iequality

Subject: Plants and

mold and bacteria, oh my! (was: Re: Cigarette Smok...

,

You are correct, it does nothing for mitigating the source or the

damage itself, water leaks must be repaired, dead animals, water,

sludge or whatever removed, etc. But we have had great success with

eliminating the odors associated with them. I couldn't locate those

studies. Do you know if they were conducted using corona discharge

generators?...Which BTW would increase the by products.

Respectfully,

Pam Young

> >

> > ,

> > Your comments are timely about ozone and mold. Let me send you to

> California

> > Air Resources Board and California

Assembly Bill AB 2276 Air

> Cleaning

> > Regulation that limits the ozone generated by air cleaning

devices

> in order

> > to protect public health.

> > http://www.arb.

> <http://www.arb.ca.gov/research/indoor/aircleaners/aircleaners.htm>

> ca.gov/research/indoor/aircleaners/aircleaners.htm

> >

> > Moffett

> >

> > _____

> >

> > From: iequality@yahoogrou <mailto:iequality%40yahoogroups.com>

ps.com

> [mailto:iequality@yahoogrou <mailto:iequality%40yahoogroups.com>

ps.com]

> On Behalf

> > Of gary

rosen

> > Sent: Tuesday, December 05, 2006 5:50 PM

> > To: iequality@yahoogrou <mailto:iequality%40yahoogroups.com>

ps.com

> > Subject: Re: Plants and mold and bacteria, oh my!

(was:

> Re:

> > Cigarette Smok...

> >

> > There is absolutely no scientific evididence that I have seen

that

> ozone is

> > useful in mold remediation. If there are any scientific studies

to

> the

> > contrary, please give me the references and I will review.

> >

> > Rosen, Ph.D.

> > Re: Plants and mold and bacteria, oh my!

(was:

> Re:

> > Cigarette Smok...

> > In a message dated 12/5/2006 4:46:32 PM Eastern Standard Time,

> > po.youngcomcast (DOT) net writes:

> >

> >

> > Group,

> >

> >

> > Look at the pictures. This is what high concentrations of ozone

> will do to

> > stachy and asp. When you use enough UV ozone generators and PPE,

> you can

> > achieve this safely.

> >

> > Pam Young

> > GP Air Restoration of Medallion Healthy Homes

> >

> > Pam,

> >

> > What do high concentrations of ozone do to the seals in those

> double pane

> > windows, and how do you know? Don't good things get oxidized

along

> with the

> > bad things?

> >

> > Are you saying that there is good ozone and bad ozone depending

on

> how it is

> > generated, or that the by-products of corona discharge generated

> ozone cause

> > problems that " pure " ozone doesn't cause?

> >

> > Steve Temes

> >

> >

> > _____

> >

> > Need a quick answer? Get one in minutes from people who know. Ask

> your

> > question on Yahoo!

> >

> <http://answers.

>

<http://answers.yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTFvbGNhMGE3BF9TAzM5NjU0NTEwOARfcw

>

> yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTFvbGNhMGE3BF9TAzM5NjU0NTEwOARfcw

> MzOTY1

> > NDUxMDMEc2VjA21haWxfdGFnbGluZQRzbGsDbWFpbF90YWcx>

Answers.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Pam,

I agree with your

methodology listed in your e-mail. We used the same procedures in the 1980’s

when there wasn’t the same information sharing or chat room discussion as

we have today. My issue is always worker protection and public protection,

which you seem to carefully and responsibly address in

your e-mail. We took your process one step further in

the 1990s by data-logging our findings during the use of gas-phase ozone. It

was at that time, and only on several occasions, I starting seeing measurable increase

of levels of benzene. I never did figure out where it came from.

Moffett

From:

iequality [mailto:iequality ] On Behalf Of totsietoo

Sent: Sunday, December 10, 2006

6:50 PM

To: iequality

Subject: Plants and

mold and bacteria, oh my! (was: Re: Cigarette Smok...

,

I couldn't help but reply to this one as it seems you are not

understanding how the ozone process takes place in order to reduce

the bio-load and not expose people to ozone. First of all, when a

Medallion Healthy Homes company is involved (or if it is someone who

has purchased enough of their own equipment)we strategically place up

to 20 pieces of ozone equipment (depending on sq.ft.)and also put

industrial fans in place. Only the technician is allowed in the

building. Wearing PPE the technician then turns on the ozone

generators and leaves. About 1/2 hour later he/she will enter

(wearing PPE) with an ozone sensor to determine the ozone is reaching

high enough levels, usually 4 ppm or higher, then leaves again, this

time for about 5 hours (or longer, depending on the severity of the

problem). Upon returning, again wearing PPE, the technician re-

enters to turn off the generators and turn ON the fans...he/she

leaves again for about 45 min. to 1 hr., at which time they return

with their sensor and walk about the living/working space in order to

determine when the ozone has returned to safe levels. We do not

allow re-entry until they are at 0.1 or 0.2ppm, which is usually what

it is outside on any given day.

Respectfully,

Pam Young

> >

> > ,

> > Your comments are timely about ozone and mold. Let me send you to

> California

> > Air Resources Board and California

Assembly Bill AB 2276 Air

> Cleaning

> > Regulation that limits the ozone generated by air cleaning

devices

> in order

> > to protect public health.

> > http://www.arb.

> <http://www.arb.ca.gov/research/indoor/aircleaners/aircleaners.htm>

> ca.gov/research/indoor/aircleaners/aircleaners.htm

> >

> > Moffett

> >

> > _____

> >

> > From: iequality

<mailto:iequality%

40yahoogroups.com>

> <mailto:iequality%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:iequality@

> <mailto:iequality >

yahoogroups.com

> <mailto:iequality%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:iequality%

40yahoogroups.com> ]

> On Behalf

> > Of gary

rosen

> > Sent: Tuesday, December 05, 2006 5:50 PM

> > To: iequality

<mailto:iequality%

40yahoogroups.com>

> <mailto:iequality%40yahoogroups.com>

> > Subject: Re: Plants and mold and bacteria, oh my!

(was:

> Re:

> > Cigarette Smok...

> >

> > There is absolutely no scientific evididence that I have seen

that

> ozone is

> > useful in mold remediation. If there are any scientific studies

to

> the

> > contrary, please give me the references and I will review.

> >

> > Rosen, Ph.D.

> > Re: Plants and mold and bacteria, oh my!

(was:

> Re:

> > Cigarette Smok...

> > In a message dated 12/5/2006 4:46:32 PM Eastern Standard Time,

> > po.youngcomcast (DOT) net writes:

> >

> >

> > Group,

> >

> >

> > Look at the pictures. This is what high concentrations of ozone

> will do to

> > stachy and asp. When you use enough UV ozone generators and PPE,

> you can

> > achieve this safely.

> >

> > Pam Young

> > GP Air Restoration of Medallion Healthy Homes

> >

> > Pam,

> >

> > What do high concentrations of ozone do to the seals in those

> double pane

> > windows, and how do you know? Don't good things get oxidized

along

> with the

> > bad things?

> >

> > Are you saying that there is good ozone and bad ozone depending

on

> how it is

> > generated, or that the by-products of corona discharge generated

> ozone cause

> > problems that " pure " ozone doesn't cause?

> >

> > Steve Temes

> >

> >

> > _____

> >

> > Need a quick answer? Get one in minutes from people who know. Ask

> your

> > question on Yahoo!

> >

> <http://answers.

>

<http://answers.yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTFvbGNhMGE3BF9TAzM5NjU0NTEwOARfcw

>

> yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTFvbGNhMGE3BF9TAzM5NjU0NTEwOARfcw

> MzOTY1

> > NDUxMDMEc2VjA21haWxfdGFnbGluZQRzbGsDbWFpbF90YWcx>

Answers.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

,

Yes, of course you are correct regarding the half life of ozone

studies, however, I have to tell you that it has been our field

experience that the decay rate of ozone must be affected by other

variables (humidity, barometric pressure, temp., whether the spaces

we are treating are furnished or completely vacant) in the real

indoor environment. There have been those times where we have re-

entered after 10-15 min. and the levels had returned to .02ppm and

then there have been other times where it DID take 1/2 hr. or

longer. Also, ozone seems to attach itself to polyester and

lingers.

I can only tell you what we have witnessed and experienced first hand

and since we do not charge the customer by the hour, what we spend of

our own time does not affect them, unless we are not careful enough

to assure a safe re-entry for them.

Respectfully,

Pam Young, assistant to

Gerald Young

GP Air Restoration of Medallion Healthy Homes

> > > > >

> > > > > ,

> > > > > Your comments are timely about ozone and mold. Let me

send

> you

> > to

> > > > California

> > > > > Air Resources Board and California Assembly Bill AB 2276

> Air

> > > > Cleaning

> > > > > Regulation that limits the ozone generated by air

cleaning

> > > devices

> > > > in order

> > > > > to protect public health.

> > > > >

http://www.arb.<http://www.arb./><http://www.arb./<http://www.arb./>>

> > > >

> >

>

<http://www.arb.ca.gov/research/indoor/aircleaners/aircleaners.htm<htt

p://www.arb.ca.gov/research/indoor/aircleaners/aircleaners.htm><htt

>

p://www.arb.ca.gov/research/indoor/aircleaners/aircleaners.htm<file://

/p://www.arb.ca.gov/research/indoor/aircleaners/aircleaners.htm>>>

> > > > ca.gov/research/indoor/aircleaners/aircleaners.htm

> > > > >

> > > > > Moffett

> > > > >

> > > > > _____

> > > > >

> > > > > From:

>

iequality <mailto:iequality ><mailto:ieq

uality <mailto:iequality >>

> <mailto:iequality%

> > > 40yahoogroups.com>

> > > > <mailto:iequality%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:iequality@

> > > >

>

<mailto:iequality <mailto:iequality ><ma

ilto:iequality <mailto:iequality >>>

> yahoogroups.com

> > > > <mailto:iequality%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:iequality%

> > > 40yahoogroups.com> ]

> > > > On Behalf

> > > > > Of gary rosen

> > > > > Sent: Tuesday, December 05, 2006 5:50 PM

> > > > > To:

>

iequality <mailto:iequality ><mailto:ieq

uality <mailto:iequality >>

> <mailto:iequality%

> > > 40yahoogroups.com>

> > > > <mailto:iequality%40yahoogroups.com>

> > > > > Subject: Re: Plants and mold and bacteria, oh

> my!

> > > (was:

> > > > Re:

> > > > > Cigarette Smok..

> > > > >

> > > > > There is absolutely no scientific evididence that I have

> seen

> > > that

> > > > ozone is

> > > > > useful in mold remediation. If there are any scientific

> studies

> > > to

> > > > the

> > > > > contrary, please give me the references and I will review.

> > > > >

> > > > > Rosen, Ph.D.

> > > > > Re: Plants and mold and bacteria, oh

> my!

> > > (was:

> > > > Re:

> > > > > Cigarette Smok...

> > > > > In a message dated 12/5/2006 4:46:32 PM Eastern Standard

> Time,

> > > > > po.youngcomcast (DOT) net writes:

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Group,

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Look at the pictures. This is what high concentrations of

> ozone

> > > > will do to

> > > > > stachy and asp. When you use enough UV ozone generators

and

> > PPE,

> > > > you can

> > > > > achieve this safely.

> > > > >

> > > > > Pam Young

> > > > > GP Air Restoration of Medallion Healthy Homes

> > > > >

> > > > > Pam,

> > > > >

> > > > > What do high concentrations of ozone do to the seals in

> those

> > > > double pane

> > > > > windows, and how do you know? Don't good things get

> oxidized

> > > along

> > > > with the

> > > > > bad things?

> > > > >

> > > > > Are you saying that there is good ozone and bad ozone

> depending

> > > on

> > > > how it is

> > > > > generated, or that the by-products of corona discharge

> > generated

> > > > ozone cause

> > > > > problems that " pure " ozone doesn't cause?

> > > > >

> > > > > Steve Temes

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > _____

> > > > >

> > > > > Need a quick answer? Get one in minutes from people who

> know.

> > Ask

> > > > your

> > > > > question on Yahoo!

> > > > >

> > > >

<http://answers.<http://answers./><http://answers./<http://answers./>>

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

<http://answers.yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTFvbGNhMGE3BF9TAzM5NjU0NTEwOARfcw

<http://answers.yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTFvbGNhMGE3BF9TAzM5NjU0NTEwOARfcw

>

>

<http://answers.yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTFvbGNhMGE3BF9TAzM5NjU0NTEwOARfcw

<http://answers.yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTFvbGNhMGE3BF9TAzM5NjU0NTEwOARfcw

>

> >

> > > >

> > > > yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTFvbGNhMGE3BF9TAzM5NjU0NTEwOARfcw

> > > > MzOTY1

> > > > > NDUxMDMEc2VjA21haWxfdGFnbGluZQRzbGsDbWFpbF90YWcx> Answers.

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>