Re: 10 yod with OCD, gets mean and angry

[Guest guest]

My child also has ocd, but is not medicated, so I do not know lots about

medication, but I have heard that zoloft can bring on anger issues in itself ...

possibly she needs a reduction in meds and an additional mood stabilizer?

I wish I had more advice for you.

in TN

Subject: 10 yod with OCD, gets mean and angry

To:

Date: Monday, May 11, 2009, 4:21 PM

My 10 yod has had ocd for 6 years now. Winter is her worse time of year. Then

she usually gets better, but she is getting worse now. the Dr. upped her meds to

200 mg of Zoloft from 150mg. She is seeing her therapist again. She gets so mean

and angry when she doesn't get her way or can't handle something. Her worry

thoughts are bad. When she gets mad she says some really mean things to me, like

she hates me. Yesterday she got a piece from a rake and scratched herself with

it a few times. I think she is full of anger from the worry thoughts and hurting

the people she loves. Today she hit me (she has done that before, but not for a

while. After she gets so mad and mean she is sorry and says she hates herself.

She is unable to handle much at all. She can't do school much (we home school),

doing chores.

[Guest guest]

If she doesn't get better, you might question the Zoloft as this kind of

response can occur on SSRI's even with atypical anti-psychotics and mood

stabilizers on board. In the meantime, I'm sure she can't help herself and I

know how taxing it can be (been there).

Bonnie

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> Subject: 10 yod with OCD, gets mean and angry

> To:

> Date: Monday, May 11, 2009, 4:21 PM

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> My 10 yod has had ocd for 6 years now. Winter is her worse time of year. Then

she usually gets better, but she is getting worse now. the Dr. upped her meds to

200 mg of Zoloft from 150mg. She is seeing her therapist again. She gets so mean

and angry when she doesn't get her way or can't handle something. Her worry

thoughts are bad. When she gets mad she says some really mean things to me, like

she hates me. Yesterday she got a piece from a rake and scratched herself with

it a few times. I think she is full of anger from the worry thoughts and hurting

the people she loves. Today she hit me (she has done that before, but not for a

while. After she gets so mad and mean she is sorry and says she hates herself.

She is unable to handle much at all. She can't do school much (we home school),

doing chores.

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[Guest guest]

Hi. It sounds like her anger increased before the med increase. . Is that

right?

How long has it been since the doc upped her Zoloft to 200 mg? Has it been long

enough to give it a chance to work? She was doing okay on 150 mg, for a while

before things ramped up and the OCD waxed?

When our son was young, a few times he did things like scratching himself. He

even did some head banging when he would get worked up. He took a swipe at me a

few times too, but usually that happened, when he felt cornered to do something

he was terrified of, like getting a shot. I often thought his reaction was the

frustration and fear of trying to deal with what he was experiencing. In Dr.

Wagner's books she described it like a teapot heating up and releasing steam. I

thought that was a good analogy. Dr. Wagner has some great information on rages

and meltdown in her book, What to do When your Child has Obsessive-Compulsive

Disorder: Strategies and Solutions.

It's good she is getting back in to see the therapist. I hope you are able to

get things back on track soon.

BJ

>

> My 10 yod has had ocd for 6 years now. Winter is her worse time of year. Then

she usually gets better, but she is getting worse now. the Dr. upped her meds

to 200 mg of Zoloft from 150mg. She is seeing her therapist again. She gets so

mean and angry when she doesn't get her way or can't handle something. Her

worry thoughts are bad. When she gets mad she says some really mean things to

me, like she hates me. Yesterday she got a piece from a rake and scratched

herself with it a few times. I think she is full of anger from the worry

thoughts and hurting the people she loves. Today she hit me (she has done that

before, but not for a while. After she gets so mad and mean she is sorry and

says she hates herself. She is unable to handle much at all. She can't do

school much (we home school), doing chores.

>

[Guest guest]

Well she has been moody for a while, she increased her meds a few days ago. Her

anger has gotten worse since then. Whether that is the reason or not I don't

know. But it is something to think about.

Thanks for you input.

> >

> > My 10 yod has had ocd for 6 years now. Winter is her worse time of year.

Then she usually gets better, but she is getting worse now. the Dr. upped her

meds to 200 mg of Zoloft from 150mg. She is seeing her therapist again. She

gets so mean and angry when she doesn't get her way or can't handle something.

Her worry thoughts are bad. When she gets mad she says some really mean things

to me, like she hates me. Yesterday she got a piece from a rake and scratched

herself with it a few times. I think she is full of anger from the worry

thoughts and hurting the people she loves. Today she hit me (she has done that

before, but not for a while. After she gets so mad and mean she is sorry and

says she hates herself. She is unable to handle much at all. She can't do

school much (we home school), doing chores.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

One strategy that may help is to try to structure her day

more to reduce frustrations. My daughter is a ridgid thinker

so when she is locked into an idea she can be difficult to

live with and impossible to get her to be more flexible.

It is hard to keep up with scripting life. But it is also

hard to live with outbursts of anger. I let my daughter

make some of the choices so she doesn't feel overly controlled.

My daughter says mean things too. I have been told to ignore

this, sometimes I tell her .. that's your opinion I think I

am pretty nice etc. This is for my mental health though. I find

I use this if someone else is around so I don't feel so

humiliated. It does seem to diffuse the situation for us somewhat.

I noticed that since my daughter is not in school she

is not distracting herself from her worries as much.

I am trying to find outside interests away from me so that

she have a distraction and an emotional break.

I hope things improve.

Pam

>

> My 10 yod has had ocd for 6 years now. Winter is her worse time of year. Then

she usually gets better, but she is getting worse now. the Dr. upped her meds

to 200 mg of Zoloft from 150mg. She is seeing her therapist again. She gets so

mean and angry when she doesn't get her way or can't handle something. Her

worry thoughts are bad. When she gets mad she says some really mean things to

me, like she hates me. Yesterday she got a piece from a rake and scratched

herself with it a few times. I think she is full of anger from the worry

thoughts and hurting the people she loves. Today she hit me (she has done that

before, but not for a while. After she gets so mad and mean she is sorry and

says she hates herself. She is unable to handle much at all. She can't do

school much (we home school), doing chores.

>

[Guest guest]

Hi,

Just my opinion, but I worry that the 200 mg Zoloft dosage is high for

a 10 year old? Is her therapist skilled in cognitive therapy and

ERP? Maybe wean down from the Zoloft and try Lexapro? Seems to me

there should not be that much anger with that high a dose of Zoloft.

I feel for you. I also think it's important that the child really

identifies with the therapist, and of course that the therapist is an

OCD expert. We have wasted a lot of time and money with therapists

who thought they were helping but weren't. It's so scary for these

kids when they can't boss back the OCD.

[Guest guest]

, I just looked in Dr. Wagner's book that has dosage ranges for different

antidepressants, and I think you could be right. It says 50-150mg, once per

day, for Zoloft.

I totally agree about finding a therapist that knows what they are doing, with

OCD. We spent many years, many wasted appointments, and lots of of money of

therapists, too, who did not understand how to treat OCD correctly. We NEVER

saw improvement, until we found someone who knew what they were doing. It's so

important to them having a chance at improving.

BJ

>

> Hi,

> Just my opinion, but I worry that the 200 mg Zoloft dosage is high for

> a 10 year old? Is her therapist skilled in cognitive therapy and

> ERP? Maybe wean down from the Zoloft and try Lexapro? Seems to me

> there should not be that much anger with that high a dose of Zoloft.

> I feel for you. I also think it's important that the child really

> identifies with the therapist, and of course that the therapist is an

> OCD expert. We have wasted a lot of time and money with therapists

> who thought they were helping but weren't. It's so scary for these

> kids when they can't boss back the OCD.

>

[Guest guest]

I took her back down to 150 mg Zoloft. The bad mood swings and outbursts got

better. So I really think that might of been it. She is still having trouble

concentrating on anything. School is just not happining now. I'm trying to let

her have a break and not expect too much from her now. Hopefully that will help

with her anxiety. If she has trouble with anything she is doing she just gets

too upset and stops. She won't try it again. (school, games, etc.) I got some

Nature's Sunshine Stress relief at this store I get a lot of natural stuff from.

It has seemed to help some, she has been a little calmer lately. I also got

some Focus attention powder today. She would not take it though. We will try

again tomorrow. She has trouble taking her meds and other stuff when she is

scared and has a lot of anxiety. She has a fear of throwing up and so taking

those things can be hard for her. It is so frustraing. She needs her meds so

she won't be as scared, but can't take them because she is scared.

I talked to her Dr. today. he said we could put her on Busbar for anxiety. Or

change her to Celexia or Prozac or Wellbutrin. Or have her take Strattera for

focus. I don't like the side effects on a lot of these. On the web it said

Wellbutrin is not for children over 18. So I wonder about that.

I want to continue to try the natural stuff a little longer and try the Focus

and see if it does anything first.

>

> Hi,

> Just my opinion, but I worry that the 200 mg Zoloft dosage is high for

> a 10 year old? Is her therapist skilled in cognitive therapy and

> ERP? Maybe wean down from the Zoloft and try Lexapro? Seems to me

> there should not be that much anger with that high a dose of Zoloft.

> I feel for you. I also think it's important that the child really

> identifies with the therapist, and of course that the therapist is an

> OCD expert. We have wasted a lot of time and money with therapists

> who thought they were helping but weren't. It's so scary for these

> kids when they can't boss back the OCD.

>

[Guest guest]

We are being referred to a pediatrician who our therapist works closely with.

We discussed potential medicines and she warned that the doses may seem high.

She told me that with OCD, they've found higher doses are what works. The doses

you read about are for depression, but when Rx'd for OCD, they are higher. Just

some info I just got that I thought I'd share! God bless, Judy

> >

> > Hi,

> > Just my opinion, but I worry that the 200 mg Zoloft dosage is high for

> > a 10 year old? Is her therapist skilled in cognitive therapy and

> > ERP? Maybe wean down from the Zoloft and try Lexapro? Seems to me

> > there should not be that much anger with that high a dose of Zoloft.

> > I feel for you. I also think it's important that the child really

> > identifies with the therapist, and of course that the therapist is an

> > OCD expert. We have wasted a lot of time and money with therapists

> > who thought they were helping but weren't. It's so scary for these

> > kids when they can't boss back the OCD.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Hi, Judy. Thanks for the input. )

The primary doc told our son he could go as high as 80 mg with Celexa, but 2

different pediatric psychiatrists said only 60 mg, tops, with all stating you

need higher doses for OCD. Seems they had different info on what that highest

dosage can be though. It's hard to know who to believe. Fortunately, the 60 mg

dosage was the point that worked for him. I wasn't really willing to go higher

than that, so was glad.

The dosages that are listed in Dr. Wagner's book are dosages for OCD, rather

than depression, since her book is about OCD. So, I'm guessing the high end she

states is the highest recommended.

It's so hard when dealing with these meds and our kids. I wish there was some

other way, but there isn't, for some. Our son's OCD was not what you would call

mild, so he needs the meds along with the therapy. I would love to get him off

of them, but last time we did, he spiraled down into the worst episode of OCD

he's had, that totally debilitated him. I don't ever want to go there again. (

BJ