RE: Re: OT: Dessicated thyroid meds (WAS) symptom list for coinfections?-

June 14, 2010

Hi Jim, I take dessicated thyroid-- I know Armour is available again after a shortage a while back, I also took nature-throid about 6 months ago. I would recommend both.

Hi ,

Is there still dessicated thyroid meds available? If so, what ones do you know of?

Thanks,

Jim

>

> A few questions out of curiosity.

>

> Are you still on LDN?

>

> Did you wean off of cortisol or just stop abruptly?

>

> Are you still on thyroid meds? If so, what type? If not, did you wean or

> stop abruptly?

>

> Did you start thyroid and cortef at the same time? Or did you start thyroid

> or cortef first?

>

> Have you done cortisol or thyroid testing since your 'crash'? If so, what

> were the results?

>

> Ok, I'm 'thinking out loud' on the keyboard! Gonna throw out some random

> thoughts, but I have more questions! And I know you probably know all this,

> but just bear with me coz I just want to help! Maybe I'll trigger something

> that makes you think of your answer!

>

> One thing I thought of is if you are taking dessicated thyroid it can take

> about 6 weeks for your body to use it effectively. So if your symptoms

> started at about 6 weeks of treatment, it could be that thyroid kicked in

> and was too much for your adrenals. (Just a theory!)

>

> You cannot separate symptoms from hormones. You can't have symptoms if your

> hormones aren't off balance. If hormones are balanced, you have no

> symptoms! Hormones are the messengers that tell the cells what to do, so if

> that message isn't there or it's too strong a message you will have symptoms

> (think high thyroid and low thyroid and the symptoms associated with those).

>

> Adrenal and thyroid hormones are your immune system. If you are fighting

> off an invader (bacteria, virus, etc.) they go into action to tell the cells

> what to do next. If you are fighting an infection cortisol will be released

> in order to get more thyroid into the cells so that the cells work right

> (cortisol opens the cell receptors to let thyroid in). (Thyroid increases

> mitochondria production and replication rates. The mitochondria is where

> the Kreb's cycle takes place, which is the energy of the cell. If the

> Kreb's cycle is happening more often and more efficiently, then the cell's

> performance is increased. This means that the cell will make its products

> and do its job better [making immune cells, fluids, or whatever that cell's

> job is].)

>

> So, if you are graphing temps/BP and are clearly hypoadrenal and hypothyroid

> and the cortef/thyroid didn't help then something is keeping them from

> working properly. Have you checked ferritin? Vit C? Vit D? Vit B's?

> Glutathione? Magnesium? Other hormones like estrogen, progesterone,

> testosterone, etc.? There is SOMETHING keeping the endocrine system from

> working properly!

>

> What type of adrenal support are you taking? (Just curious!) Just be sure

> to be careful not to take something that is stimulating like ginsing,

> ashwaghanda, rhiodola, etc. even caffeine. Those can cause the adrenals to

> make too much adrenaline, if it's unable to make cortisol. That will only

> stress your system further and you don't want that!

>

> Ok. I think that's it for now! Again, my goal is to help and nothing more.

> One of my favorite show's is House coz I love to try to figure things out!

> LOL!

>

> Take care and I hope you find your answer! (((HUGS)))

>

> From: Lyme_and_Rife [mailto:Lyme_and_Rife ]

> On Behalf Of T Walters

> Sent: Friday, June 11, 2010 9:25 AM

> To: Lyme_and_Rife

> Subject: Re: Re: symptom list for coinfections?-

>

> Hi ,

>

> Let me put your mind at rest--I'm not interpreting your message as pushy. I

> appreciate the time and effort required to write such a lengthy email, as

> well as the concern that lies behind it.

>

> Okay, so here's my situation: I know that my immune system was functioning

> before the current symptoms started, and that it was not too worn down to do

> anything. A year ago I was sick a lot. Every time I went out in public or

> got exposed to anything, I got sick and stayed sick for a week or two. I

> had a series of vitamin C IV's with glutathione and started on LDN, and

> everything turned around. From that point on I didn't get sick anymore. So

> it was clear that my immune system had rebounded and was doing very well.

>

> My symptoms have been so severe that I considered the possibility of an

> adrenal crisis and explained my reasoning to my doctor. But he doesn't feel

> that's what I'm going through right now. We have discussed this at length,

> he is monitoring me, and has told me what to watch out for so that I can

> keep him informed of my situation. An adrenal crisis is life-threatening

> and I understand that.

>

> Also, we have checked aldosterone and it's normal, so there doesn't seem to

> be a need for Florinef. Blood pressure is normal. I've looked at these

> things and everything else I can think of, because things went downhill so

> badly after I started thyroid meds and Cortef. I was doing MUCH better

> before I started these things. Not perfect, after all I've had Lyme

> problems for over 25 years. But I was able to work in my studio all day

> every day, with a bit of rest midday. I can't even think about doing that

> now. And as I've said, this ALL started after I started thyroid meds and

> Cortef, so it's virtually impossible for me not to see a connection.

>

> Yes, the group I was on was NTH Adrenals. I found them through Stop the

> Thyroid Madness, and I've read everything at that site many, many times. I

> was on the group daily and followed the protocol faithfully. I'm very

> stubborn, so I refused to give up, especially since most everyone else was

> doing so well--till it was obvious that I was going downhill further and

> further. I know that I have adrenal fatigue, as my salivary cortisol tests

> were below the range in 3 out of 4 collection times, with the 4th being

> barely in range. I also understand the importance of cortisol to the body.

> But Cortef is not the answer to that for me.

>

> Yes, I have been recording and graphing my temps for many months. They

> indicate I'm both hypothyroid and hypoadrenal, and they've indicated this

> all along. Those indicators did not improve with Cortef and T3--they got

> worse. My last blood test was only a few weeks ago, and everything looked

> pretty good, except for extremely high EBV titers. My doctor thinks the

> problems I'm having right now are from an infection, and that I need to make

> that a priority. I agree, so that's the way I'm approaching it. Throwing

> in thyroid hormone and Cortef when I already know they made me worse--that

> doesn't make sense to me. So I'm using natural adrenal support, treating

> for the virus, and detoxing. That seems to be the best I can do for now.

>

> Peggy

>

> Re: Re: symptom list for coinfections?

>

> Hi ,

>

> I was using Cortef, and there's no way I would take it again. I was under

> close supervision while on it, and I was on the adrenals group moderated by

> several knowledgeable people. Most people there were totally sold on

> hydrocortisone. So I know that my reaction is unusual. It was a

> replacement dose, not a high dose at all, but as I mentioned in another

> post, I am extremely sensitive to medication and can't take many things that

> other people take without a second thought. That's probably thanks to my

> 25+ years with Lyme.

>

> My immune system hadn't been shut off when I started Cortef--I didn't even

> get a cold last winter, and I could be exposed to people with viruses

> without catching them. I was doing very well, in fact. Lyme seemed to be

> in remission, or asleep, or whatever it is that it does when it decides not

> to bother you. The symptoms I started experiencing--weakness, exhaustion,

> sweating--weren't a herx. If they had been, it would be the longest herx on

> record, as it's going on three months now.

>

> I've tried just about every adrenal supplement known to mankind without

> results. I did receive a glowing recommendation for another one that should

> be arriving today. Fingers crossed that this one is able to get through to

> my adrenals--the others haven't.

>

> Thanks for taking the time to send all the info, and especially for your

> concern.

>

> Peggy

>

> No virus found in this incoming message.

> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com

> Version: 9.0.829 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2930 - Release Date: 06/10/10

> 23:35:00

>

-- Whitney Schmucker

June 14, 2010

Armour has been " re-formulated " some people like it - many do not. Everyone just needs to try it. I have been having my dessicated thyroid compounded - about $100 for a 3 month supply (well really more than three months. That was for 200 capsules compounded to 1 grain/60 mg each.) Remember to keep this stuff in the freezer.

L

June 15, 2010

, that wouldn't surprise me because I've heard that it is the filler that was changed. (So sad, they messed with a good product. Maybe it was the only way to get the FDA approval they shouldn't have had to fight for. )

I’ve heard that if you crush Armour that it works like it used

to! I think I heard that on Janie’s blog or something. Don’t quote me on

that! LOL!

From:

Lyme_and_Rife [mailto:Lyme_and_Rife ] On

Behalf Of H

Sent: Monday, June 14, 2010 2:10 PM

To: Lyme_and_Rife

Subject: Re: Re: OT: Dessicated thyroid meds (WAS)

symptom list for coinfections?-

Armour has been " re-formulated " some

people like it - many do not. Everyone just needs to try it. I have been

having my dessicated thyroid compounded - about $100 for a 3 month supply (well

really more than three months. That was for 200 capsules compounded to 1

grain/60 mg each.) Remember to keep this stuff in the freezer.

L

No virus

found in this incoming message.

Checked by AVG - www.avg.com

Version: 9.0.829 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2937 - Release Date: 06/13/10

23:35:00

June 15, 2010

Just now looked for the beginning of this thread! LOL! Sorry!

Yes, there are several out there. Naturthroid and Westhroid are

the two I’m familiar with. I’m sure there are others. Some people were upset

with Armour because of the reformulation, but apparently if you crush the ‘new’

Armour it works like the old Armour. For the last 2 years, I’ve taken my

thyroid sublingually so I don’t have to fret about taking it around food.

Crushing it and/or taking it under the tongue seems to work for many people!

From:

Lyme_and_Rife [mailto:Lyme_and_Rife ] On Behalf

Of Sunshine

Sent: Sunday, June 13, 2010 3:13 PM

To: Lyme_and_Rife

Subject: Re: OT: Dessicated thyroid meds (WAS) symptom

list for coinfections?-

Hi ,

Is there still dessicated thyroid meds available? If so, what ones do you know

of?

Thanks,

Jim

>

> A few questions out of curiosity.

>

> Are you still on LDN?

>

> Did you wean off of cortisol or just stop abruptly?

>

> Are you still on thyroid meds? If so, what type? If not, did you wean or

> stop abruptly?

>

> Did you start thyroid and cortef at the same time? Or did you start

thyroid

> or cortef first?

>

> Have you done cortisol or thyroid testing since your 'crash'? If so, what

> were the results?

>

> Ok, I'm 'thinking out loud' on the keyboard! Gonna throw out some random

> thoughts, but I have more questions! And I know you probably know all

this,

> but just bear with me coz I just want to help! Maybe I'll trigger

something

> that makes you think of your answer!

>

> One thing I thought of is if you are taking dessicated thyroid it can take

> about 6 weeks for your body to use it effectively. So if your symptoms

> started at about 6 weeks of treatment, it could be that thyroid kicked in

> and was too much for your adrenals. (Just a theory!)

>

> You cannot separate symptoms from hormones. You can't have symptoms if

your

> hormones aren't off balance. If hormones are balanced, you have no

> symptoms! Hormones are the messengers that tell the cells what to do, so

if

> that message isn't there or it's too strong a message you will have

symptoms

> (think high thyroid and low thyroid and the symptoms associated with

those).

>

> Adrenal and thyroid hormones are your immune system. If you are fighting

> off an invader (bacteria, virus, etc.) they go into action to tell the

cells

> what to do next. If you are fighting an infection cortisol will be

released

> in order to get more thyroid into the cells so that the cells work right

> (cortisol opens the cell receptors to let thyroid in). (Thyroid increases

> mitochondria production and replication rates. The mitochondria is where

> the Kreb's cycle takes place, which is the energy of the cell. If the

> Kreb's cycle is happening more often and more efficiently, then the cell's

> performance is increased. This means that the cell will make its products

> and do its job better [making immune cells, fluids, or whatever that

cell's

> job is].)

>

> So, if you are graphing temps/BP and are clearly hypoadrenal and

hypothyroid

> and the cortef/thyroid didn't help then something is keeping them from

> working properly. Have you checked ferritin? Vit C? Vit D? Vit B's?

> Glutathione? Magnesium? Other hormones like estrogen, progesterone,

> testosterone, etc.? There is SOMETHING keeping the endocrine system from

> working properly!

>

> What type of adrenal support are you taking? (Just curious!) Just be sure

> to be careful not to take something that is stimulating like ginsing,

> ashwaghanda, rhiodola, etc. even caffeine. Those can cause the adrenals to

> make too much adrenaline, if it's unable to make cortisol. That will only

> stress your system further and you don't want that!

>

> Ok. I think that's it for now! Again, my goal is to help and nothing more.

> One of my favorite show's is House coz I love to try to figure things out!

> LOL!

>

> Take care and I hope you find your answer! (((HUGS)))

>

> From: Lyme_and_Rife

[mailto:Lyme_and_Rife ]

> On Behalf Of T Walters

> Sent: Friday, June 11, 2010 9:25 AM

> To: Lyme_and_Rife

> Subject: Re: Re: symptom list for coinfections?-

>

> Hi ,

>

> Let me put your mind at rest--I'm not interpreting your message as pushy.

I

> appreciate the time and effort required to write such a lengthy email, as

> well as the concern that lies behind it.

>

> Okay, so here's my situation: I know that my immune system was functioning

> before the current symptoms started, and that it was not too worn down to

do

> anything. A year ago I was sick a lot. Every time I went out in public or

> got exposed to anything, I got sick and stayed sick for a week or two. I

> had a series of vitamin C IV's with glutathione and started on LDN, and

> everything turned around. From that point on I didn't get sick anymore. So

> it was clear that my immune system had rebounded and was doing very well.

>

> My symptoms have been so severe that I considered the possibility of an

> adrenal crisis and explained my reasoning to my doctor. But he doesn't feel

> that's what I'm going through right now. We have discussed this at length,

> he is monitoring me, and has told me what to watch out for so that I can

> keep him informed of my situation. An adrenal crisis is life-threatening

> and I understand that.

>

> Also, we have checked aldosterone and it's normal, so there doesn't seem

to