Guest guest Posted November 24, 2010 Report Share Posted November 24, 2010 >> Descartes said:I think therefor I am.> Scratch that!!!My philosophy is:> I observe therefor I am> Mm, an interesting new slant. When I read it I thought maybe I would modify it further and say: I observe that I am. And then I thought yet again and realised that I am nothing without others so perhaps it should be I observe that I am and others are too. Not trying to be clever but I have been thinking a lot about values this week in view of some things that have happened in my life recently and I've been realising that if I value getting on with others I have to value their values as well but when they clash where do I draw the line before speaking out? Or am I wrong to expect to value others' values. Is observing them enough? I have always found getting angry very hard as I always think that if I were in others' shoes I would think and behave the way they do so who am I to get angry? Then I start feeling guilty! Any thoughts about that anyone? S. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2010 Report Share Posted November 24, 2010 WOW! Sooz - You are doing some heavy thinking, and the good time too!Other people's values, in themselves, are something we probably can't do much about. But how we react to other's values is within our realm. So we are back to ACT - is how I'm reacting to other's values useful to ME living a valued life? For the most part I think people are doing the best they can under the circumstances. Whenever I get angry at someone I usually find out later that I just didn't understand. I think you are fine and am not sure why you would feel guilty.BillTo: ACT_for_the_Public From: soozy128@...Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2010 15:09:49 +0000Subject: Re: My Philosophy >> Descartes said:I think therefor I am.> Scratch that!!!My philosophy is:> I observe therefor I am> Mm, an interesting new slant. When I read it I thought maybe I would modify it further and say: I observe that I am. And then I thought yet again and realised that I am nothing without others so perhaps it should be I observe that I am and others are too. Not trying to be clever but I have been thinking a lot about values this week in view of some things that have happened in my life recently and I've been realising that if I value getting on with others I have to value their values as well but when they clash where do I draw the line before speaking out? Or am I wrong to expect to value others' values. Is observing them enough? I have always found getting angry very hard as I always think that if I were in others' shoes I would think and behave the way they do so who am I to get angry? Then I start feeling guilty! Any thoughts about that anyone? S. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2010 Report Share Posted November 24, 2010 Interesting I was just getting at the fact I see the observing self superseding the thinking self. To quote Russ the Sky is the observing self where as the thinking self is merely the ongoing weather conditions. Just my humble take on it. > > > > Descartes said:I think therefor I am. > > Scratch that!!!My philosophy is: > > I observe therefor I am > > > > Mm, an interesting new slant. > > When I read it I thought maybe I would modify it further and say: > > I observe that I am. > > And then I thought yet again and realised that I am nothing without > others so perhaps it should be I observe that I am and others are too. > > Not trying to be clever but I have been thinking a lot about values this > week in view of some things that have happened in my life recently and > I've been realising that if I value getting on with others I have to > value their values as well but when they clash where do I draw the line > before speaking out? > > Or am I wrong to expect to value others' values. Is observing them > enough? > > I have always found getting angry very hard as I always think that if I > were in others' shoes I would think and behave the way they do so who am > I to get angry? Then I start feeling guilty! > > Any thoughts about that anyone? > > S. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2010 Report Share Posted November 24, 2010 I go along with Bill on others' values, though I phrase it a bit stronger for myself: " Others' values are no concern of mine. " I find it hard enough keeping my own ACT boat steady and headed in MY valued directions. Bringing others' values aboard invites problems, IMHO. I agree, it would be honorable and generous to have as one's value " helping others to pursue their values. " But I think ACT values are too personal a thing to make this practical. I don't see a happy outcome for either party. If you can manage to be that selfless, though - and it is one of your values - then more power to you. As for rephrasing Decartes, how about: " I am the observing. " Thanks to all for this thoughtful thread...Best regards, Tom Hardy Interesting I was just getting at the fact I see the observing self superseding the thinking self. To quote Russ the Sky is the observing self where as the thinking self is merely the ongoing weather conditions. Just my humble take on it. > > > > Descartes said:I think therefor I am. > > Scratch that!!!My philosophy is: > > I observe therefor I am > > > > Mm, an interesting new slant. > > When I read it I thought maybe I would modify it further and say: > > I observe that I am. > > And then I thought yet again and realised that I am nothing without > others so perhaps it should be I observe that I am and others are too. > > Not trying to be clever but I have been thinking a lot about values this > week in view of some things that have happened in my life recently and > I've been realising that if I value getting on with others I have to > value their values as well but when they clash where do I draw the line > before speaking out? > > Or am I wrong to expect to value others' values. Is observing them > enough? > > I have always found getting angry very hard as I always think that if I > were in others' shoes I would think and behave the way they do so who am > I to get angry? Then I start feeling guilty! > > Any thoughts about that anyone? > > S. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2010 Report Share Posted November 24, 2010 Other people's values matter to me, if the other people matter to me, but their values never trump my values. You can acknowledge them without bringing them aboard. But, you can even bring them aboard without letting them drive your bus or plane or car or whatever the vehicle is. You can let them sit in the back seat, where they belong, and it's not about being selfish or selfless. It's about getting where you want to go, no matter who/what hitches a ride with you. As far as rephrasing Descartes goes, this my take: I am. Helena Original Message -----To: "ACT for the Public" <ACT_for_the_Public >Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2010 4:06:00 PMSubject: Re: Re: My Philosophy I go along with Bill on others' values, though I phrase it a bit stronger for myself: "Others' values are no concern of mine." I find it hard enough keeping my own ACT boat steady and headed in MY valued directions. Bringing others' values aboard invites problems, IMHO. I agree, it would be honorable and generous to have as one's value "helping others to pursue their values." But I think ACT values are too personal a thing to make this practical. I don't see a happy outcome for either party. If you can manage to be that selfless, though - and it is one of your values - then more power to you. As for rephrasing Decartes, how about: "I am the observing." Thanks to all for this thoughtful thread... Best regards, Tom Hardy Interesting I was just getting at the fact I see the observing self superseding the thinking self.To quote Russ the Sky is the observing self where as the thinking self is merely the ongoing weather conditions.Just my humble take on it. > >> > Descartes said:I think therefor I am.> > Scratch that!!!My philosophy is:> > I observe therefor I am> >> > Mm, an interesting new slant.> > When I read it I thought maybe I would modify it further and say:> > I observe that I am.> > And then I thought yet again and realised that I am nothing without> others so perhaps it should be I observe that I am and others are too.> > Not trying to be clever but I have been thinking a lot about values this> week in view of some things that have happened in my life recently and> I've been realising that if I value getting on with others I have to> value their values as well but when they clash where do I draw the line> before speaking out?> > Or am I wrong to expect to value others' values. Is observing them> enough?> > I have always found getting angry very hard as I always think that if I> were in others' shoes I would think and behave the way they do so who am> I to get angry? Then I start feeling guilty!> > Any thoughts about that anyone?> > S.> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2010 Report Share Posted November 24, 2010 > > I go along with Bill on others' values, though I phrase it a bit stronger > for myself: > > " Others' values are no concern of mine. " Oh dear, I'm sure this was not your intention but that comes across to me a bit like keep your nose out of other people's business! :-) Say I value being heard and having my concerns addressed then surely I am obliged to offer the same to others? > > I find it hard enough keeping my own ACT boat steady and headed in MY valued > directions. Bringing others' values aboard invites problems, IMHO. I'm sure I'm not the only one whose values are socially-based. My problem is very much with getting the balance right between asserting my values and having others assert theirs. Or to use your metaphor others can very easily rock my boat but if we are in dfferent boats then I suppose mine will rock theirs back! > > I agree, it would be honorable and generous to have as one's value " helping > others to pursue their values. " But I think ACT values are too personal a > thing to make this practical. I don't see a happy outcome for either party. > If you can manage to be that selfless, though - and it is one of your values > - then more power to you. Well when you put it like that " helping others to pursue their values " that sounds a bit hyperresponsible. Not what I was envisaging. More that when others have clearly different values I wonder whether I am in the wrong and feel as though I am the problem. It sets me off doubting. Is my OCD showing? > > As for rephrasing Decartes, how about: > > " I am the observing. " > > Thanks to all for this thoughtful thread... Yes, it has made me think but surely it's not just about observing but also about doing? " I am the observing " makes me think of someone who has opted out. S. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2010 Report Share Posted November 24, 2010 > > > > Descartes said:I think therefor I am. > > Scratch that!!!My philosophy is: > > I observe therefor I am > > > Mm, an interesting new slant. > When I read it I thought maybe I would modify it further and say: > I observe that I am. > And then I thought yet again and realised that I am nothing without others so perhaps it should be I observe that I am and others are too. > Not trying to be clever but I have been thinking a lot about values this week in view of some things that have happened in my life recently and I've been realising that if I value getting on with others I have to value their values as well but when they clash where do I draw the line before speaking out? > Or am I wrong to expect to value others' values. Is observing them enough? > I have always found getting angry very hard as I always think that if I were in others' shoes I would think and behave the way they do so who am I to get angry? Then I start feeling guilty! > Any thoughts about that anyone? > S. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2010 Report Share Posted November 24, 2010 I have no idea what I meant. Should have looked at it before I sent it. But I'm sure it was wise :I I'll l blame it on the BlackBerry keypad. Bill Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry Re: My Philosophy > > > > Descartes said:I think therefor I am. > > Scratch that!!!My philosophy is: > > I observe therefor I am > > > Mm, an interesting new slant. > When I read it I thought maybe I would modify it further and say: > I observe that I am. > And then I thought yet again and realised that I am nothing without others so perhaps it should be I observe that I am and others are too. > Not trying to be clever but I have been thinking a lot about values this week in view of some things that have happened in my life recently and I've been realising that if I value getting on with others I have to value their values as well but when they clash where do I draw the line before speaking out? > Or am I wrong to expect to value others' values. Is observing them enough? > I have always found getting angry very hard as I always think that if I were in others' shoes I would think and behave the way they do so who am I to get angry? Then I start feeling guilty! > Any thoughts about that anyone? > S. > ------------------------------------ For other ACT materials and list serves see www.contextualpsychology.org <http://www.contextualpsychology.org> If you do not wish to belong to ACT_for_the_Public, you may unsubscribe by sending an email to ACT_for_the_Public-unsubscribe@...! Groups Links Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2010 Report Share Posted November 24, 2010 Other people mean a lot to me, too. And believe me, I'm cheering everyone on with their values, whatever they are. As for bringing them aboard the bus, I'm not clear how that fits the metaphor as used in ACT. Of course if you can find a way, you're welcome to bring them on - that's your choice. And to be perfectly honest I've got a pretty full-time job managing the passengers already on my bus. Your mileage (as , I believe, likes to say) may vary...I appreciate your thoughtful post, as always. Tom Hardy Other people's values matter to me, if the other people matter to me, but their values never trump my values. You can acknowledge them without bringing them aboard. But, you can even bring them aboard without letting them drive your bus or plane or car or whatever the vehicle is. You can let them sit in the back seat, where they belong, and it's not about being selfish or selfless. It's about getting where you want to go, no matter who/what hitches a ride with you. As far as rephrasing Descartes goes, this my take: I am. Helena Original Message -----To: " ACT for the Public " <ACT_for_the_Public > Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2010 4:06:00 PMSubject: Re: Re: My Philosophy I go along with Bill on others' values, though I phrase it a bit stronger for myself: " Others' values are no concern of mine. " I find it hard enough keeping my own ACT boat steady and headed in MY valued directions. Bringing others' values aboard invites problems, IMHO. I agree, it would be honorable and generous to have as one's value " helping others to pursue their values. " But I think ACT values are too personal a thing to make this practical. I don't see a happy outcome for either party. If you can manage to be that selfless, though - and it is one of your values - then more power to you. As for rephrasing Decartes, how about: " I am the observing. " Thanks to all for this thoughtful thread... Best regards, Tom Hardy Interesting I was just getting at the fact I see the observing self superseding the thinking self.To quote Russ the Sky is the observing self where as the thinking self is merely the ongoing weather conditions. Just my humble take on it. > >> > Descartes said:I think therefor I am.> > Scratch that!!!My philosophy is:> > I observe therefor I am> >> > Mm, an interesting new slant. > > When I read it I thought maybe I would modify it further and say:> > I observe that I am.> > And then I thought yet again and realised that I am nothing without> others so perhaps it should be I observe that I am and others are too. > > Not trying to be clever but I have been thinking a lot about values this> week in view of some things that have happened in my life recently and> I've been realising that if I value getting on with others I have to > value their values as well but when they clash where do I draw the line> before speaking out?> > Or am I wrong to expect to value others' values. Is observing them> enough?> > I have always found getting angry very hard as I always think that if I> were in others' shoes I would think and behave the way they do so who am> I to get angry? Then I start feeling guilty!> > Any thoughts about that anyone?> > S.> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2010 Report Share Posted November 24, 2010 How about "I act therefore I am"KateDescartes said:I think therefor I am.Scratch that!!!My philosophy is: I observe therefor I am Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2010 Report Share Posted November 24, 2010 Kate - I give yours a ten! Bill To: ACT_for_the_Public From: catherine7250@...Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2010 11:04:18 +1100Subject: Re: My Philosophy How about "I act therefore I am" Kate Descartes said: I think therefor I am. Scratch that!!! My philosophy is: I observe therefor I am Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2010 Report Share Posted November 24, 2010 Soozy, I applaud you in choosing and pursuing your own ACT values, whatever they may be and without regard to what anyone else says. Especially me. I was just relating my own experience in hope that it might be helpful to someone on the list in choosing practical, workable values. Apologies if I offended anyone else. Best regards to all,Tom Hardy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2010 Report Share Posted November 25, 2010 >Soozy, I applaud you in choosing and pursuing your own ACT values, whatever they may be and without regard to what anyone else says. Especially me. I was just relating my own experience in hope that it might be helpful to someone on the list in choosing practical, workable values. Apologies if I offended anyone else. > Hi Winslow, You absolutely didn't offend me either. I know people often read things into what I write as it doesn't seem to come across the way I mean it sometimes on internet. However, if you look back at what I said you may accept that I actually was not offended but was observing (and passing on) my reaction to what you wrote as it is important for me to see things from both sides. What you wrote set me thinking. That's all! You are very right in identifying my problem which is choosing workable values - that is the bit I find hardest. People I care about (caring is a value) have been doing things that bother me and it has finally come to a head. I still care about them (value) but have had to break off contact as they are not listening to me and I can't associate myself with what they are doing any more. It is hard seeing people you care about about to self-destruct. I already feel bereaved. It hurts! When you suffer from OCD it is easy for your anxiety to be dismissed as hyperresponsibilty yet those around me that I respect and who do not have OCD say it definitely isn't and have urged me to get out. I know I can't control other people's values and haven't tried to but I still care. Conflict of values, I suppose. Also how do you ensure values are workable? There's Irresponsibility, Responsibility and Hyperresponsibility. How do you know where one ends and the next begins? I used to obsess about St Francis when I was small and feel bad for not selling my possessions and feeding the starving children in the Congo. Now was he hyperresponsible or irresponsible or just someone who valued his ornithology hobby <smile>? S. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2010 Report Share Posted November 25, 2010 Me likes, me like a lot! > > > > > Descartes said: > > I think therefor I am. > > > > Scratch that!!! > > My philosophy is: > > > > I observe therefor I am > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2010 Report Share Posted November 25, 2010 What if someone else values bullying people and stealing from them. It's hard to respect those values. What I'm saying is what if the other persons values are in direct conflict with your own values? > > Soozy, > > I applaud you in choosing and pursuing your own ACT values, whatever they > may be and without regard to what anyone else says. Especially me. > > I was just relating my own experience in hope that it might be helpful to > someone on the list in choosing practical, workable values. > > Apologies if I offended anyone else. > > Best regards to all, > Tom Hardy > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2010 Report Share Posted November 25, 2010 > > > > Soozy, > > > > I applaud you in choosing and pursuing your own ACT values, whatever they > > may be and without regard to what anyone else says. Especially me. > > > > I was just relating my own experience in hope that it might be helpful to > > someone on the list in choosing practical, workable values. > > > > Apologies if I offended anyone else. > > > > Best regards to all, > > Tom Hardy > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2010 Report Share Posted November 25, 2010 >>as for bringing them aboard the bus, I'm not clear how that fits the metaphor as used in ACT. Of course if you can find a way, you're welcome to bring them on - that's your choice. Maybe not such a good metaphor--stretched a bit too much! I was thinking of other people's values as sometimes trying to hijack your bus, not that you willingly bring them on -- somewhat like the ACT metaphor of welcoming the unpleasant aunt to your house for Thanksgiving dinner. Thanks for bringing it up so I could clarify what I meant. I appreciate your thoughtful posts as well! Happy Thanksgiving to everyone in the USA! Helena To: "ACT for the Public" <ACT_for_the_Public >Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2010 6:31:40 PMSubject: Re: Re: My Philosophy Other people mean a lot to me, too. And believe me, I'm cheering everyone on with their values, whatever they are. As for bringing them aboard the bus, I'm not clear how that fits the metaphor as used in ACT. Of course if you can find a way, you're welcome to bring them on - that's your choice. And to be perfectly honest I've got a pretty full-time job managing the passengers already on my bus. Your mileage (as , I believe, likes to say) may vary... I appreciate your thoughtful post, as always. Tom Hardy Other people's values matter to me, if the other people matter to me, but their values never trump my values. You can acknowledge them without bringing them aboard. But, you can even bring them aboard without letting them drive your bus or plane or car or whatever the vehicle is. You can let them sit in the back seat, where they belong, and it's not about being selfish or selfless. It's about getting where you want to go, no matter who/what hitches a ride with you. As far as rephrasing Descartes goes, this my take: I am. Helena Original Message -----To: "ACT for the Public" <ACT_for_the_Public >Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2010 4:06:00 PMSubject: Re: Re: My Philosophy I go along with Bill on others' values, though I phrase it a bit stronger for myself: "Others' values are no concern of mine." I find it hard enough keeping my own ACT boat steady and headed in MY valued directions. Bringing others' values aboard invites problems, IMHO. I agree, it would be honorable and generous to have as one's value "helping others to pursue their values." But I think ACT values are too personal a thing to make this practical. I don't see a happy outcome for either party. If you can manage to be that selfless, though - and it is one of your values - then more power to you. As for rephrasing Decartes, how about: "I am the observing." Thanks to all for this thoughtful thread... Best regards, Tom Hardy Interesting I was just getting at the fact I see the observing self superseding the thinking self.To quote Russ the Sky is the observing self where as the thinking self is merely the ongoing weather conditions.Just my humble take on it. > >> > Descartes said:I think therefor I am.> > Scratch that!!!My philosophy is:> > I observe therefor I am> >> > Mm, an interesting new slant.> > When I read it I thought maybe I would modify it further and say:> > I observe that I am.> > And then I thought yet again and realised that I am nothing without> others so perhaps it should be I observe that I am and others are too.> > Not trying to be clever but I have been thinking a lot about values this> week in view of some things that have happened in my life recently and> I've been realising that if I value getting on with others I have to> value their values as well but when they clash where do I draw the line> before speaking out?> > Or am I wrong to expect to value others' values. Is observing them> enough?> > I have always found getting angry very hard as I always think that if I> were in others' shoes I would think and behave the way they do so who am> I to get angry? Then I start feeling guilty!> > Any thoughts about that anyone?> > S.> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2010 Report Share Posted November 25, 2010 "I act therefore I am" I am .... impressed! Thanks, Kate! Helena Re: My Philosophy How about "I act therefore I am" Kate Descartes said: I think therefor I am. Scratch that!!! My philosophy is: I observe therefor I am Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2010 Report Share Posted November 25, 2010 When I get muddled about values, one thing that helps me is to remember that the word is used differently in ACT than in ordinary speech. Specifically, in ACT " values " isn't so much a noun as it is a verb: " to value " is to make choices over time in accord with what we care about. When the word is used this way, we can say that everyone values just like everyone walks or talks or pees or laughs. And just as I am the only one who can walk or talk or pee or laugh for myself, so I am the only one who can do my own valuing. So although I often want to know what other people in my life care about, and sometimes want to help and other times not, and still other times don't know what to do ... still and all, I can do only my own valuing. And although I may value being a caring person, a loving person, holding such a value is unlikely to make life simpler, or to tell me what to do. Valuing doesn't give me a crystal ball, only the inkling of a direction to return to. In fact my experience is that in painful areas especially, valuing can make life not less but more complicated, not less but more difficult. When I behave as if I don't care, then there are many situations and choices I can avoid. A lot simpler and easier than caring and trying and possibly failing. As you might gather I am still struggling with values myself. To borrow from Bill C., some other tools in the ACT toolkit that can help with valuing are defusion and acceptance. Time for a little of that for me. - Randy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2010 Report Share Posted November 25, 2010 It seems like what is most important is how we think about others values. That is something we can do something about. We could become an anti bullying advocate if that is congruent with one of our values. Or we could choose to keep our bus going in the direction we have already chosen. I'm thankful for ACT people today and every day. Bill Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry Re: My Philosophy What if someone else values bullying people and stealing from them. It's hard to respect those values. What I'm saying is what if the other persons values are in direct conflict with your own values? > > Soozy, > > I applaud you in choosing and pursuing your own ACT values, whatever they > may be and without regard to what anyone else says. Especially me. > > I was just relating my own experience in hope that it might be helpful to > someone on the list in choosing practical, workable values. > > Apologies if I offended anyone else. > > Best regards to all, > Tom Hardy > ------------------------------------ For other ACT materials and list serves see www.contextualpsychology.org <http://www.contextualpsychology.org> If you do not wish to belong to ACT_for_the_Public, you may unsubscribe by sending an email to ACT_for_the_Public-unsubscribe@...! Groups Links Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2010 Report Share Posted November 25, 2010 I think the word "value" implies something good and desirable, something of worth. So if someone lives an immoral or unethical life, then I would say they have no values, or very few values. Bullying, to me, would indicate a lack of values rather than a "negative value." I don't know if I'm right about this definition, but it helps me to see it that way. I like what Randy wrote: "to value" is to make choices over time in accord with what we care about. Knowing what we care about (and being able to articulate that) is probably the toughest part of identifying one's values; at least, it is for me. If something is worthwhile, or essential, to living life mindfully and to my fullest potential, then it is a value--the noun. Living that value means putting my values into action, or valuing--the verb, which, as Randy pointed out, is what is most important. I hope I have helped to clarify and not added to the confusion : ) Helena Re: My Philosophy > >> > Soozy,> > > > I applaud you in choosing and pursuing your own ACT values, whatever they> > may be and without regard to what anyone else says. Especially me.> > > > I was just relating my own experience in hope that it might be helpful to> > someone on the list in choosing practical, workable values.> > > > Apologies if I offended anyone else.> > > > Best regards to all,> > Tom Hardy> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2010 Report Share Posted November 25, 2010 Maybe values are similar to virtues > > > > > > Soozy, > > > > > > I applaud you in choosing and pursuing your own ACT values, whatever they > > > may be and without regard to what anyone else says. Especially me. > > > > > > I was just relating my own experience in hope that it might be helpful to > > > someone on the list in choosing practical, workable values. > > > > > > Apologies if I offended anyone else. > > > > > > Best regards to all, > > > Tom Hardy > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2010 Report Share Posted November 25, 2010 Similar, maybe, but different, IMO. "Virtue" as opposed to "Vice" seems to entail judgment about what's good and what's bad for society in general. Still, it probably does play into defining our values. Helena Re: My Philosophy Maybe values are similar to virtues > > > > > > Soozy, > > > > > > I applaud you in choosing and pursuing your own ACT values, whatever they > > > may be and without regard to what anyone else says. Especially me. > > > > > > I was just relating my own experience in hope that it might be helpful to > > > someone on the list in choosing practical, workable values. > > > > > > Apologies if I offended anyone else. > > > > > > Best regards to all, > > > Tom Hardy > > > > >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2010 Report Share Posted November 25, 2010 If there is no judgement and values are 100% up to the individual Then values society perceive as negative such as bullying those weaker than us may in fact be a valid values to certain unsavory individuals. > > > > > > > > Soozy, > > > > > > > > I applaud you in choosing and pursuing your own ACT values, whatever they > > > > may be and without regard to what anyone else says. Especially me. > > > > > > > > I was just relating my own experience in hope that it might be helpful to > > > > someone on the list in choosing practical, workable values. > > > > > > > > Apologies if I offended anyone else. > > > > > > > > Best regards to all, > > > > Tom Hardy > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2010 Report Share Posted November 25, 2010 Another question I have is : Are values constrained by what society defines as morally acceptable? > > > > > > > > > > Soozy, > > > > > > > > > > I applaud you in choosing and pursuing your own ACT values, whatever they > > > > > may be and without regard to what anyone else says. Especially me. > > > > > > > > > > I was just relating my own experience in hope that it might be helpful to > > > > > someone on the list in choosing practical, workable values. > > > > > > > > > > Apologies if I offended anyone else. > > > > > > > > > > Best regards to all, > > > > > Tom Hardy > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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