Guest guest Posted September 15, 2009 Report Share Posted September 15, 2009 Kathy, Please read my most recent post. Your child's situation may be vastly different from that of my sons. Jack From: miralax [mailto:miralax ] On Behalf Of KathySent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 10:30 AMTo: miralax Subject: Re: Miralax forum Jack, I don't want to get into this, but have you ever been harmed by a Pharma drug, or by anything done by a doctor? Doctor's are trained on drugs and surgery, not natural methods or any methods that use the body to heal and help itself. The body is not deficient in PEG or miralax or any other chemical. It may be deficient in specific nutrients or it may not be absorbing the nutrients due to leaky gut or any type of lack of absorption caused by food allergy or many other reasons. So therefore, it makes sense to get to the bottom of the issue regarding the constipation, so to speak. It can be caused by many things. Think out of the box. Chiropractors can help, naturopaths can help. If you don't want to take the advice here then that's fine, but we know how detrimental this drug can be especially used long term. As a parent you don't want to see you child in any type of pain and it can be hard to stop using miralax, the parent can become dependent on it due to frustration or fear of nothing else working. Believe me I've been there. We used it for 7 years ! It is possible to get off it. My child is still suffering from some of the effects of it even after being off it for 2 years. It took one year of the Low oxalate diet to help rid her body of the oxalates caused by miralax. I know this to be true due to the nature of her stools and also testing. Doctors do not explore so deeply into problems and causes like we as parents do. We love our kids and don't want them to suffer in any way, so we go to the ends of the earth to find out what is causing the problem and how to solve it. Keep searching, but just know the advice you get here is better than any double blind placebo study or a commercial on TV praising the virtues of the latest drug. We're in the trenches 24/7 and this makes us experts in many ways ! Oh, BTW, many doctors believe this laxative is problematic as well, not just the parents.............. Kathy Miralax forum It is amazing what is read in my posts that I didn't write. I wonder what type of mental image some of you have formed of me? Here is who I am: I am a parent. I have a kid who becomes constipated without Miralax. I know the cause of his constipation. I'm scared of using something that will harm him. Since I have not found any other viable alternatives to Miralax, I seek good information. I get combative when I read responses about this great conspiracy to hurt our kids. If there was anything here concrete enough that I could take to a doctor, you wouldn't hear me shouting for good information. No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG - www.avg.comVersion: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.99/2372 - Release Date: 09/15/09 05:59:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 15, 2009 Report Share Posted September 15, 2009 Have you tried anything else? MOM, or Natural Calm, or Kirkmans Mag. Citrate? My daughter has severe hypotonia, motility problems, food allergies, colitis and autism. She also had horrible reflux on miralax and now does not have it at all.............the colitis has also cleared. No more grainy stools either. The worse thing she has is spasms in her foot that we have not been able to resolve.................... I tried weaning miralax many, many times, It didn't work. We had to go cold turkey and deal with the after affects for about 2 months before she started getting better............. From: Jack Gershon To: miralax Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 10:39 AM Subject: RE: Miralax forum Kathy, Please read my most recent post. Your child's situation may be vastly different from that of my sons. Jack From: miralax [mailto:miralax ] On Behalf Of KathySent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 10:30 AMTo: miralax Subject: Re: Miralax forum Jack, I don't want to get into this, but have you ever been harmed by a Pharma drug, or by anything done by a doctor? Doctor's are trained on drugs and surgery, not natural methods or any methods that use the body to heal and help itself. The body is not deficient in PEG or miralax or any other chemical. It may be deficient in specific nutrients or it may not be absorbing the nutrients due to leaky gut or any type of lack of absorption caused by food allergy or many other reasons. So therefore, it makes sense to get to the bottom of the issue regarding the constipation, so to speak. It can be caused by many things. Think out of the box. Chiropractors can help, naturopaths can help. If you don't want to take the advice here then that's fine, but we know how detrimental this drug can be especially used long term. As a parent you don't want to see you child in any type of pain and it can be hard to stop using miralax, the parent can become dependent on it due to frustration or fear of nothing else working. Believe me I've been there. We used it for 7 years ! It is possible to get off it. My child is still suffering from some of the effects of it even after being off it for 2 years. It took one year of the Low oxalate diet to help rid her body of the oxalates caused by miralax. I know this to be true due to the nature of her stools and also testing. Doctors do not explore so deeply into problems and causes like we as parents do. We love our kids and don't want them to suffer in any way, so we go to the ends of the earth to find out what is causing the problem and how to solve it. Keep searching, but just know the advice you get here is better than any double blind placebo study or a commercial on TV praising the virtues of the latest drug. We're in the trenches 24/7 and this makes us experts in many ways ! Oh, BTW, many doctors believe this laxative is problematic as well, not just the parents.............. Kathy Miralax forum It is amazing what is read in my posts that I didn't write. I wonder what type of mental image some of you have formed of me? Here is who I am: I am a parent. I have a kid who becomes constipated without Miralax. I know the cause of his constipation. I'm scared of using something that will harm him. Since I have not found any other viable alternatives to Miralax, I seek good information. I get combative when I read responses about this great conspiracy to hurt our kids. If there was anything here concrete enough that I could take to a doctor, you wouldn't hear me shouting for good information. No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG - www.avg.comVersion: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.99/2372 - Release Date: 09/15/09 05:59:00 No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.99/2372 - Release Date: 09/15/09 05:59:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 15, 2009 Report Share Posted September 15, 2009 Can you elaborate on the "after affects for about 2 months"? What ended up being your solution? From: miralax [mailto:miralax ] On Behalf Of KathySent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 10:46 AMTo: miralax Subject: Re: Miralax forum Have you tried anything else? MOM, or Natural Calm, or Kirkmans Mag. Citrate? My daughter has severe hypotonia, motility problems, food allergies, colitis and autism. She also had horrible reflux on miralax and now does not have it at all.............the colitis has also cleared. No more grainy stools either. The worse thing she has is spasms in her foot that we have not been able to resolve.................... I tried weaning miralax many, many times, It didn't work. We had to go cold turkey and deal with the after affects for about 2 months before she started getting better............. From: Jack Gershon To: miralax Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 10:39 AM Subject: RE: Miralax forum Kathy, Please read my most recent post. Your child's situation may be vastly different from that of my sons. Jack From: miralax [mailto:miralax ] On Behalf Of KathySent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 10:30 AMTo: miralax Subject: Re: Miralax forum Jack, I don't want to get into this, but have you ever been harmed by a Pharma drug, or by anything done by a doctor? Doctor's are trained on drugs and surgery, not natural methods or any methods that use the body to heal and help itself. The body is not deficient in PEG or miralax or any other chemical. It may be deficient in specific nutrients or it may not be absorbing the nutrients due to leaky gut or any type of lack of absorption caused by food allergy or many other reasons. So therefore, it makes sense to get to the bottom of the issue regarding the constipation, so to speak. It can be caused by many things. Think out of the box. Chiropractors can help, naturopaths can help. If you don't want to take the advice here then that's fine, but we know how detrimental this drug can be especially used long term. As a parent you don't want to see you child in any type of pain and it can be hard to stop using miralax, the parent can become dependent on it due to frustration or fear of nothing else working. Believe me I've been there. We used it for 7 years ! It is possible to get off it. My child is still suffering from some of the effects of it even after being off it for 2 years. It took one year of the Low oxalate diet to help rid her body of the oxalates caused by miralax. I know this to be true due to the nature of her stools and also testing. Doctors do not explore so deeply into problems and causes like we as parents do. We love our kids and don't want them to suffer in any way, so we go to the ends of the earth to find out what is causing the problem and how to solve it. Keep searching, but just know the advice you get here is better than any double blind placebo study or a commercial on TV praising the virtues of the latest drug. We're in the trenches 24/7 and this makes us experts in many ways ! Oh, BTW, many doctors believe this laxative is problematic as well, not just the parents.............. Kathy Miralax forum It is amazing what is read in my posts that I didn't write. I wonder what type of mental image some of you have formed of me? Here is who I am: I am a parent. I have a kid who becomes constipated without Miralax. I know the cause of his constipation. I'm scared of using something that will harm him. Since I have not found any other viable alternatives to Miralax, I seek good information. I get combative when I read responses about this great conspiracy to hurt our kids. If there was anything here concrete enough that I could take to a doctor, you wouldn't hear me shouting for good information. No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG - www.avg.comVersion: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.99/2372 - Release Date: 09/15/09 05:59:00 No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.99/2372 - Release Date: 09/15/09 05:59:00 No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG - www.avg.comVersion: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.99/2372 - Release Date: 09/15/09 05:59:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 15, 2009 Report Share Posted September 15, 2009 cranky, horrible stools, really constipated. magnesium citrate, occasional enema, lots of water, fiber, sometimes dulcolax, ( but rarely). 6 months later she was rescoped by her GI and showed no colitis or inflammation in the esophagus. he put her on MOM twice a day, but now we only do one time.............. she does get constipated from time to time still................ oh yeah, she takes good probiotics, nordic naturals fish oil and enzymes................. enzymes can help a lot. www.enzymestuff.com RE: Miralax forum Can you elaborate on the "after affects for about 2 months"? What ended up being your solution? From: miralax [mailto:miralax ] On Behalf Of KathySent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 10:46 AMTo: miralax Subject: Re: Miralax forum Have you tried anything else? MOM, or Natural Calm, or Kirkmans Mag. Citrate? My daughter has severe hypotonia, motility problems, food allergies, colitis and autism. She also had horrible reflux on miralax and now does not have it at all.............the colitis has also cleared. No more grainy stools either. The worse thing she has is spasms in her foot that we have not been able to resolve.................... I tried weaning miralax many, many times, It didn't work. We had to go cold turkey and deal with the after affects for about 2 months before she started getting better............. No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.99/2372 - Release Date: 09/15/09 05:59:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 15, 2009 Report Share Posted September 15, 2009 Banana's cause constipation in some. Make sure that the levels are always checked during blood tests. I would ask your childs doctor about supplementing potassium/electrolytes and safe levels etc(come naturally in many foods also). You can overdose on it supplementing, but I suspect this would be outrageous amounts(supplement wise). Im not 100% on potassium levels etc. It is a mineral electrolyte. This also affects the kidneys. Ironically one of the miralax's obvious warnings on there labels is not to use if kidney disease is present(our sons gi new of his kidney condition(not diseased) and still scripted it, so not sure how much of all this was his past condition/surgery successful on kidneys). The danger in the PEG and potassium is if it sits in there to long(stool doesnt move out or takes to long), honeslty I am nervous about it period. Our sons peg cleanout only sat in there about 24hrs befor the heart issue was caught. So just be sure and keep your childs stool moving as much as possible. Honestly I cant state 100% sure this would be an affect with all, but was with our son. Jennie<>< From: Jack Gershon <jackgershon (DOT) cc>Subject: Miralax forumTo: miralax@yahoogroups .comDate: Tuesday, September 15, 2009, 1:00 AM It is amazing what is read in my posts that I didn't write. I wonder what type of mental image some of you have formed of me? Here is who I am: I am a parent. I have a kid who becomes constipated without Miralax. I know the cause of his constipation. I'm scared of using something that will harm him. Since I have not found any other viable alternatives to Miralax, I seek good information. I get combative when I read responses about this great conspiracy to hurt our kids. If there was anything here concrete enough that I could take to a doctor, you wouldn't hear me shouting for good information. A significant portion of what I get here states that Coke-Cola, our doctors, pharmaceutical companies, and the FDA are all trying to hurt our kids. I don't buy it. The files are thin, very thin. I know many of you disagree with me, but without a certain degree of bias against PeG 3350, the files don't paint the picture some here see. There are assumptions that you have to believe for the files to stand up. I disagree with some of the assumptions. Do I trust doctors? I trust that they have a much better education than I do. I trust myself to bring them the right questions. I trust that if I ask questions of them that their answers will be in some fashion derived from that education. I trust myself to press them harder when I don't trust their answer. People here don't like my questions? You should be present from some of the 'discussions' I have had with my son's doctors. Doctors do not like to be challenged either. I pay for their expertise. They need to substantiate as well. Bonnie, Thank you for your response. I can understand your concern based on your experiences. My case is a bit different. We don't have the contents taking weeks to move through my son's system. As such, we probably aren't seeing the same effects that a 'prolonged stay' might cause my son. I sincerely hope your daughter does well and you can find a solution to whatever is the cause of her constipation. Yvette, Please quit looking for the absolute worst in my posts. I said that there is SOME bad information here. I also stated that there is good information to be found here as well. No, I do not hold a degree in chemical engineering or any related field. I wish I did. It would make it possible to better understand some of the data I have come across here and elsewhere. I am relying on common sense and mathematics. When I see articles with toxicity reports and the dosages that induced toxicity are ridiculously large, things like that jump off the page at me. , I have stated my reason for being here again and again. I want good information about PeG 3350 and what side effects have been documented. Susie, I'm really not all that lazy, just busy, as I am sure you are as well. I google this topic a whole lot. I am not finding anything out there to support the opinion of this forum. As such, I challenge this forum to share their information. Honeymarkey, I have stated again and again that I am not challenging anyone's personal experience. But have you tried taking "Jane Doe on the internet reports X' to your doctors as reliable information? Jeanie, You and I read the same words and focus on completely different aspects. You highlighted the blue, while I focused on the red. "It is similar to floor wax. It is a big polymer, and it has a very low toxicity because it is a large molecule that is absorbed or metabolized not at all by humans." That is probably why we take exception to each other. "why can't you see what I see?" (could be either one of us thinking that) We disagree. I can live with that. , I honestly appreciate your post. It is going to take some time to review your abstracts. The abstracts are, again, not very concrete. There are a lot of 'coulds' and 'mays' in there. For me, those are leap of faith type of stuff. But you raise valid points in your posts. You are right about my lack of sensitivty. I apologize to everyone here for starting a ruckus. It is not my intent to minimize any of your experiences. I will try to ask my questions with greater respect for your feelings and experiences. I'm sure none of you will be surprised if I continue my skepticism. My quest for answers has not changed. Jack No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG - www.avg.comVersion: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.99/2372 - Release Date: 09/15/09 05:59:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 15, 2009 Report Share Posted September 15, 2009 Poor kid:( Re: Miralax forum Jack, I don't want to get into this, but have you ever been harmed by a Pharma drug, or by anything done by a doctor? Doctor's are trained on drugs and surgery, not natural methods or any methods that use the body to heal and help itself. The body is not deficient in PEG or miralax or any other chemical. It may be deficient in specific nutrients or it may not be absorbing the nutrients due to leaky gut or any type of lack of absorption caused by food allergy or many other reasons. So therefore, it makes sense to get to the bottom of the issue regarding the constipation, so to speak. It can be caused by many things. Think out of the box. Chiropractors can help, naturopaths can help. If you don't want to take the advice here then that's fine, but we know how detrimental this drug can be especially used long term. As a parent you don't want to see you child in any type of pain and it can be hard to stop using mi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 15, 2009 Report Share Posted September 15, 2009 Jack, even if you do take it to a doc, they won't listen. They will treat you like you are crazy! Deanna To: miralax Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 6:29:43 AMSubject: Re: Miralax forum Jack, I don't want to get into this, but have you ever been harmed by a Pharma drug, or by anything done by a doctor? Doctor's are trained on drugs and surgery, not natural methods or any methods that use the body to heal and help itself. The body is not deficient in PEG or miralax or any other chemical. It may be deficient in specific nutrients or it may not be absorbing the nutrients due to leaky gut or any type of lack of absorption caused by food allergy or many other reasons. So therefore, it makes sense to get to the bottom of the issue regarding the constipation, so to speak. It can be caused by many things. Think out of the box. Chiropractors can help, naturopaths can help. If you don't want to take the advice here then that's fine, but we know how detrimental this drug can be especially used long term. As a parent you don't want to see you child in any type of pain and it can be hard to stop using miralax, the parent can become dependent on it due to frustration or fear of nothing else working. Believe me I've been there. We used it for 7 years ! It is possible to get off it. My child is still suffering from some of the effects of it even after being off it for 2 years. It took one year of the Low oxalate diet to help rid her body of the oxalates caused by miralax. I know this to be true due to the nature of her stools and also testing. Doctors do not explore so deeply into problems and causes like we as parents do. We love our kids and don't want them to suffer in any way, so we go to the ends of the earth to find out what is causing the problem and how to solve it. Keep searching, but just know the advice you get here is better than any double blind placebo study or a commercial on TV praising the virtues of the latest drug. We're in the trenches 24/7 and this makes us experts in many ways ! Oh, BTW, many doctors believe this laxative is problematic as well, not just the parents..... ......... Kathy Miralax forum It is amazing what is read in my posts that I didn't write.. I wonder what type of mental image some of you have formed of me? Here is who I am: I am a parent. I have a kid who becomes constipated without Miralax. I know the cause of his constipation. I'm scared of using something that will harm him. Since I have not found any other viable alternatives to Miralax, I seek good information. I get combative when I read responses about this great conspiracy to hurt our kids. If there was anything here concrete enough that I could take to a doctor, you wouldn't hear me shouting for good information. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 15, 2009 Report Share Posted September 15, 2009 OMG! Come on Jack..........Are you soliciting a response from me? What is wrong with you??? From: Jack Gershon <jackgershon (DOT) cc>Subject: Miralax forumTo: miralax@yahoogroups .comDate: Tuesday, September 15, 2009, 1:00 AM It is amazing what is read in my posts that I didn't write. I wonder what type of mental image some of you have formed of me? Here is who I am: I am a parent. I have a kid who becomes constipated without Miralax. I know the cause of his constipation. I'm scared of using something that will harm him. Since I have not found any other viable alternatives to Miralax, I seek good information. I get combative when I read responses about this great conspiracy to hurt our kids. If there was anything here concrete enough that I could take to a doctor, you wouldn't hear me shouting for good information. A significant portion of what I get here states that Coke-Cola, our doctors, pharmaceutical companies, and the FDA are all trying to hurt our kids. I don't buy it. The files are thin, very thin. I know many of you disagree with me, but without a certain degree of bias against PeG 3350, the files don't paint the picture some here see. There are assumptions that you have to believe for the files to stand up. I disagree with some of the assumptions. Do I trust doctors? I trust that they have a much better education than I do. I trust myself to bring them the right questions. I trust that if I ask questions of them that their answers will be in some fashion derived from that education. I trust myself to press them harder when I don't trust their answer. People here don't like my questions? You should be present from some of the 'discussions' I have had with my son's doctors. Doctors do not like to be challenged either. I pay for their expertise. They need to substantiate as well. Bonnie, Thank you for your response. I can understand your concern based on your experiences. My case is a bit different. We don't have the contents taking weeks to move through my son's system. As such, we probably aren't seeing the same effects that a 'prolonged stay' might cause my son. I sincerely hope your daughter does well and you can find a solution to whatever is the cause of her constipation. Yvette, Please quit looking for the absolute worst in my posts. I said that there is SOME bad information here. I also stated that there is good information to be found here as well. No, I do not hold a degree in chemical engineering or any related field. I wish I did. It would make it possible to better understand some of the data I have come across here and elsewhere. I am relying on common sense and mathematics. When I see articles with toxicity reports and the dosages that induced toxicity are ridiculously large, things like that jump off the page at me. , I have stated my reason for being here again and again. I want good information about PeG 3350 and what side effects have been documented. Susie, I'm really not all that lazy, just busy, as I am sure you are as well. I google this topic a whole lot. I am not finding anything out there to support the opinion of this forum. As such, I challenge this forum to share their information. Honeymarkey, I have stated again and again that I am not challenging anyone's personal experience. But have you tried taking "Jane Doe on the internet reports X' to your doctors as reliable information? Jeanie, You and I read the same words and focus on completely different aspects. You highlighted the blue, while I focused on the red. "It is similar to floor wax. It is a big polymer, and it has a very low toxicity because it is a large molecule that is absorbed or metabolized not at all by humans." That is probably why we take exception to each other. "why can't you see what I see?" (could be either one of us thinking that) We disagree. I can live with that. , I honestly appreciate your post. It is going to take some time to review your abstracts. The abstracts are, again, not very concrete. There are a lot of 'coulds' and 'mays' in there. For me, those are leap of faith type of stuff. But you raise valid points in your posts. You are right about my lack of sensitivty. I apologize to everyone here for starting a ruckus. It is not my intent to minimize any of your experiences. I will try to ask my questions with greater respect for your feelings and experiences. I'm sure none of you will be surprised if I continue my skepticism. My quest for answers has not changed. Jack No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG - www.avg.comVersion: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.99/2372 - Release Date: 09/15/09 05:59:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 15, 2009 Report Share Posted September 15, 2009 Why does something have to be wrong with me? You and I disagree, can we leave it at that? I am serious when I state I am interested in seeing the documents you will be posting. Even though you and I disagree about our thoughts on this topic, I appreciate the effort you put forth researching. I have learned much from the articles you have posted and referenced. I find it interesting that you and I draw such different conclusions from what we read in these artciles. Jack From: miralax [mailto:miralax ] On Behalf Of jeanie wardSent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 7:27 PMTo: miralax Subject: RE: Miralax forum OMG! Come on Jack..........Are you soliciting a response from me? What is wrong with you??? From: Jack Gershon <jackgershon (DOT) cc>Subject: Miralax forumTo: miralax@yahoogroups .comDate: Tuesday, September 15, 2009, 1:00 AM It is amazing what is read in my posts that I didn't write. I wonder what type of mental image some of you have formed of me? Here is who I am: I am a parent. I have a kid who becomes constipated without Miralax. I know the cause of his constipation. I'm scared of using something that will harm him. Since I have not found any other viable alternatives to Miralax, I seek good information. I get combative when I read responses about this great conspiracy to hurt our kids. If there was anything here concrete enough that I could take to a doctor, you wouldn't hear me shouting for good information. A significant portion of what I get here states that Coke-Cola, our doctors, pharmaceutical companies, and the FDA are all trying to hurt our kids. I don't buy it. The files are thin, very thin. I know many of you disagree with me, but without a certain degree of bias against PeG 3350, the files don't paint the picture some here see. There are assumptions that you have to believe for the files to stand up. I disagree with some of the assumptions. Do I trust doctors? I trust that they have a much better education than I do. I trust myself to bring them the right questions. I trust that if I ask questions of them that their answers will be in some fashion derived from that education. I trust myself to press them harder when I don't trust their answer. People here don't like my questions? You should be present from some of the 'discussions' I have had with my son's doctors. Doctors do not like to be challenged either. I pay for their expertise. They need to substantiate as well. Bonnie, Thank you for your response. I can understand your concern based on your experiences. My case is a bit different. We don't have the contents taking weeks to move through my son's system. As such, we probably aren't seeing the same effects that a 'prolonged stay' might cause my son. I sincerely hope your daughter does well and you can find a solution to whatever is the cause of her constipation. Yvette, Please quit looking for the absolute worst in my posts. I said that there is SOME bad information here. I also stated that there is good information to be found here as well. No, I do not hold a degree in chemical engineering or any related field. I wish I did. It would make it possible to better understand some of the data I have come across here and elsewhere. I am relying on common sense and mathematics. When I see articles with toxicity reports and the dosages that induced toxicity are ridiculously large, things like that jump off the page at me. , I have stated my reason for being here again and again. I want good information about PeG 3350 and what side effects have been documented. Susie, I'm really not all that lazy, just busy, as I am sure you are as well. I google this topic a whole lot. I am not finding anything out there to support the opinion of this forum. As such, I challenge this forum to share their information. Honeymarkey, I have stated again and again that I am not challenging anyone's personal experience. But have you tried taking "Jane Doe on the internet reports X' to your doctors as reliable information? Jeanie, You and I read the same words and focus on completely different aspects. You highlighted the blue, while I focused on the red. "It is similar to floor wax. It is a big polymer, and it has a very low toxicity because it is a large molecule that is absorbed or metabolized not at all by humans." That is probably why we take exception to each other. "why can't you see what I see?" (could be either one of us thinking that) We disagree. I can live with that. , I honestly appreciate your post. It is going to take some time to review your abstracts. The abstracts are, again, not very concrete. There are a lot of 'coulds' and 'mays' in there. For me, those are leap of faith type of stuff. But you raise valid points in your posts. You are right about my lack of sensitivty. I apologize to everyone here for starting a ruckus. It is not my intent to minimize any of your experiences. I will try to ask my questions with greater respect for your feelings and experiences. I'm sure none of you will be surprised if I continue my skepticism. My quest for answers has not changed. Jack No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG - www.avg.comVersion: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.99/2372 - Release Date: 09/15/09 05:59:00 No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG - www.avg.comVersion: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.100/2373 - Release Date: 09/15/09 13:37:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 15, 2009 Report Share Posted September 15, 2009 Just jumping in regarding 'grainy stools'. Was this like little black ground pepper grains that dont easily wipe off? Cheers Hannah Subject: Re: Miralax forumTo: miralax Received: Wednesday, 16 September, 2009, 12:45 AM Have you tried anything else? MOM, or Natural Calm, or Kirkmans Mag. Citrate? My daughter has severe hypotonia, motility problems, food allergies, colitis and autism. She also had horrible reflux on miralax and now does not have it at all......... ....the colitis has also cleared. No more grainy stools either. The worse thing she has is spasms in her foot that we have not been able to resolve..... ......... ...... I tried weaning miralax many, many times, It didn't work. We had to go cold turkey and deal with the after affects for about 2 months before she started getting better...... ....... From: Jack Gershon To: miralax@yahoogroups .com Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 10:39 AM Subject: RE: Miralax forum Kathy, Please read my most recent post. Your child's situation may be vastly different from that of my sons. Jack From: miralax@yahoogroups .com [mailto:miralax@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of KathySent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 10:30 AMTo: miralax@yahoogroups .comSubject: Re: Miralax forum Jack, I don't want to get into this, but have you ever been harmed by a Pharma drug, or by anything done by a doctor? Doctor's are trained on drugs and surgery, not natural methods or any methods that use the body to heal and help itself. The body is not deficient in PEG or miralax or any other chemical. It may be deficient in specific nutrients or it may not be absorbing the nutrients due to leaky gut or any type of lack of absorption caused by food allergy or many other reasons. So therefore, it makes sense to get to the bottom of the issue regarding the constipation, so to speak. It can be caused by many things. Think out of the box. Chiropractors can help, naturopaths can help. If you don't want to take the advice here then that's fine, but we know how detrimental this drug can be especially used long term. As a parent you don't want to see you child in any type of pain and it can be hard to stop using miralax, the parent can become dependent on it due to frustration or fear of nothing else working. Believe me I've been there. We used it for 7 years ! It is possible to get off it. My child is still suffering from some of the effects of it even after being off it for 2 years. It took one year of the Low oxalate diet to help rid her body of the oxalates caused by miralax. I know this to be true due to the nature of her stools and also testing. Doctors do not explore so deeply into problems and causes like we as parents do. We love our kids and don't want them to suffer in any way, so we go to the ends of the earth to find out what is causing the problem and how to solve it. Keep searching, but just know the advice you get here is better than any double blind placebo study or a commercial on TV praising the virtues of the latest drug. We're in the trenches 24/7 and this makes us experts in many ways ! Oh, BTW, many doctors believe this laxative is problematic as well, not just the parents..... ......... Kathy Miralax forum It is amazing what is read in my posts that I didn't write. I wonder what type of mental image some of you have formed of me? Here is who I am: I am a parent. I have a kid who becomes constipated without Miralax. I know the cause of his constipation. I'm scared of using something that will harm him. Since I have not found any other viable alternatives to Miralax, I seek good information. I get combative when I read responses about this great conspiracy to hurt our kids. If there was anything here concrete enough that I could take to a doctor, you wouldn't hear me shouting for good information. No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG - www.avg.comVersion: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.99/2372 - Release Date: 09/15/09 05:59:00 No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.99/2372 - Release Date: 09/15/09 05:59:00 Get more done like never before with Yahoo!7 Mail. Learn more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 15, 2009 Report Share Posted September 15, 2009 I am going to jump in here. Studies, research theory assumption. Fact is this stuff isnt approved for pedatric use. I know a lot of kids that do miralax recover and do great no constipation for years after. My children had constipation reflux and a comprimised immune system and it was a disaster for them. I also know of other children with social axiety disorder during miralax. Every child is different. I you give this miralax to your child (which i dont recommend because the fricken fda says not to) and they dont react. Good, your lucky. When it comes right down to it, it is not approved for children. It is just that darn simple. Prevacid isnt approved for infants and I gave it to my children because they had failure to thrive. That was my choice and it was an informed one. Most parents that are prescribed miralax for a child are never informed that it is not approved for children and there is something severely wrong with that. I personally believe that a parent should be shown all options and know that this stuff is not approved. Not trying to be rude, please forgive me if I sound that way. To: miralax Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 6:27:11 PMSubject: RE: Miralax forum OMG! Come on Jack........ ..Are you soliciting a response from me? What is wrong with you??? From: Jack Gershon <jackgershon (DOT) cc>Subject: Miralax forumTo: miralax@yahoogroups .comDate: Tuesday, September 15, 2009, 1:00 AM It is amazing what is read in my posts that I didn't write. I wonder what type of mental image some of you have formed of me? Here is who I am: I am a parent. I have a kid who becomes constipated without Miralax. I know the cause of his constipation. I'm scared of using something that will harm him. Since I have not found any other viable alternatives to Miralax, I seek good information. I get combative when I read responses about this great conspiracy to hurt our kids. If there was anything here concrete enough that I could take to a doctor, you wouldn't hear me shouting for good information. A significant portion of what I get here states that Coke-Cola, our doctors, pharmaceutical companies, and the FDA are all trying to hurt our kids. I don't buy it. The files are thin, very thin. I know many of you disagree with me, but without a certain degree of bias against PeG 3350, the files don't paint the picture some here see. There are assumptions that you have to believe for the files to stand up. I disagree with some of the assumptions. Do I trust doctors? I trust that they have a much better education than I do. I trust myself to bring them the right questions. I trust that if I ask questions of them that their answers will be in some fashion derived from that education. I trust myself to press them harder when I don't trust their answer. People here don't like my questions? You should be present from some of the 'discussions' I have had with my son's doctors. Doctors do not like to be challenged either. I pay for their expertise. They need to substantiate as well. Bonnie, Thank you for your response. I can understand your concern based on your experiences. My case is a bit different. We don't have the contents taking weeks to move through my son's system. As such, we probably aren't seeing the same effects that a 'prolonged stay' might cause my son. I sincerely hope your daughter does well and you can find a solution to whatever is the cause of her constipation. Yvette, Please quit looking for the absolute worst in my posts. I said that there is SOME bad information here. I also stated that there is good information to be found here as well. No, I do not hold a degree in chemical engineering or any related field. I wish I did. It would make it possible to better understand some of the data I have come across here and elsewhere. I am relying on common sense and mathematics. When I see articles with toxicity reports and the dosages that induced toxicity are ridiculously large, things like that jump off the page at me. , I have stated my reason for being here again and again. I want good information about PeG 3350 and what side effects have been documented. Susie, I'm really not all that lazy, just busy, as I am sure you are as well. I google this topic a whole lot. I am not finding anything out there to support the opinion of this forum. As such, I challenge this forum to share their information. Honeymarkey, I have stated again and again that I am not challenging anyone's personal experience. But have you tried taking "Jane Doe on the internet reports X' to your doctors as reliable information? Jeanie, You and I read the same words and focus on completely different aspects. You highlighted the blue, while I focused on the red. "It is similar to floor wax. It is a big polymer, and it has a very low toxicity because it is a large molecule that is absorbed or metabolized not at all by humans." That is probably why we take exception to each other. "why can't you see what I see?" (could be either one of us thinking that) We disagree. I can live with that. , I honestly appreciate your post. It is going to take some time to review your abstracts. The abstracts are, again, not very concrete. There are a lot of 'coulds' and 'mays' in there. For me, those are leap of faith type of stuff. But you raise valid points in your posts. You are right about my lack of sensitivty. I apologize to everyone here for starting a ruckus. It is not my intent to minimize any of your experiences. I will try to ask my questions with greater respect for your feelings and experiences. I'm sure none of you will be surprised if I continue my skepticism. My quest for answers has not changed. Jack No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG - www.avg.comVersion: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.99/2372 - Release Date: 09/15/09 05:59:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 15, 2009 Report Share Posted September 15, 2009 When he is off the Miralax, the stool are ball shaped that are smaller than grapes, but larger than pees. About the size of a small cocktail onion. The stool balls are hard as stone. They are dark in color. Not quite black, but close. You can crush them between your finger and thumb, and the stool disintegrates into a sandlike powder. The 'sand' inside is much lighter in color, yellow/brown. From: miralax [mailto:miralax ] On Behalf Of Hannah AlanSent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 9:24 PMTo: miralax Subject: Re: Miralax forum Just jumping in regarding 'grainy stools'. Was this like little black ground pepper grains that dont easily wipe off? Cheers Hannah From: Kathy <jhud2earthlink (DOT) net>Subject: Re: Miralax forumTo: miralax Received: Wednesday, 16 September, 2009, 12:45 AM Have you tried anything else? MOM, or Natural Calm, or Kirkmans Mag. Citrate? My daughter has severe hypotonia, motility problems, food allergies, colitis and autism. She also had horrible reflux on miralax and now does not have it at all......... ....the colitis has also cleared. No more grainy stools either. The worse thing she has is spasms in her foot that we have not been able to resolve..... ......... ...... I tried weaning miralax many, many times, It didn't work. We had to go cold turkey and deal with the after affects for about 2 months before she started getting better...... ....... From: Jack Gershon To: miralax@yahoogroups .com Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 10:39 AM Subject: RE: Miralax forum Kathy, Please read my most recent post. Your child's situation may be vastly different from that of my sons. Jack From: miralax@yahoogroups .com [mailto:miralax@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of KathySent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 10:30 AMTo: miralax@yahoogroups .comSubject: Re: Miralax forum Jack, I don't want to get into this, but have you ever been harmed by a Pharma drug, or by anything done by a doctor? Doctor's are trained on drugs and surgery, not natural methods or any methods that use the body to heal and help itself. The body is not deficient in PEG or miralax or any other chemical. It may be deficient in specific nutrients or it may not be absorbing the nutrients due to leaky gut or any type of lack of absorption caused by food allergy or many other reasons. So therefore, it makes sense to get to the bottom of the issue regarding the constipation, so to speak. It can be caused by many things. Think out of the box. Chiropractors can help, naturopaths can help. If you don't want to take the advice here then that's fine, but we know how detrimental this drug can be especially used long term. As a parent you don't want to see you child in any type of pain and it can be hard to stop using miralax, the parent can become dependent on it due to frustration or fear of nothing else working. Believe me I've been there. We used it for 7 years ! It is possible to get off it. My child is still suffering from some of the effects of it even after being off it for 2 years. It took one year of the Low oxalate diet to help rid her body of the oxalates caused by miralax. I know this to be true due to the nature of her stools and also testing. Doctors do not explore so deeply into problems and causes like we as parents do. We love our kids and don't want them to suffer in any way, so we go to the ends of the earth to find out what is causing the problem and how to solve it. Keep searching, but just know the advice you get here is better than any double blind placebo study or a commercial on TV praising the virtues of the latest drug. We're in the trenches 24/7 and this makes us experts in many ways ! Oh, BTW, many doctors believe this laxative is problematic as well, not just the parents..... ......... Kathy Miralax forum It is amazing what is read in my posts that I didn't write. I wonder what type of mental image some of you have formed of me? Here is who I am: I am a parent. I have a kid who becomes constipated without Miralax. I know the cause of his constipation. I'm scared of using something that will harm him. Since I have not found any other viable alternatives to Miralax, I seek good information. I get combative when I read responses about this great conspiracy to hurt our kids. If there was anything here concrete enough that I could take to a doctor, you wouldn't hear me shouting for good information. No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG - www.avg.comVersion: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.99/2372 - Release Date: 09/15/09 05:59:00 No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.99/2372 - Release Date: 09/15/09 05:59:00 Get more done like never before with Yahoo!7 Mail. Learn more. No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG - www.avg.comVersion: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.100/2373 - Release Date: 09/15/09 13:37:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 15, 2009 Report Share Posted September 15, 2009 YES !! She had that for years !! Miralax forum It is amazing what is read in my posts that I didn't write. I wonder what type of mental image some of you have formed of me? Here is who I am: I am a parent. I have a kid who becomes constipated without Miralax. I know the cause of his constipation. I'm scared of using something that will harm him. Since I have not found any other viable alternatives to Miralax, I seek good information. I get combative when I read responses about this great conspiracy to hurt our kids. If there was anything here concrete enough that I could take to a doctor, you wouldn't hear me shouting for good information. No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG - www.avg.comVersion: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.99/2372 - Release Date: 09/15/09 05:59:00 No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.99/2372 - Release Date: 09/15/09 05:59:00 Get more done like never before with Yahoo!7 Mail. Learn more. No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.99/2372 - Release Date: 09/15/09 05:59:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 15, 2009 Report Share Posted September 15, 2009 Did you ever work out what it was?? I could never quite pinpoint its cause or what it was exactly.cheers Hannah From: Kathy <jhud2earthlink (DOT) net>Subject: Re: Miralax forumTo: miralax@yahoogroups .comReceived: Wednesday, 16 September, 2009, 12:45 AM Have you tried anything else? MOM, or Natural Calm, or Kirkmans Mag. Citrate? My daughter has severe hypotonia, motility problems, food allergies, colitis and autism. She also had horrible reflux on miralax and now does not have it at all......... ....the colitis has also cleared. No more grainy stools either. The worse thing she has is spasms in her foot that we have not been able to resolve..... ......... ...... I tried weaning miralax many, many times, It didn't work. We had to go cold turkey and deal with the after affects for about 2 months before she started getting better...... ....... From: Jack Gershon To: miralax@yahoogroups .com Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 10:39 AM Subject: RE: Miralax forum Kathy, Please read my most recent post. Your child's situation may be vastly different from that of my sons. Jack From: miralax@yahoogroups .com [mailto:miralax@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of KathySent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 10:30 AMTo: miralax@yahoogroups .comSubject: Re: Miralax forum Jack, I don't want to get into this, but have you ever been harmed by a Pharma drug, or by anything done by a doctor? Doctor's are trained on drugs and surgery, not natural methods or any methods that use the body to heal and help itself. The body is not deficient in PEG or miralax or any other chemical. It may be deficient in specific nutrients or it may not be absorbing the nutrients due to leaky gut or any type of lack of absorption caused by food allergy or many other reasons. So therefore, it makes sense to get to the bottom of the issue regarding the constipation, so to speak. It can be caused by many things. Think out of the box. Chiropractors can help, naturopaths can help. If you don't want to take the advice here then that's fine, but we know how detrimental this drug can be especially used long term. As a parent you don't want to see you child in any type of pain and it can be hard to stop using miralax, the parent can become dependent on it due to frustration or fear of nothing else working. Believe me I've been there. We used it for 7 years ! It is possible to get off it. My child is still suffering from some of the effects of it even after being off it for 2 years. It took one year of the Low oxalate diet to help rid her body of the oxalates caused by miralax. I know this to be true due to the nature of her stools and also testing. Doctors do not explore so deeply into problems and causes like we as parents do. We love our kids and don't want them to suffer in any way, so we go to the ends of the earth to find out what is causing the problem and how to solve it. Keep searching, but just know the advice you get here is better than any double blind placebo study or a commercial on TV praising the virtues of the latest drug. We're in the trenches 24/7 and this makes us experts in many ways ! Oh, BTW, many doctors believe this laxative is problematic as well, not just the parents..... ......... Kathy Miralax forum It is amazing what is read in my posts that I didn't write. I wonder what type of mental image some of you have formed of me? Here is who I am: I am a parent. I have a kid who becomes constipated without Miralax. I know the cause of his constipation. I'm scared of using something that will harm him. Since I have not found any other viable alternatives to Miralax, I seek good information. I get combative when I read responses about this great conspiracy to hurt our kids. If there was anything here concrete enough that I could take to a doctor, you wouldn't hear me shouting for good information. No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG - www.avg.comVersion: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.99/2372 - Release Date: 09/15/09 05:59:00 No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.99/2372 - Release Date: 09/15/09 05:59:00 Get more done like never before with Yahoo!7 Mail. Learn more. No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.99/2372 - Release Date: 09/15/09 05:59:00 Get more done like never before with Yahoo!7 Mail. Learn more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 Truthfully Jack, I really don't care if you disagree...............The way you've treated eveyone on here makes me think you don't deserve any responses. If you talk to us this way makes me feel very sorry for your child. From: Jack Gershon <jackgershon (DOT) cc>Subject: Miralax forumTo: miralax@yahoogroups .comDate: Tuesday, September 15, 2009, 1:00 AM It is amazing what is read in my posts that I didn't write. I wonder what type of mental image some of you have formed of me? Here is who I am: I am a parent. I have a kid who becomes constipated without Miralax. I know the cause of his constipation. I'm scared of using something that will harm him. Since I have not found any other viable alternatives to Miralax, I seek good information. I get combative when I read responses about this great conspiracy to hurt our kids. If there was anything here concrete enough that I could take to a doctor, you wouldn't hear me shouting for good information. A significant portion of what I get here states that Coke-Cola, our doctors, pharmaceutical companies, and the FDA are all trying to hurt our kids. I don't buy it. The files are thin, very thin. I know many of you disagree with me, but without a certain degree of bias against PeG 3350, the files don't paint the picture some here see. There are assumptions that you have to believe for the files to stand up. I disagree with some of the assumptions. Do I trust doctors? I trust that they have a much better education than I do. I trust myself to bring them the right questions. I trust that if I ask questions of them that their answers will be in some fashion derived from that education. I trust myself to press them harder when I don't trust their answer. People here don't like my questions? You should be present from some of the 'discussions' I have had with my son's doctors. Doctors do not like to be challenged either. I pay for their expertise. They need to substantiate as well. Bonnie, Thank you for your response. I can understand your concern based on your experiences. My case is a bit different. We don't have the contents taking weeks to move through my son's system. As such, we probably aren't seeing the same effects that a 'prolonged stay' might cause my son. I sincerely hope your daughter does well and you can find a solution to whatever is the cause of her constipation. Yvette, Please quit looking for the absolute worst in my posts. I said that there is SOME bad information here. I also stated that there is good information to be found here as well. No, I do not hold a degree in chemical engineering or any related field. I wish I did. It would make it possible to better understand some of the data I have come across here and elsewhere. I am relying on common sense and mathematics. When I see articles with toxicity reports and the dosages that induced toxicity are ridiculously large, things like that jump off the page at me. , I have stated my reason for being here again and again. I want good information about PeG 3350 and what side effects have been documented. Susie, I'm really not all that lazy, just busy, as I am sure you are as well. I google this topic a whole lot. I am not finding anything out there to support the opinion of this forum. As such, I challenge this forum to share their information. Honeymarkey, I have stated again and again that I am not challenging anyone's personal experience. But have you tried taking "Jane Doe on the internet reports X' to your doctors as reliable information? Jeanie, You and I read the same words and focus on completely different aspects. You highlighted the blue, while I focused on the red. "It is similar to floor wax. It is a big polymer, and it has a very low toxicity because it is a large molecule that is absorbed or metabolized not at all by humans." That is probably why we take exception to each other. "why can't you see what I see?" (could be either one of us thinking that) We disagree. I can live with that. , I honestly appreciate your post. It is going to take some time to review your abstracts. The abstracts are, again, not very concrete. There are a lot of 'coulds' and 'mays' in there. For me, those are leap of faith type of stuff. But you raise valid points in your posts. You are right about my lack of sensitivty. I apologize to everyone here for starting a ruckus. It is not my intent to minimize any of your experiences. I will try to ask my questions with greater respect for your feelings and experiences. I'm sure none of you will be surprised if I continue my skepticism. My quest for answers has not changed. Jack No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG - www.avg.comVersion: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.99/2372 - Release Date: 09/15/09 05:59:00 No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG - www.avg.comVersion: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.100/2373 - Release Date: 09/15/09 13:37:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 pretty sure it was the miralax causing high oxalates hence those crystals or whatever they were. i'm not a doctor, but a mom very experienced in studying stools. all this went away after stopping miralax and doing low oxalate for about a year........... ----- Original Message ----- From: Hannah Alan To: miralax Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 2009 11:41 PM No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.99/2372 - Release Date: 09/15/09 05:59:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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