Re: Pain is a treatable disease- why wont the doctor treat it? the answer is here

December 7, 2009

Barby, After three years in this group, I have heard this same story over and

over... A person is suffering from liver pain, or spleen pain, and has yet to be

treated for it. All the peer reviewed papers I have read differentiate between

cancer pain and non cancer pain. Our society is so insane when it comes to

poppies, they actually separate the two, as if pain from cancer is worse. No

other area of medicine does this. I have read that pain from a compound

fracture of the long bones is right up there with birth and gun shot wounds and

billary collick, which is gallbladder spasms. The other word for gallbladder

spasms is " billary diskinesia " . I have Billary diskinesia, even though my

gallbladder is gone. Can you imagine a doctor telling you that he can treat your

diabetes as long as it is type one and not type two? Most of all, I do not

understand how there are so many new guidelines for treating pain, but it seems

like no one is paying any attention

to them except our doctor. I know that this isnt true, because there are others

here who have a good pain doctor, but most who need one do not have one.

I hope you guys find a good one and that he helps Bobby Glenn once and for all.

love bobby

long life, old age, everything good-Apache prayer

________________________________

To: livercirrhosissupport

Sent: Mon, December 7, 2009 8:23:09 AM

Subject: Re: Pain is a treatable disease- why wont the

doctor treat it? the answer is here

bobby i hope you get feeling better soon my friend, we are experiencing that

side pain here as well, asking dr. on the 23rd.for a pain specialist, excuse my

french but i have had enough of this shit ,hes suffered enough in the past 8

weeks from that stupid treatment, he just told me his side and chest by his

heart was hurting so bad he almost work me up to go to the ER at 330 am. i said

why didnt you honey ,he said he wanted me to sleep....so of course that lead to

me getting upset that i was asleep and he was suffering alone. i take maimtaince

meds. to stay ahead of my dragons head for my back, so i understand what you are

saying.some days i wonder barby do you really need to swallow that half of blue

pill today...then i remeber what happens when i decide i didnt need them

anymore, in the bed for 3 days from picking up a bag of stupid potatoes...cause

i was feeling great and didnt practice my rountine of lifting with my legs

instead of my back. so i

swollow that half a pill twice a day.just to be safe. i feel nothing of them.

its likje eating a vitiam but they do there job i guess. and i want something

doing its job for my husband and everyone else who is suffering. thank you once

again bobby love ya man!!!

>

> Dear Twila, I am so sorry to hear about your loss. What a terrible thing to

endure. My prayers are with you.

> About the pain problem, I do have something to say about that.

>

> This is not meant to be divisive or partisan in any way so I ask all who read

it to take it in the spirit I am saying it. In a spirit of helping a fellow

human alleviate his terrible suffering. I was being seen by a primary care

doctor, gastro interologist, hepatologist, surgeon, and none of these fine

doctors ever offered me any thing for pain despite me reporting pain in each of

dozens of visits. My wife has a debilitating brain condition called Chiari

Malformation, and I took a page from her play book. I asked my primary care

doctor for a referral to a pain specialist. Do not expect a primary care or

hepatologist or any other specialist to give good pain treatment. It is not

going to happen. They will do anything to avoid properly treating pain!! Even if

they do write a script, it will contain Tylenol, which makes it toxic and adds

an upward limit, or will be a weak synthetic so they can avoid the

responsibility of prescribing a real opioid . Opioid

> analgesics do not have an upward limit. The proper dose is one in which the

doctor has found by upward adjusting the drug to the pain. If the pain doctor

tells you otherwise, he is afraid of being procecuted, anf nothing more. Doctors

learn in med school something they never ever want patients to know...

>

> Opiates can be increased untill the level of pain is controlled or adverse

side effects happen. If that turns out to be a higher than normal dose, then

that is what the individual person's body chemistry needed for his or her pain.

>

> They cannot do this with an opioid naive patient, meaning " not used to it " ,

though because it can cause respitory depression, but even that will not occur

if the medicine is titrated or adjusted against the pain level.

> The biggest obstacle is this-

> We are in the midst of a WAR on drugs. Doctors are in the crosshairs because

of high profile celebrity deaths as a result of their abuse of drugs.

> Can you imageing having surgery and being told that because of

's abuse of Propofol, you cannot recieve any for your surgery? The

doctors are terrified of being arrested. Many have been already. There is a

phenomen called " pseudo addiction " which looks like addiction, but occurs when a

person has real pain, and does bizzarre and illegal things to get drugs for his

pain. This only lends to the histeria.

> These meds are the most misunderstood medicines, no,make that SUBSTANCES on

the entire planet. One major misunderstanding is that only two side effects will

remain after a few weeks of constant use... dilated pupils, and constipation.

>

> The feelings of euphoria dissappear. (The thrill is gone)

>

> The respiratory depression will dissappear.

>

> The reason people get addiced is that the euphoria dissappears, and the

patient will want it back.

> Of course the only way to get it back is to increase the doasge.

> A person could go from taking 50 milligrams a day to taking 50 grams a day.

This would be the beginning of addiction. Heroin addicts do this.

> A smart pain patient who wants his pain to be soothed will not.

> He will take only what is prescribed, exactly as prescribed, and if some days

it does not work as well because the liver is aching worse than usual, then so

be it. (Barby, this is what I meant when I said I was under the weather lately)

> I am describing me here. I started out taking only 5 milligrams of oxycodone

a day. Now I take 80 mg of morphine. It works most of the time. But when I eat

protien or fat, It does not. I have end stage liver disease, portal

hypertension, and an enlarged spleen. i am in severe pain. I was very very

afraid of becoming addicted to the medicine, but my doctor told me that if I

only do what he advises, I will not and so far he has been right. I take less

than I am allowed, and choose to be in some amount of pain rather than always

max out. I call this " keeping my body BEHIND the head of the DRAGON "

> ( never let any part of your body get in front of the dragon's head, I always

say)

> It is like riding a dragon. I am a recovering alcoholic. I have to use those

12 steps every day, all day.

>

> I thank GOD for my pain doctor. Before I get treatment, I used to have

nightmares that a coyote was chewing on my side, or that I have been shot by a

robber. I cannot, nor do I want to live with untreated pain. I have to jump

through hoops every month, because there are shortages here every month, but it

is worth it. Before , I was desperate, but now most days I am comfortable at

least some of the time.

> My other doctors seem relieved that they do not have to adress my pain issues.

I have run in to opioid biased doctors in the hospital, but so far not as bad as

friends of mine have. These friends have actually had thier pain meds taken away

by doctors in the hospital!!

> Here is the link to our groups copy of the intractable pain patient's survival

guide. -it is 9th on this list- Please download it and read it.

>

> http://health. groups.yahoo. com/group/ livercirrhosissu pport/files/

>

> Please call the doctor and ask for a referral to see a good PHYSIATRIST, who

specializes in rehabilitation and pain medicine. My pain doc tells me to say

this " pain management is not the same as pain medicine!! " . Pain " medicine " is

the key work here. Good luck, and God bless you. Love, Bobby

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

> From: tjingham <tjingham@.. .>

> To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> Sent: Sun, December 6, 2009 7:23:00 AM

> Subject: It's Been Awhile...

>

> Haven't posted much of late, but lurking in the corners, reading all your

posts when time permits. Hope everyone is doing as well as expected and

enjoying the company of loved ones this holiday season.

>

> We're working up to Christmas as best we can this year. I don't remember if I

told ya'all or not, but our son died just 4 days short of his 30th birthday, on

Sept 30th, so October was pretty much a non-existent month for us. November

wasn't much better. There's no easy way to say this, so I'll just say it....get

it out there. He hung himself in a friend's garage, leaving his two sons, age 7

& 13, behind. He'd had an extremely difficult summer trying to get his wife of

2 years, to work on their marriage with him. Thankfully, she's NOT the mother

of his sons. She bounced him around, in and out, up and down, like a yo yo and

I guess he just couldn't do it anymore. He was a good kid, with a huge heart

that he wore on his sleeve. He just never managed to put up any fences around

that heart to keep it from being broken, so he had no way to protect himself or

his heart from being squashed.

>

> I think the hardest part of this for me, is that he didn't even leave a note

telling those of us that did love him, goodbye. Throughout the summer,

and I kinda' saw something like this coming, but we couldn't figure a way to

stop it. I kept reaching out to him whenever I could reach him at all, but to

no avail. I saw him that morning and he seemed fine. A bit perturbed that he

needed to ask me for gas money, but that's what kids do, isn't it? It was kind

of funny, cuz just as he was pulling in to get the $ from me, he ran out of gas.

Yeah, it's ok to smile here.

>

> Anyway, we're beginning to see some light here and there. I've always loved

the holiday season and expect I will again. But this year will be a bit

tougher. Thank God we have his sons, our two grandsons to dote on and to spoil.

Especially now. They get all the love we had for our son plus the love we hold

for them! The youngest one, 7, lived with us from the time he was 18 mos. till

he was about 5 1/2, so he still considers our home to be his home no matter

where he and his mom lives, (not 'the wife'). But because of that, he also

thinks he should be here with us most of the time. Ha! More work for Grandma!

Seriously though, we're so blessed to have them. They both live near by now, so

seeing them whenever, is usually just involves a phone call to their respective

mothers and a pickup time.

>

> But this is not the reason I wanted to write today. For those that don't

know, or don't remember, I am the care giver. My husband is the one with

cirrhosis, (NASH), polycythemia, & now, type 2 diabetes. He's doing ok, and

occassionally has better days, but he's experiencing a lot of leg and foot pain.

He's been taking 20-24 units of insulin once day at bed time since April. Since

starting insulin, he also started having HUGE headaches & lots of dizziness,

that wouldn't go away for days at a time. His newest primary decided to change

from Levimir to Lantus about 2 months ago. That seems to have helped the

headaches & dizziness considerably. Also seems that his foot swelling has

subsided quite a bit, but the foot pain still exists. Most days his feet and

legs hurt so badly he can hardly walk around the house.

>

> And of course, there's the issue of extreme fatigue and grogginess. Seems to

be a vicious circle for him. He's exhausted. Manages to sleep 2-4 hours, then

the pain in his legs and feet wakes him up and the cycle starts all over again.

He also seems to have a lot of abdominal pain/cramping. Keeps complaining about

stomach upset/pain. Sometimes Pepcid helps, sometimes baking soda or alka

seltzer helps. Sometimes nothing helps.

>

> We've tried to talk to the doctors about these issues; both his liver

specialists and his primary. But they either don't care or because they've

'never heard of such a thing', they ignore it. We've tried several OTC pain

meds but nothing seems to help. The funny thing is that it doesn't seem to

matter whether or not his feet are swollen, he still has the pain. I strongly

suspect it's nerve damage, but can't get the doctors to 'do' anything about it.

>

> The specialists have done a new abdominal ultra sound and thoroughly checked

his one remaining kidney. They also did a brain CT scan to check for any

abnormalities there. I said " it's pretty tough to look for brain tumors etc

where there's no brain " , but didn't think that was very funny. Both

tests were normal for his condition. No new surprises to deal with.

>

> Seems to me, though, that if he could get some relief from the foot & leg

pain, he'd probably sleep a bit better and in turn, not be so tired and worn out

all the time. And maybe not quite so crabby! Especially since it's the

pain that seems to be the waking factor.

>

> I'm wondering what kind of pain meds some of you are getting and what it's

for? And how the hell do you get the doctors to listen to you about the pain

you're all experiencing? ! It's been danged frustrating for us!

>

> That's about it for now. Sorry for the long post. I really should make time

to post more often, then maybe my novels would be more like novelets!

>

> OH, as for the Christmas decorating.. .I've got 2 little lighted decorations

outside, some lighted things in the window, but no tree yet. It's still in the

garage and now that winter is smacking us right in the face, I'm not convinced I

want to go dig it out. I'm sure I will, but not much before next weekend now.

NO time today. To put the tree up, I have to make room for it...that means

putting my one and only living room chair or my exercise bike out in the garage

until time to take the tree down. The bike's way too heavy to haul out there,

so the chair gets relegated to the garage temporarily. So, I procrastinate.

I'll put up a pic when I finally 'git er done'. Yep, I think next weekend

will be the weekend to put up the tree and get my Christmas candies made and get

the annual Christmas letter done & mailed. That outta' be enough to keep me

busy for one weekend. Ya' think?

>

> Thanks all for 'listening' to me. I truly love this group, even if I don't

'come around much'. Merry Christmas to all of you! I hope each of you has a

blessed Christmas this year and for years to come!

>

> Twila

>

December 7, 2009

Bobby,

I think it's really sad. Pain is so treatable and yet so hard to get

treatment for. Luckily my doctor does prescribe pain medication. If

he didn't I'd have to find a new one. Of course, my insurance runs

out at the end of the month.....so there is no telling what can of

worms that will open. At the pharmacy they look down their noses at

me and the pharmacists hangs on to my prescription until the day

before I'm out when it had been approved by my doctor days before.

This is a new thing to deal with. I'm like.......excuse

me........isn't there like a window of time or something? Are you my

doctor? I just keep my mouth shut though.

love,

Roni

> Barby, After three years in this group, I have heard this same story

> over and over... A person is suffering from liver pain, or spleen

> pain, and has yet to be treated for it. All the peer reviewed papers

> I have read differentiate between cancer pain and non cancer pain.

> Our society is so insane when it comes to poppies, they actually

> separate the two, as if pain from cancer is worse. No other area of

> medicine does this. I have read that pain from a compound fracture

> of the long bones is right up there with birth and gun shot wounds

> and billary collick, which is gallbladder spasms. The other word for

> gallbladder spasms is " billary diskinesia " . I have Billary

> diskinesia, even though my gallbladder is gone. Can you imagine a

> doctor telling you that he can treat your diabetes as long as it is

> type one and not type two? Most of all, I do not understand how

> there are so many new guidelines for treating pain, but it seems

> like no one is paying any attention

> to them except our doctor. I know that this isnt true, because there

> are others here who have a good pain doctor, but most who need one

> do not have one.

> I hope you guys find a good one and that he helps Bobby Glenn once

> and for all.

>

> love bobby

>

> long life, old age, everything good-Apache prayer

>

> ________________________________

>

> To: livercirrhosissupport

> Sent: Mon, December 7, 2009 8:23:09 AM

> Subject: Re: Pain is a treatable disease-

> why wont the doctor treat it? the answer is here

>

> bobby i hope you get feeling better soon my friend, we are

> experiencing that side pain here as well, asking dr. on the 23rd.for

> a pain specialist, excuse my french but i have had enough of this

> shit ,hes suffered enough in the past 8 weeks from that stupid

> treatment, he just told me his side and chest by his heart was

> hurting so bad he almost work me up to go to the ER at 330 am. i

> said why didnt you honey ,he said he wanted me to sleep....so of

> course that lead to me getting upset that i was asleep and he was

> suffering alone. i take maimtaince meds. to stay ahead of my dragons

> head for my back, so i understand what you are saying.some days i

> wonder barby do you really need to swallow that half of blue pill

> today...then i remeber what happens when i decide i didnt need them

> anymore, in the bed for 3 days from picking up a bag of stupid

> potatoes...cause i was feeling great and didnt practice my rountine

> of lifting with my legs instead of my back. so i

> swollow that half a pill twice a day.just to be safe. i feel nothing

> of them. its likje eating a vitiam but they do there job i guess.

> and i want something doing its job for my husband and everyone else

> who is suffering. thank you once again bobby love ya man!!!

>

> >

> > Dear Twila, I am so sorry to hear about your loss. What a terrible

> thing to endure. My prayers are with you.

> > About the pain problem, I do have something to say about that.

> >

> > This is not meant to be divisive or partisan in any way so I ask

> all who read it to take it in the spirit I am saying it. In a spirit

> of helping a fellow human alleviate his terrible suffering. I was

> being seen by a primary care doctor, gastro interologist,

> hepatologist, surgeon, and none of these fine doctors ever offered

> me any thing for pain despite me reporting pain in each of dozens of

> visits. My wife has a debilitating brain condition called Chiari

> Malformation, and I took a page from her play book. I asked my

> primary care doctor for a referral to a pain specialist. Do not

> expect a primary care or hepatologist or any other specialist to

> give good pain treatment. It is not going to happen. They will do

> anything to avoid properly treating pain!! Even if they do write a

> script, it will contain Tylenol, which makes it toxic and adds an

> upward limit, or will be a weak synthetic so they can avoid the

> responsibility of prescribing a real opioid . Opioid

> > analgesics do not have an upward limit. The proper dose is one in

> which the doctor has found by upward adjusting the drug to the pain.

> If the pain doctor tells you otherwise, he is afraid of being

> procecuted, anf nothing more. Doctors learn in med school something

> they never ever want patients to know...

> >

> > Opiates can be increased untill the level of pain is controlled or

> adverse side effects happen. If that turns out to be a higher than

> normal dose, then that is what the individual person's body

> chemistry needed for his or her pain.

> >

> > They cannot do this with an opioid naive patient, meaning " not

> used to it " , though because it can cause respitory depression, but

> even that will not occur if the medicine is titrated or adjusted

> against the pain level.

> > The biggest obstacle is this-

> > We are in the midst of a WAR on drugs. Doctors are in the

> crosshairs because of high profile celebrity deaths as a result of

> their abuse of drugs.

> > Can you imageing having surgery and being told that because of

> 's abuse of Propofol, you cannot recieve any for your

> surgery? The doctors are terrified of being arrested. Many have been

> already. There is a phenomen called " pseudo addiction " which looks

> like addiction, but occurs when a person has real pain, and does

> bizzarre and illegal things to get drugs for his pain. This only

> lends to the histeria.

> > These meds are the most misunderstood medicines, no,make that

> SUBSTANCES on the entire planet. One major misunderstanding is that

> only two side effects will remain after a few weeks of constant

> use... dilated pupils, and constipation.

> >

> > The feelings of euphoria dissappear. (The thrill is gone)

> >

> > The respiratory depression will dissappear.

> >

> > The reason people get addiced is that the euphoria dissappears,

> and the patient will want it back.

> > Of course the only way to get it back is to increase the doasge.

> > A person could go from taking 50 milligrams a day to taking 50

> grams a day. This would be the beginning of addiction. Heroin

> addicts do this.

> > A smart pain patient who wants his pain to be soothed will not.

> > He will take only what is prescribed, exactly as prescribed, and

> if some days it does not work as well because the liver is aching

> worse than usual, then so be it. (Barby, this is what I meant when I

> said I was under the weather lately)

> > I am describing me here. I started out taking only 5 milligrams of

> oxycodone a day. Now I take 80 mg of morphine. It works most of the

> time. But when I eat protien or fat, It does not. I have end stage

> liver disease, portal hypertension, and an enlarged spleen. i am in

> severe pain. I was very very afraid of becoming addicted to the

> medicine, but my doctor told me that if I only do what he advises, I

> will not and so far he has been right. I take less than I am

> allowed, and choose to be in some amount of pain rather than always

> max out. I call this " keeping my body BEHIND the head of the DRAGON "

> > ( never let any part of your body get in front of the dragon's

> head, I always say)

> > It is like riding a dragon. I am a recovering alcoholic. I have to

> use those 12 steps every day, all day.

> >

> > I thank GOD for my pain doctor. Before I get treatment, I used to

> have nightmares that a coyote was chewing on my side, or that I have

> been shot by a robber. I cannot, nor do I want to live with

> untreated pain. I have to jump through hoops every month, because

> there are shortages here every month, but it is worth it. Before , I

> was desperate, but now most days I am comfortable at least some of

> the time.

> > My other doctors seem relieved that they do not have to adress my

> pain issues. I have run in to opioid biased doctors in the hospital,

> but so far not as bad as friends of mine have. These friends have

> actually had thier pain meds taken away by doctors in the hospital!!

> > Here is the link to our groups copy of the intractable pain

> patient's survival guide. -it is 9th on this list- Please download

> it and read it.

> >

> > http://health. groups.yahoo. com/group/ livercirrhosissu pport/

> files/

> >

> > Please call the doctor and ask for a referral to see a good

> PHYSIATRIST, who specializes in rehabilitation and pain medicine. My

> pain doc tells me to say this " pain management is not the same as

> pain medicine!! " . Pain " medicine " is the key work here. Good luck,

> and God bless you. Love, Bobby

> >

> > ____________ _________ _________ __

> > From: tjingham <tjingham@.. .>

> > To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com

> > Sent: Sun, December 6, 2009 7:23:00 AM

> > Subject: It's Been Awhile...

> >

> > Haven't posted much of late, but lurking in the corners, reading

> all your posts when time permits. Hope everyone is doing as well as

> expected and enjoying the company of loved ones this holiday season.

> >

> > We're working up to Christmas as best we can this year. I don't

> remember if I told ya'all or not, but our son died just 4 days short

> of his 30th birthday, on Sept 30th, so October was pretty much a non-

> existent month for us. November wasn't much better. There's no easy

> way to say this, so I'll just say it....get it out there. He hung

> himself in a friend's garage, leaving his two sons, age 7 & 13,

> behind. He'd had an extremely difficult summer trying to get his

> wife of 2 years, to work on their marriage with him. Thankfully,

> she's NOT the mother of his sons. She bounced him around, in and

> out, up and down, like a yo yo and I guess he just couldn't do it

> anymore. He was a good kid, with a huge heart that he wore on his

> sleeve. He just never managed to put up any fences around that heart

> to keep it from being broken, so he had no way to protect himself or

> his heart from being squashed.

> >

> > I think the hardest part of this for me, is that he didn't even

> leave a note telling those of us that did love him, goodbye.

> Throughout the summer, and I kinda' saw something like this

> coming, but we couldn't figure a way to stop it. I kept reaching out

> to him whenever I could reach him at all, but to no avail. I saw him

> that morning and he seemed fine. A bit perturbed that he needed to

> ask me for gas money, but that's what kids do, isn't it? It was kind

> of funny, cuz just as he was pulling in to get the $ from me, he ran

> out of gas. Yeah, it's ok to smile here.

> >

> > Anyway, we're beginning to see some light here and there. I've

> always loved the holiday season and expect I will again. But this

> year will be a bit tougher. Thank God we have his sons, our two

> grandsons to dote on and to spoil. Especially now. They get all the

> love we had for our son plus the love we hold for them! The youngest

> one, 7, lived with us from the time he was 18 mos. till he was about

> 5 1/2, so he still considers our home to be his home no matter where

> he and his mom lives, (not 'the wife'). But because of that, he also

> thinks he should be here with us most of the time. Ha! More work for

> Grandma! Seriously though, we're so blessed to have them. They both

> live near by now, so seeing them whenever, is usually just involves

> a phone call to their respective mothers and a pickup time.

> >

> > But this is not the reason I wanted to write today. For those that

> don't know, or don't remember, I am the care giver. My husband is

> the one with cirrhosis, (NASH), polycythemia, & now, type 2

> diabetes. He's doing ok, and occassionally has better days, but he's

> experiencing a lot of leg and foot pain. He's been taking 20-24

> units of insulin once day at bed time since April. Since starting

> insulin, he also started having HUGE headaches & lots of dizziness,

> that wouldn't go away for days at a time. His newest primary decided

> to change from Levimir to Lantus about 2 months ago. That seems to

> have helped the headaches & dizziness considerably. Also seems that

> his foot swelling has subsided quite a bit, but the foot pain still

> exists. Most days his feet and legs hurt so badly he can hardly walk

> around the house.

> >

> > And of course, there's the issue of extreme fatigue and

> grogginess. Seems to be a vicious circle for him. He's exhausted.

> Manages to sleep 2-4 hours, then the pain in his legs and feet wakes

> him up and the cycle starts all over again. He also seems to have a

> lot of abdominal pain/cramping. Keeps complaining about stomach

> upset/pain. Sometimes Pepcid helps, sometimes baking soda or alka

> seltzer helps. Sometimes nothing helps.

> >

> > We've tried to talk to the doctors about these issues; both his

> liver specialists and his primary. But they either don't care or

> because they've 'never heard of such a thing', they ignore it. We've

> tried several OTC pain meds but nothing seems to help. The funny

> thing is that it doesn't seem to matter whether or not his feet are

> swollen, he still has the pain. I strongly suspect it's nerve

> damage, but can't get the doctors to 'do' anything about it.

> >

> > The specialists have done a new abdominal ultra sound and

> thoroughly checked his one remaining kidney. They also did a brain

> CT scan to check for any abnormalities there. I said " it's pretty

> tough to look for brain tumors etc where there's no brain " , but

> didn't think that was very funny. Both tests were normal

> for his condition. No new surprises to deal with.

> >

> > Seems to me, though, that if he could get some relief from the

> foot & leg pain, he'd probably sleep a bit better and in turn, not

> be so tired and worn out all the time. And maybe not quite so

> crabby! Especially since it's the pain that seems to be the

> waking factor.

> >

> > I'm wondering what kind of pain meds some of you are getting and

> what it's for? And how the hell do you get the doctors to listen to

> you about the pain you're all experiencing? ! It's been danged

> frustrating for us!

> >

> > That's about it for now. Sorry for the long post. I really should

> make time to post more often, then maybe my novels would be more

> like novelets!

> >

> > OH, as for the Christmas decorating.. .I've got 2 little lighted

> decorations outside, some lighted things in the window, but no tree

> yet. It's still in the garage and now that winter is smacking us

> right in the face, I'm not convinced I want to go dig it out. I'm

> sure I will, but not much before next weekend now. NO time today. To

> put the tree up, I have to make room for it...that means putting my

> one and only living room chair or my exercise bike out in the garage

> until time to take the tree down. The bike's way too heavy to haul

> out there, so the chair gets relegated to the garage temporarily.

> So, I procrastinate. I'll put up a pic when I finally 'git er

> done'. Yep, I think next weekend will be the weekend to put up

> the tree and get my Christmas candies made and get the annual

> Christmas letter done & mailed. That outta' be enough to keep me

> busy for one weekend. Ya' think?

> >

> > Thanks all for 'listening' to me. I truly love this group, even if

> I don't 'come around much'. Merry Christmas to all of you! I hope

> each of you has a blessed Christmas this year and for years to come!

> >

> > Twila

> >

December 7, 2009

Here is the way it is in the world of pain.Â Recently my primary care doctor

moved.Â So I needed to establish care with a new physicians.Â I called a local

clinic, and said I needed to establish a primary care doc. as mine had moved.Â

The never asked me my name or what my medical problems were.Â The only thing

they wanted to know was what medication I was now taking.Â As I ran down my

long list and told of my hydrocodone priscription, she abruptly cut me off and

stated we do not see new patients with pain problems.Â Didn't want to know

anything about health conditions, just point blank won't see you.Â Dave

________________________________

To: livercirrhosissupport

Sent: Mon, December 7, 2009 2:05:50 PM

Subject: Re: Pain is a treatable disease- why wont the

doctor treat it? the answer is here

Â

Barby, After three years in this group, I have heard this same story over and

over... A person is suffering from liver pain, or spleen pain, and has yet to be

treated for it. All the peer reviewed papers I have read differentiate between

cancer pain and non cancer pain. Our society is so insane when it comes to

poppies, they actually separate the two, as if pain from cancer is worse. No

other area of medicine does this. I have read that pain from a compound fracture

of the long bones is right up there with birth and gun shot wounds and billary

collick, which is gallbladder spasms. The other word for gallbladder spasms is

" billary diskinesia " . I have Billary diskinesia, even though my gallbladder is

gone. Can you imagine a doctor telling you that he can treat your diabetes as

long as it is type one and not type two? Most of all, I do not understand how

there are so many new guidelines for treating pain, but it seems like no one is

paying any attention

to them except our doctor. I know that this isnt true, because there are others

here who have a good pain doctor, but most who need one do not have one.

I hope you guys find a good one and that he helps Bobby Glenn once and for all.

love bobby

long life, old age, everything good-Apache prayer

____________ _________ _________ __

From: pinkmeetsblue <pinkmeetsblue@ yahoo.com>

To: livercirrhosissuppo rtyahoogroups (DOT) com