Guest guest Posted May 16, 2006 Report Share Posted May 16, 2006 Hey, Val, Yesterday I took 10, 10, 5 and 5 of HC. I have never taken an evening dose before but I started getting shaky last night and didn't feel quite right. I have been having mild depression since being on the HC along with the anxiety. I am taking 3.5 grains of Armour at 6 am and 1/2 grain at 10 am. I am now swallowing it again. I don't seem to do very well in the afternoons/evenings. I am wired but tired. I thought the HC would relieve this but it hasn't. I am sleeping ok but I have been popping Xanex the last couple of nights because I have felt wired at bedtime. I am at a loss of what to do. I don't think my Cortisol is high because I have actually lost a few pounds mainly in my stomach, seems alot flatter. I don't have any hyper symptoms, no sweating or heart palps just sometimes a tightness in my chest. My ferritin is fine and I also take Niacin, 3000 Vit. C, Cal/Mag 1000/500, Panthotenic Acid, Vit. E, Selenium. Any suggestions? DHEA? Sue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 2006 Report Share Posted May 16, 2006 SPLIT your Armour doses up! That is SO hard on the adrenals to sumo in all that T3 at once. You are running out of T3 in the afternoons and evenings leaving the adrenals to fill in the gap. They can't as they are fatigued. Maybe try 2 grains AM 1 at noon-1PM and then another at 5-6PM -- Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV My Ebay Jewelry Store http://stores.ebay.com/valeriescrystalcreations The BEST thyroid website! http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 2006 Report Share Posted May 16, 2006 > > SPLIT your Armour doses up! That is SO hard on the adrenals to sumo in > Val, I tried that. I was taking 2 at 6, 1 at 10 and 1 at 2 and it seemed like I felt worse! When I first started that I felt pretty good but went downhill slowly. I seem to fell best in the mornings and feel like crap in the late afternoon/evening whether I split my Armour or not. I have also noticed that I feel even worse when I eat any foods with flour or sugar in them. Sue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 2006 Report Share Posted May 16, 2006 Maybe you need more Armour in the evenings. I take 2 grains at bedtime. 2 in the morning and 2 at 10Am and 1.5 at 2PM.. My worst time of th day for energy is around 5 PM... Because of the lower dose at 2 I am sure but if I take the extra half grain I get hyper symptoms and feel worse. I am sure it is too much T4, but I still need that extra T3 then. So I have adjusted my dose of T3 to be a tad higher then and it has worked. It took me years to figure out this schedule just trying to save you some time. Maybe keep what you are doing and add in your next dose raise an hour or two before you start feeling bad. I used to make hourly notes how I felt so I new what was happening with my dose and the times I took them. -- Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV My Ebay Jewelry Store http://stores.ebay.com/valeriescrystalcreations The BEST thyroid website! http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 2006 Report Share Posted May 16, 2006 Thanks, Val. I will try switching around and see how it goes. My basal temp in the morings is still running around 97.2 to 97.6 which shows that I still need more Armour. I have been on the 4 grains since 4/25 so do I need to wait until 4 weeks before I increase again? Sue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 2006 Report Share Posted May 16, 2006 My doc told me Armour have only a small amount of T3. Maybe Sue needs straight T3? -- Re: HC Question >> SPLIT your Armour doses up! That is SO hard on the adrenals to sumo in > Val, I tried that. I was taking 2 at 6, 1 at 10 and 1 at 2 and it seemed like I felt worse! When I first started that I felt pretty good but went downhill slowly. I seem to fell best in the mornings and feel like crap in the late afternoon/evening whether I split my Armour or not. I have also noticed that I feel even worse when I eat any foods with flour or sugar in them.Sue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 2006 Report Share Posted May 16, 2006 > > My doc told me Armour have only a small amount of T3. Maybe Sue needs > straight T3? Can you order straight T3 without a script online?? Sue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 2006 Report Share Posted May 16, 2006 >>My doc told me Armour have only a small amount of T3. Maybe Sue needs straight T3? << Every grain (60MG ) of Armour has 9mcg T3, which is no small amount. VERY few people can tolerate straight T3. Many have problems with the T3 in Armour as it is a stress on the Adrenals when you take T3 in large amounts. If you have low cortisol and take straight T3 you are looking to put yourself in the hospital! Ask Deborah! This is why I do not ever recommend straight T3 and it is as bad as taking just T4 in that it is still not a whole thyroid treatment plan that covers everything your body needs. -- Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV My Ebay Jewelry Store http://stores.ebay.com/valeriescrystalcreations The BEST thyroid website! http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 2006 Report Share Posted May 16, 2006 I get my T3 at a compounding pharmacy. I have an allergy/environmental doc, luckily, and he has connections to two private compounding pharmacies. -- Re: HC Question >> My doc told me Armour have only a small amount of T3. Maybe Sue needs> straight T3? Can you order straight T3 without a script online??Sue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 2006 Report Share Posted May 16, 2006 >>Can you order straight T3 without a script online??<< You can, BUT as you are on an adrenal forum, I really really think you should try other things first, like more Armour. T3, if you have weak adrenals can put you in the hospital! You are all big girls and can make your own decisions, but this is my strong advice. If you are going to try this go VERY slow and be careful. -- Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV My Ebay Jewelry Store http://stores.ebay.com/valeriescrystalcreations The BEST thyroid website! http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 2006 Report Share Posted May 16, 2006 I meant T3 in addition to cortisol. My T3 dose per pill is 20 mcg. The doc wants me on 90mcg per day for several months and he will then switch me to Armour. If one is a converter (T4 to T3) then they do not need T3, just more T4. But you can only tell that by dosing, if you are low in all thyroid functions. -- Re: Re: HC Question >>My doc told me Armour have only a small amount of T3. Maybe Sue needs straight T3? <<Every grain (60MG ) of Armour has 9mcg T3, which is no small amount. VERY few people can tolerate straight T3. Many have problems with the T3 in Armour as it is a stress on the Adrenals when you take T3 in large amounts. If you have low cortisol and take straight T3 you are looking to put yourself in the hospital! Ask Deborah! This is why I do not ever recommend straight T3 and it is as bad as taking just T4 in that it is still not a whole thyroid treatment plan that covers everything your body needs.-- Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WVMy Ebay Jewelry Store http://stores.ebay.com/valeriescrystalcreations The BEST thyroid website! http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 2006 Report Share Posted May 16, 2006 I am just going to stick with my Armour increases and moving it around, I don't need to throw anything else into the mix right now! Sue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 2006 Report Share Posted May 16, 2006 Ok I am confused! What is T4? Becky > > Every grain (60MG ) of Armour has 9mcg T3, which is no small amount. > VERY few people can tolerate straight T3. Many have problems with the T3 > in Armour as it is a stress on the Adrenals when you take T3 in large > amounts. If you have low cortisol and take straight T3 you are looking > to put yourself in the hospital! Ask Deborah! This is why I do not ever > recommend straight T3 and it is as bad as taking just T4 in that it is > still not a whole thyroid treatment plan that covers everything your > body needs. > > -- > Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV > My Ebay Jewelry Store http://stores.ebay.com/valeriescrystalcreations > The BEST thyroid website! http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com > http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 2006 Report Share Posted May 16, 2006 >> If one is a converter (T4 to T3) then they do not need T3, just more T4. << I disagree with this! I know of NO ONE that does well indefinitely on T4 alone. If your body was meant to convert all it's T3 from the T4 you have, why would your own thyroid bother to make T3? -- Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV My Ebay Jewelry Store http://stores.ebay.com/valeriescrystalcreations The BEST thyroid website! http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 2006 Report Share Posted May 16, 2006 I do not know how to answer this. I am just telling what my endocrinologist and environmental doc told me. They both prescribe Armour thyroid and say it has negligible amounts of T3 in relation to what one needs per day. If one does well on Armour then T3 is not the main issue, according the their advice. I realize that most doctors are not thought highly of here. But the question of why our bodies were designed to convert T4 into T3 is like asking why estradiol converts into estrone and estriol. I have no answer to the why's of physiology. Sorry. -- Re: Re: HC Question >> If one is a converter (T4 to T3) then they do not need T3, just more T4. <<I disagree with this! I know of NO ONE that does well indefinitely on T4 alone. If your body was meant to convert all it's T3 from the T4 you have, why would your own thyroid bother to make T3?-- Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WVMy Ebay Jewelry Store http://stores.ebay.com/valeriescrystalcreations The BEST thyroid website! http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 2006 Report Share Posted May 16, 2006 >>Ok I am confused! What is T4?<< T4 is one thyroid hormone. There are several hormones your thyroid produces. T1, T2, T3, T4 and Calcitonin. A healthy thyroid makes ALL of these hormones. But many doctors replace only T4 and tell you it is enough. It is NOT for most people. T4 only meds are synthetics and often feel like taking nothing at all, they did nothing for me when I was severely hypothyroid except bring my TSH (Thyroid Stimulating Hormone, a Pituitary hormone) down so I LOOKED normal thyroid but I sure wasn't. The brands are Levothyroxine, Synthroid and several others. There is a synthetic T4/T3 combo out that has been marketed for years as well called Thyrolar. My uncle is dying on that one. Armour Thyroid contains ALL the thyroid hormones in a natural form made from drying pig (closest to human) thyroids and [processing the natural thyroid with all it's components into tablets. -- Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV My Ebay Jewelry Store http://stores.ebay.com/valeriescrystalcreations The BEST thyroid website! http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 2006 Report Share Posted May 16, 2006 I am on 3 grains of Armour and Isocort. That is allright isn't it? Becky > >>Ok I am confused! What is T4?<< > > T4 is one thyroid hormone. There are several hormones your thyroid > produces. T1, T2, T3, T4 and Calcitonin. A healthy thyroid makes ALL of > these hormones. But many doctors replace only T4 and tell you it is > enough. It is NOT for most people. T4 only meds are synthetics and often > feel like taking nothing at all, they did nothing for me when I was > severely hypothyroid except bring my TSH (Thyroid Stimulating Hormone, a > Pituitary hormone) down so I LOOKED normal thyroid but I sure wasn't. > The brands are Levothyroxine, Synthroid and several others. There is a > synthetic T4/T3 combo out that has been marketed for years as well > called Thyrolar. My uncle is dying on that one. Armour Thyroid contains > ALL the thyroid hormones in a natural form made from drying pig (closest > to human) thyroids and [processing the natural thyroid with all it's > components into tablets. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 2006 Report Share Posted May 16, 2006 8 tablets of Isocort a day > > I am on 3 grains of Armour and Isocort. That is allright isn't it? > Becky > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 2006 Report Share Posted May 16, 2006 Most doctors say thee is too much T3 in Armour that human thyroids do not make as much. But I believe when we are taking meds orally, we do need that extra T3 that is in Armour. Your doctors are sure different in their opinions than any I have ever seen! LOL Some folks even take extra T4 with Armour as they feel they need more of it, I am a rarity that actually needs alot more T3 than what Armour has in it. -- Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV My Ebay Jewelry Store http://stores.ebay.com/valeriescrystalcreations The BEST thyroid website! http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 2006 Report Share Posted May 16, 2006 >>I am on 3 grains of Armour and Isocort. That is alright isn't it?<< That is definitely the best start! Do you have any thyroid labs you could show us with the reference ranges? I could tell you alot more about your thyroid status if you had some labs. -- Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV My Ebay Jewelry Store http://stores.ebay.com/valeriescrystalcreations The BEST thyroid website! http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 2006 Report Share Posted May 16, 2006 what about iodine supplementation with either Ioderal or Lugols iodine? -- Re: Re: HC Question Most doctors say thee is too much T3 in Armour that human thyroids do not make as much. But I believe when we are taking meds orally, we do need that extra T3 that is in Armour. Your doctors are sure different in their opinions than any I have ever seen! LOL Some folks even take extra T4 with Armour as they feel they need more of it, I am a rarity that actually needs alot more T3 than what Armour has in it.-- Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WVMy Ebay Jewelry Store http://stores.ebay.com/valeriescrystalcreations The BEST thyroid website! http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 2006 Report Share Posted May 16, 2006 >>what about iodine supplementation with either Ioderal or Lugols iodine? << I do believe there is a place for that in thyroid treatment. I have experimented with it myself. I did 2 drops Lugol's for 3 months topically and seemed to get the best results with that then it stopped being beneficial. I think I actually loaded my body with it and now I just use 2 drops about every 3 days. When I took it orally, I could not feel it doing anything. I used to take 75MCG T3 with my Armour before using the Iodine, now I need less. -- Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV My Ebay Jewelry Store http://stores.ebay.com/valeriescrystalcreations The BEST thyroid website! http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 2006 Report Share Posted May 16, 2006 Wow that is amazing. You must not be iodine deficient at all. The iodine patch tests consists of a 2 by 2 square inch of Lugols painted on the skin. If it is absorbed before 24 hours, thru the skin, say in 12 hours, one is deficient. There is also a urine test with preloading of iodine tablets but the skin test is easier. I do 10-20 drops of Lugols a day but when it does not seem to be enough. I use up to 50 mg of the Iodoral. Right now I am very irritated with the treatment in general. It seems that when I get to therapeutic doses of my T3 in addition to Armour (I never take as much as they tell me) I do NOT feel more energetic, just hot and with palpitations. I also use cortef daily. Sometimes I feel like not taking anything at all!! -- Re: Re: HC Question >>what about iodine supplementation with either Ioderal or Lugols iodine? <<I do believe there is a place for that in thyroid treatment. I have experimented with it myself. I did 2 drops Lugol's for 3 months topically and seemed to get the best results with that then it stopped being beneficial. I think I actually loaded my body with it and now I just use 2 drops about every 3 days. When I took it orally, I could not feel it doing anything. I used to take 75MCG T3 with my Armour before using the Iodine, now I need less.-- Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WVMy Ebay Jewelry Store http://stores.ebay.com/valeriescrystalcreations The BEST thyroid website! http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 2006 Report Share Posted May 16, 2006 This was taken on 3/7/06 TSH 0.058L range 0.350-5.500 T4 Free ( direct) 0.93 range 0.61-1.76 I am to see and endocrinologist in 2 weeks My GYN only wants me on 2 grain (60) of Amour. I increased it myself to 3 grains a day and am feeling good. Becky > >>I am on 3 grains of Armour and Isocort. That is alright isn't it?<< > > That is definitely the best start! Do you have any thyroid labs you > could show us with the reference ranges? I could tell you alot more > about your thyroid status if you had some labs. > > -- > Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV > My Ebay Jewelry Store http://stores.ebay.com/valeriescrystalcreations > The BEST thyroid website! http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com > http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 16, 2006 Report Share Posted May 16, 2006 >>(I never take as much as they tell me) I do NOT feel more energetic, just hot and with palpitations. I also use Cortef daily.<< Have you had your Ferritin checked? According to Broda , low Ferritin is very common in Hypo as it is caused by it. The first level that drops is the Ferritin then anemia if that is not corrected. You can have normal iron and low Ferritin. Your Ferritin should be between 70 & 90.. Less than that WILL cause serious heart palps and pounding heartbeat as you raise your Armour (or T3) dosage. -- Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV My Ebay Jewelry Store http://stores.ebay.com/valeriescrystalcreations The BEST thyroid website! http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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