RE: Oral tabs = thumbs down!

[Guest guest]

.. Also my blood sugar control is back to normal.

Laurel,

What do you mean

by this? I feel like I have hypoglycemia all the time. When I first started on

E, that lifelong condition seemed cured. It is back with a vengeance with the

oral E.

Thanks for the

report, disappointing as it is.

nne

[Guest guest]

Laurel -- does this include sublinguals?

mary

>

> Well, I thought I could be different and make it work. And

> Hakala said his oral tabs were different. Not for me. No way.

> After two months I finally couldn't hear the E and it took more

to

> stop my period which was going too long and I was getting edema.

So

> I switched to OOE. and the bleeding stopped and the edema is

going

> down. Also my blood sugar control is back to normal.

>

>

[Guest guest]

I don't know.  You could take a look at your c-reactive protein, IGF-1, and anything else which is liver related to get an idea. (?) Maybe you absorb it into the blood stream?  I'm leery about saying everyone is the same and I imagine it depends on the way it is compounded too.   I wonder if it goes in too fast and creates fluctuating blood levels.  That's another angle we need to keep into account.  I sure do learn a lot going down the wrong roads.  Increases my motivation to learn. (-: Why do you do sublingual E?  Transdermal is considered to be the best.  I knew this, but I wanted to see if I get away with the oral to increase the margin of safely for my young children.   LaurelLaurel -- does this include sublinguals? mary >> Well, I thought I could be different and make it work. And > Hakala said his oral tabs were different. Not for me. No way. > After two months I finally couldn't hear the E and it took more to > stop my period which was going too long and I was getting edema. So > I switched to OOE. and the bleeding stopped and the edema is going > down. Also my blood sugar control is back to normal.> >

[Guest guest]

My blood sugars when up with the oral E.  I think that was the major factor.  However, I must keep into account that the oral E created a high SHGB and that could have dinged up other things which deal with blood sugar.  But goofing around with the liver is just bad news.  You live, you learn.  Dr. Formby was concerned about the oral E.....   he knew.  I was deep on hope.   Doing a wide range of serum and saliva testing was very helpful.  Laurel  . Also my blood sugar control is back to normal.Laurel,What do you mean by this? I feel like I have hypoglycemia all the time. When I first started on E, that lifelong condition seemed cured. It is back with a vengeance with the oral E.Thanks for the report, disappointing as it is.nne 

[Guest guest]

Laurel,

My SHGB went up for

the first time when I used the OO E sublingually. I tried to be safe using that

route. I thought it was ideal until then.

nne

However,

I must keep into account that the oral E created a high SHGB and that could

have dinged up other things which deal with blood sugar. But goofing around

with the liver is just bad news.

[Guest guest]

Laurel,

Do you know if Dr. Fromby has any thoughts about the pellet therapy?

Liz

My blood sugars when up with the oral E. I think that was the major factor. However, I must keep into account that the oral E created a high SHGB and that could have dinged up other things which deal with blood sugar. But goofing around with the liver is just bad news.

You live, you learn.

Dr. Formby was concerned about the oral E..... he knew.

I was deep on hope. Doing a wide range of serum and saliva testing was very helpful.

Laurel

..

[Guest guest]

Liz,

You mentioned earlier that you had communincated with women that had bad experiences with pellet therapy. What did they say about it?

Reply-To: rhythmicliving To: <rhythmicliving >Subject: RE: Oral tabs = thumbs down!Date: Tue, 8 Aug 2006 17:49:09 -0700

Laurel,

Do you know if Dr. Fromby has any thoughts about the pellet therapy?

Liz

My blood sugars when up with the oral E. I think that was the major factor. However, I must keep into account that the oral E created a high SHGB and that could have dinged up other things which deal with blood sugar. But goofing around with the liver is just bad news.

You live, you learn.

Dr. Formby was concerned about the oral E..... he knew.

I was deep on hope. Doing a wide range of serum and saliva testing was very helpful.

Laurel

..

[Guest guest]

Yes, I'd be concerned too about contamination if I had kids. But I

was put on SL because no cream helped! I had to go to high doses of

cream to feel anything and then I would start to bleed because it

stimulated my fibroids. But I'd still get hot flashes along with

the bleeding because it was apparently STILL too low of a dose. I

was planning to try the OO again since I was getting creams from

different pharmacies that were all DIFFERENT!! Some were too strong,

some were too weak. I felt they were messing with the mix in some

way. No one regulating them! Talk about going down the wrong

roads. Can't do SL P though! Forget it. The least little bit and

I'm in agony. SO I only use SL E. I agree though. I think it goes

in too fast. However, I DO get hot flash relief. I'm using Biest

though - not straight estradiol.

>

> I don't know. You could take a look at your c-reactive protein,

> IGF-1, and anything else which is liver related to get an idea.

(?)

> Maybe you absorb it into the blood stream? I'm leery about

saying

> everyone is the same and I imagine it depends on the way it is

> compounded too.

>

> I wonder if it goes in too fast and creates fluctuating blood

> levels. That's another angle we need to keep into account.

>

> I sure do learn a lot going down the wrong roads. Increases my

> motivation to learn. (-:

>

> Why do you do sublingual E? Transdermal is considered to be the

> best. I knew this, but I wanted to see if I get away with the

oral

> to increase the margin of safely for my young children.

>

> Laurel

>

[Guest guest]

Well, along with prescribing my SL E, my doctor gave me 2

supplements to take to control my blood sugar. Next time I go, I'll

get my SHBG checked and I guess I'll have to do an insulin test. I

hate that test! But I STILL want my SWEETS!!

>

> My blood sugars when up with the oral E. I think that was the

major

> factor. However, I must keep into account that the oral E created

a

> high SHGB and that could have dinged up other things which deal

with

> blood sugar. But goofing around with the liver is just bad news.

>

> You live, you learn.

>

> Dr. Formby was concerned about the oral E..... he knew.

>

> I was deep on hope. Doing a wide range of serum and saliva

testing

> was very helpful.

>

> Laurel

[Guest guest]

Why Biest?  Biest and OTC transdermal P ===  well marketed NOT well supported with good research.  Dr. Vliet said the estriol provokes more uterine activity.  I don't have the study on-hand -sorry.  I heard her say this in an interview.  Do the Europeans use Biest or is it an American marketing thing?   Laurel . I'm using Biest though - not straight estradiol. -. 

[Guest guest]

My oder sister (in Germany) has been taking (only; no P either) estriol suppositories twice/week @ 0.5mg each for 8 years, and has not had any uterine overactivity nor fibroids. She is 70.

Charlotte

Re: Re: Oral tabs = thumbs down!

Why Biest? Biest and OTC transdermal P === well marketed NOT well supported with good research.

Dr. Vliet said the estriol provokes more uterine activity. I don't have the study on-hand -sorry. I heard her say this in an interview.

Do the Europeans use Biest or is it an American marketing thing?

Laurel

.. I'm using Biest though - not straight estradiol. -

..

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[Guest guest]

I have a feeling it's an American marketing thing. Because every

doctor loves to give us this. But I must say that I had plenty of

uterine activity on straight estradiol too.

>

> > Why Biest? Biest and OTC transdermal P === well marketed NOT

well

> > supported with good research.

>

> Dr. Vliet said the estriol provokes more uterine activity. I

don't

> have the study on-hand -sorry. I heard her say this in an

interview.

>

> Do the Europeans use Biest or is it an American marketing thing?

>

> Laurel

>

>

> >

> >

>

>

>

> > . I'm using Biest

> > though - not straight estradiol.

> >

> >

> >

> > -

> >> .

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Larrian Gillespie says estriol metabolizes down the most carcinogenic pathway and strongly discourages its use (except on the face where it is not absorbed systemically). I don't understand well enough how different estrogens metabolize to explain it better.

As far as I know, there is NO research on the compounded stuff. Bi-est, tri-est and P cream are products of the often not-so-well-researched "natural" medical community and the compounding pharmas.

Val

-----Original Message-----From: rhythmicliving [mailto:rhythmicliving ]On Behalf Of

I have a feeling it's an American marketing thing. Because every doctor loves to give us this. But I must say that I had plenty of uterine activity on straight estradiol too. >> > Why Biest? Biest and OTC transdermal P === well marketed NOT well > > supported with good research.> > Dr. Vliet said the estriol provokes more uterine activity. I don't > have the study on-hand -sorry. I heard her say this in an interview.> > Do the Europeans use Biest or is it an American marketing thing?> > Laurel

..

[Guest guest]

When I go back to my doctor, I'm going to ask her to change me to

estradiol. However, I have never heard that estriol is the most

carcinogenic. Every doctor I've ever been to is leery of the

estradiol - that is the strongest of the Es and the most dangerous.

So I'm not sure where Gillespie is coming from. But my flashes are

gone so I'm happy.

> >

> > > Why Biest? Biest and OTC transdermal P === well marketed NOT

> well

> > > supported with good research.

> >

> > Dr. Vliet said the estriol provokes more uterine activity. I

> don't

> > have the study on-hand -sorry. I heard her say this in an

> interview.

> >

> > Do the Europeans use Biest or is it an American marketing

thing?

> >

> > Laurel

> .

>

[Guest guest]

They might be reading marketing literature rather than the science.  Vliet has goobs of good E stuff and there is that list on the wb page.  E is not carcinogenic.  What Vliet said is it is more active in the uterus.  You might want your doctor to explain why you need to use a form of E which is higher during pregnancy?  Why would a post meno woman need pregnancy E hormones?  LaurelWhen I go back to my doctor, I'm going to ask her to change me to estradiol. However, I have never heard that estriol is the most carcinogenic. Every doctor I've ever been to is leery of the estradiol - that is the strongest of the Es and the most dangerous. So I'm not sure where Gillespie is coming from. But my flashes are gone so I'm happy. --- I.