Guest guest Posted May 30, 2008 Report Share Posted May 30, 2008 Chuck- I'm pretty sure someone could build a house using a Leatherman or Swiss Army Knife, but it probably wouldn't be the most efficient or cost-effective means to do so.Why throw out the many effective means we know work for various problems in favor of a single tool?One size does not fit all. One tool does not adapt itself to every situation. It just doesn't cut it to say that those who don't like or react adversely to the pRoshi "NEEDED it the most." Maybe they will need it, but not at the point where the thought of putting this pulsating electronic thingy on their head evokes anxiety and an intense fear of losing controls, no matter how gently you start and how you set the controls.b/rgds DG================================================ ,>> I don't agree that NF or the Trauma Releasing Exercises are "graduated> exposure". The trauma does set up and maintain changes in body and brain> patterns which are stable. Releasing those patterns, which in my > experience often occurs without any necessary recollection of their source, > helps the organism (the client) move beyond programmed responses to new > experience based on past traumatic ones.>> PetePete-I'd love to see evidence supporting your assertion that "...trauma [??combat, sexual assault, males, females, age trauma experienced??) does set up and maintain changes in body and brain patterns which are stable (?? how, for how long, under what circumstances??)" Life would be so much easier. Even some of the most studied brainwaves (P300, for example) depend on averaging over multiple trials of a simple task. I agree that there doesn't have to be any necessary recollection of the source (i.e. presumed traumatic event(s)...but there has to be a deconditioning or unlinking between the triggers of the emotional reaction and the reaction itself. There are many ways this can happen. The ways it can be resolved are about as varied as the people who experience traumatic reactions. One person does it with religious beliefs, another by service to others, another by the belief "that what does not kill me makes me stronger," another through journaling (Penniston, 1991) and others by drinking and shooting heroin. Some ways of coping are healthier than others, of course.b/rgdsDG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 31, 2008 Report Share Posted May 31, 2008 > > Chuck- > > I'm pretty sure someone could build a house using a Leatherman or > Swiss Army Knife, but it probably wouldn't be the most efficient or > cost-effective means to do so. Indeed, but I do argue that the pROSHI is the most efficient and cost-effective means, to begin rebuilding that " house " . It saves a great deal of " hunting and pecking " , to begin the task. > > Why throw out the many effective means we know work for various > problems in favor of a single tool? Never said throw out the over tools, except the drugs, ASAP. > > One size does not fit all. One tool does not adapt itself to every > situation. The pROSHI does not " adapt " itself to anything. The task is for the brain to adapt itself to the pROSHI. >It just doesn't cut it to say that those who don't like or > react adversely to the pRoshi " NEEDED it the most. " Yes, it does! Because, for a healthy brain, the pROSHI simply guides it towards its natural " Relaxation Response " . Seems to me that you've made that report, yourself. >Maybe they will > need it, but not at the point where the thought of putting this > pulsating electronic thingy on their head evokes anxiety and an > intense fear of losing controls, no matter how gently you start and > how you set the controls. In these cases, the pROSHI driven MagStims would be in order. They don't flicker /ChuckD.... > > b/rgds > DG > > ================================================ > > , > > > > I don't agree that NF or the Trauma Releasing Exercises are > " graduated > > exposure " . The trauma does set up and maintain changes in body and > brain > > patterns which are stable. Releasing those patterns, which in my > > experience often occurs without any necessary recollection of their > source, > > helps the organism (the client) move beyond programmed responses to > new > > experience based on past traumatic ones. > > > > Pete > > Pete- > > I'd love to see evidence supporting your assertion that " ...trauma [?? > combat, sexual assault, males, females, age trauma experienced??) does > set up and maintain changes in body and brain patterns which are > stable (?? how, for how long, under what circumstances??) " Life > would be so much easier. Even some of the most studied brainwaves > (P300, for example) depend on averaging over multiple trials of a > simple task. > > I agree that there doesn't have to be any necessary recollection of > the source (i.e. presumed traumatic event(s)...but there has to be a > deconditioning or unlinking between the triggers of the emotional > reaction and the reaction itself. There are many ways this can > happen. The ways it can be resolved are about as varied as the > people who experience traumatic reactions. One person does it with > religious beliefs, another by service to others, another by the belief > " that what does not kill me makes me stronger, " another through > journaling (Penniston, 1991) and others by drinking and shooting > heroin. Some ways of coping are healthier than others, of course. > > b/rgds > DG > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 31, 2008 Report Share Posted May 31, 2008 > >> > Chuck-> >> > I'm pretty sure someone could build a house using a Leatherman or> > Swiss Army Knife, but it probably wouldn't be the most efficient or> > cost-effective means to do so.> > Indeed, but I do argue that the pROSHI is the most efficient and> cost-effective means, to begin rebuilding that "house".> > It saves a great deal of "hunting and pecking", to begin the task.> > >> > Why throw out the many effective means we know work for various> > problems in favor of a single tool?> > Never said throw out the over tools, except the drugs, ASAP.> >> > One size does not fit all. One tool does not adapt itself to every> > situation.> > The pROSHI does not "adapt" itself to anything. The task is for the> brain to adapt itself to the pROSHI.> > >It just doesn't cut it to say that those who don't like or> > react adversely to the pRoshi "NEEDED it the most."> > Yes, it does! Because, for a healthy brain, the pROSHI simply guides> it towards its natural "Relaxation Response".> > Seems to me that you've made that report, yourself.> > >Maybe they will> > need it, but not at the point where the thought of putting this> > pulsating electronic thingy on their head evokes anxiety and an> > intense fear of losing controls, no matter how gently you start and> > how you set the controls.> > In these cases, the pROSHI driven MagStims would be in order.> > They don't flicker > > /ChuckD....> >> > b/rgds> > DG> >> > ================================================> >> > ,> > >> > > I don't agree that NF or the Trauma Releasing Exercises are> > "graduated> > > exposure". The trauma does set up and maintain changes in body and> > brain> > > patterns which are stable. Releasing those patterns, which in my> > > experience often occurs without any necessary recollection of their> > source,> > > helps the organism (the client) move beyond programmed responses to> > new> > > experience based on past traumatic ones.> > >> > > Pete> >> > Pete-> >> > I'd love to see evidence supporting your assertion that "...trauma [??> > combat, sexual assault, males, females, age trauma experienced??) does> > set up and maintain changes in body and brain patterns which are> > stable (?? how, for how long, under what circumstances??)" Life> > would be so much easier. Even some of the most studied brainwaves> > (P300, for example) depend on averaging over multiple trials of a> > simple task.> >> > I agree that there doesn't have to be any necessary recollection of> > the source (i.e. presumed traumatic event(s)...but there has to be a> > deconditioning or unlinking between the triggers of the emotional> > reaction and the reaction itself. There are many ways this can> > happen. The ways it can be resolved are about as varied as the> > people who experience traumatic reactions. One person does it with> > religious beliefs, another by service to others, another by the belief> > "that what does not kill me makes me stronger," another through> > journaling (Penniston, 1991) and others by drinking and shooting> > heroin. Some ways of coping are healthier than others, of course.> >> > b/rgds> > DG> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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