Re: Grains Good as Gold

January 26, 2004

Not around here (Northern Virginia). I was quoted $2.40/pound for beef

(and pork), and was told that the loss and processing fees would work the

actual price up to about $3.00/pound. Well, by the time I got my stuff,

the " loss " was more like 40% (and on one pig, a whopping 47%), which jacked

the net prices to me up to $4.50/$4.75 per pound. I'd had a similar

experience with lamb from a different supplier (loss of about 40%), so I

thought that was average. Is it really supposed to average only 20%?

Although I guess I can see where the total loss would be higher on a

younger animal, like lamb.

I'd had some suspicions about some of the practices of the guy I'd gotten

the first beef and pork from, and the fact that he never bothered to answer

my questions about that last pig pretty much sealed in my mind that it was

him, not the butcher, that was responsible for all the things that were

consistently, mysteriously missing from my orders.

On the good side, I've found another, better supplier for those meats.

At 05:49 PM 1/25/04 -0800, Heidi wrote:

>Anyway, you

> can buy steer on the hoof for about $1.00 to $1.50 per

> pound hanging weight. There is about 20% loss, so that

> comes to $1.25 to $1.87 per lb, plus another .40/lb for butchering.

MFJ

Any moment in which you feel like dancing is a perfect moment.

January 26, 2004

>? Anyway, the re-introduction of

>complex carb white corn and the native bean caused a reversal in

>diabetes in the tribe. They now had slow burning staples,

>non-hybridized foods that their metabolism resonated with. The

>bioneers people call combinations of traditional plant foods 'true

>slow food,' because it 'sticks to your ribs' because it metabolizes

>slowly be releases a lot of energy.

I agree totally! There has been some discussion of that ... there was

also a case in Africa where the tribes there had some corn they ate,

and they had much lower rates of colon cancer than the local white

people who did not eat that corn.. Rice got hybridized to make

higher yeilds, and in the process lot it's iron content.

A lot of the nutritionists are now

saying you really have to look at the SOURCE of food, not just

the macronutrient levels.

>Ever read those 19th century frontier novels like 's? There's

>always some mention of 'grabbing a couple of johnny cakes' and

>heading across the divide. Can you imagine doing any hiking - - or

>any real work - - on a few pieces of modern cornbread (and I think

>johnny cakes were more like polenta)? This has lways troubled me

>because, as much as I like corn bread, I could never be satisfied

>from a meal of it. Truth is: the settlers were still using Iroquois

>white corn and it packed the energy to be a road food in the

>wilderness.

My Mom used to make ny Cakes, and I do too sometimes.

They are kind of like frybread ... she used very coarse, solid

corn meal and they had lots of fat on them from frying, and eggs,

and yeah, they stuck to your ribs! Probably more so with Iroquois corn.

But it brings up another point ... modern corn bread is made with

very finely ground corn and sugar, and a lot of the older recipes used very

coarsly ground corn (or other grains) and no sugar.

I also find the Mc's experiment interesting. Technically,

a person could live off fried potatoes, meat, and some bread

for every meal for a month without having major health problems.

Shoot, in the South some people DID eat like that their whole

lives. But this guy got sick after a month. Which means there is

something else going on ... the form of the food, chemicals,

trans fats, high-gluten bread, corn syrup in the pop. But the

blame will probably be put on the " high fat " diet at Mc's,

because people tend just to look at the macronutrient levels,

not at the quality of the food itself (and hey, aren't the burgers

there made from old milk cows a lot?).

-- Heidi

January 26, 2004

>I have doubts about this. Sprouting turns much or most of the starches into

>sugars, and fermenting/soaking does a fair amount of the same. I suspect it's

>more related to the nutrient value.

>

>Chris

I'm no molecular chemist, but the ones I know, like Dr Al

Kapuler, say that the carbohydrates in traditional grains are more

complex, in longer chains, etc. that's why they digest slowly and

'stick to your ribs.'

Another example of this comes from the tenet that 'every form of life

has its ow n form of food' and that 'insects eat sick plants not

healthy plants' and yet, insects eat our food plants. By raising the

brix of the produce, making nutritional elements readily available to

the plant, more complex sugars are made by the plant, LONG molecules

that insects cannot digest. When these long molecules are in the sap,

the plant IS food for humans and the insects leave it alone. I got a

good lecture from Phil Callahan's assistant at ACRES this year about

this one.

-Allan

January 26, 2004

Sorry I left out the link

>DANGEROUS GRAINS - Why Gluten Cereal Grains May Be Hazardous to Your Health,

2002, by Braly, M.D. and Ron Hoggan, M.A.

Click on the title for an extensive review.

http://www.mercola.com/2002/oct/5/dangerous_grains.htm

Peace,

Kris , gardening in harmony with nature in northwest Ohio

http://home.woh.rr.com/billkrisjohnson/

On the Fallacy of our Cheap Food policies:

http://home.woh.rr.com/billkrisjohnson/Kris/Justice.htm

January 26, 2004

>Another example of this comes from the tenet that 'every form of life

>has its ow n form of food' and that 'insects eat sick plants not

>healthy plants' and yet, insects eat our food plants. By raising the

>brix of the produce, making nutritional elements readily available to

>the plant, more complex sugars are made by the plant, LONG molecules

>that insects cannot digest. When these long molecules are in the sap,

>the plant IS food for humans and the insects leave it alone. I got a

>good lecture from Phil Callahan's assistant at ACRES this year about

>this one.

CLAP! CLAP! CLAP! CLAP!! yay! i'm glad you mentioned the brix_index, which

i'm beginning to think might be a crucial tool in returning nutrient-dense

foods to our tables. michael's also mentioned it from time to time on this

forum (and often to me privately - kudos!) and it's got me thinking! for

example, just today he mentioned that the guy who runs the brix page website

(http://www.brixpage.com/) was saying that non-organic plants growing on

high fertility soil don't absorb pesticides nearly at the rate of organic

plants on low fertility soil. (maybe the same principle applies to *us*?).

it seems that high brix foods are also far more resistant to disease and

pests as you mentioned (i think the same principle applies to *us* here to).

clearly " grass-fed " is no guarantee of nutritional quality, " raw " is no

guarantee of nutritional quality, *fermented* is no guarantee of nutritional

quality and " organic " is no guarantee of nutritional quality. if grass-fed,

raw, fermented and organic foods are grown (or eat foods grown) on *low*

fertility soil, they are still not of the quality of foods that kept price's

primitives disease-resistant, it seems. nor would such foods keep *us*

disease resistant, i would think. the health of our soil is determinant in

our own health.

so it seems our first concern should be *soil fertility* and the brix index

of our foods rather than whether they are organic, fermented, raw or

grass-fed. the rest should follow...

HIGH FERTILITY SOIL = HIGH BRIX INDEX = HIGH RESISTANCE TO DISEASE

ne pas?

Suze Fisher

Lapdog Design, Inc.

Web Design & Development

http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze3shjg

Weston A. Price Foundation Chapter Leader, Mid Coast Maine

http://www.westonaprice.org

----------------------------

" The diet-heart idea (the idea that saturated fats and cholesterol cause

heart disease) is the greatest scientific deception of our times. " --

Mann, MD, former Professor of Medicine and Biochemistry at Vanderbilt

University, Tennessee; heart disease researcher.

The International Network of Cholesterol Skeptics

<http://www.thincs.org>

----------------------------

>

January 26, 2004

>>>Part of the reason the NT principle is stated the way it is is

>economics. Poorer people simply can't afford to completely eschew cheap

>carbohydrates.

You know, I'm not so sure about that. Page 493 of the second edition of

Nourishing Traditions says this:

" Weston Price's studies convinced him that the best diet was one that

combined nutrient-dense whole grains with animal products, particularly

fish. The healthiest African tribe he studied was the Dinkas...They were

physically better proportioned and had greater strength. Their diet

consisted mainly of fish and cereal grains. This is one of the most

important lessons of Price's research--that a mixed diet of whole foods,

one that avoids the extremes of the carnivorous Masai and the largely

vegetarian Bantu, ensures optimum physical development "

So it would seem the NT principle is stated the way it is because that

was the conclusion Price himself reached.

Doesn't mean Price couldn't have been wrong however.

Superhero Bush Rescues Marriage

http://tinyurl.com/yvrn6

January 26, 2004

>so it seems our first concern should be *soil fertility* and the brix index

>of our foods rather than whether they are organic, fermented, raw or

>grass-fed. the rest should follow...

Suse - I loved your note, BUT, I don't think you can get truly

hi-brix food outside of an organic management system. I know that

many goose the brix with nutrient sprays, but if you are building

brix from the ground up, then you are going to need living soils. You

can't have living soils and poor poisons on them also, of course.

Lots of compost and Albrecht soil balancing is what works well for

'real' brix.

Just the same, I agree with everything you said, otherwise.

And it comes down to this: YOU ARE WHAT YOU ATE ATE

It's so easy to forget!!

Allan

January 26, 2004

Very true, Suze. I have been measuring the brix of vegetables from my organic

garden and so far have been disappointed. I will keep working at it until I

figure out how to get it right. This is in spite of using volcanic rock dusts,

all kinds of homemade compost, and kelp and now this year I'll try minerals of

the sea and compost tea. Tain't easy!