Guest guest Posted October 2, 2007 Report Share Posted October 2, 2007 These paragraphs need some explanation. I assume they mean that the athletes that dropped out of the programme had a 17 time higher risk of injury than did those who completed the programme. I assume that the balance programme had a positive effect on risk. The 17 times greater injury potential is interesting, how did those who started the course but dropped out compare to those who never undertook the course? I know it was a summary article, anybody have access to that journal so some of the non press details could be posted here? > For the study, players followed a 5-week training program involving > balance training exercises with gradually increasing difficulty. > > About half the athletes did not complete the program. They had a 17 > times higher risk of injury, according to Bahr. " This is evidence of > the impaction on risk, " he said. > There were fewer figures in the balance programme so I was wondering which protocol was more efficient. Best Regards Nick Tatalias Joahnesburg South Africa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 2, 2007 Report Share Posted October 2, 2007 > > > > These paragraphs need some explanation. I assume they mean that the > athletes that dropped out of the programme had a 17 time higher risk of > injury than did those who completed the programme. I assume that the > balance programme had a positive effect on risk. *** That's correct. Adherence to these preventative means is essential hence it would be advisable to integrate the program into either a session warm up phase, specific conditioning or a game related session. Bahr stated " So, the program not only strengthens the lower extremity in general, but the ACL specifically...We should be thinking of ways to create programs that are fun [and] challenging, something athletes will like to do and enjoy doing in all sports. " > The 17 times greater injury potential is interesting, how did those who started the course but > dropped out compare to those who never undertook the course? I know it was > a summary article, anybody have access to that journal so some of the non > press details could be posted here? > *** Here is a relevant link: http://www.bmj.com/cgi/content/full/330/7489/449? maxtoshow= & HITS=10 & hits=10 & RESULTFORMAT= & fulltext=bahr & searchid=1 & FIRS TINDEX=0 & resourcetype=HWCIT I'll send you video clips of additional exercises. > > > For the study, players followed a 5-week training program involving > > balance training exercises with gradually increasing difficulty. > > > > About half the athletes did not complete the program. They had a 17 > > times higher risk of injury, according to Bahr. " This is evidence of > > the impaction on risk, " he said. > > > > There were fewer figures in the balance programme so I was wondering which > protocol was more efficient. > > Best Regards > Nick Tatalias > Joahnesburg > South Africa Hope that helps Carruthers Wakefield, UK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 2, 2007 Report Share Posted October 2, 2007 I would be willing to bet that the reduction in ACL injuries is a result of the hamstring strengthening that was performed. Youths are typically more quad dominate and typically have poor hamstring strength, lack hamstring flexibility. A program that would address this should see improved results regardless of the other methods employed. Damien Chiappini Pittsburgh, PA. Re: ACL Injury prevention > > > > These paragraphs need some explanation. I assume they mean that the > athletes that dropped out of the programme had a 17 time higher risk of > injury than did those who completed the programme. I assume that the > balance programme had a positive effect on risk. *** That's correct. Adherence to these preventative means is essential hence it would be advisable to integrate the program into either a session warm up phase, specific conditioning or a game related session. Bahr stated " So, the program not only strengthens the lower extremity in general, but the ACL specifically. ..We should be thinking of ways to create programs that are fun [and] challenging, something athletes will like to do and enjoy doing in all sports. " > The 17 times greater injury potential is interesting, how did those who started the course but > dropped out compare to those who never undertook the course? I know it was > a summary article, anybody have access to that journal so some of the non > press details could be posted here? > *** Here is a relevant link: http://www.bmj. com/cgi/content/ full/330/ 7489/449? maxtoshow= & HITS= 10 & hits=10 & RESULTFORMAT= & fulltext= bahr & searchid= 1 & FIRS TINDEX=0 & resourcety pe=HWCIT I'll send you video clips of additional exercises. > > > For the study, players followed a 5-week training program involving > > balance training exercises with gradually increasing difficulty. > > > > About half the athletes did not complete the program. They had a 17 > > times higher risk of injury, according to Bahr. " This is evidence of > > the impaction on risk, " he said. > > > > There were fewer figures in the balance programme so I was wondering which > protocol was more efficient. > > Best Regards > Nick Tatalias > Joahnesburg > South Africa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 3, 2007 Report Share Posted October 3, 2007 Damien Interesting to observe which had more effect. I hadn't thought about which training has the best effect since so many things were done in the intervention it is hard to be definitive as to whether the balance stuff worked or if getting the kids to do hamstring strengthening work or cutting and mobility had the greatest effect. What I liked about the programme was that the intervention was used every practice for 15 occasions and then reduced to a weekly protocol, used in warm up which is good from an efficiency point of view. Practice time is limited in any form of the game and getting the best result for least time is good. I will consider trying to implement some of these things with my guys as a fun alternative. Best Regards Nick Tatalias Johannesburg South Africa > > I would be willing to bet that the reduction in ACL injuries is a result > of the hamstring strengthening that was performed. Youths are typically more > quad dominate and typically have poor hamstring strength, lack hamstring > flexibility. A program that would address this should see improved results > regardless of the other methods employed. > > Damien Chiappini > Pittsburgh, PA. > > Re: ACL Injury prevention > > > > > > > > > > These paragraphs need some explanation. I assume they mean that the > > athletes that dropped out of the programme had a 17 time higher > risk of > > injury than did those who completed the programme. I assume that > the > > balance programme had a positive effect on risk. > > *** > That's correct. Adherence to these preventative means is essential > hence it would be advisable to integrate the program into either a > session warm up phase, specific conditioning or a game related > session. Bahr stated " So, the program not only strengthens the lower > extremity in general, but the ACL specifically. ..We should be thinking of > ways to create programs that are fun [and] challenging, something athletes > will like to do and enjoy doing in all sports. " > > > The 17 times greater injury potential is interesting, how did those who > started the > course but > > dropped out compare to those who never undertook the course? I > know it was > > a summary article, anybody have access to that journal so some of > the non > > press details could be posted here? > > > > *** > Here is a relevant link: > http://www.bmj. com/cgi/content/ full/330/ 7489/449? > maxtoshow= & HITS= 10 & hits=10 & RESULTFORMAT= & fulltext= bahr & searchid= > 1 & FIRS > TINDEX=0 & resourcety pe=HWCIT > > I'll send you video clips of additional exercises. > > > > > > For the study, players followed a 5-week training program > involving > > > balance training exercises with gradually increasing difficulty. > > > > > > About half the athletes did not complete the program. They had a > 17 > > > times higher risk of injury, according to Bahr. " This is evidence > of > > > the impaction on risk, " he said. > > > > > > > There were fewer figures in the balance programme so I was > wondering which > > protocol was more efficient. > > > > Best Regards > > Nick Tatalias > > Joahnesburg > > South Africa > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 3, 2007 Report Share Posted October 3, 2007 Nick There are studies that show that strengthening the hamstrings aid in prevention of ACL tears. For female athletes it is one of best things you can do for them in this regard. Their increased Q angle and monthly cycle have an effect on the knee integrity. In general, kids who participate in sports activities spend a great deal of time running, jumping and doing the things that were part of the study. They don't spend as much time strengthening their hamstrings, which also help you to decelerate and aid integrity to the knee joint. The hamstring exercise chosen , in the study, also activates the gastrocs and as they cross the knee joint aid in joint stability as well. I would tend to look at this as what decreased incidence of ACL tears. The exact problem with the study was that there were too many variables to pin point what was the actual fix. If I recall you work with rugby players, i assume you utilize active warmup and dynamic drills at the beginning of practice instead of stretching. This would pretty much cover what the study proposed sans the hamstring exercises. This type of activity takes 10 to 15 minutes. There are hundreds of drills one can do for this. You could have 5 or 7 different warm up plans to run through so as to fight boredom and focus on a variety of different abilities with the drills. Just my 2 cents. Damien Chiappini Pittsburgh,PA. Re: ACL Injury prevention > > > > > > > > > > These paragraphs need some explanation. I assume they mean that the > > athletes that dropped out of the programme had a 17 time higher > risk of > > injury than did those who completed the programme. I assume that > the > > balance programme had a positive effect on risk. > > *** > That's correct. Adherence to these preventative means is essential > hence it would be advisable to integrate the program into either a > session warm up phase, specific conditioning or a game related > session. Bahr stated " So, the program not only strengthens the lower > extremity in general, but the ACL specifically. ..We should be thinking of > ways to create programs that are fun [and] challenging, something athletes > will like to do and enjoy doing in all sports. " > > > The 17 times greater injury potential is interesting, how did those who > started the > course but > > dropped out compare to those who never undertook the course? I > know it was > > a summary article, anybody have access to that journal so some of > the non > > press details could be posted here? > > > > *** > Here is a relevant link: > http://www.bmj. com/cgi/content/ full/330/ 7489/449? > maxtoshow= & HITS= 10 & hits=10 & RESULTFORMAT= & fulltext= bahr & searchid= > 1 & FIRS > TINDEX=0 & resourcety pe=HWCIT > > I'll send you video clips of additional exercises. > > > > > > For the study, players followed a 5-week training program > involving > > > balance training exercises with gradually increasing difficulty. > > > > > > About half the athletes did not complete the program. They had a > 17 > > > times higher risk of injury, according to Bahr. " This is evidence > of > > > the impaction on risk, " he said. > > > > > > > There were fewer figures in the balance programme so I was > wondering which > > protocol was more efficient. > > > > Best Regards > > Nick Tatalias > > Joahnesburg > > South Africa > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 4, 2007 Report Share Posted October 4, 2007 Hi Damien Yes I do a number of the dynamic warm up drills that are quite similar (sans wobble boards). I have done those hamstring strengthening drills will the players, (after the paper that Carruthers posted) but not as intensively or consistently as is perhaps required. I think that my warm ups can be a bit boring as I tend to repeat the same stuff. Perhaps a bit more variety would work. One of the balance drills I can include is the wrestling. In my past when I was training for my first dan in KogaRyu Ninjitsu we did quite a lot of grappling on our feet trying to pull the other fighter off balance blindfolded. I'll try to get some sort of wrestling contest going for the players so that they learn balance. Best Regards Nick Tatalias Johannesburg > > Nick > > There are studies that show that strengthening the hamstrings aid in > prevention of ACL tears. For female athletes it is one of best things you > can do for them in this regard. Their increased Q angle and monthly cycle > have an effect on the knee integrity. In general, kids who participate in > sports activities spend a great deal of time running, jumping and doing the > things that were part of the study. They don't spend as much time > strengthening their hamstrings, which also help you to decelerate and aid > integrity to the knee joint. The hamstring exercise chosen , in the study, > also activates the gastrocs and as they cross the knee joint aid in joint > stability as well. I would tend to look at this as what decreased incidence > of ACL tears. > > The exact problem with the study was that there were too many variables to > pin point what was the actual fix. > > If I recall you work with rugby players, i assume you utilize active > warmup and dynamic drills at the beginning of practice instead of > stretching. This would pretty much cover what the study proposed sans the > hamstring exercises. This type of activity takes 10 to 15 minutes. There are > hundreds of drills one can do for this. You could have 5 or 7 different warm > up plans to run through so as to fight boredom and focus on a variety of > different abilities with the drills. > > Just my 2 cents. > > Damien Chiappini > Pittsburgh,PA. > > Re: ACL Injury prevention > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > These paragraphs need some explanation. I assume they mean that the > > > athletes that dropped out of the programme had a 17 time higher > > risk of > > > injury than did those who completed the programme. I assume that > > the > > > balance programme had a positive effect on risk. > > > > *** > > That's correct. Adherence to these preventative means is essential > > hence it would be advisable to integrate the program into either a > > session warm up phase, specific conditioning or a game related > > session. Bahr stated " So, the program not only strengthens the lower > > extremity in general, but the ACL specifically. ..We should be thinking > of > > ways to create programs that are fun [and] challenging, something > athletes > > will like to do and enjoy doing in all sports. " > > > > > The 17 times greater injury potential is interesting, how did those > who > > started the > > course but > > > dropped out compare to those who never undertook the course? I > > know it was > > > a summary article, anybody have access to that journal so some of > > the non > > > press details could be posted here? > > > > > > > *** > > Here is a relevant link: > > http://www.bmj. com/cgi/content/ full/330/ 7489/449? > > maxtoshow= & HITS= 10 & hits=10 & RESULTFORMAT= & fulltext= bahr & searchid= > > 1 & FIRS > > TINDEX=0 & resourcety pe=HWCIT > > > > I'll send you video clips of additional exercises. > > > > > > > > > For the study, players followed a 5-week training program > > involving > > > > balance training exercises with gradually increasing difficulty. > > > > > > > > About half the athletes did not complete the program. They had a > > 17 > > > > times higher risk of injury, according to Bahr. " This is evidence > > of > > > > the impaction on risk, " he said. > > > > > > > > > > There were fewer figures in the balance programme so I was > > wondering which > > > protocol was more efficient. > > > > > > Best Regards > > > Nick Tatalias > > > Joahnesburg > > > South Africa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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