Re: Welcoming --was Send Intro to RawDairy

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

Welcome to the group! You will learn a lot here. Before I would boil

(this is pasteurizing, even ultra-pasteurizing) my raw milk, I would

visit the local farmers and talk to them. It would make all the

difference. Ask if they give rBGH, antibiotics, grain, soy of any kind

in the grain. Also I would ask about cleanliness procedures. I would

also recommend that you find a farm with old-fashioned breeds such as

Jerseys, Guernseys, Dutch Belted, etc. as opposed to Holsteins (which

require grain a little because of their genetics.) If you find a

simple, nice, friendly farmer who is organic and understands about

pasture feeding and basic cleanlinesss, you don't have to boil that

milk.

That would be my suggestion from...experience.

On Aug 13, 2004, at 11:11 AM, RawDairy wrote:

> Message: 1

> Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 05:54:51 -0500

>

> Subject: Fw: File - Send Intro to RawDairy

>

>

> Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2004 5:45 PM

>

>

> | Hi,

> |

> | My name's . I grew up in Wisconsin (Ripon for those of you that

> | know the state and now live in Mexico with my wife and 5 home

> | schooled kids.

> |

> | We're wanna-bes. Here we can buy raw milk from local farmers but

> | there ain't no standards, testing, etc. to check the safety so we

> | haven't tried it raw. We boil it when we buy raw which kind of bugs

> | me but better safe than sorry I guess. Any suggestions?

> |

> | We're big fans of Nourishing Traditions type stuff and are going to

> | get some kefir grains from some neighbors and are thinking maybe

> | we'll do the process with raw milk and see how it goes.

> |

> | Thanks for the group and looking forward to learning with you.

> |

> | and Arlene

> |

> | ps - whereabout's Arkansas WI? My folks grew up in MN.

> |

*This is what the Lord says: " Let not the wise man boast of his wisdom

or the strong man boast of his strength or the rich man boast of his

riches, but let him who boasts boast about this: that he understands

and knows me, that I am the Lord, who exercises kindness, justice and

righteousness on earth, for in these I delight. 9:23-24

[Guest guest]

Thanks ,

The man who sells milk through our neighborhood is a humble campesino

who comes by on his burro with jugs of fresh milk. I suspect he lives

on the outskirts of town and has a few cows that run around free

eating grass. We are now in the rainy season so there is lots of nice

green grass and the milk is probably fantastic if the cows are

healthy.

Where we used to live the family that sold milk lived in a tarpaper

shack and their 5 cows just wandered around the local countryside.

I would very much like to get to know him and visit his place if I

can. Chances are he may not know much about all those acronyms and

stuff you talk about. That's not at all to say he's ignorant, just

not wrapped up in all the latest scientific politically correct

nonsense that you have to deal with there.

Mexico is another world. There is so little government control here

that small operators like this are not subject to any regulations.

This has its down side too. There may be lots of insecticide or other

poisons in the grass his cows eat since they just wander around. He

may have sick cows who's milk he sells because he needs to feed his

children. People have the habit of telling you what you want to hear

regardless of what the truth is. There are so many variables that

cannot be controlled that I sometimes think it's not worth the time

to look into it all.

Right now we are passing through pretty lean times. My basic thought

has been that when the Lord provides, we'll have a cow or goat or two

of our own and do it up right.

I'll see if I can visit and ask these questions. What do you think?

If I get a chance to see his cows, how he handles the milk and a

sense of his character and it looks pretty clean, do you suppose it's

probably pretty safe? I don't know if you can have milk tested around

here anywhere. Also can you tell me (in 50 words or less what a

healthy cow looks like? Maybe some urls?

Another question I have is this. How much can you go by how the milk

looks and smells?

I understand that culturing milk with kefir grains (which we just

started using and LOVE IT) offers some protection against harmful

bacteria. I know it's not a magic bullet, but how can one discern the

state of the milk by how the culture reacts, smells, etc.?

Well, this has gone on a bit long. Thanks for your help and best to

all.

On 14 Aug 2004 at 10:32, RawDairy wrote:

> Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 20:36:04 -0500

>

> Subject: Re: Welcoming --was Send Intro to RawDairy

>

> I would

> visit the local farmers and talk to them. It would make all the

> difference. Ask if they give rBGH, antibiotics, grain, soy of any kind

> in the grain. Also I would ask about cleanliness procedures. I would

> also recommend that you find a farm with old-fashioned breeds such as

> Jerseys, Guernseys, Dutch Belted, etc. as opposed to Holsteins (which

> require grain a little because of their genetics.) If you find a

> simple, nice, friendly farmer who is organic and understands about

> pasture feeding and basic cleanlinesss, you don't have to boil that

> milk.

> That would be my suggestion from...experience.

>

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

I may seem a bit cavalier or reckless, but I would try it raw and see how it feels to me on a gut level/intuitive level. Milk is not like water. The whole cow is an amazing filtering and processing organism.

Even up here in the states I've seen some very funky milking operations putting out good milk. I've gotten milk out of bulk tanks that had various things like hay and god knows what in it, but the milk never spoiled early, sometimes tasted a little funny but I just decided to drink it anyway and never had a problem with any of it.

Of course you will have to do what you are comfortable with. I'd hate to find out that you were one of the few people who really got sick from drinking raw milk, because of my big mouth.

As for kefir grains, is the reigning goddess, but I don't think much can compete with it and survive in the culturing process. But that is all just my little bitty opinion.

Good luck with it and enjoy the life down there,

Tonio

Thanks ,The man who sells milk through our neighborhood is a humble campesino who comes by on his burro with jugs of fresh milk. I suspect he lives on the outskirts of town and has a few cows that run around free eating grass. We are now in the rainy season so there is lots of nice green grass and the milk is probably fantastic if the cows are healthy. Where we used to live the family that sold milk lived in a tarpaper shack and their 5 cows just wandered around the local countryside.I would very much like to get to know him and visit his place if I can. Chances are he may not know much about all those acronyms and stuff you talk about. That's not at all to say he's ignorant, just not wrapped up in all the latest scientific politically correct nonsense that you have to deal with there. Mexico is another world. There is so little government control here that small operators like this are not subject to any regulations. This has its down side too. There may be lots of insecticide or other poisons in the grass his cows eat since they just wander around. He may have sick cows who's milk he sells because he needs to feed his children. People have the habit of telling you what you want to hear regardless of what the truth is. There are so many variables that cannot be controlled that I sometimes think it's not worth the time to look into it all. Right now we are passing through pretty lean times. My basic thought has been that when the Lord provides, we'll have a cow or goat or two of our own and do it up right.I'll see if I can visit and ask these questions. What do you think? If I get a chance to see his cows, how he handles the milk and a sense of his character and it looks pretty clean, do you suppose it's probably pretty safe? I don't know if you can have milk tested around here anywhere. Also can you tell me (in 50 words or less what a healthy cow looks like? Maybe some urls?Another question I have is this. How much can you go by how the milk looks and smells?I understand that culturing milk with kefir grains (which we just started using and LOVE IT) offers some protection against harmful bacteria. I know it's not a magic bullet, but how can one discern the state of the milk by how the culture reacts, smells, etc.?Well, this has gone on a bit long. Thanks for your help and best to all.

[Guest guest]

@@@ :

Another question I have is this. How much can you go by how the milk

looks and smells?

@@@@

(this only apply to cows, not goats or sheep)

If it is yellowish then you've probably got some good milk! If there

is no yellow in the color then the cows are eating a poor diet (grains

or poor grass).... That's at least one criterion to go by...

Mike

SE Pennsylvania

The best way to predict the future is to invent it. --Alan Kay

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

I did not realize you were in Mexico. Well, if it were me, yes I would

go check on his farm personally. I would just make sure he is

handling it in a fairly clean (doesn't have to be PERFECT) way, and

cooling it down pretty quickly. Others on this list could probably

speak to what it is that makes for a healthy looking cow. I would say,

no diarrhea, and a happy expression, easily handled, etc. I would

watch him milk and see that he wipes the udder and teats before

milking. Good milk will taste good from the start. I have a cow in my

co-op down here who we are about to fire from her job as her milk

tastes nasty from the get-go. But the other girls all have lovely

tasting milk and it lasts sometimes for 2 weeks in a cold fridge (38

degrees farenheit). Anyway that's all I can think of now as I am a bit

tired and need a nap.

Nighty-night,

On Aug 14, 2004, at 5:53 PM, RawDairy wrote:

> Message: 21

> Date: Sat, 14 Aug 2004 16:19:21 -0500

>

> Subject: Re: Welcoming --was Send Intro to RawDairy

>

> Thanks ,

>

> The man who sells milk through our neighborhood is a humble campesino

> who comes by on his burro with jugs of fresh milk. I suspect he lives

> on the outskirts of town and has a few cows that run around free

> eating grass. We are now in the rainy season so there is lots of nice

> green grass and the milk is probably fantastic if the cows are

> healthy.