Re: cleaning now wild yeasts -Marieta!!!

[Guest guest]

Marieta!!! I am so tickled you are still here! Taa daa!

Everyone, here is the Queen of Yogurt of this list! She hails from

Bulgaria, homeplace of the world's yogurt! She has been quiet for

quite a spell, I do hope she will stay out of the lurking mode more

often! How about it, eh, Marieta? ;-)

At the bottom, you will see an old email of hers, that mention

spores, etc. lingering in the air, per the current thread Terry and

Tom H. developed. This email was in messages #1900-2000's

(thereabouts) of the archives. There is a bunch of posts around

there that talks a whole lot about yogurt, with Marieta's input. (We

should set up a " Hall of Fame " for outstanding posts! Sorry, don't

look at me, got a big, big plate and it's heaped full! ;-)

This yougurt-yeast-air thread also reminds me of one poster who

joined a bit ago, perhaps 2 weeks ago. He mentioned that his parents

would make yogurt out of goats' milk all the time somewhere in Europe

(I'm so sorry, I can't remember right now where in Europe

exactly..the Balkans? and I apologize too for not remembering his

name!) Then when they moved here, they just could NOT reproduce what

they were able to do back home (making yogurt. They could only find

raw cow's milk, not goat's milk, if I remember right?. Hmmm, now I

am thinking....what do you wager that imitating yogurt has a lot to

do with the AIR and not quality of milk per se, etc. ?

Sara - (keep reading!)

******

Dennis,

At the present moment all cultures being used in dairy products come

from laboratories. Therefore you can make any type of product

anywhere in the world. L.Bulgaricus grows only on the Balkans and

mutates everywhere because of the specific local microclimate. I am

not a microbiologist and can't explain why mutations occur when a

bacteria, yeast or mold is out of its natural habitat. It is like

the sourdough bread. You may have a San Francisco starter but if you

move out of Frisco your starter will change, the yeast will mutate

and your bread will not taste as SF sourdough anymore.

Or like with the French Roquefort. You can purchase Penicillium

Roqueforti here in the US and make a cheese. If you follow the

manufacturing process of the French cheese makers you will

make " roquefort " . But 100 years ago you could not produce it in

America. However the cheese that you can produce at the present

moment here, using P.Roqueforti and the exact conditions the French

use, can't be label as " Roquefort " because of the designation AOC.

Today's technology gives you the means for producing something that

could be produced only in particular area before. In the case of

Roquefort, it used to be made by leaving bread in the limestone

caves in Southern France. The soil and the walls of the caves are

rich with naturally occurring Penicillium Roqueforti. After the

bread developed mold it was then dried and crumbled and then added

to the ewe's milk. The cheese was aged in the same limestone caves.

At the present day nobody uses bread that was aged in a limestone

cave to produce P.Roqueforti. This is done in labs. But the cheese

is still aged in the caves, mostly because of tradition.

L.Bulgaricus are presented everywhere on the Balkans - soil, air,

even on the bark of some trees in the Rodopi mountain region. During

past centuries sheppards there used to take a piece of bark and stir

it in the fresh milk. On the next day the milk was turned into

yogurt.

In the last few years there has been a fight between Bulgaria,

Greece, Turkey and the European Union for the use of the designation

AOC (Appellation d'Origine Controlee). This is the same designation

of origin label that is being used for cheeses such as Roquefort,

Pecorino Romano, Parmigiano Reggiano, etc. Basically it guarantees

that a product of quality has been produced in a specific

geographical area and under established production methods. The

Greeks want the AOC for feta, the Bulgarians - AOC for yogurt, and

meanwhile all 3 are in disputes for the designation with each other

too. It boils down to the fact that if any one country is granted

AOC, the other 2 (and the rest of the world) can't call their feta

or yogurt with the same name anymore. France of course opposes

this, because this would jeopardize their own feta production. And

Dannon is protesting like crazy about the yogurt.

Marieta

[Guest guest]

Marieta!!! I am so tickled you are still here! Taa daa!

Everyone, here is the Queen of Yogurt of this list! She hails from

Bulgaria, homeplace of the world's yogurt! She has been quiet for

quite a spell, I do hope she will stay out of the lurking mode more

often! How about it, eh, Marieta? ;-)

At the bottom, you will see an old email of hers, that mention

spores, etc. lingering in the air, per the current thread Terry and

Tom H. developed. This email was in messages #1900-2000's

(thereabouts) of the archives. There is a bunch of posts around

there that talks a whole lot about yogurt, with Marieta's input. (We

should set up a " Hall of Fame " for outstanding posts! Sorry, don't

look at me, got a big, big plate and it's heaped full! ;-)

This yougurt-yeast-air thread also reminds me of one poster who

joined a bit ago, perhaps 2 weeks ago. He mentioned that his parents

would make yogurt out of goats' milk all the time somewhere in Europe

(I'm so sorry, I can't remember right now where in Europe

exactly..the Balkans? and I apologize too for not remembering his

name!) Then when they moved here, they just could NOT reproduce what

they were able to do back home (making yogurt. They could only find

raw cow's milk, not goat's milk, if I remember right?. Hmmm, now I

am thinking....what do you wager that imitating yogurt has a lot to

do with the AIR and not quality of milk per se, etc. ?

Sara - (keep reading!)

******

Dennis,

At the present moment all cultures being used in dairy products come

from laboratories. Therefore you can make any type of product

anywhere in the world. L.Bulgaricus grows only on the Balkans and

mutates everywhere because of the specific local microclimate. I am

not a microbiologist and can't explain why mutations occur when a

bacteria, yeast or mold is out of its natural habitat. It is like

the sourdough bread. You may have a San Francisco starter but if you

move out of Frisco your starter will change, the yeast will mutate

and your bread will not taste as SF sourdough anymore.

Or like with the French Roquefort. You can purchase Penicillium

Roqueforti here in the US and make a cheese. If you follow the

manufacturing process of the French cheese makers you will

make " roquefort " . But 100 years ago you could not produce it in

America. However the cheese that you can produce at the present

moment here, using P.Roqueforti and the exact conditions the French

use, can't be label as " Roquefort " because of the designation AOC.

Today's technology gives you the means for producing something that

could be produced only in particular area before. In the case of

Roquefort, it used to be made by leaving bread in the limestone

caves in Southern France. The soil and the walls of the caves are

rich with naturally occurring Penicillium Roqueforti. After the

bread developed mold it was then dried and crumbled and then added

to the ewe's milk. The cheese was aged in the same limestone caves.

At the present day nobody uses bread that was aged in a limestone

cave to produce P.Roqueforti. This is done in labs. But the cheese

is still aged in the caves, mostly because of tradition.

L.Bulgaricus are presented everywhere on the Balkans - soil, air,

even on the bark of some trees in the Rodopi mountain region. During

past centuries sheppards there used to take a piece of bark and stir

it in the fresh milk. On the next day the milk was turned into

yogurt.

In the last few years there has been a fight between Bulgaria,

Greece, Turkey and the European Union for the use of the designation

AOC (Appellation d'Origine Controlee). This is the same designation

of origin label that is being used for cheeses such as Roquefort,

Pecorino Romano, Parmigiano Reggiano, etc. Basically it guarantees

that a product of quality has been produced in a specific

geographical area and under established production methods. The

Greeks want the AOC for feta, the Bulgarians - AOC for yogurt, and

meanwhile all 3 are in disputes for the designation with each other

too. It boils down to the fact that if any one country is granted

AOC, the other 2 (and the rest of the world) can't call their feta

or yogurt with the same name anymore. France of course opposes

this, because this would jeopardize their own feta production. And

Dannon is protesting like crazy about the yogurt.

Marieta

[Guest guest]

Sara--

Bless your heart for remembering and digging that out for us! I wish Yahoo Archives were as easy as Google, but I know I ask too much....

I have an article going on Sourdough and Cheese cultures and will use this valuable info.

Thanks!

And Marieta DO join us more often. After reading your post, our Ideas about Cleanliness in these things look even more ridiculous...

--Terry

Re: cleaning now wild yeasts -Marieta!!!

Marieta!!! I am so tickled you are still here! Taa daa! Everyone, here is the Queen of Yogurt of this list! She hails from Bulgaria, homeplace of the world's yogurt! She has been quiet for quite a spell, I do hope she will stay out of the lurking mode more often! How about it, eh, Marieta? ;-) At the bottom, you will see an old email of hers, that mention spores, etc. lingering in the air, per the current thread Terry and Tom H. developed. This email was in messages #1900-2000's (thereabouts) of the archives. There is a bunch of posts around there that talks a whole lot about yogurt, with Marieta's input. (We should set up a "Hall of Fame" for outstanding posts! Sorry, don't look at me, got a big, big plate and it's heaped full! ;-) This yougurt-yeast-air thread also reminds me of one poster who joined a bit ago, perhaps 2 weeks ago. He mentioned that his parents would make yogurt out of goats' milk all the time somewhere in Europe (I'm so sorry, I can't remember right now where in Europe exactly..the Balkans? and I apologize too for not remembering his name!) Then when they moved here, they just could NOT reproduce what they were able to do back home (making yogurt. They could only find raw cow's milk, not goat's milk, if I remember right?. Hmmm, now I am thinking....what do you wager that imitating yogurt has a lot to do with the AIR and not quality of milk per se, etc. ? Sara - (keep reading!)****** Dennis,At the present moment all cultures being used in dairy products come from laboratories. Therefore you can make any type of product anywhere in the world. L.Bulgaricus grows only on the Balkans and mutates everywhere because of the specific local microclimate. I am not a microbiologist and can't explain why mutations occur when a bacteria, yeast or mold is out of its natural habitat. It is like the sourdough bread. You may have a San Francisco starter but if you move out of Frisco your starter will change, the yeast will mutate and your bread will not taste as SF sourdough anymore.Or like with the French Roquefort. You can purchase Penicillium Roqueforti here in the US and make a cheese. If you follow the manufacturing process of the French cheese makers you will make "roquefort". But 100 years ago you could not produce it in America. However the cheese that you can produce at the present moment here, using P.Roqueforti and the exact conditions the French use, can't be label as "Roquefort" because of the designation AOC.Today's technology gives you the means for producing something that could be produced only in particular area before. In the case of Roquefort, it used to be made by leaving bread in the limestone caves in Southern France. The soil and the walls of the caves are rich with naturally occurring Penicillium Roqueforti. After the bread developed mold it was then dried and crumbled and then added to the ewe's milk. The cheese was aged in the same limestone caves.At the present day nobody uses bread that was aged in a limestone cave to produce P.Roqueforti. This is done in labs. But the cheese is still aged in the caves, mostly because of tradition.L.Bulgaricus are presented everywhere on the Balkans - soil, air,even on the bark of some trees in the Rodopi mountain region. During past centuries sheppards there used to take a piece of bark and stir it in the fresh milk. On the next day the milk was turned into yogurt.In the last few years there has been a fight between Bulgaria, Greece, Turkey and the European Union for the use of the designation AOC (Appellation d'Origine Controlee). This is the same designation of origin label that is being used for cheeses such as Roquefort, Pecorino Romano, Parmigiano Reggiano, etc. Basically it guarantees that a product of quality has been produced in a specific geographical area and under established production methods. The Greeks want the AOC for feta, the Bulgarians - AOC for yogurt, and meanwhile all 3 are in disputes for the designation with each other too. It boils down to the fact that if any one country is granted AOC, the other 2 (and the rest of the world) can't call their feta or yogurt with the same name anymore. France of course opposes this, because this would jeopardize their own feta production. And Dannon is protesting like crazy about the yogurt.Marieta

[Guest guest]

Hi Sara,

Thank you for the warm words! I am still here. Just reading instead

speaking:-)Been busy lately and went in the lurking mode.

Marieta

> Marieta!!! I am so tickled you are still here! Taa daa!