Guest guest Posted July 17, 2004 Report Share Posted July 17, 2004 I don't see how a relationship between particle counts and mold counts will ever be developed, particularly since so many " noise " (background non-mold particles) exist in some areas. Possibly, with an extremely large collection of data, some correlation might exist; but that data will have to come from a very broad range of environments throughout this country. Still, I wish them luck. I did just notice that ASHRAE wants to develop a guideline for testing filters in place using a particle counter. Particle counters are used for testing filters in the lab under Standard 52.2. In the field, well, that will be a challenge. I have used particle counters to get background counts of particles to try to narrow down my search for problematic air contaminants. But, the results are not the end of the search, just a tool. I also have used particle counters to monitor a residence for background counts prior to and during mold sampling to make sure that nothing abnormal happened during my sampling. In this case, which was a legal case, the residents or their pets were not supposed to be in the house for several days prior to the sampling. The lawsuit dealt with their exposure to mold in the walls. I wanted to make sure that I was not sampling particles that were made airborne by the activities of the residents. The counter results showed pretty stable counts throughout the prior days and during sampling, except for the previous weekend two days before sampling, when the counts went way up. Despite the residents saying that they were not in the building, the neighbors told a different story. They said that the family regularly returned to the house on weekends. The counter showed that fact. Further support for that finding was shown by letting the counter run after sampling when a brigade of other " experts " and lawyers invaded the house after my sampling was completed. Counts during that time were similar to those from the previous weekend. Particle counters can have a great many uses. Those uses generally are not prescriptive, though, unless specified in a standard. Counters are a tool just like so many others we have for investigation purposes. The results will require interpretation, meaning that you really need to understand particles, particle dynamics and their impact on health. Not all particles are the same nor to they all act the same. ****************************************************** If what is written looks too stupid to be written by me, I disclaim it. On the other hand, if it is brilliant, then I have no one to blame but myself. Otherwise, whether you choose to accept my opinion is up to you. ****************************************************** K. Klein, PE ME, MBA Indoor Air Quality Solutions, Inc. PO Box 7 Bethel, OH 45106-0007 VOICE: FAX: E-mail: mkklein68@... ******************************************************* Wouldn't it be nice if common sense were really common? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 17, 2004 Report Share Posted July 17, 2004 to Jim Akey: The type of study you mentioned is EXACTLY what I have been looking for. Not so much because I think it will solve any particle counting issues but because I am curious as to the correlation, if any exists, between particle counts and spore traps. I have collected several hundred readings on my own and have tried to correlate them to air sampling results from the lab. I found that sometimes there was a clear, definite correlation and sometimes none. Given all the variables, as Jim White mentioned, this is to be expected. Nevertheless I am glad to know that someone undertook this type of project - please do let us know when the IESO study is completed ! e Indoor Environmental Testing Inc. Re: Particle Counter Hello e and Group:I agree, there is very little data available regarding the use of particle counters in an IAQ investigation. I was asked by the Indoor Air Quality Association to write the article for IE Connections (I think it was the February 2004 issue) that you mentioned in your post.There is a study currently being conducted by the Indoor Environmental Standards Organization (IESO) and the folks at Air Advantage / Next Generation to determine if a correlation exists between particulate counts, and other methods of sampling (spore traps, cassettes, etc.) As far as I know, this is the first study of this sort. When the results are in (I believe late summer), I will be happy to share the data with this group.As you mentioned, using a particle counter during your investigations can be a very useful tool. This type of instrument can provide you with immediate data regarding particulate levels in a certain area. No, the particle counter will not "tell" you if it is mold. Particle counters do not analyze the particles, they just size and count them. However, we know that in general, mold spores are between 1 and 10 microns (of course, there are exceptions to this). When the counts on the upper channels of your particle counter increase dramatically, this can alert you that more testing should be done in the area. Counts should be taken outside as well as throughout the building, so comparative data can be examined. If anyone would like to discuss this further, please feel free to contact me. Jim AkeyLighthouse Worldwide Solutions1221 Disk DriveMedford, OR 97501jakey@... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 20, 2004 Report Share Posted July 20, 2004 After reading Jim Akey's recent post, I wish to clarify that IE Connections may have requested him to write for IE Connections, but IAQA did not. The newspaper is the official publication of IAQA; however, the newspaper is independently owned and operated. For what it's worth, I also spoke with the executive director of IESO, and he said that IESO is not engaged in any cooperative research work with Air Advantage / Next Generation. Sincerely, Steve Sauer, EditorIndoor Environment Communications12339 Carroll AvenueRockville, MD 20852-1867Phone: ext. 17Fax: E-mail: IECnews@... Hello e and Group:I agree, there is very little data available regarding the use of particle counters in an IAQ investigation. I was asked by the Indoor Air Quality Association to write the article for IE Connections (I think it was the February 2004 issue) that you mentioned in your post.There is a study currently being conducted by the Indoor Environmental Standards Organization (IESO) and the folks at Air Advantage / Next Generation to determine if a correlation exists between particulate counts, and other methods of sampling (spore traps, cassettes, etc.) As far as I know, this is the first study of this sort. When the results are in (I believe late summer), I will be happy to share the data with this group.As you mentioned, using a particle counter during your investigations can be a very useful tool. This type of instrument can provide you with immediate data regarding particulate levels in a certain area. No, the particle counter will not "tell" you if it is mold. Particle counters do not analyze the particles, they just size and count them. However, we know that in general, mold spores are between 1 and 10 microns (of course, there are exceptions to this). When the counts on the upper channels of your particle counter increase dramatically, this can alert you that more testing should be done in the area. Counts should be taken outside as well as throughout the building, so comparative data can be examined. If anyone would like to discuss this further, please feel free to contact me. Jim AkeyLighthouse Worldwide Solutions1221 Disk DriveMedford, OR 97501jakey@... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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