Guest guest Posted February 24, 2006 Report Posted February 24, 2006 I once read that the free T4/T3 test are better for women on birth control. I'm not on BC, and indeed the totals look a little more like how I feel to me. > > You did say if the labs are FT3 and FT4? If they are T3 and T4 that > will not give you a clear picture as it is the total in your body not > the free and available levels that your body can utilize. For > example I always have a normal T3, elevated TT3, but low FT3. Quote
Guest guest Posted February 24, 2006 Report Posted February 24, 2006 Trying to sort out what free T3/T4 vs T3/T4...just when I think I've " got it " ...I feel confused. My understanding (I desperatly want to really understand the mechanics of this) Pituitary gland makes TSH which tells the thyroid to make T4, which breaks down into free T3/T4...which tells the Pituitary gland to make more or less TSH... I'm sorry if my question is stupid...I just seem to have a mental block on this. Cinnamon, really not happy she even has to worry about this... > > > > You did say if the labs are FT3 and FT4? If they are T3 and T4 that > > will not give you a clear picture as it is the total in your body not > > the free and available levels that your body can utilize. For > > example I always have a normal T3, elevated TT3, but low FT3. > Quote
Guest guest Posted February 24, 2006 Report Posted February 24, 2006 Hi Cinnamon -- the thyroid gland releases T4 and T3 (along with T1 and T2, but T4 and T3 are the critical components). Since T4 is just the storage form of T3, the body will also convert it to T3 when needed, as I understand it, if it can (some hypo people have trouble there). The total T4 and T3 tests measure how much of those components are in your bloodstream, total. The frees measure how much hormone is free, ie, " unbound " (I honestly forget what kind of stuff it binds to) and therefore actually available to be absorbed. And yes, the TSH tells the thyroid to release hormone. Personally I wouldn't get too caught up in the difference between the frees and the totals unless you are on birth control -- in that case, be sure to ask for the frees... OR if you just don't like the results the totals gave you, it's worth it to try the other just so you have a bigger picture. (If I got any of this wrong, gang, please jump in!) > > Trying to sort out what free T3/T4 vs T3/T4...just when I think > I've " got it " ...I feel confused. > > My understanding (I desperatly want to really understand the mechanics > of this) > > Pituitary gland makes TSH which tells the thyroid to make T4, which > breaks down into free T3/T4...which tells the Pituitary gland to make > more or less TSH... > > I'm sorry if my question is stupid...I just seem to have a mental > block on this. > > > Cinnamon, really not happy she even has to worry about this... Quote
Guest guest Posted February 25, 2006 Report Posted February 25, 2006 Not on birth control, but recently started progesterone and estrogen due to perimenopause (very early due to emergency hysterectomy at my dd's birth 3 1/2 years ago) Since those would be naturally occuring, I wouldn't think they would act like b/c pills...that was since my last labs anyway... Thanks for the run down... This list has been very helpful. Cinnamon > > > > Trying to sort out what free T3/T4 vs T3/T4...just when I think > > I've " got it " ...I feel confused. > > > > My understanding (I desperatly want to really understand the mechanics > > of this) > > > > Pituitary gland makes TSH which tells the thyroid to make T4, which > > breaks down into free T3/T4...which tells the Pituitary gland to make > > more or less TSH... > > > > I'm sorry if my question is stupid...I just seem to have a mental > > block on this. > > > > > > Cinnamon, really not happy she even has to worry about this... > Quote
Guest guest Posted February 25, 2006 Report Posted February 25, 2006 Actually, I think estrogen might be something thyroid does bind to... I can't remember, I know there is an inverse relationship between the two.. sorry I don't have that research in front of me but if you are on female hormones, I'd ask about getting the frees tested, it can't hurt. Good luck, > > Not on birth control, but recently started progesterone and estrogen > due to perimenopause (very early due to emergency hysterectomy at my > dd's birth 3 1/2 years ago) Since those would be naturally occuring, > I wouldn't think they would act like b/c pills...that was since my > last labs anyway... > > Thanks for the run down... > This list has been very helpful. > Cinnamon Quote
Guest guest Posted February 25, 2006 Report Posted February 25, 2006 Ah, here's a good article: http://www.salivatest.com/store/rc_pms2_estrogen_dom.html Excerpts: Estrogen interferes with the action of thyroid hormone, while progesterone enhances thyroid hormone. Estrogen increases the production of the protein thyroid binding globulin. This protein transports thyroid hormone in the blood. When thyroid hormone is bound to the carrier protein, it becomes inactive. If estrogen levels are elevated thyroid binding globulin is elevated and free thyroid hormone is decreased. A low, free thyroid level decreases the body's ability to utilize carbohydrates, fats and proteins. This causes cravings and an increased appetite because the body is unable to effectively use the food consumed. Thyroid hormone has profound effects on the brain. Low thyroid levels can cause depression, weakness and fatigue.... Also, hypothyroidism can cause difficulty with concentration and forgetfulness. Free thyroid hormone directly affects the ability of of the brain to utilize the energy needed to perform properly. Stress also decreases the amount of thyroid hormone available. > > Not on birth control, but recently started progesterone and estrogen > due to perimenopause (very early due to emergency hysterectomy at my > dd's birth 3 1/2 years ago) Since those would be naturally occuring, > I wouldn't think they would act like b/c pills...that was since my > last labs anyway... > > Thanks for the run down... > This list has been very helpful. > Cinnamon Quote
Guest guest Posted February 25, 2006 Report Posted February 25, 2006 This is what I was looking for....*insert bowing smilie* Cinnamon > > > > Not on birth control, but recently started progesterone and estrogen > > due to perimenopause (very early due to emergency hysterectomy at my > > dd's birth 3 1/2 years ago) Since those would be naturally occuring, > > I wouldn't think they would act like b/c pills...that was since my > > last labs anyway... > > > > Thanks for the run down... > > This list has been very helpful. > > Cinnamon > Quote
Guest guest Posted February 25, 2006 Report Posted February 25, 2006 As I understand it, the difference between the free T3 and T4 and the full T3 and T4 can be significant, whether you take artificial hormones or not, so most docs in the know will test free T4. Only some will test freeT3, though. FreeT3 can be pretty changeable throughout the day if you're taking a T3 med like Armour or Cytomel. Also, if the fact that you're taking estrogen and thyroid hormones concerns you in the sense that they interfere with one another, you could switch your estrogen to a patch. Transdermal estrogen does not raise your thyroid binding globulin--only the oral kind does. > > > > Trying to sort out what free T3/T4 vs T3/T4...just when I think > > I've " got it " ...I feel confused. > > > > My understanding (I desperatly want to really understand the mechanics > > of this) > > > > Pituitary gland makes TSH which tells the thyroid to make T4, which > > breaks down into free T3/T4...which tells the Pituitary gland to make > > more or less TSH... > > > > I'm sorry if my question is stupid...I just seem to have a mental > > block on this. > > > > > > Cinnamon, really not happy she even has to worry about this... > Quote
Guest guest Posted February 25, 2006 Report Posted February 25, 2006 The stuff that binds to T3 and T4 is " thyroid binding globulin. " There's also " sex hormone binding globulin, " which binds to estrogen and testosterone. The things that increase the one type of binding globulin seem to also increase the other type, so sex hormones increase both SHBG and TBG, and thyroid hormones increase both TBG and SHBG. -- In Thyroiditis , " suuzin " wrote: > > Hi Cinnamon -- the thyroid gland releases T4 and T3 (along with > T1 and T2, but T4 and T3 are the critical components). Since T4 > is just the storage form of T3, the body will also convert it to T3 > when needed, as I understand it, if it can (some hypo people have > trouble there). > > The total T4 and T3 tests measure how much of those components > are in your bloodstream, total. The frees measure how much hormone > is free, ie, " unbound " (I honestly forget what kind of stuff it binds to) > and therefore actually available to be absorbed. > > And yes, the TSH tells the thyroid to release hormone. > > Personally I wouldn't get too caught up in the difference between > the frees and the totals unless you are on birth control -- in that > case, be sure to ask for the frees... OR if you just don't like the > results the totals gave you, it's worth it to try the other just so > you have a bigger picture. > > (If I got any of this wrong, gang, please jump in!) > > > > > > > > > Trying to sort out what free T3/T4 vs T3/T4...just when I think > > I've " got it " ...I feel confused. > > > > My understanding (I desperatly want to really understand the mechanics > > of this) > > > > Pituitary gland makes TSH which tells the thyroid to make T4, which > > breaks down into free T3/T4...which tells the Pituitary gland to make > > more or less TSH... > > > > I'm sorry if my question is stupid...I just seem to have a mental > > block on this. > > > > > > Cinnamon, really not happy she even has to worry about this... > Quote
Guest guest Posted February 25, 2006 Report Posted February 25, 2006 That must be why this Dr. prescribed the estrogen patch... > > > > > > Trying to sort out what free T3/T4 vs T3/T4...just when I think > > > I've " got it " ...I feel confused. > > > > > > My understanding (I desperatly want to really understand the mechanics > > > of this) > > > > > > Pituitary gland makes TSH which tells the thyroid to make T4, which > > > breaks down into free T3/T4...which tells the Pituitary gland to make > > > more or less TSH... > > > > > > I'm sorry if my question is stupid...I just seem to have a mental > > > block on this. > > > > > > > > > Cinnamon, really not happy she even has to worry about this... > > > Quote
Guest guest Posted February 25, 2006 Report Posted February 25, 2006 Yeah, but even without that benefit, the estrogen patch rocks! > > > > > > > > Trying to sort out what free T3/T4 vs T3/T4...just when I > think > > > > I've " got it " ...I feel confused. > > > > > > > > My understanding (I desperatly want to really understand the > mechanics > > > > of this) > > > > > > > > Pituitary gland makes TSH which tells the thyroid to make T4, > which > > > > breaks down into free T3/T4...which tells the Pituitary gland > to make > > > > more or less TSH... > > > > > > > > I'm sorry if my question is stupid...I just seem to have a > mental > > > > block on this. > > > > > > > > > > > > Cinnamon, really not happy she even has to worry about this... > > > > > > Quote
Guest guest Posted February 26, 2006 Report Posted February 26, 2006 , Free T tests replace the older obsolete total tests. As we all know many doctors still use them. However, many medications—including estrogen, certain types of birth control pills, and large doses of aspirin—can affect total T4 an T3 test results. Free T4 and Free T3 levels are not affected by these medications. The traditional tests of thyroid function, the T4 (or total T4), T3-uptake, FTI, 'T7', total T3, and T3-by-RIA tests should be abandoned because they are unreliable as gauges of thyroid function. Here is a quote from Dr. Ken Woliner: " I no longer test for Total T4, Total T3, Free Thyroxine Index (FTI), and T3 Resin Uptake (T3RU). They can be thrown off by toxic chemicals and drugs (lead poisoning, birth control pills, hormone replacement therapy, seizure medication, blood pressure and cholesterol drugs (Propranolol, Gemfibrozil), and high dose aspirin (used for arthritis)); deficiencies of vitamins and minerals (Vitamin E, Selenium, others...), and chronic disease (liver and kidney disease, Parkinson's Dementia). The only reason to continue to draw those tests is to bill you or your insurance company. They don't change prognosis or medical management one iota. " As for me, I happen to have a very low conversion problem from T4 to T3 so I have to have a FT3 test every six weeks along with the FT4. And, periodly the TSH. I hope this is useful... Google free t3 and you will find numerous info. ~~bj > > > > You did say if the labs are FT3 and FT4? If they are T3 and T4 that > > will not give you a clear picture as it is the total in your body not > > the free and available levels that your body can utilize. For > > example I always have a normal T3, elevated TT3, but low FT3. > Quote
Guest guest Posted February 26, 2006 Report Posted February 26, 2006 Hi, Can you tell me if this is the bio-identical estrogen that our body naturally makes? Or, synthetic? I take the Bio-identical estrogen, progesterone as well as testosterone that are compounded. I, also, must be in peri-menopause as I had three huge fibroid tumors, which have shrunk, plus the horrible heavy periods are better. ~~bj > > > > > > > > > > Trying to sort out what free T3/T4 vs T3/T4...just when I > > think > > > > > I've " got it " ...I feel confused. > > > > > > > > > > My understanding (I desperatly want to really understand the > > mechanics > > > > > of this) > > > > > > > > > > Pituitary gland makes TSH which tells the thyroid to make T4, > > which > > > > > breaks down into free T3/T4...which tells the Pituitary gland > > to make > > > > > more or less TSH... > > > > > > > > > > I'm sorry if my question is stupid...I just seem to have a > > mental > > > > > block on this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Cinnamon, really not happy she even has to worry about this... > > > > > > > > > > Quote
Guest guest Posted February 26, 2006 Report Posted February 26, 2006 Thank you for that info., I didn't know! Interestingly though, the totals have a much wider number range so my last labs ended up looking better with them than with the frees (my free T3 tends to look high). Recent labs: 9/04 free T3 4.2 (2.3-4.2) free T4 1.5 (.8-1.8) 2/05 on same meds T3 total: 143 (60-181) free T4 1.6 (.8-1.8) - he ran my free T4 and total T3 for some reason > > , > > Free T tests replace the older obsolete total tests. As we all know > many doctors still use them. However, many medications—including > estrogen, certain types of birth control pills, and large doses of > aspirin—can affect total T4 an T3 test results. Free T4 and Free T3 > levels are not affected by these medications. The traditional tests of > thyroid function, the T4 (or total T4), T3-uptake, FTI, 'T7', total T3, > and T3-by-RIA tests should be abandoned because they are unreliable as > gauges of thyroid function. Quote
Guest guest Posted March 14, 2006 Report Posted March 14, 2006 I don't really know, but somehow I think not--it shouldn't have THAT much effect. On the other hand, a thyroid imbalance can have that kind of effect. After meeting lots of people with hormone problems, my opinion is that one can't say a problem is definitively one hormone or another; you might have to do some experimentation. > > > > > > > > Trying to sort out what free T3/T4 vs T3/T4...just when I think > > > > I've " got it " ...I feel confused. > > > > > > > > My understanding (I desperatly want to really understand the mechanics > > > > of this) > > > > > > > > Pituitary gland makes TSH which tells the thyroid to make T4, which > > > > breaks down into free T3/T4...which tells the Pituitary gland to make > > > > more or less TSH... > > > > > > > > I'm sorry if my question is stupid...I just seem to have a mental > > > > block on this. > > > > > > > > > > > > Cinnamon, really not happy she even has to worry about this... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *Note: Information is freely exchanged on this board based on patient > > experiences, and should not be considered a medical recommendation. > > Quote
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