Re: Alternatives for ingredients

[Guest guest]

>Also does anyone have a good starting formula for a cream rinse/hair

conditioner for normal to dry hair?

http://www.theherbarie.com/herbarie-formulary.html#HydroBody

http://www.theherbarie.com/herbarie-formulary.html#ApricotConditioner

Maurice

------------------------

Maurice O. Hevey

Convergent Cosmetics, Inc.

http://www.ConvergentCosmetics.com

[Guest guest]

>Are there comparable alternatives (replacements) for Ceteareth-25 and Cetearyl

Octanoate?

The answer to your question is dependent on how Ceteareth-25 and

Cetearyl Octanoate is being used, at what level they're being used at

and whats wrong with using Ceteareth-25 and Cetearyl Octanoate.

I'm guessing you saw these two ingredients in a formula that you would

like to duplicate and you don't have a source for Ceteareth-25 and

Cetearyl Octanoate and would like to find something that would be

comparable.

Cetereth-25 is a nonionic emulsifier with an HLB of approximately 16 to

17. Ceteareth-25 is an ethoxylated fatty alcohol. It's waxy and hard.

White in color.

Unfortunately, I don't believe anyone sells nonionic surfactants to

homecrafters. An interesting opportunity. So, it will be difficult to

find the ideal substitute. Try Emulsifying Wax NF and see what

happens.

Like Ceteareth-25, Cetearyl Octanoate is also derived from Cetearyl

Alcohol. Cetearyl Alcohol is a blend of Cetyl Alcohol and Stearyl

Alcohol.

The INCI name for Cetearyl Octanoate is Cetearyl Ethylhexanoate. As I

recall, it's a ver beautiful, velvety smooth emoilient. I'd try a

Caprylic/Capric Triglyceride. From what I can see, Caprylic/Capric

Triglycerides are the middle cut coconut oils that are being sold to

home crafters.

Maurice

------------------------

Maurice O. Hevey

Convergent Cosmetics, Inc.

http://www.ConvergentCosmetics.com

[Guest guest]

Maurice,

Here's the formula I wanted to try:

Conditioning Rinse

1.5% Cetearth-6 (and) stearyl alcohol (I have this)

1.5% Ceteareth-25

6.0% Cetearyl Octanoate

3.0% Cetearyl Alcohol (I have this)

4.0% Luviquat Mono LS (Cocotrimonium Methosulfate) I have this

0.5% Citric Acid (Have this)

2.0% Propylene Glycol (have this)

qs Preservative (Have both Phenonip and DMDM)

81.5% Water

qs fragrance

I think I found this one on Happi's site but may have been BASF's site too

(I've been to so many, that I tend to forget!)

[Guest guest]

>Here's the formula I wanted to try:

>

>Conditioning Rinse

>

>1.5% Cetearth-6 (and) stearyl alcohol (I have this)

>1.5% Ceteareth-25

>6.0% Cetearyl Octanoate

>3.0% Cetearyl Alcohol (I have this)

>4.0% Luviquat Mono LS (Cocotrimonium Methosulfate) I have this

>0.5% Citric Acid (Have this)

>2.0% Propylene Glycol (have this)

>qs Preservative (Have both Phenonip and DMDM)

>81.5% Water

>qs fragrance

>

>I think I found this one on Happi's site but may have been BASF's site too

>(I've been to so many, that I tend to forget!)

A few comments:

First, there are many cosmetic formularies available online and many

more available off-line directly from the individual raw material

vendors. Just so that there is no misunderstanding, these formularies

are designed, primarily, to sell raw materials.

To me, cosmetic formulas should be effective and efficient. Quite

often, the formulas found in vendor formularies are effective, seldom

efficient. These cosmetic formulas demonstrate the uniqueness and the

capabilities of a raw material or blend of raw materials, not

necessarily the effectiveness of a formula.

Second, the key ingredient in your formula is Luviquat Mono LS

(Cocotrimonium Methosulfate). This is a conditioner that will attach

itself to a damaged spot on the hair shaft.

This is very similar to Angie's Emulsifying Conditioner (Behentrimonium

Methosulfate (and) Cetearyl Alcohol)

Cocotrimonium Methosulfate is based on Coconut fatty acids.

Behentrimonium Methosulfate is based on Behenic Acid. I checked in the

CTFA dictionary and there are 236 listings for Methosulfate.

It's the fatty chain that gives the " conditioning " effect.

Compare your formula with Angie's conditioner. Go to:

http://www.convergentcosmetics.com/downloads/CosmeticInfo.pdf

Do you see the similarities?

Maurice

----------------------------------------------------------

Maurice O. Hevey

Convergent Cosmetics, Inc.

http://www.ConvergentCosmetics.com

----------------------------------------------------------