Re: Re: Odds of mold toxicity symptoms being reversible ROBERT

[Guest guest]

>

>Contaminated items can and will transfer contamination to a new and

>clean place, and even establish new living mold colonies (albeit

>non-visible if there's limited amount of moisture). Elevated air

>moisture or condensation is usually sufficient for this to happen.

Obviously if you give spores the favorable conditions you will have a

problem. I have no argument here. My argument is if you put humans in

contact with common contaminated household items in an otherwise clean

environment. They WILL NOT react to them. It's just my hunch, I can be

persuaded with reputable science that points to either way. But still

have not seen any. I could also be persuaded by carefully conducted

test's on myself which I intend to do.

>

>It appears that some people will not react to this level of

>contamination (they react only to visible mold and high concentrations

>of mycotoxins), but there are some of us who do react even to this

>level of contamination.

I consider myself amongst the highest of reactors. So I should

definitely be inside this group but I am not.

Further, this is anecdotal I admit but if you read my previous

post's you know I brought more than enough items to my brothers house

to contaminate it. 2 1/2 years later I stayed there for 5 days and

felt nothing but relief from where I was staying in my mold ridden

trailer. Not saying I was cured but it is probably the best

environment I have been in baring being outdoors.

Conversely a year and a half prior to that I was sick the whole time I

was there because I brought this monitor

http://home.tampabay.rr.com/rchrist9/Moldy%20Monitor.shtml

with me and sat in front of it more than a few hours a day.

I was profoundly ill. The difference is that this monitor had albeit

small, actual LIVING mold colonies on it.

>There is nothing extraordinary in what he said. Read this peer

>reviewed scientific document:

Something that defy's common sense DOES qualify as extraordinary

regardless of weather it's real or not. The fact that the earth is 4

billion years old is extraordinary, the theory that the entire

universe was once encompassed an area thousands of times smaller than

the head of a pin is incredibly extraordinary. but they have much

better evidence to back this up than what you have presented to me

here to further your argument:

http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN & cpsidt=4847462

I will first preface this with I have no question of the legitimacy of

the test's at pub med.

But you have NOT shown any evidence of profound human reactivity to

common household items contaminated under normal circumstances one

would expect in a house with severe mold issues.

You haven't shown the longevity of mycotoxins on real world belongings

deposited by natural conditions, from a home with severe mold issues.

Instead you have shown what their longevity is in sealed ampoules and

in special solutions. Also there is no information on how these toxins

were obtained. Are they synthetic or are they actual samples taken

from specific species of mold?

>

>I have a hypothesis - and this is just my conjecture - that these

>stable mycotoxins serve as a very good " protective shield " for the

>species of molds that originally produced them. Let's take an object

>that is contaminated with, say, T-2 toxin which was produced by

>Fusarium mold. The spores of the original Fusarium that are still

>present on that object, or the spores of Fusarium that drop on that

>object from the " new " place, will have the competitive egde over the

>other, commoner molds because of this toxin, and will be able to

>overcome other molds. A little condensation or higher humidity will do

>the job, and you'll have the problem again.

I pretty much always took this as a given. Sounds logical to me.

>So, think twice before you take your contaminated objects to a clean

>place.

I plan on doing just this under controlled conditions, specifically

because I want to know the facts. If I find what you and others have

been saying all along here is right I will be the first to come back

to this forum and say I was wrong.

[Guest guest]

All I really can say to you at this point is your monitor looks so clean it is

not funny, you want to see a moldy monitor go look at mine in the groups photos.

Sit in front of that one awhile and see what happens...

Christ <antares41_41@...> wrote:

>

>Contaminated items can and will transfer contamination to a new and

>clean place, and even establish new living mold colonies (albeit

>non-visible if there's limited amount of moisture). Elevated air

>moisture or condensation is usually sufficient for this to happen.

Obviously if you give spores the favorable conditions you will have a

problem. I have no argument here. My argument is if you put humans in

contact with common contaminated household items in an otherwise clean

environment. They WILL NOT react to them. It's just my hunch, I can be

persuaded with reputable science that points to either way. But still

have not seen any. I could also be persuaded by carefully conducted

test's on myself which I intend to do.

>

>It appears that some people will not react to this level of

>contamination (they react only to visible mold and high concentrations

>of mycotoxins), but there are some of us who do react even to this

>level of contamination.

I consider myself amongst the highest of reactors. So I should

definitely be inside this group but I am not.

Further, this is anecdotal I admit but if you read my previous

post's you know I brought more than enough items to my brothers house

to contaminate it. 2 1/2 years later I stayed there for 5 days and

felt nothing but relief from where I was staying in my mold ridden

trailer. Not saying I was cured but it is probably the best

environment I have been in baring being outdoors.

Conversely a year and a half prior to that I was sick the whole time I

was there because I brought this monitor

http://home.tampabay.rr.com/rchrist9/Moldy%20Monitor.shtml

with me and sat in front of it more than a few hours a day.

I was profoundly ill. The difference is that this monitor had albeit

small, actual LIVING mold colonies on it.

>There is nothing extraordinary in what he said. Read this peer

>reviewed scientific document:

Something that defy's common sense DOES qualify as extraordinary

regardless of weather it's real or not. The fact that the earth is 4

billion years old is extraordinary, the theory that the entire

universe was once encompassed an area thousands of times smaller than

the head of a pin is incredibly extraordinary. but they have much

better evidence to back this up than what you have presented to me

here to further your argument:

http://cat.inist.fr/?aModele=afficheN & cpsidt=4847462

I will first preface this with I have no question of the legitimacy of

the test's at pub med.

But you have NOT shown any evidence of profound human reactivity to

common household items contaminated under normal circumstances one

would expect in a house with severe mold issues.

You haven't shown the longevity of mycotoxins on real world belongings

deposited by natural conditions, from a home with severe mold issues.

Instead you have shown what their longevity is in sealed ampoules and

in special solutions. Also there is no information on how these toxins

were obtained. Are they synthetic or are they actual samples taken

from specific species of mold?

>

>I have a hypothesis - and this is just my conjecture - that these

>stable mycotoxins serve as a very good " protective shield " for the

>species of molds that originally produced them. Let's take an object

>that is contaminated with, say, T-2 toxin which was produced by

>Fusarium mold. The spores of the original Fusarium that are still

>present on that object, or the spores of Fusarium that drop on that

>object from the " new " place, will have the competitive egde over the

>other, commoner molds because of this toxin, and will be able to

>overcome other molds. A little condensation or higher humidity will do

>the job, and you'll have the problem again.

I pretty much always took this as a given. Sounds logical to me.

>So, think twice before you take your contaminated objects to a clean

>place.

I plan on doing just this under controlled conditions, specifically

because I want to know the facts. If I find what you and others have

been saying all along here is right I will be the first to come back

to this forum and say I was wrong.

Life is a balance of holding on and letting go...

---------------------------------

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