Re: Wait a minute? Attachment disorder?

[Guest guest]

In this case the child's behaviors have not worsened since the

placement. Many have actually improved, which is why I don't believe

social services will want to disrupt the placement. None of the

other foster parents have been able to deal with the behaviors for

very long, but I think it's because they were trying to actually

treat her correctly like a human being, and that the only reason some

of the behaviors are improving is that she is used to being abused

and is not fighting an attachment with the foster mother. (Children

with attachment disorder often act out the MOST when they are feeling

like they are attaching to an adult figure-- therefore it makes sense

that in this case her behaviors might improve because she is not

attaching at all. It looks like progress but is not).

This child needs the attachment disorder to be diagnosed and she

needs that label because she is NOT getting the help she needs in

this home. I posted about this situation on a board for parents of

attachment disordered children and JUST AS I EXPECTED there were no

expressions of disgust over how the girl was being treated, the most

anyone could say was that the foster mother's methods won't work with

the child. That is the exact same attitude I expect from social

services who will take everything at face value and might even

justify some of this treatment because it's effective. I dont say

this because I believe it I say it because a lot of these people have

NO CLUE. They yank children from their homes, which in some cases

are bad situations, some cases not so bad, and then put them with

strangers, which is some cases are very bad situations. And once the

kid hits 18, they're on their own, to repeat the cycle with their own

children. You'd think something would go into getting these kids

help.

Anyway I have no proof of anything though I wouldn't expect this

foster mom to lie. I just see what she is doing as being excused by

people who don't want to have to deal with finding yet another

placement for this child. I can't tape record coversations as in my

state it is illegal to record someone without their knowledge unless

it's at a public event. I could record telephone conversations but

have never discussed this issue on the phone with her nor would I

expect to. There is a worker I plan to discuss this with who I

believe might be able to do something, who is in a " higher " position

than those who are directly involved with the case. I do know though

if she does not do anything about it, nobody will. I don't think the

child will be killed by this foster mother, but she will as an adult

be borderline. Her behaviors actually are very similar to what my

mother's were as a child and oftentimes untreated attachment

disorders lead to personality disorders. So it just makes me ill to

see someone at such a young age who is still very salvageable, and

watch everyone fail her, knowing what she's going to grow up to be.

This situation sucks.

>

> Sounds like the more this child is being abused, the more she is

reacting to it, IE acting out...or maybe just acting like any child

(and you know they do stuff that is irritating and, gee, immature,

but that is NORMAL)

>

> There was some witch who beat, LITERALLY BEAT her adopted child

black and blue and to death, and then said 1) it was attachment

disorder and 2) THAT THE KID BEAT HIMSELF TO DEATH!!!!!!!!!!

>

> I hate it when parents abuse their kids, and then LABEL THE KID ASA

RATIONALIZATION FOR THE ABUSE]

[Guest guest]

Helen's World BP site has some excellent info about the correlation

between attachment disorders and borderline personality, at:

http://www.bpdresources.com/etiology.html#Attachment

One could argue that borderlines are also attachment disordered,

therefore it is a very related subject to those of us who were raised

by these people. How can someone who never learned to attach

possibly attach to her own children? If nothing else I feel

personally this has been the biggest issue for me, AS A KO. Living

with the lingering effects of never being securely attached to my

mother. I encourage everyone here to read up on attachment disorder

some more, especially if your borderline parent is one who was

traumatized in childhood. Nothing else I've read, since reading up

on BP after she was first diagnosed, has enlightened me more than

reading up on that subject. I don't really even have to ask " why "

anymore, when I wonder how she ended up the way she did. That

doesn't excuse her treatment of others one bit, I am just the type

who feels that there are many benefits to understanding " why " .

That said, I don't understand what ENgland's slapping laws have to do

with being a KO, so I guess I can only hope we can stop talking about

THAT as well.

> The DSM-IV explicitly states one cannot diagnose a child with a

personality

> disorder. I am sure there is one at anyone's local library.

>

[Guest guest]

<< " Vela, Gottlieb, E., and Gottlieb H. (1983) identified six

behavioral symptoms regarding the diagnosis of BPD in children. They

are as follows: (1) disturbed interpersonal relationships, (2)

disturbances in the sense of reality, (3) excessive anxiety, (4)

impulsive behavior, (5) `neurotic like' symptoms, and (6) uneven or

distorted development. >>

Ack! I had all of these symptoms as a child. But I don't think I

had or have BPD, I was just victimized by it.

How would you treat a child for BPD? Maybe the same treatment would

help KO's.

- Dan

[Guest guest]

> Ack! I had all of these symptoms as a child. But I don't think I

> had or have BPD, I was just victimized by it.

>

> How would you treat a child for BPD? Maybe the same treatment

would

> help KO's.

>

Exactly! It's like for me when I looked at the signs of attachment

disorder and found that as a child I MET THE CRITERIA. Knowing the

links between attachment disorder and bpd, I of course was dismayed

knowing that as a child I was possibly on my way to bpd. But the

thing is, a child IS a child, and a BPD adult is an adult who NEVER

GOT PAST a certain developmental age. So I guess at some point I did,

whereas my mom didn't. And maybe at some point you did, too. That's

why I personally would wonder about diagnosing BP in children,

because they ARE children, NOT done developing, MIGHT still " grow

out " of some of these symptoms or lose some along the way depending

on their life experiences, dispositions, etc.

I still am thinking cognitive therapy would be effective for KOs even

though it's also the treatment for BPs (DBT is a form of cognitive

therapy specifically designed for BPs, I would be interested in

knowing if DBT would be helpful for nons with fleas/cognitive

distortions or not).