whack job parents, holiday visits and emotional incest

[Guest guest]

Otwoma, Dan, Sylvia, , etc. (every KO and his brother...),

I love the whack job adjective. Gave me a light-hearted laugh with

a carnal twinge of cynicism-- probably not the most mature of

responses, but I laughed anyway.

I too realize that distancing myself can just be shrinking back in

fear from the inevitable task of flexing my KO muscles. Some days

it seems easy, and other days it it a threat. But everything does

intensify at this time of year that should be lovely and wonderful,

or so most of us are taught to expect. Coupled with everything

else, it really is a double whammy. Sometimes the double whammy is

just beyond my ability to handle well.

A wise man sees trouble ahead and avoids it, but cowards do too.

But that line deliniating the two is dynamic, and when you have the

added pressures of self-deprecation, bad history, or anything else

that adds additional stress, emotional stability becomes risky. So

the paralell line to this could also be the one separating and

defining what you consider to be self-protection or best self-

interest and propriety with family. If you look at it that way, we

should anticipate our vulnerability, and maybe make a visit but not

when our foos have itchy trigger fingers and lots of ammo.

Dan: Maybe you could tell your family that the French govt.

recommended that you not travel because of security and safety

issues. Say that your plane was diverted to the Carribean. I would

just be determined to have a restful holiday. Even the pop-in visit

may be too much. I think that this is when you must trust your gut

or follow your heart of hearts. If we love our foos, we will

struggle with this inevitably, it seems. Only we can determine

whether we are up to the challenge. I just feel leary about your

jumping into a very volatle situation when you're very vunerable, or

vunerable at all. That is a dynamic thing too.

Thank you for your kindness and peaceful, gracious words of support,

everybody. I feel safe here, despite the threats all around me, and

the safe feeling stays with me which I find to be a completely new

experience when coping with the holidays and nada.

K

[Guest guest]

Dear Dan,

Thank you for your reply. Isn't it horrible and frustrating when lies

are used against you when you are so honest yourself? My nada always

averred that my husband had a drinking problem. He doesn't, she just

loves picking on him. When our last child went off to college, my

husband decided to stop drinking entirely. I though, well, finally, I

can tell her something true which will get her off his back. So I

told her. Years later my sister told me that nada had " wondered " to

the rest of the family if I had caught my drunken husband in bed with

another woman and that is why he stopped drinking!! It's beyond

understanding how malicious a woman like that can be.

I have to admit that when I as much as told, you, a man of obvious

principle to lie to his mother, as soon as I hit the send button I was

sure you would take me to task somehow. I guess I'm punchy. But all

of you have been sweet to me even when, to my own ears, I was

" raising my voice " . Being brough up by a BP creates an very empathetic

person, doesn't it? You have to tune in to what others are feeling

and thinking just to survive. My nada often told us that you

couldn't find fault with her because she had raised sweet children!

But at least, unlike survivors of some types of abuse, we don't hurt

each other.

I once asked my psychiatrist why people aren't nice to you if you're

nice to them. I told him (all the while crying into my hankie) that

that was how it was in the book Copperfield. Everyone loved

because she was a kind, gentle, good girl, which I and my

sisters all tried to be. My shrink said, Copperfield is

a work of fiction.

Lesson number one.

Here, however, the fiction is fact.

[Guest guest]

Dear ,

> My nada always averred that my husband had a drinking problem.

Reminds me of the time my mother told me darkly how worried she was

about my father's " drinking binge " . It turned out he had bought a 6-

pack of beer and consumed it over two weeks!

> Being brough up by a BP creates an very empathetic

> person, doesn't it?

It can. It can also create another generation of BPD. Another

outcome is a cruel person who wants to get even with the world for

what was done to him. Yet another outcome is like my sister, who is

empathetic but dishonest because she still tries to cover up for

Nada. None of these other types of KO would join a discussion group

like this.

I cancelled my hotel reservations in my parents' village. I will

visit my son in Boston instead. He says it was very brave of me to

have even considered visiting my parents. Yes, brave, but stupid.

I didn't realize the effect it would have on me.

I wrote my mother and told her exactly why I was cancelling the

visit. She wrote back a long letter, making excuses for everything

she had done and blaming my sister for some of it. I told her that

I would be glad to see her in Boston for a half a day - it is a 1

1/2 hour drive. She said she and my father don't drive to Boston.

Well, my sister will come to Boston, she can come with her, but I

think the real reason is that my mother doesn't want to see me

except in her own lair. If that is the case, I will never see her

again. I feel sad about that, but it is better than letting her

complete the job of destroying me.

- Dan

[Guest guest]

Dear ,

It *is* Dickensian here! Oh, I never looked at it like that! Maybe

that's why we love Dickens. His characters always win against great

adversity and that gives us hope. A lot of what they conquer is

emotional abandonment and abuse--not just the physical kind. You can

feel the vulnerability in his characters. They evoke a visceral

reaction, don't they? Is it because their feelings are so familiar? Wow.

<snip> situations that exploit the good in you by misrepresenting good

and true elements or mingling genuine stuff with the perverse.

Oh, so true! Someone else mentioned that their nada's body language

said one thing, her words another. Ours was like that too. When our

dad died and we (Al, and I)were staying at nada's house (!!) Al was

talking to her one day. Nada kept saying, 'yes, you're right. I

don't blame you.' All the while she was pacing and wringing her

hands. I had never noticed she did that until I was away from her for

several years. Confusion times ten--especially for a kid.

<snip> " sick and tired of the fake niceness. "

It *is* fake! I never took that mental leap. To me it just seemed

like a lie, and we all know lying is a no-no. (This being a grown-up

stuff is hard.) There are so many knee-jerk reactions still

programmed into the adult which were put into the child. They rear

their ugly heads in the most simple of interactions, don't they?

<snip> ******* " she was born above a bar and no one wanted her. " *******

> So, what, she has the right to lie and berate and gaslight for

> whatever unrelated reason she wants for the rest of her life? A

> universal, immutable get out of jail free card?

I think our dad used to cut nada a lot of slack because he knew she'd

had it bad as a teenager. (I was born when she was 15). At the end

of his life, he was just a staring, intoxicated, silent man who didn't

even try to change his world. He was living with a monster and he

knew it. So is your FIL, he just doesn't know it. After our dad

died, nada decided she would go see that guy... the

medium. She wanted to get in touch with dad and settle some stuff,

apparently. My sister Al said, " he can't even get away from her when

he's dead! " LOL

<snip> > My shrink said, , Copperfield is a work of fiction.

> Oh, is this sad and sweet. Can I copy and keep this?

Of course, you can, . You are so kind. You made me cry. I never

thought I'd say these words...I love Kansas!

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

Thanks for responding. I cried too.

RE: my FIL, you wrote:

>I think our dad used to cut nada a lot of slack because he knew

she'd

had it bad as a teenager. (I was born when she was 15). At the end

of his life, he was just a staring, intoxicated, silent man who

didn't

even try to change his world. He was living with a monster and he

knew it. So is your FIL, he just doesn't know it.

~~~~~~ It's very sad because FIL did realize it when I first signed

on with the family. He used to tell my husband, " You know how she

is so just deal with it and do what she wants. " Prior to retirement

and several surgeries for irritable bowel and gastric reflux, he had

more spunk and would set limits on MIL's acting out. He did a great

job of stopping aggression sessions, and I'm fairly certain that he

tried his best to privately hold my MIL accountable. I always

respected his marital united front, taking care of business but not

in front of subordinates.

My husband and I viewed him as an ally, and it took several bad

burns from the family until we considered that he totally went over

to the dark side. He doesn't have much bowel left to sacrifice to

the stress of resistance. Admitting the change in him and adjusting

to it was much like greiving his death. It is sad, because these

men that I see and am told about clearly love their BP wives. They

get pulled into orbit around their BP like everything else within

close proximity, losing a part of themselves. And we who resist

know that living with the false personna is horrible, so I pity

them. But even the pity poses a threat to getting stuck back into

the gravitational pull of nada's hoover.

K

P.S. Have you read 'Our Mutual Friend'?