Re: to the parents of boys...

April 26, 2000

Joan and other parents of boys,

About 6 months ago I posted a desperate plea for ideas when was

spraying pee all over the bathroom and I was living in a cloud of Clorox

scent.

List members came to my rescue with lots of creative suggestions, and I'm

really grateful.

We showed him how to wad up some toilet paper and push his penis down, also

to sit as far back as possible, and eventually -- it worked. It did,

however, take a few months and now he doesn't need the wad of TP or the

verbal reminders any more. We did have an aide who was willing to work with

us, and that made all the difference. If *goes* at all at school,

it'll just be once and he is far more self sufficient now than ever before.

I also made a social story book breaking down the process into its

component parts and illustrating the sentences with horribly badly drawn

pictures-- just to give him a visual idea of the physical steps such as pants

way down around ankles, sit far, far back on the toilet seat, take some

toilet paper and push down on your penis, take a deep breath and blow out

slowly (to release the flow).

Hang in there -- it's just a matter of time, I think.

Best,

Jacqui

April 26, 2000

Elie also is a sitter. We have taught him from early years on to push his penis

down - yes we use those words. He does it quite well now so that shoes, pants,

floor, etc stay clean. As to relaxing - we have taught and continue to teach

deep breathing exercises. This is so he can learn to relax on command. If he

is deep breathing, he relaxes all over. As to leaning his head forward, if he

is pushing his penis down, he will naturally tend to lean forward. That

combined with deep breathing should help.

In my opinion, the aide is being careful that she not be accused of

inappropriate behavior. In this day and age, she has a right to be careful.

Sara

>>> jmedlen@... - 04/25/0 11:43 AM >>>

Ok....I need some technical assistance.

Andy is a " sitter " when it comes to going to the bathroom. Needless to say,

he's " growing " in all ways. The routine at home has been for him to sit,

then (out of self-preservation) I push " it " down so it goes in the bowl,

and he leans forward and puts his head on my shoulder. The issue is (or was

when he first learned to go potty) that he leans forward so he can relax

enough to go. It's never really been about " aim, " for him to lean forward.

He relaxes his entire upper body and then he's able to release his bladder

or focus on his stomach muscles for a BM.

Our Assistant at school will not get close enough for him to lean forward.

" I want to respect his privacy...he closes the door to the stall on me. "

Geez. So what. there are times to be there. I have been getting requests

for two and three changes of clothes..even shoes (which he doesn't have)

b/c this woman let's him sit there and literally spray the bathroom.

I've suggested that she get some toilet paper and push it down between his

legs to make sure " it " is going down and then we can teach him to do that

himself. But she still needs to be there for him to lean on her.

Anyone have some suggestions on how to accomplish this one? I'm at a loss

since I " m not engineered this way.....I'm not sure he'll know what to do if

we stand him in front of a urinal...and for certain it will go EVERYWHERE.

And I KNOW I don't want him standing at home!!!

I'm incredibly frustrated. I would be frustrated if I had to share the

bathroom with him too.

::sigh:::

I can just see them want to change his placement b/c THEY can't figure out

toileting....

j

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April 26, 2000

At 09:15 PM 4/26/00 -0400, you wrote:

>

>In my opinion, the aide is being careful that she not be accused of

inappropriate behavior. In this day and age, she has a right to be careful.

Indeed she does, to a certain point. But at some point, there must be

coordinated teaching. We are all being up front and open about the issues

at hand. Today she told me she had great success with the technique of

beginning to teach him to push it down with toilet paper. That's all I've

been asking her to do for the last 3 months. We've been teaching this at

home for a number of months. And, as we all know, it will take a number of

months more before he is independent in that step.

I don't think we're asking for anything inappropriate, I do appreciate her

concern, but I dont appreciate it after 3 months of " discussing " it ad

nauseum. This issue has gone all the way up to the director of special

education.....completely blown out of proportion.

Unfortunately, everything must be taught.

j

April 27, 2000

Gail and others with boys on the list ( and girls for that matter )

I think the important thing to try to do is to initially toilet train our

kids the way they will eventually be going as adults ( when possible ). Our

son was trained at age 4 to push his down. He does this well, but now at 11,

trying to get him to stand up and go is a real chore which we seldom attempt

( but helpful to be able to do on roadtrips when you can't make the next rest

stop.) Also, he still hasn't learned to wipe which is really tough and

something in the younger years we never really got to. ( I am just having my

five year old do this now). Also, my son says " potty " when he needs to use

the bathroom. This is fine for a little child but is kind of wierd when a

big guy says this in public when he needs to go. Best to start out by saying

" bathroom " I think. I guess my point here is that I think when our kids are

really small, we need to be cognizant of the fact that they are going to get

bigger and some things we start may be hard to change. Teach it EARLY the

way you think it should be because for us, it has just gotten tougher.

Lauri

April 27, 2000

Joan, is he too big for a toilet seat that has one of those upright pieces

on it,those things to stop toddlers falling in the loo,though if he pees at

the upright piece it shoul be fairly spectacular. pees standing altho in

public he has nt mastered not letting his clothes fall to the floor and if he

sits he holds his own,Colin has the opposite problem he sits too far back and

gets crap in places thet need a toothpick to get it off the seat Pat

April 27, 2000

Lauri is so right - teach it once and the way you want it.

As to toileting - we early on decided that using a standup posture was not as

safe as sitting - even men's rooms usually have stalls for sitting!! He has

learned to squat on the roadside in an emergency - but usually we need to stop

on road trips as often as he does! We did carry a potty until his buttocks got

too big for it!

Also - we use REAL WORDS in all transactions. We try very hard not to use any

but anatomic names for body parts because these are the words Elie will need to

explain if something is wrong when he is an adult. (He uses bathroom for that

need and penis for his body part that squirts all over if he doesn't control the

direction).

Some aide decided that " stinks " was the appropriate term for BM or feces - he

learned that in one day and we have never been able to change his mind - funny

how some things stick.

Sara

>>> timothytlstein@... - 04/27/0 11:19 AM >>>