Guest guest Posted January 20, 2002 Report Share Posted January 20, 2002 Maki, " I've found so far that I'm losing aproximately 2 pounds per week without the aid of cardiovascular exercise " . If you don't mind volunteering, how is your energy level and what type of training are you doing? I'm asking this because I know of 3 people who have tried this approach to lose the weight only at the expense of their energy level. Also, they seemed to suffer side effects such as headaches,intermittent nausea, and difficulty sleeping. Finally, they rebounded right back to higher body weight (fat) levels soon after stopping the diet. Have you experienced any of these effects? Or do you think that some people are more prone to them than others? Thanks, R. Gray, M.Sc., C.S.C.S., C.K. Toronto, Ontario firstline@o... **** My energy levels are fine, what I mean to say is that when I go to work out I'm not feeling lethargic. My training is based upon the suggestions from the late Dan Duchaine and Lyle Mcdonald. They suggest that one should train the body as you would normally ( I'm trying to attain hypertrophy) the day after your carb up. I perform 2 sets of 6 reps for each major muscle group making sure I don't reach concentric failure. I probaly shy short of failure by 2-3 reps. The following day I'll train the entire body again. This time I'll use lighter weights. I usually perform 2 sets of 15 reps again for each major muscle group. Then the day before my carb up I will eat a pice of fruit an hour before my workout and then proceed to do a glycogen depleting workout. I again use 15-20 reps per muscle group and I make sure I don't reach failure. I usually only can get 3 sets done for each muscle group. One thing, is that I do it in a circuit training fashion. I don't follow the suggestion that one should rest a minute between sets. The first time I ever tried this method I suffered from the side effects you mentioned. This time around I didn't suffer at all. It was actually a quite smooth transition. I would tend to think that everyone who trys this method may suffer from one or more of the side effects. Of course it's hard to say. Now once I come off of this diet I will have to pay close attention to my carbs. I will try to slowly adjust my ratios so that I can go back to a normal eating regimin. I'm training for size so I tend to go straight from " bulking " up to " leaning " out and so on. I never have a period where I'm just trying to maintain my body weight. Maki Riddington Vancouver, British Columbia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 22, 2002 Report Share Posted January 22, 2002 Dear : My experience with a ketogenic diet was not particularly good in terms of the " mental " aspect. I had read Dan Duchane's BodyOpus and followed it to the letter through the Isocaloric, etc. All I noticed that was different between using my normal high-carb diet and BodyOpus was that I lost a lot more water on the latter (which makes sense since I wasn't eating carbohydrates). I swung between being a complete zombie to extreme irritability (temper tantrums and all). To say that my energy levels were " low " would be an understatement. Perhaps there is truth that one can lose fat while losing less muscle on a ketogenic diet, but my experience with this formof diet led me to feel that it wasn't worth it. Life is just too short to feel that bad. Navarra Reid Saskatoon SK Canada Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 22, 2002 Report Share Posted January 22, 2002 Dear : My experience with a ketogenic diet was not particularly good in terms of the " mental " aspect. I had read Dan Duchane's BodyOpus and followed it to the letter through the Isocaloric, etc. All I noticed that was different between using my normal high-carb diet and BodyOpus was that I lost a lot more water on the latter (which makes sense since I wasn't eating carbohydrates). I swung between being a complete zombie to extreme irritability (temper tantrums and all). To say that my energy levels were " low " would be an understatement. Perhaps there is truth that one can lose fat while losing less muscle on a ketogenic diet, but my experience with this formof diet led me to feel that it wasn't worth it. Life is just too short to feel that bad. Navarra Reid Saskatoon SK Canada *** My own experience with a ketogenic diet was similar, although with an ECA stack, I didn't really experience the low energy. I definitely alternated between being a zombie and a complete jerk, though. It's not a bad way to get ready for a bodybuilding contest, but I wouldn't really recommend it for any other reason. McClinch Blacksburg, VA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 22, 2002 Report Share Posted January 22, 2002 My experience is almost exact the opposite as yours. I did a CKD similar to BodyOpus. I was never hungy, I had very stable and pretty high energy levels (no ups and downs), I was not irritable at all and my brain worked just fine. In fact I almost never felt bad except maybe for a few hours before I would re-enter ketosis after the 24 hour carbup. I did this diet for 5 months and went from 103 kg to 85 kg with very little strength/muscle loss. Like I said I was never hungry. In fact sometimes I would forget to eat. Now if I would do this on a " normal " diet I would feel very hungry and dizzy. Also it was funny to watch the bodybuilders in my gym dieting on similar calorie intake carb based diets walking around like zombies and dreaming about food all the time. One of my friends said he thought he could smell food all the time because he was so hungry. The same guys would overeat/pig out for months after finishing their diets. When I finished my 5 month diet I had no cravings and my first post diet meal was a bowl of oatmeal. All this worked well for me. However the keto breath of death. Oh my! Jan Baggerud Larsen Oslo, Norway Re: Ketogenic diets Dear : My experience with a ketogenic diet was not particularly good in terms of the " mental " aspect. I had read Dan Duchane's BodyOpus and followed it to the letter through the Isocaloric, etc. All I noticed that was different between using my normal high-carb diet and BodyOpus was that I lost a lot more water on the latter (which makes sense since I wasn't eating carbohydrates). I swung between being a complete zombie to extreme irritability (temper tantrums and all). To say that my energy levels were " low " would be an understatement. Perhaps there is truth that one can lose fat while losing less muscle on a ketogenic diet, but my experience with this formof diet led me to feel that it wasn't worth it. Life is just too short to feel that bad. Navarra Reid Saskatoon SK Canada Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 22, 2002 Report Share Posted January 22, 2002 What exactly do you mean by " ketosis is not a normal state of being " ? Please elaborate. Why do you need to be in a normal state of being in the first place? What is a normal state of being? Jan Baggerud Larsen Oslo, Norway Re: Ketogenic diets wrote: I was wondering what people on supertraining think about ketogenic diets? Poetter Phoenix,AZ , I'm sure there are people on the list who are very knowledgeable about ketogenic diets. I am a pediatric nurse, I work with children who are placed on ketogenic diets for medical reasons. These children are hospitalized and monitored during the first few days of the diet. They are followed closely by a medical team and dietitian. Please be careful as constant ketosis is not a normal state of being. We want you to be able to keep posting! Kathie Chase E'town, KY Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 25, 2002 Report Share Posted January 25, 2002 I was wondering when someone would mention this. It is amazing to me the number of people who dismiss the Atkin's diet for what they see in the first few chapters. Atkin's science may not be perfect but his results speak for themselves. As long as one can deal with the weird feelings the first few weeks. Of course, I would imagine there are plenty of people, some in my office who never seem to go past those first few weeks and eat too much fat and never get to the complex carbohydrates. Steve Kuykendall Austin TX USA --------- Bobbler The Juggler wrote: >After 4-6 weeks, carbs are added in 4 phases (and ends up what appears to >me a sensible diet of no sugar, or other *refined* carbohydrates). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 1, 2002 Report Share Posted February 1, 2002 I also had a positive experience on the Atkins diet. I believe its a case of individual chemistry, and maybe heredity, if this is a good diet for you. As far as ketosis being a non-normal state of being: I believe it is. I dont think it would be *normal* for our bodies to store more and more fat until we die. Hungry meat-eater animals I assume are in ketosis when they hunt, and must be at their best or starve. I cant back it up with science, but I dont believe ketosis is necessarily bad. Its just the body switching to a secoondary source of energy. Bob Mckee Atlanta/Chicago USA > Message: 7 > Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2002 00:38:20 +0100 > From: Jan Baggerud Larsen Produktsjef 8366 <JBL@...> > Subject: RE: Re: Ketogenic diets > > What exactly do you mean by " ketosis is not a normal state of being " ? Please > elaborate. Why do you need to be in a normal state of being in the first > place? What is a normal state of being? > > __________________________________________________ FREE voicemail, email, and fax...all in one place. Sign Up Now! http://www.onebox.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 22, 2002 Report Share Posted February 22, 2002 wrote: I was wondering what people on supertraining think about ketogenic diets? Poetter Phoenix,AZ , I'm sure there are people on the list who are very knowledgeable about ketogenic diets. I am a pediatric nurse, I work with children who are placed on ketogenic diets for medical reasons. These children are hospitalized and monitored during the first few days of the diet. They are followed closely by a medical team and dietitian. Please be careful as constant ketosis is not a normal state of being. We want you to be able to keep posting! Kathie Chase E'town, KY Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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