Re: secondary metabolites(mycotoxins)

[Guest guest]

" who " <jeaninem660@...> wrote:

>

> This statement jumped out at me while reading something on the

cleveland ohio case. " The mere presence of mold does not necessary

mean that there are mycotoxins or spores in the air. mycotoxins are

secondary metabolites of certain types of mold. (a secondary

metabolite is a product produced by an organism that is not

necessary to sustain its life).<

Mold is a lot more talented than people give it credit for.

We had a discussion not too long ago about Stachy's capacity to

switch toxin production on or off in response to the presence of

competing microorganisms.

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> Re: Mycotoxin Questions

Fri Nov 11, 2005 6:41 pm

Mycotoxins are secondary metabolites specifically produced as a

defensive mechanism.

Very " biologically expensive " to produce, which is why Stachy doesn't

even bother to formulate toxins if it senses no competitor or threat.

Very economically efficient for such a " simple " organism.

As I wrote in an old post, Mold is a morally superior life form to

humans. Makes no weapons it doesn't need and is more " sharing " and

cooperative than Homo Sapiens, or, as I think our species should

REALLY be named: " Homo Stupidens " since we seem to be bent on self

destruction.

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[Guest guest]

How can anyone generalize so broadly about 'mycotoxins' when there are

hundreds (thousands?) of known mycotoxins and they represent so many

differenent kinds of molecules and so many different kinds of toxicities.

Effects may not be considered toxicity per se (and also, may be almost

impossible to prove without extremely powerful testing, an example might be

mimicking endocrine-disrupting homones that are potent in tiny amounts) but

any pharmacologically active substance does effect life systems profoundly

if present in concentrations high enough..

You would not go to a party and reach into a bowl of unknown pharmaceutical

pills and grab a handful and swallow them, would you?

(That was in ascene from an anti-drug movie I saw in health class when i was

a kid)

Well, a similar situation applies when you have an extreme mold situation..

the effects of so many different myco-chemicals can do many different things

at different times, almost none of them would ever be desirable - especially

if they were not known - or voluntary.

LSD, for example, is a mycotoxin.. (an ergot alkaloid, ergot alkaloids are

also produced by many aspergillus sp.)

Why people don't make this connection is beyond me.

[Guest guest]

LiveSimply <quackadillian@...> wrote:

>

> How can anyone generalize so broadly about 'mycotoxins' when there

are hundreds (thousands?) of known mycotoxins and they represent so

many differenent kinds of molecules and so many different kinds of

toxicities.

>

Well, that's because it's a true statement:

" The mere presence of mold does not necessary mean that there are

mycotoxins or spores in the air. "

We all know that you can come face to face with Stachy and STILL

find no airborne spores. Strange, but true.

AND, if one considers mycotoxins to be defensive secondary

metabolites, then non toxigenic molds which produce none can be

present in great quantity - but still no " toxins " are present.

I've been in plenty of moldy places which don't have any apparent

effect on me. But on the other hand, I've taken articles that were

knowingly exposed to Stachy out to the desert, laid out a tarp on

the ground - positioned the parameters of the test - and done a few

experiments to see how close I can get to the lone " bad " object in

an otherwise pristine environment - and the damn stuff knocks me for

a loop at a distance of several feet.

So the trick is to identify where it is, what is cross

contaminated - and stay just far away enough to be out of range.

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