Re: Trichothecenes degradation by ammonia - is there any evidence ?

[Guest guest]

No replies on this ?

(I just realized that I had not introduced myself here.

Sorry about that (:/ Brainfog.

I'm a 43 year old male. I live in Tennessee. I have

had CFS since 1984, after a bad case of mono. Mold has

been involved in my case, as have dental issues. I am

a current patient of Dr. Cheney. Ummm...

that's about all I can think of that is pertinent.)

Best,

Zippy

=================================================

>

> I Googled some articles about degradation

> of mycotoxins with ammonia and ozone, but

> none of them referfed to triochothecenes.

> Mostly they referred to ammonia degrading

> aflatoxins in grains.

>

> Is there any hard evidence of which mycotoxins

> can be degraded (and under what conditions,

> time of exposure, temp., etc..) by

> things a person could commonly use at home

> without great risk of harm from exposure.

>

> Things like: ammonia, chlorine, and ozone?

>

> Is this just a shot in the dark? Anecdotal

> evidence? What?

>

> Thanks,

> Zippy

>

[Guest guest]

-decontamination in food by ammonina(chemical decontamination of

mycotoxins) still looking but this is worth the read on mycotoxins in

foods and addressing many different tried methods.

http://www.fao.org/documents/show_cdr.asp?

url_file=/docrep/X2100T/X2100t07.htm

-- In

, " bhp355 " <zippy890@...> wrote:

>

> No replies on this ?

>

> (I just realized that I had not introduced myself here.

> Sorry about that (:/ Brainfog.

> I'm a 43 year old male. I live in Tennessee. I have

> had CFS since 1984, after a bad case of mono. Mold has

> been involved in my case, as have dental issues. I am

> a current patient of Dr. Cheney. Ummm...

> that's about all I can think of that is pertinent.)

>

> Best,

> Zippy

>

>

> =================================================

>

>

> >

> > I Googled some articles about degradation

> > of mycotoxins with ammonia and ozone, but

> > none of them referfed to triochothecenes.

> > Mostly they referred to ammonia degrading

> > aflatoxins in grains.

> >

> > Is there any hard evidence of which mycotoxins

> > can be degraded (and under what conditions,

> > time of exposure, temp., etc..) by

> > things a person could commonly use at home

> > without great risk of harm from exposure.

> >

> > Things like: ammonia, chlorine, and ozone?

> >

> > Is this just a shot in the dark? Anecdotal

> > evidence? What?

> >

> > Thanks,

> > Zippy

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Zippy,

As far as I remember, ammonia is used to destroy aflatoxins in food. I

haven't read it can degrade thrichothecene mycotoxins anywhere.

Someone recently said ammonia helped him in removing mycotoxins, but

he didn't say what type. Testing ammonia against trichothecenes

remains on my to-do list, it would be great if it could degrade

trichothecenes, but I really doubt it.

There is that often cited US army report about these toxins. I just

uploaded it to the files section of this group (pdf format). They

don't mention ammonia for degradation, but a mixture of sodium

hidroxide and sodium hypochlorite. If ammonia was known to be

successful I think they would have mentioned it. Don't know. In any

case, even the alkaline mixture of sodium hypochlorite didn't help in

my case, or maybe it depends on the surface in every particular case.

In my case it was wood.

Here's the excerpt:

--------------

The trichothecenes make up a family of closely

related chemical compounds called sesquiterpenoids

(Figure 34-1). The structures of close to 150 derivatives

of the trichothecenes are described in the scientific

literature.35,43 The specific side structures of

the most abundant of the naturally occurring

trichothecenes are shown in Table 34-1. Because of

its availability and relatively high toxicity, T-2 toxin

has been the most extensively studied trichothecene

mycotoxin.

The trichothecene mycotoxins are nonvolatile,

low-molecular-weight (MW 250–550) compounds.43

This group of mycotoxins is relatively insoluble in

water but highly soluble in acetone, ethyl acetate,

chloroform, dimethyl sulfoxide (DMSO), ethanol,

methanol, and propylene glycol.43 Purified trichothecenes

generally have a low vapor pressure, but

they do vaporize when heated in organic solvents.

Extraction of trichothecene mycotoxins from fungal

cultures with organic solvents yields a yellowbrown

liquid, which, if allowed to evaporate, forms

a greasy, yellow crystalline product. Some experts

10,16 believe this extract to be the yellow contaminate

of yellow rain. In contrast, highly purified

toxins form white, crystalline products that

have characteristic melting points.35

When maintained as either crystalline powders

or liquid solutions, trichothecene mycotoxin compounds

are stable when exposed to air, light, or

both. 35,44 Moreover, these mycotoxins are not inactivated

by autoclaving but require heating at 900°F

for 10 minutes or 500°F for 30 minutes for complete

inactivation.

A 3% to 5% solution of sodium hypochlorite

is an effective inactivation agent for

them.44 The efficacy of this solution can be increased

by the addition of small amounts of alkali.

------------------------------------

I also uploaded a pdf text named " An Investigation into Techniques for

Cleaning Mold-Contaminated Home Contents " .

Here's an excerpt from the introduction:

------------------------------------

This study examined the efficacy of the following treatments

to reduce selected fungal spore and mycotoxin levels on materials

commonly found in home contents: (1) gamma irradiation

at a 10–13 kiloGray exposure, (2) a detergent/bleach wash,

and (3) a steam cleaning technique. A minimum of six replicates

were performed per treatment. Paper, cloth, wood, and

carpet were inoculated with either fungal spores (Stachybotrys

chartarum, Aspergillus niger, Penicillium chrysogenum, or

Chaetomium globosum) at 240,000 spores/2.54 cm2 of material

or with the mycotoxins roridin A, T-2, and verrucarin A at

10 & #956;g per 2.54cm2 of material. Treatments were evaluated with

an agar plating technique for fungal spores and a yeast toxicity

culture assay for mycotoxins. Results showed that gamma irradiation

inactivated fungal spores, but the treatment was not

successful in inactivating mycotoxins. The washing technique

completely inactivated or removed spores on all materials

except for C. globosum, which was reduced on all items except

paper (p<0.05).Washing inactivated all mycotoxins on paper

and cloth but not on carpet or untreated wood (p<0.001). The

steam cleaning treatment did not completely eliminate any fungal

spores; however, it reduced P. chrysogenum numbers on all

materials, C. globosum was reduced on wood and carpet, and

S. chartarum was reduced on wood (p < 0.05). Steam cleaning

was unsuccessful in inactivating any of the tested mycotoxins.

These results show that the bleach/detergent washing technique

was more effective overall in reducing spore and mycotoxin

levels than gamma irradiation or steam cleaning. However, the

other examined techniques were successful in varying degrees.

------------------------------------------

So, I can't give you any definite answer. But, more likely than not,

I'd say ammonia isn't effective. I wish it would turn out I was wrong

though!

-Branislav

> >

> > I Googled some articles about degradation

> > of mycotoxins with ammonia and ozone, but

> > none of them referfed to triochothecenes.

> > Mostly they referred to ammonia degrading

> > aflatoxins in grains.

> >

> > Is there any hard evidence of which mycotoxins

> > can be degraded (and under what conditions,

> > time of exposure, temp., etc..) by

> > things a person could commonly use at home

> > without great risk of harm from exposure.

> >

> > Things like: ammonia, chlorine, and ozone?

> >

> > Is this just a shot in the dark? Anecdotal

> > evidence? What?

> >

> > Thanks,

> > Zippy

> >

>