Re: Re: It is Evidence-Based Medicine; Objection to Dr. Shoemaker being described as nontraditional or alter

[Guest guest]

,

Your post below is excellent about Shoemaker et al and the

distinction between allergic and non-allergic health effects. This is

critical information.

However, I would add my strong concerns about testing to those

already posted. I would specifically caution against using the Home

Depot test kit for definitive proof, or anything beyond an initial

screening or as a starting point. The vagaries of testing in general

has been well stated by more than just me - with the most compelling

stories by the victims themselves.

There are two main types of error (and a third) to beware of, both

resulting in harm:

1. Negative results that are false - which are very common. You are

exposed to mold and mold " products " but the test doesn't show

anything. Reasons could be that the mold is dead, it won't grow on

this particular sampling " food, " it doesn't survive shipping and

handling, it is a slow growing mold (like Stachy) that hasn't yet

become visible, " toxic " molds were successfully fought off by others,

the area sampled contained " something " but it wasn't mold, etc. Air

sampling will not find mold on surfaces. No spore-based methods will

identify the non-spore components. RISK: You are exposed but don't

act and you stay ill.

2. Positive results that misrepresent the exposure - even more

common. A dime sized colony of Stachybotrys collected and analyzed

could return a result, for example, of 100,000 CFU/cm2 if cultured or

even higher spores/cm2 by microscopy. HUGE! But if that is the only

location of Stachybotrys it most likely is not a concern - just

carefully wipe it off & check for moiture sources. And/or, the bigger

source is somewhere else. This actually happened to a client by a

" professional " that resulted in a $30,000 bid for the wrong area when

a $9,000 job in the right area would have been successful. Worse is

when a simple cleaning of the location or removing moldy contents is

sufficient but you pay several thousand instead. Or, you find Stachy

but you are extremely reactive to Penicillium instead. RISK: You

spend thousands of dollars and untold " brain damage " fighting the

wrong cause of your illness. You dig youself such a deep " hole " that

now you are financially unable to leave and find a new home.

3. There is also a third error: Making decisions based on whether

particular molds are " toxigenic " or " non-toxigenic. " Some, such as

Stachybotrys and several species of Penicillium (plus others) are

more likely to have generated mycotoxins than many others, but Stachy

has 3 varieties of the chartarum species, only one of which produces

mycotoxins. That is why they are, as you correctly identify them,

" toxigenic " molds rather than " toxic " molds. Toxigenic means they

can, but do not always, produce mycotoxins. " Toxic " means they always

do. None of them always produce mycotoxins and ALL can, in the right

environment.

SUGGESTION: Use the Home Depot kits as an initial screening device to

help make decisions about whether or not to do further investigation

on both the exposure level and the medical level. But don't try to

use them to " prove " to yourself or the skeptics.

Look, I know we can't trust the authorities and the " professional "

testing companies have so many fraudulant methods with so much spin

at unaffordable costs that it's hard to resist a simple, self test.

But please be aware that the Hope Depot test kit is NOT DEFINITIVE.

And only a very few methods in research labs approach being

definitive - and they requrie large numbers of samples costing

thousands of dollars.

Mold needs certain environments to barely survive, and more specific

environments to thrive and grow into mold " gardens " or " jungles. "

These can usually be identified without testing. These can also

usually be fixed without testing. (Appropriate testing by a qualified

professional will help in legal actions or if the doctor needs

speciation). For an excellent discussion about the ecology of mold,

read the interview of Dr Eugene Cole at:

http://members.aol.com/iecnews/Grimes-Oct03.html

Carl Grimes

Healthy Habitats LLC

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> I am lucky to have a job where I interact with physicians and other

> healthcare providers, including nurse practitioners and physician

> assistants. Almost all of them knew what I was on disability for, and

> when I talk about the SCIENCE of Dr. Shoemaker, Dr. Hudnell and

> others, they do not object to it. And his methods have been approved

> by the Agency for Healthcare and Research Quality. I have even loaned

> my copy of Mold Warriors to a couple of them to read the Chapter on

> 'The Biotoxin Pathway'. After reading it, one Family Physician

> thought that " the science is there " and is looking forward to the

> article in JAMA (Journal of the American Medical Association) coming

> from Dr. Shoemaker.

>

> I have posted this subject many times before, so forgive me if you

> are getting sick of it. It is just that there are so many new

> people. The main point that he can show is that the disease is not

> limited to allergy. Allergy is important, and can lead to asthma,

> but if you are NOT allergic, it needs to be treated through a

> different pathway. Doctors would agree to this logic since

> something like " Vasomotor " rhinitis (NON-allergic inflammation of

> the nose) is not due to allergy, a very different treatment is

> necessary from " Allergic " Rhinitis. The same lifestyle change

> (avoidance) and medication will not work for each. This is what is

> called a differential diagnosis. Now since a while back there was a

> study that came out of the Mayo Clinic looking at " Toxic Mold

> Syndrome " that determined 'Toxic Mold Syndrome could be explained by

> other things....including allergy'. Now since '24% of patients were

> not allergic', they admitted that it 'needed further investigation.'

>

> If you haven't already done so, please have your place tested with

> an inexpensive " Home Mold Test Kit " . You can get it at Lowe's for

> $10 and it takes $30 to analyze it. Make sure you do the physical

> sample, and if there is toxigenic fungi, please inform your doctor

> and ask him not to limit the effects to allergy, even if you are

> allergic to it.

>

> Good luck to all.