Tylenol

[Guest guest]

I was told by Dr. Czaja that if I have pain or sinus problems to take two

tylenol or tylenol sinus. Figure that out. I only use it only when

necessary. Also I have pain pills now.

Sue AIH

Wisconsin

[Guest guest]

Geri, apparently you can have some problems with tylenol if you are not

careful, expecially children. But I can't figure out if you have to have a bad

liver to start with or if it actually gives you one. But they did tell me

right off to only take tylenol one or two a week or so. Lynn I don't take

anything.

Geri Spang wrote:

> From: Geri Spang <spangs@...>

>

> Lynn,

> I would tell people I have AIH and they'd tell me about things they'd heard

> about Hepatitis C. Very frustrating. My husband told me that he had to be

> careful what he said at work because people thought I might have HIV,

> though that's not contagious either. People hear what they want to hear or

> what is familiar, no matter what you actually say.

> I've been surprised, though, that I haven't run into any medical people in

> Las Vegas who seemed to think I have something contagious. In fact, a few

> times I've been worried about how careless they seemed, since they didn't

> know what I actually have. But at least they haven't worn masks and rubber

> gloves everytime they come near me.

>

> Tylenol of all things! Crazy. Tylenol, of course, can be dangerous for

> people who drink and who have compromised livers, but it doesn't cause the

> liver disease I don't think. Lord, I don't know anymore. Until November

> 1997, liver was something I enjoyed with bacon and onions.

> Take care,

> Geri

>

> ---------------------------

[Guest guest]

Tom,

I'm always told to take Tylenol instead of aspirin, for a week before any

kind of procedure that might result in bleeding. Of course, the

instructions aren't telling me that I should start taking it whether I need

it or not, but aspirin is usually not allowed before surgery, etc. I'm

sure that's been the experience of just about everyone. I know this is a

dumb question and the answer might be on the bottle, but is Bufferin

considered aspiriin? I assume it is, but want to double check.

Take care,

Geri

[Guest guest]

Jayne, My experience with Tylenol, is it should not be taken on a

daily basis for anything.... it is really only for the occasional

headache... Quantities like 6/day every day is toxic to the liver and

can cause damage...Believe me, I know... I used Tylenol for about a year

in this fashion for a toothache that I didn't have the money to go to

the dentist... In the hospital, they said I showed signs of liver

weakness and high enzymes , we attributed it to overuse of Tylenol...

Ask you Doctor what you can take. Or there are herbal pain relievers

that don't have side effects.

This nail pits thing has got be totally confused and after reading the

last post that described them, I'm wondering if what I have is really

pits, I have no pain, no hole in nail, and no separation of the nail, no

psorisis near the nail or next joint, no swelling or sausage like joints

of any kind.

I just have dents in my nails that look like I dropped something on them

but they are not black and blue...I always thought that these dents were

caused by damage to the nail bed that had grown out.

What do you think? I had two good night sleep and last night, the

shoulder pain was unbearable, just couldn't sleep..can't figure it

out...

Ellen

http://onward.to/theherbhouse

[Guest guest]

Hi all:

At my last biopsy, 9/2/99, when the Physician's Assistant was dismissing me she

told me that I could take 1 Tylenol every six hours for pain. My mouth dropped

open. When I questioned her about the horror stories of Tylenol that I had

heard, she said that the best pain reliever was still one Tylenol every six

hours. For the good that would do me, I told her that I would forgo it.

This was at a leading teaching hospital(Cedars)/university (University of

Miami).

Go figure.

Warmly,

[Guest guest]

,

My doctors at one of the leading transplant hospitals told me I could still

take tylenol. Only 4 a day. However almost dieing from tylenol poisining I am

afraid to take anything with acetometephine in it. And all the people I know

including my doctors are thinking twice when they need something for pain.

Gayle

[Guest guest]

Dear Harper

Thanks so much for the info. I'm so thankful that I found this support

group, I already have a page full of questions to ask 's doctor next

time we see him.

Thanks again

Lori ('s Mom)

[Guest guest]

Thanks

I really appreciated the info.

Lori ('s Mom)

[Guest guest]

nne,

From my personal experience of taking Tylenol and close to dying because of it I am very cautious. All of my Docs tell me no over the counter drugs unless they OK it first they have instructed me to call on any question about drugs even my other docs give me. They would rather give narcotics because while there is still Tylenol in them you won't take as much or be tempted to take Tylenol. I took 5-6 at a time every 4 hours. I have intense pain from my Fibromyalgia that I have to take pain meds to function. I don't agree that you have been told you have to tough it out. I am sorry if your pain is to much you should not have to be in pain. My docs say there are plenty of pain meds on the market that no one should have to suffer. When you can't control the pain you can't help your body to do any kind of healing.

gayle trans/6-99 ^oo^

galye@...

[Guest guest]

, you said your family doc okd taking tylenol. Do you have a

gastro or hepatologist as well? Everything I have read in relation

to taking that when dealing with liver problems is either not to at

all, or very sparingly. You may want to run it by your doctor

again if he is the only one treating you.

When I had the first acute flareup, the gastro at that time was

adamant that I not take ANY medication such as tylenol, motrin, advil,

etc. The family doctor I saw while waiting to see the new gastro told

me he would rather give me a prescription for a narcotic than have me

take tylenol (I still cant figure that one out) Last fall while

waiting for the results of the ANA, etc, I had the worst joint

pain...the new gastro was just as insistent I not take anything, just

had to tough it out. Now that my levels are within touching distance

of " normal " I was allowed to take ibuprofen when I fractured my arm,

but only if I really needed it. They still dont want me taking

tylenol. My gastro also advised that if I were to see another doctor

for any kind of acute illness, injury, etc, and was given a

prescription or told to take some over the counter stuff, to either

have that doctor contact him, or for me to check with him before I

took it.

> Hi Everyone

>

> Could someone please help with his question about tylenol? I

know that

> is allowed to have tylenol but only when really necessary.

>

> 's doctor really hasn't gone into what meds she should avoid.

Are

> there some that are that she shouldn't take? I try not to give her

anything

> but have given her advil a couple of times for tooth pain.

>

> Thanks

> Lori ('s Mom)

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 8/16/01 5:54:16 PM Pacific Daylight Time, nneW5@... writes:

also didnt mention that they believe the first acute flareup was caused by an antibiotic I was taking for rosacea. After the dx of AIH, it was avoid tylenol, anything else only take if necessary and only after clearing it with the doc.

nne

Which antibiotic were you taking? My doctor thought amoxicillin, taken for difficulties following flu, might have been responsible -- or it might have been Detrol, or Estrace, or Tylenol. Or just lack of sleep and excess of pressure at work. Who knows.

Harper (AIH 5/00)

[Guest guest]

Gayle,

I guess I didnt explain well...but at the time they told me to try to

tough it out, they were still trying to figure out what was wrong with

my liver...waiting for the labs (ANA) to come back and no biopsy at

that point. I was advised to try to tough it out and hang in there

until they could find out what was wrong. I think the concern was that

without knowing what was causing the problem, I might make matters

worse. I also didnt mention that they believe the first acute flareup

was caused by an antibiotic I was taking for rosacea. After the dx of

AIH, it was avoid tylenol, anything else only take if necessary and

only after clearing it with the doc.

nne

> nne,

> From my personal experience of taking Tylenol and close to dying

because of

> it I am very cautious. All of my Docs tell me no over the counter

drugs

> unless they OK it first they have instructed me to call on any

question about

> drugs even my other docs give me. They would rather give narcotics

because

> while there is still Tylenol in them you won't take as much or be

tempted to

> take Tylenol. I took 5-6 at a time every 4 hours. I have intense

pain from my

> Fibromyalgia that I have to take pain meds to function. I don't

agree that

> you have been told you have to tough it out. I am sorry if your pain

is to

> much you should not have to be in pain. My docs say there are plenty

of pain

> meds on the market that no one should have to suffer. When you can't

control

> the pain you can't help your body to do any kind of healing.

>

> gayle trans/6-99 ^oo^

> galye@a...

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 1/4/02 6:54:25 PM Pacific Standard Time, tdcc2000@... writes:

Harper, one of my co workers takes two tylenol PM each night to sleep. She has been doing this for years...and she is only in her early 30's. It is frightening to know that it could be a reason for people developing AIH. I wonder why the AMA has not said anything about it? But, then, they may have and I just don't know about it...debby

There has been a fair amount in the news about people who have had various liver problems with Tylenol. Tylenol is particularly dangerous for people who drink even moderately. However, not everyone is harmed by it, of course! For many people it's been a great help.

I can remember vividly where I was, what I was doing the first time I heard of Tylenol. About thirty years ago, I was sitting in a tree swing when a pre-med student working at a pharmacy told me to be careful because it had the potential to cause liver damage. At the time I didn't even know where my liver was, and I thought I was invulnerable, Superwoman, born to hike and camp and swim. So, obviously, I didn't have to pay attention!

Harper

[Guest guest]

Wow! That is frightening that a med student knew about it. Seems like the used to teach them in med school! I wonder what ever happened to that guy! He must be an awesome doctor!

debby

Re: [ ] Tylenol

In a message dated 1/4/02 6:54:25 PM Pacific Standard Time, tdcc2000@... writes:

Harper, one of my co workers takes two tylenol PM each night to sleep. She has been doing this for years...and she is only in her early 30's. It is frightening to know that it could be a reason for people developing AIH. I wonder why the AMA has not said anything about it? But, then, they may have and I just don't know about it...debbyThere has been a fair amount in the news about people who have had various liver problems with Tylenol. Tylenol is particularly dangerous for people who drink even moderately. However, not everyone is harmed by it, of course! For many people it's been a great help. I can remember vividly where I was, what I was doing the first time I heard of Tylenol. About thirty years ago, I was sitting in a tree swing when a pre-med student working at a pharmacy told me to be careful because it had the potential to cause liver damage. At the time I didn't even know where my liver was, and I thought I was invulnerable, Superwoman, born to hike and camp and swim. So, obviously, I didn't have to pay attention! Harper

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 2/10/02 6:58:14 PM Pacific Standard Time, seajay192002@... writes:

Thanks Harper. Tylenol is not a New Zealand Brand. I

suspect it is akin to our Panadol which is paracetmol

and I am not at all happy about taking that. My

taking of anything would be limited to about once in a

few weeks and then hardly that. Seems almost not worth

it - but sometimes one --just does.

I see. Yes, I think Tylenol and Panadol (paracetamol) are basically the same thing. Tylenol is based on acetaminophen. Acetaminophen is believed to have been the trigger for AIH in many people, and large amounts of it, particularly with alcohol, can cause extremely severe liver damage. I'm very uneasy about taking Tylenol, but everything I read and every medical person I speak with says it's the safest mild analgesic for people with liver disease. Oddly, good old aspirin seems to be regarded as riskier. Fortunately, currently I'm don't have to use either drug, but I like knowing Tylenol is there if needed.

Harper

[Guest guest]

--- karolynt47 <karolyn1@...> wrote:

I have found the only thing that works

> for me on the rare occasions I get a severe headache is tylenol. I

> am trying to keep all chemicals out of my body but must admit that

I > took two Excedrin Migraine (acetaminophen + aspirin) last month.

I > felt so guilty doing it. Claudine's post makes me rest a bit >

easier. Of course, I know I must be cautious. Compared to the way I

ingested analgesics, antihistamines and other medications

pre-diagnosis, now I am a saint! Because of all the good things I'm

doing >for my liver, in my heart I don't think 2 Excedrin every two

months >or more is going to contribute to further deterioration.

>Karolyn

Karolyn, Your stressing over whether to take this or that might be

doing more harm than the pill, lol. It's important for people to

remember that the liver is an AMAZING organ, and while it might have

to work a bit harder, up until it reaches the point of end-stage

liver failure, it will continue to function pretty darned good. (That

is why the TRUE liver function tests of Albumin, bilirubin,

prothromin time, etc., are almost always still normal up until the

disease progresses to cirrhosis, and often not until the cirrhosis is

advanced.) Sure, we want to treat our livers with respect, but all

you have to do really is know a few basic facts about drugs, pain,

and the liver, and use common sense. (Who with any common sense is

going to down 20 extra-strength Tylenol at once, unless it's a

deliberate suicide attempt?) Taking a couple of Tylenol at the first

sign of of a sinus headache is probably the BEST thing you can do for

your liver since trying to 'tough it out' often leads to the need for

more or stronger pain medications in the long run. And - my main

point in writing this - when Tylenol in moderate doses doesn't do the

trick, then the best thing to do is see a doctor. As odd as this may

sound, some of the safest pain relievers are narcotics, although many

doctors hesitiate to prescribe them. But often a prescription

medication, such as Vicodin (which is acetaminophen combined with

hydrocodone) will allow you to take the stronger pain med you need

without going over your limit of Tylenol. And as for KNOWING about

various drugs, I strongly recommend everyone always read up on any

drug you are considering taking, even if it's your GI doctor

prescribing it. Doctors are often sadly unknowledgable about side

effects of drugs, or possible drug interactions. Unless it's a drug

they prescribe very commonly for conditions they are trained to treat

(like prescribing Prevacid for someone with a GI reflux), they may

not know any more than what a drug salesman has told them about a

drug. A very good site to read up on drugs (and some herbs too) is

http://www.rxlist.com/ 'Clicking' on the generic form of the drug

will give you all the same prescribing information, side effects,

warnings, etc., that are available to physicians. Again, knowledge is

power.

Claudine

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

I have found dye free Children's Motrin so I stick with that, though

it still has flavors it doesn't seem to bother Luke too much since he

gets it so rarely. GL!

> Hi, I have a question on tylenol, should I use it? What is best to

> use for fever or pain? Also does anyone have a list of foods high

in

> phenol? Thanks alot for everyones great advice..

[Guest guest]

I use this also but since starting No Fenol I've tried a couple of

meds that previously bothered my daughter(like Benedryl) with NF and

she was fine with it :-)

> > Hi, I have a question on tylenol, should I use it? What is best

to

> > use for fever or pain? Also does anyone have a list of foods high

> in

> > phenol? Thanks alot for everyones great advice..

[Guest guest]

> Hi, I have a question on tylenol, should I use it? What is best to

> use for fever or pain?

I use motrin, usually the capsules but sometimes the liquid. My kids

do okay with motrin, and it works best for them.

> Also does anyone have a list of foods high in

> phenol? Thanks alot for everyones great advice..

My page

http://www.autismchannel.net/dana/phenol.htm

Dana

[Guest guest]

Thanks, for the info guys. I had already known that Tylenol was OK in

moderation. I stopped feeling guilty about taking it occasionally

after Claudine posted an article about it.. (Might have been the same

article). I feel terrible taking the motrin, but I remembered from

somewhere it was better for tooth pain. I think I'll stick with

Tylenol - Probably the lesser of two evils. Love & Peace. Karolyn

[Guest guest]

Kat,

My Doc said Tylenol is OK in normal doses provided I do NOT drink alcohol.

Could the recommendation for Tylenol depend on the amount of liver damage one

has?

Jane

[Guest guest]

Jane,

Very good question! I wish I knew as well. Again, What I do understand in

cats is some medications are toxic at normal levels when they are

compromised, or older (16 yrs.+). Sometimes I extrapolate to humans in

regards to medications both from research I've done in my family, and what

is known for animals. Incidentally, many drugs we use for people have

extrapolated doses for animals, without true research and monitoring of

levels. Such a confusing issue about doses, and still an area of research

both on doses and on length of time on meds. Basically, it comes down to

trusting your doc, and observing how you feel when starting the meds.

My mom is so terrified of the side effects of ANY medication, she takes it

at an ineffective dose, experiences no effect (and no benefit) and then

discontinues it. :-( I usually have to explain every side effect in detail,

and then mention a dose she could start with (usually the high end of the

dosage level) so when she " chooses " a lower dose it is still in the

therapeutic range. Talk about a pain!!! Amazingly, she has yet to have

problems with this method. Boy the hoops we caregivers go thru!

If you have an answer on the Tylenol, let me know.

Thanks,

Kat

Re: [ ] Re: Tylenol

> Kat,

>

> My Doc said Tylenol is OK in normal doses provided I do NOT drink alcohol.

> Could the recommendation for Tylenol depend on the amount of liver damage

one

> has?

>

> Jane

>

>

[Guest guest]

Joy,

Have you tried Bextra? My doctor gave me that because my family has a

history of stomach issues when taking NSAIDs...she says its much easier on

the stomach than Vioxx or Celebrex...

[Guest guest]

Thanks, I will write this down. Is this for pain or inflammation?

I started taking Lodine and bam my feet swelled bigger then they normally

are....ugh.

Joy

----------------

Bextra is new on the drug market for anit-inflammation. PatB

> Joy,

>

> Have you tried Bextra? My doctor gave me that because my family has a

> history of stomach issues when taking NSAIDs...she says its much easier on

> the stomach than Vioxx or Celebrex...

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Joy,

The Bextra is for both pain and inflammation. For the last 8 months, its

worked great for both. Over the last few weeks, my pain has gotten much

worse and I need to supplement the Bextra with Tylenol. But it still is

keeping the inflammation down (I think), my fingers and toes aren't swollen.