Re: Marathoning /Cholesterol

[Guest guest]

a=z,

You should not be surprised that too much of a good thing is bad. Too

much exercise will wear our your joints and break down your muscles.

With regard to high cholesterol, you need to become familiar with the

Hegsted equation, and the Mensink and Katan equations. These

equations describe how your blood cholesterol changes based on the

proportions of fatty acids in the diet. You cannot hope to have

Optimum Nutrition without understanding fatty acid balance.

There are three main causes of high cholesterol: 1) familial

hypercholesterolemia which is fairly rare (~1/500 people), 2) high

carbohydrate, low-fat diet, and 3) diet deficient in essential

omega-6, omega-3 fatty acids.

High carbohydrate, low-fat diets increase cholesterol because

carbohydrates get metabolized to palmitate (C16:0) which is a

saturated fatty acid that can increase cholesterol. When the diet

does not have enough omega-6, i.e., linoleic acid (C18:2), your

cholesterol will be high.

Similarly, if your diet is high in saturated fats, your cholesterol

will be high. You need to reduce the amount of saturated fats, and

increase the amount of polyunsaturated in your diet. I have

summarized this information in my three pages on cholesterol:

http://www.scientificpsychic.com/health/cholesterol.html

It is time to review and revise your diet. Something like cutting

back on the " healthy " olive oil and replacing it with a high

polyunsaturated oil like grape seed oil, and adding one tablespoon of

flax seed oil per day to your diet is generally all it takes to

normalize your cholesterol. Of course, you have to avoid hydrogenated

fats, and saturated fats like coconut oil and palm kernel oil too.

It would be educational for all of us if you could post your current

typical diet, so that we may analyze it.

Tony

>

> Baloney there goes my training and last planned attempt at another

> marathon. One wise sage (Dirty Harry in Magnum Force) once said, " A

> man's got to know his limitations. "

>

> http://www.nytimes.com/2006/12/07/fashion/07Fitness.html?

> ex=1166245200 & en=e0790378c2f0eb67 & ei=5070 & emc=eta1

>

> Actually had a physical the day after my only completed marathon and

> the doctor mentioned that the blood tests showed some muscle damage.

> Always thought it was my poor sore leg muscles, but maybe it was

> actually my heart itself. Anyway that's it for me folks - sticking

> to 6 or maybe 10 miles max and trying hard not to hold more than a

> 100 lb potato sack (in each arm for at least a minute)**.

>

> a=z

>

> PS Did my cholesterol today - yikes - back to some serious CRONing.

>

> ** For any retards out there, that means the sack itself, sans

> potatoes. Sorry for the acerbity, but he author (me) is in a bad

> mood due to high cholesterol and the prospect of a dreary life with

> no more marathon training. And just when I was getting good at

> running up that d*%m hill.

>

[Guest guest]

> >

> > Baloney there goes my training and last planned attempt at

another

> > marathon. One wise sage (Dirty Harry in Magnum Force) once

said, " A

> > man's got to know his limitations. "

> >

> > http://www.nytimes.com/2006/12/07/fashion/07Fitness.html?

> > ex=1166245200 & en=e0790378c2f0eb67 & ei=5070 & emc=eta1

> >

> > Actually had a physical the day after my only completed marathon

and

> > the doctor mentioned that the blood tests showed some muscle

damage.

> > Always thought it was my poor sore leg muscles, but maybe it was

> > actually my heart itself. Anyway that's it for me folks -

sticking

> > to 6 or maybe 10 miles max and trying hard not to hold more than

a

> > 100 lb potato sack (in each arm for at least a minute)**.

> >

> > a=z

> >

> > PS Did my cholesterol today - yikes - back to some serious

CRONing.

> >

> > ** For any retards out there, that means the sack itself, sans

> > potatoes. Sorry for the acerbity, but he author (me) is in a bad

> > mood due to high cholesterol and the prospect of a dreary life

with

> > no more marathon training. And just when I was getting good at

> > running up that d*%m hill.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Citpeks/Tony wrote:"With regard to high cholesterol, you need to become familiar with theHegsted equation, and the Mensink and Katan equations. Theseequations describe how your blood cholesterol changes based on theproportions of fatty acids in the diet. You cannot hope to haveOptimum Nutrition without understanding fatty acid balance.There are three main causes of high cholesterol: 1) familialhypercholesterolemia which is fairly rare (~1/500 people), 2) highcarbohydrate, low-fat diet, and 3) diet deficient in essentialomega-6, omega-3 fatty acids.High carbohydrate, low-fat diets increase cholesterol becausecarbohydrates get metabolized to palmitate (C16:0) which is asaturated fatty acid that can increase cholesterol. When the dietdoes not have enough omega-6, i.e., linoleic acid (C18:2), yourcholesterol will be high.Similarly, if your diet is high in saturated fats, your cholesterolwill be high. You need to reduce the amount of saturated fats, andincrease the amount of polyunsaturated in your diet. I havesummarized this information in my three pages on cholesterol:http://www.scientificpsychic.com/health/cholesterol.htmlIt is time to review and revise your diet. Something like cuttingback on the "healthy" olive oil and replacing it with a highpolyunsaturated oil like grape seed oil, and adding one tablespoon offlax seed oil per day to your diet is generally all it takes tonormalize your cholesterol. Of course, you have to avoid hydrogenatedfats, and saturated fats like coconut oil and palm kernel oil too"

Is the above rather negative view on monounsaturateds, and positive view on polyunsaturateds, an "extreme" view or something that has become accepted in wider circles? If the latter, I've missed out on something. I have faithfully followed Roy Walford's 120-year diet book over the last six years, which states that: 80% of your fats or oils should be monounsaturated (olive and canola oil, avocados), 10 % polyunsaturated (mainly Omega 3:s) and the rest can be saturated. Amongst the motives for this as mentioned in his book are:

- Monounsaturateds lower LDL and raise HDL

- On the contrary, polyunsaturateds ("like corn and safflower oil" - I don't know how grape seed oil would fit in here) risks lowering both LDL and HDL

- Omega 6 should not be more than about four times that of Omega 3 intake. Vegetable polyunsaturateds tend to have a much higher Omega 6 ratio, e.g. safflower oil 255/1 (The cholesterol info ón "scientificpsychic" above mentions the possibility of replacing grape seed oil with safflower oil).

- Excess polyunsaturateds, while decreasing the incidence of cornoary heart disease, may stimulate cancer. Auto-oxidation of the polyunsaturateds, initiated by heating, causes them to combine with oxygen to produce peroxidized free radicals that may increase the incidence of cancer.

Cutting back on the monos and starting with grape seed oil would be a minor revolution for me, and I'd appreciate more info before considering taking such a step!

Ulf

[Guest guest]

Hi Ulf:

There has been quite a lot of discussion here about monounsaturated

(as well as the others of course) fats.

There are two studies I have paid attention to. First, the Nurses'

Health Study - that has followed more than 100,000 nurses for more

than 30 years. Many of them have already died, are dying, or getting

sick, and the investigators can now look back at what the differences

were about the behaviours of the healthy ones compared with the dead

ones.

There were huge differences in fat consumption. Overwhelmingly the

worst were hydrogenated fats. Those that had consumed large amounts

of them were dying like flies. Next worst were saturated fats, but

with sickness/death rates only slightly worse than the average.

Monos came next, slightly better than the average. And polys, which

were much better than the average.

Some people have interpreted this as an endorsement of monos. But it

is pretty damning that the health of people who ate them was only

slightly better than that of the average american nurse who was, of

course, on the perfectly dreadful 'SAD' diet. It is no claim to fame

to be marginally less bad than the SAD diet. I believe monos are

atherogenic, but less so than hydrogenated oils and myristic acid.

The second study of interest is a study in Crete. Fewer people die

of heart disease in Crete than in north america. But a study was

done of the characteristics of those in Crete who did succumb to

CVD. One notable characteristic was that they were those who, of the

residents of Crete, consumed the most monounsaturated oils.

There is more information in a similar vein. I avoid all fats to the

extent I can. I use safflower oil when I really need to use some

kind of oil. I eat some nuts and fish which provides more than

plenty fat. But if an important recipe occasionally demands it I

will use olive oil (or even butter in very small quantities from time

to time).

If I eat no nuts or fish, fat amounts to about 10% of my calories.

But I almost alweays do eat fish and/or nuts. So much more often

fats account for about 20% of calories. Today, as it happens will be

much higher as I have eaten a lot (many too many, lol) of nuts.

Of course there is no nutritional requirement for monounsaturated

oils. Just almost entirely empty calories.

Just my take. But check the archives. There is a lot more

discussion. Especially from Jeff Novick.

Rodney.

>

> " With regard to high cholesterol, you need to become familiar with

the

> Hegsted equation, and the Mensink and Katan equations. These

> equations describe how your blood cholesterol changes based on the

> proportions of fatty acids in the diet. You cannot hope to have

> Optimum Nutrition without understanding fatty acid balance.

>

> There are three main causes of high cholesterol: 1) familial

> hypercholesterolemia which is fairly rare (~1/500 people), 2) high

> carbohydrate, low-fat diet, and 3) diet deficient in essential

> omega-6, omega-3 fatty acids.

>

> High carbohydrate, low-fat diets increase cholesterol because

> carbohydrates get metabolized to palmitate (C16:0) which is a

> saturated fatty acid that can increase cholesterol. When the diet

> does not have enough omega-6, i.e., linoleic acid (C18:2), your

> cholesterol will be high.

>

> Similarly, if your diet is high in saturated fats, your cholesterol

> will be high. You need to reduce the amount of saturated fats, and

> increase the amount of polyunsaturated in your diet. I have

> summarized this information in my three pages on cholesterol:

>

> http://www.scientificpsychic.com/health/cholesterol.html

>

> It is time to review and revise your diet. Something like cutting

> back on the " healthy " olive oil and replacing it with a high

> polyunsaturated oil like grape seed oil, and adding one tablespoon

of

> flax seed oil per day to your diet is generally all it takes to

> normalize your cholesterol. Of course, you have to avoid

hydrogenated

> fats, and saturated fats like coconut oil and palm kernel oil too "

>

> Is the above rather negative view on monounsaturateds, and positive

view on polyunsaturateds, an " extreme " view or something that has

become accepted in wider circles? If the latter, I've missed out on

something. I have faithfully followed Roy Walford's 120-year diet

book over the last six years, which states that: 80% of your fats or

oils should be monounsaturated (olive and canola oil, avocados), 10 %

polyunsaturated (mainly Omega 3:s) and the rest can be saturated.

Amongst the motives for this as mentioned in his book are:

> - Monounsaturateds lower LDL and raise HDL

> - On the contrary, polyunsaturateds ( " like corn and safflower oil " -

I don't know how grape seed oil would fit in here) risks lowering

both LDL and HDL

> - Omega 6 should not be more than about four times that of Omega 3

intake. Vegetable polyunsaturateds tend to have a much higher Omega 6

ratio, e.g. safflower oil 255/1 (The cholesterol info

ón " scientificpsychic " above mentions the possibility of replacing

grape seed oil with safflower oil).

> - Excess polyunsaturateds, while decreasing the incidence of

cornoary heart disease, may stimulate cancer. Auto-oxidation of the

polyunsaturateds, initiated by heating, causes them to combine with

oxygen to produce peroxidized free radicals that may increase the

incidence of cancer.

>

> Cutting back on the monos and starting with grape seed oil would be

a minor revolution for me, and I'd appreciate more info before

considering taking such a step!

>

> Ulf

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Ulf:

Post # 24188 is one from me on olive oil, that you might want to take

a look at.

Rodney.

>

> " With regard to high cholesterol, you need to become familiar with

the

> Hegsted equation, and the Mensink and Katan equations. These

> equations describe how your blood cholesterol changes based on the

> proportions of fatty acids in the diet. You cannot hope to have

> Optimum Nutrition without understanding fatty acid balance.

>

> There are three main causes of high cholesterol: 1) familial

> hypercholesterolemia which is fairly rare (~1/500 people), 2) high

> carbohydrate, low-fat diet, and 3) diet deficient in essential

> omega-6, omega-3 fatty acids.

>

> High carbohydrate, low-fat diets increase cholesterol because

> carbohydrates get metabolized to palmitate (C16:0) which is a

> saturated fatty acid that can increase cholesterol. When the diet

> does not have enough omega-6, i.e., linoleic acid (C18:2), your

> cholesterol will be high.

>

> Similarly, if your diet is high in saturated fats, your cholesterol

> will be high. You need to reduce the amount of saturated fats, and

> increase the amount of polyunsaturated in your diet. I have

> summarized this information in my three pages on cholesterol:

>

> http://www.scientificpsychic.com/health/cholesterol.html

>

> It is time to review and revise your diet. Something like cutting

> back on the " healthy " olive oil and replacing it with a high

> polyunsaturated oil like grape seed oil, and adding one tablespoon

of

> flax seed oil per day to your diet is generally all it takes to

> normalize your cholesterol. Of course, you have to avoid

hydrogenated

> fats, and saturated fats like coconut oil and palm kernel oil too "

>

> Is the above rather negative view on monounsaturateds, and positive

view on polyunsaturateds, an " extreme " view or something that has

become accepted in wider circles? If the latter, I've missed out on

something. I have faithfully followed Roy Walford's 120-year diet

book over the last six years, which states that: 80% of your fats or

oils should be monounsaturated (olive and canola oil, avocados), 10 %

polyunsaturated (mainly Omega 3:s) and the rest can be saturated.

Amongst the motives for this as mentioned in his book are:

> - Monounsaturateds lower LDL and raise HDL

> - On the contrary, polyunsaturateds ( " like corn and safflower oil " -

I don't know how grape seed oil would fit in here) risks lowering

both LDL and HDL

> - Omega 6 should not be more than about four times that of Omega 3

intake. Vegetable polyunsaturateds tend to have a much higher Omega 6

ratio, e.g. safflower oil 255/1 (The cholesterol info

ón " scientificpsychic " above mentions the possibility of replacing

grape seed oil with safflower oil).

> - Excess polyunsaturateds, while decreasing the incidence of

cornoary heart disease, may stimulate cancer. Auto-oxidation of the

polyunsaturateds, initiated by heating, causes them to combine with

oxygen to produce peroxidized free radicals that may increase the

incidence of cancer.

>

> Cutting back on the monos and starting with grape seed oil would be

a minor revolution for me, and I'd appreciate more info before

considering taking such a step!

>

> Ulf

>

[Guest guest]

It's beginning to sound to me like the ideal dietary

protein/fat/carbohydrate ratio should be something like:

10%/15%/75% where the fat percentage varies from 10-20% and the

carbohydrate ratio would then vary from 70-80%.

This is based on the protein/cancer study posted by Al, and the

information Rodney has posted below. By eating mostly vegetables and

fruit with a tiny bit of fish and nuts, you should be able to attain

P/F/C ratios in this ballpark.

-Diane

> >

> > " With regard to high cholesterol, you need to become familiar with

> the

> > Hegsted equation, and the Mensink and Katan equations. These

> > equations describe how your blood cholesterol changes based on the

> > proportions of fatty acids in the diet. You cannot hope to have

> > Optimum Nutrition without understanding fatty acid balance.

> >

> > There are three main causes of high cholesterol: 1) familial

> > hypercholesterolemia which is fairly rare (~1/500 people), 2) high

> > carbohydrate, low-fat diet, and 3) diet deficient in essential

> > omega-6, omega-3 fatty acids.

> >

> > High carbohydrate, low-fat diets increase cholesterol because

> > carbohydrates get metabolized to palmitate (C16:0) which is a

> > saturated fatty acid that can increase cholesterol. When the diet

> > does not have enough omega-6, i.e., linoleic acid (C18:2), your

> > cholesterol will be high.

> >

> > Similarly, if your diet is high in saturated fats, your cholesterol

> > will be high. You need to reduce the amount of saturated fats, and

> > increase the amount of polyunsaturated in your diet. I have

> > summarized this information in my three pages on cholesterol:

> >

> > http://www.scientificpsychic.com/health/cholesterol.html

> >

> > It is time to review and revise your diet. Something like cutting

> > back on the " healthy " olive oil and replacing it with a high

> > polyunsaturated oil like grape seed oil, and adding one tablespoon

> of

> > flax seed oil per day to your diet is generally all it takes to

> > normalize your cholesterol. Of course, you have to avoid

> hydrogenated

> > fats, and saturated fats like coconut oil and palm kernel oil too "

> >

> > Is the above rather negative view on monounsaturateds, and positive

> view on polyunsaturateds, an " extreme " view or something that has

> become accepted in wider circles? If the latter, I've missed out on

> something. I have faithfully followed Roy Walford's 120-year diet

> book over the last six years, which states that: 80% of your fats or

> oils should be monounsaturated (olive and canola oil, avocados), 10 %

> polyunsaturated (mainly Omega 3:s) and the rest can be saturated.

> Amongst the motives for this as mentioned in his book are:

> > - Monounsaturateds lower LDL and raise HDL

> > - On the contrary, polyunsaturateds ( " like corn and safflower oil " -

> I don't know how grape seed oil would fit in here) risks lowering

> both LDL and HDL

> > - Omega 6 should not be more than about four times that of Omega 3

> intake. Vegetable polyunsaturateds tend to have a much higher Omega 6

> ratio, e.g. safflower oil 255/1 (The cholesterol info

> ón " scientificpsychic " above mentions the possibility of replacing

> grape seed oil with safflower oil).

> > - Excess polyunsaturateds, while decreasing the incidence of

> cornoary heart disease, may stimulate cancer. Auto-oxidation of the

> polyunsaturateds, initiated by heating, causes them to combine with

> oxygen to produce peroxidized free radicals that may increase the

> incidence of cancer.

> >

> > Cutting back on the monos and starting with grape seed oil would be

> a minor revolution for me, and I'd appreciate more info before

> considering taking such a step!

> >

> > Ulf

> >

>