Weight loss issues vs. CR issues

[Guest guest]

Well, first of all, I promise never to use the word A*****s on this

forum again. It appears to inflame old wounds and have other untoward

effects.

I think there are two completely separate areas of discussion:

1) The first is, what's the best balance of proteins, fats, and carbs

in a diet to be followed by an obese person who wants to lose weight, and

2) the second is, what is the best balance of proteins, fats, and

carbs in a " skinny " or normal person who is following a CR diet.

The answers may not be the same. Some of discussions here have

focused on weight loss diets, which are probably really off-topic. A

high protein intake has been shown to be good for weight loss diets

because a high protein intake suppresses appetite, and metabolism of

protein has a higher calorie cost than metabolism of carbs and fats.

A low carb diet may be good for weight loss because, as was pointed

out, you wind up cutting down total calories, plus, if you get to the

point of being ketotic, your appetite is suppressed. On the other

hand, for obese people eating a lot of food and trying to lose weight,

too high a protein intake can lead to aciduria, hypercalciuria, and

hyperuricemia (from associated purine intake). Too high a saturated

fat intake can lead to atherosclerosis, and too many carbs can lead to

carb craving and elevated blood glucose levels, which also are being

identified now as a risk factor for cardiovascular disease. AGE's

(advanced glycosylation end products) are also very important, but

these can be avoided no matter what diet you're following (I found out

that duck skin has the highest level of AGEs by the way, and then I

said, " forget it " . I'm not giving up my roasted duck!)

But now let's consider CR mode. Here the questions are completely

different. It's no longer a proportions issue, but an absolute

amounts issue. The questions here (among others) are as follows:

1) What's the minimum amount of protein intake to preserve lean body

mass? Is the minimum required protein intake higher if one is

pursuing IF fasting where ketosis occurs? Is minimum protein intake

higher if one is CR'ing using a ketogenic diet where you eat every day

but limit carb intake?

2) Is there any minimum requirement for saturated fat in the diet?

Are you taking a health risk by avoiding saturated fats completely?

3) Is there a minimum requirement for carbs in a CR diet? Does this

depend on just the amount of carbs (protein-sparing issue) or the

types of carbs (micronutrient issue).

4) If you swear off meat, what about compounds like carnitine,

glucosamine, and chondroitin sulfate? B12? Supplements issue.

5) Is the CR effect of, say, neuroprotection, due in part or at all to

ketosis, or can you completely avoid ketosis and get all of the

benefits of CR?

5) Is there a minimum BMI or muscle mass threshold where the dangers

of a CR diet begin to outweigh possible survival benefits?

I know that many of these issues have been discussed already in weeks

or years past, but I think this sort of frames some of the recent

discussions about protein requirements and ketosis.

I would be particularly interested to know if people doing CR are all

routinely taking glucosamine/chondroitin and/or carnitine.