RE: NT, weight gain, thyroid

[Guest guest]

Heidi-

>I did " light weights " for a long time until I read an article about how

>they used heavy weights (so the person can't do more than 8 reps), with

>only one set, on elderly women. And they got great results! Using light

>weights and resistence bands on the old ladies did not much good at all,

>but the heavy weights helped with arthritis etc. and they had some who

>could barely move, climbing stairs in a week or two.

Could you point me to this article? My grandmother is severely

osteoporotic and decrepit. Conventional medicine has done nothing but make

her worse (Fosamax being one of the prime culprits) but she's moving in

with my mom soon, so I'd like to point her to something more useful than

the useless exercises her doctors have her doing.

Thanks,

-

-

[Guest guest]

>Could you point me to this article? My grandmother is severely

>osteoporotic and decrepit. Conventional medicine has done nothing but make

>her worse (Fosamax being one of the prime culprits) but she's moving in

>with my mom soon, so I'd like to point her to something more useful than

>the useless exercises her doctors have her doing.

>

>Thanks,

>

>-

The one I read was in Health magazine before it got so commercial, and I

don't keep back copies. But I did find one online that seems pretty good:

http://www.unm.edu/~lkravitz/Article%20folder/age.html

Strength Training: The Unsung Fitness Modality Hero

The participation in resistance training programs has demonstrated some

clear and consistent results showing that elders 67 to 91 years of age can

significantly improve muscular strength, functional mobility and balance

(Munnings, 1993) . Also, with elders showing stable cardiovascular and

musculoskeletal systems, there appears to be relatively few

contraindications to strength training. Resistance training may not be

encouraged with some hypertensive individuals due to elevated blood

pressure. Arthritis sufferers may also experience some flare ups. The

strength prescription for elders is very similar, though modified for

fitness level, as prescribed for younger populations (Fleck & Kraemer,

1988) . However, it appears that researchers dramatically vary in their

resistance intensity prescription. For instance, Fiatrone et al. (1990)

have shown great muscular fitness results (and no injury) with frail

seniors (average age 90 years) progressing rapidly to lifting resistances

that are 80% of the subjects' 1 repetition maximum (1 RM).

-- Heidi

[Guest guest]

Hello,

i'd suggest reading 'how we heal' by douglas morrison (north atlantic books)

i'd also suggest doing a thorough colon cleansing program and only eating

alkaline forming foods during that time, whilst introducing a strong

probiotic, parasite cleanse for 4-6 weeks and taking thyridine (natural

thyroid support) www.thyridine.com.

I've seen excellent results in most poeople who follow this protocol

more support @ howweheal

Ciao, Chris

Melb, Oz

>From: Carol Saunders <carolnpepa@...>

>Reply-

>

>Subject: NT, weight gain, thyroid

>Date: Sat, 7 Jun 2003 05:05:57 -0700 (PDT)

>

>Lynn,

>

>I have recently been diagnosed with a T4 to T3

>conversion problem. All thyroid tests were normal

>except T3. The major symptomolgy of hypothyroidism I

>did not seem to have; I experienced difficulty loosing

>weight <not quite under weight either, LOL> and low

>energy levels in the evening. My basal temp ran low

>also.

>

>My hair, skin, nails are in great shape. I exercise

>(vigorous cardio and weight training) 5 days a week.

>I began to seriously eat NT style at the beginning of

>the year because even though I suspected a thyroid

>issue I was trying to " repair " myself on my own.

>Hopefully I won't need to be treated with medication

>long-term. I have not experienced a weight gain on NT,

>but as I put it to my doctor, my problem was that I

>needed to know why I was not getting any " return " on

>my " investment " of healthy eating and exercise.

>

>I would have it checked out. Shoman has a great

>site over at about.com and addressing issues related

>to the misdiagnosis and under diagnosis of thyroid

>conditions.

>

>HTH - Carol

>

>

>--- Lynn Razaitis <lyn122@...> wrote:

> > -----> Yup I know about this one and would love to

> > explore it more!! My hair looks great, hormones more

> > balanced,headaches disappearing,skin clearer, etc

> > ... BUT I'm gaining. It's not good especially as I

> > wasn't underweight to begin with. I've been eating

> > NT for the past 1 1/2 years and my weight has

> > steadily climbed. I think someone (Heidi, I

> > believe) mentioned her weight was dropping

> > as she found herself only eating about 1600

> > calories/day with high fat intake. I get hungry on

> > that amount of calories even with it heavy in fat.

> > The people I've seen who were unable to gain truly

> > do look wonderful on this diet! They seem

> > to reach an equilibrium that's an ideal wieght for

> > them and hold it. I'm very interested in the idea

> > of thyroid being the culprit of all this.

> > I also attempted to consume more coconut in

> > hopes of losing and straightening out my thyroid.

> > I'm similar to you and can gain wieght with it.

> > Anyhow enough said....anyone else out there

> > experiencing weight gain

> > with added fats let's here your words of wisdom!

> >

> > Bye

> > Lynn

>

>

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[Guest guest]

>1.25/day is a lot. Just 5 min of weight lifting a day twice a week is

>enough to build strength in the whole body, provided that weight is such

>that it limits your max reps to about 5.

Training in this manner will create scar tissue in the muscles, which in

turn by reflex acticity will weaken your major organs and glands. I learned

that by experience.

ie. your quadracep muscle reflexes to the heart, which is why many people

who've suffered heart attackes suddenly have weak thighs and cannot climb

stairs.

the tricep muscle reflexes the pancreas/adrenals, so 'flabbly underarms'

usually indicates poor digestion and tiredness after meals...

Body Electronics (as discussed in " how we heal' by douglas morrison) is the

only method i know of to regenerate scar tissue and the body

Chris

Melb, Oz

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[Guest guest]

Bellanger wrote:

>>1.25/day is a lot. Just 5 min of weight lifting a day twice a week is

>>enough to build strength in the whole body, provided that weight is such

>>that it limits your max reps to about 5.

> Training in this manner will create scar tissue in the muscles, which in

> turn by reflex acticity will weaken your major organs and glands. I learned

> that by experience.

Which way, 1.25/day or 5 min with heavy weight, Chris?

Where did you get that? From the same book, " How We Heal " ? Has it been confirmed

anywhere else?

Roman

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 6/10/03 8:53:02 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

Idol@... writes:

> Why is it common sense? Plenty of injuries don't result in scar

> tissue. Most cuts, for example, don't, and even cuts and burns which might

> otherwise develop scar tissue during healing can often or perhaps even

> always heal cleanly with proper nutrition, dressings, etc. Is there any

> actual documented proof of this assertion?

Plus just walking around creates these small tears in your muscles

constantly. Should we move towards complete vegetation to avoid scar tissue?

-chris

[Guest guest]

> > Training in this manner will create scar tissue in the muscles, which in

> > turn by reflex acticity will weaken your major organs and glands. I

>learned

> > that by experience.

>

>Which way, 1.25/day or 5 min with heavy weight, Chris?

>Where did you get that? From the same book, " How We Heal " ? Has it been

>confirmed anywhere else?

>

>Roman

>

Lifting heavy weights 'tears' muscle tissue. Its commonsense that when it

regrows, there will be scar tissue. That muscle, however slowly, will have a

lessened 'electrical potential' and will weaken any organs or glands its

associated with by reflex activity. Myotherapists call it 'referral',

iridologists call it 'reflex', acupuncturists call it 'meridian', etc, its

all the same thing.

This knowlege has been around for decades, just simply forgotten.

Teeth has feflex action to the rest of the body as well. An interesting

observation:

Get a tooth reflex chart, check which teeth you have problems with, and

invariably those teeth will reflex to or be reflexed by the major organs or

glands you have problems with. Iridology is very useful for this.

Often times a persons syptoms are in an area they have no problems, because

its a reflex action from another area of the body entirely.

pancreas/adrenals- eye problems

heart- thigh weakness etc, etc

The list is endless.

If you train in a manner where you lift a weight that you can do a minimum

of 20 reps, this will be benificial to the muscles and reflexed organs, and

will not create scar tissue, but most people want to be 'buff' and so take

the quick route.

Another sign i see routinely is in the area of the heart (in the iris),

which i see in athletes and workaholics, where they have a low heart beat.

Contrary to popular belief, the heart is under great stress when its low,

and should be at 72 beats per minute. as their bodies heal these iris signs

diminish greatly.

Anyone who's been involved in Body Electronics for a while will tell you

from experience that as they begin to heal (as evidenced by changes in the

iris) the heart rate moves towards 72 bpm.

When we experience love/non-resistance, the heart rate moves towards 72,

when we're angry it speeds up, etc

All the best, Chris

>

>

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[Guest guest]

Chris-

>Its commonsense that when it

>regrows, there will be scar tissue.

Why is it common sense? Plenty of injuries don't result in scar

tissue. Most cuts, for example, don't, and even cuts and burns which might

otherwise develop scar tissue during healing can often or perhaps even

always heal cleanly with proper nutrition, dressings, etc. Is there any

actual documented proof of this assertion?

-

[Guest guest]

Idol wrote:

> Chris-

>

>

>>Its commonsense that when it

>>regrows, there will be scar tissue.

>

>

> Why is it common sense? Plenty of injuries don't result in scar

> tissue. Most cuts, for example, don't, and even cuts and burns which might

> otherwise develop scar tissue during healing can often or perhaps even

> always heal cleanly with proper nutrition, dressings, etc. Is there any

> actual documented proof of this assertion?

I was going to comment on that too. Common sense on the same issues varies from

a group to group of people. For instance, for many, it is common sense that meat

is a source of poisons and cause of many illnesses and that a diet must be carb

(especially grain) based; while for others, common sense is the opposite.

Roman

[Guest guest]

Chris-

>Plus just walking around creates these small tears in your muscles

>constantly.

Really? I didn't know that. That makes it sounds like some degree of

muscle damage is required to even maintain a steady state of strength.

-

[Guest guest]

>Why is it common sense? Plenty of injuries don't result in scar

>tissue. Most cuts, for example, don't, and even cuts and burns which might

>otherwise develop scar tissue during healing can often or perhaps even

>always heal cleanly with proper nutrition, dressings, etc. Is there any

>actual documented proof of this assertion?

Certainly there are injuries that occur that do not result in scar tissue,

however, i'm referring to resistance training involving 1-5 rep max sets,

where the person is REALLY straining, attempting to encourage the muscle

fibres to be torn and then respond by regrowing....

I would certainly understand anyones scepticism, heck, i started lifting

weights at the age of 12, seriously at the age of 115 and many thought at

the rate i was going i would be the next anrnold schwarzenegger. However i

discovered Body Electronics at the age of 18 (8 years ago) and since then, i

view things a little differently. I'm still repairing the damage i did back

then.

Diet can help greatly, but long term weight trainers lose suppleness,

experience constant colds and flus, have little endurance, etc, etc

I have done my own research WITH MY OWN BODY, thats all i can offer.

Anything else is merely second hand information.

If you are interested, read 'How We Heal' then get back to me. Most people

however will read that book and not believe it. When i tell people that

surgically removed bone, tendon, tissue, etc, can regrow, well, you can

guess the response.

All i can say is, most of what we beleive is true isn't, or is distorted in

some way. We'd rather believe non-truth or some distortion of it because it

suits our agendas, but the truth is availalbe, dare i say pray and you'll be

answered

Our minds and thoughts have more to do with our realities and perceptions

than anything we'll ever eat.

Consider the teachers of Jesus, Buddha, Krishna, etc, etc

They all teach the same basic laws and truths.

All the best, Chris

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[Guest guest]

In a message dated 6/10/03 11:48:35 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

Idol@... writes:

> Really? I didn't know that. That makes it sounds like some degree of

> muscle damage is required to even maintain a steady state of strength.

>

Exactly. That's what I always thought. Pretty sure I learned that in health

class (not the *most* reliable source of info, but better than hearing it

from a random person :-P )

-chris

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 6/11/03 1:58:43 AM Eastern Daylight Time,

chrisb05@... writes:

> I would certainly understand anyones scepticism, heck, i started lifting

> weights at the age of 12, seriously at the age of 115 and many thought at

> the rate i was going i would be the next anrnold schwarzenegger

At the age of 115? How old are you now???

Now THAT is a tribute to Weston Price!!!

LOL!

-chris ;-)

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 6/11/03 7:54:16 AM Eastern Daylight Time,

s.fisher22@... writes:

> ---------->damn! i knew you'd make a joke about that too, and i tried to

> beat you to it because the first one's always the funniest, but you must've

> hit the " send " key a moment before i did! grumph!

dunno, but i *sent* it MINUTES before I *received* yours. don't worry, i

laughed out loud anyway! lol...

-chris

[Guest guest]

>>>> i started lifting

weights at the age of 12, seriously at the age of 115

---->yeowsa...hope i'll be still be lifting when i reach 115....

Suze Fisher

Lapdog Design, Inc.

Web Design & Development

http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze3shjg/

mailto:s.fisher22@...

[Guest guest]

> I would certainly understand anyones scepticism, heck, i started lifting

> weights at the age of 12, seriously at the age of 115 and many thought at

> the rate i was going i would be the next anrnold schwarzenegger

>>>>>At the age of 115? How old are you now???

Now THAT is a tribute to Weston Price!!!

LOL!

---------->damn! i knew you'd make a joke about that too, and i tried to

beat you to it because the first one's always the funniest, but you must've

hit the " send " key a moment before i did! grumph!

Suze Fisher

Lapdog Design, Inc.

Web Design & Development

http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze3shjg/

mailto:s.fisher22@...

[Guest guest]

Chris-

>but long term weight trainers lose suppleness,

>experience constant colds and flus, have little endurance, etc, etc

Isn't this largely a function of the way they (a) don't stretch, ( go for

a " cut " look which means having an unnaturally (and unhealthily) low amount

of bodyfat? And isn't endurance largely task-specific? A guy who moves

boxes for a living will have no endurance when running and a runner will

have no endurance moving boxes. I think this is a pretty universal

principle, which suggests to me that endurance is highly task-specific. It

is true that many bodybuilders don't do anything at all for endurance,

which is probably foolish, but I don't think anyone here is advocating

their lifestyle.

As to injuries, even aside from their diet, super-slow training is designed

specifically to avoid injury. Even decrepit, osteoporotic elderly people

can do super-slow weight training, which is closely related to the kind of

training we're talking about and definitely involves using heavy weights,

or at least training towards heavy weights, though the amount of weight you

can move very slowly is definitely much lower than the amount you can move

fast.

-

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 6/11/03 12:08:10 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

s.fisher22@... writes:

> ----->could it also possibly be a function of the powdered death some of

> them seem so fond of binging on? one of the guys who works at my gym has a

> HUGE bucket of nearly pure dextrose that he downs. it contains no fat and no

> protein (i think). however, the manufacturer is kind enough to add a little

> lipoic acid and a few other things, i think, that may slightly help regulate

> blood sugar levels after such a sugar shock.

Plus low-fat diets they follow, plenty of protein drinks and bars. The guy

who owns my gym eats beef on special occasions. Some woman there who writes a

column in the newsletter wants me to get info on protein isolates being

excitotoxins for her and the trainer because they sell the stuff there. Pretty

cool, maybe they'll stop and get real food or at least some half-decent protein

like Goat-tein from GOL or something.

-chris

[Guest guest]

>but long term weight trainers lose suppleness,

>experience constant colds and flus, have little endurance, etc, etc

>>>>>Isn't this largely a function of the way they (a) don't stretch, ( go

for

a " cut " look which means having an unnaturally (and unhealthily) low amount

of bodyfat?

----->could it also possibly be a function of the powdered death some of

them seem so fond of binging on? one of the guys who works at my gym has a

HUGE bucket of nearly pure dextrose that he downs. it contains no fat and no

protein (i think). however, the manufacturer is kind enough to add a little

lipoic acid and a few other things, i think, that may slightly help regulate

blood sugar levels after such a sugar shock.

Suze Fisher

Lapdog Design, Inc.

Web Design & Development

http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze3shjg/

mailto:s.fisher22@...

[Guest guest]

Suze-

>one of the guys who works at my gym has a

>HUGE bucket of nearly pure dextrose that he downs.

Wow, I'd forgotten to mention © their generally very poor diet, including

the protein powders they eat so much of, but I didn't know body builders

also eat pure sugar! How utterly bizarre!

-

[Guest guest]

Oops,

too many ones, that was 15, not 115... i'm 26 now

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[Guest guest]

Chris-

>but i took both those into account, stretched daily, and

>still lost flexibility.

OK, but there are still many things to consider here.

First, did you lose desirable, normal flexibility, or undesirable excess

flexibility? People (some people, anyway) can become amazing

contortionists by stretching enough, but that doesn't mean it's natural or

even desirable in most cases to be able to stretch that much. Stretching

past a normal range of motion puts you in a position in which your joints

are no longer adequately supported and protected by muscle strength unless

you also adequately strength-train your muscle in that rate, but I'm not

sure whether it's safe or even possible to do strength training in some

extreme ranges of motion.

Second, are you sure you were using the right stretching

technique? Whenever I've been to gyms, and even when I studied kenpo a

little, the trainers almost always used what I always called the

bouncy-bouncy method, and even years before I looked into the subject I

hated it and wanted to give them a little of the old punchy-punchy. Then

there's the Wharton approach, detailed in their book _The Whartons' Stretch

Book_, which is quite different. At the time I read it several years ago,

I thought it was a profound improvement over the conventional system, but

since then I've come across two more schools of thought, and I haven't had

time to fully evaluate them. (I also wonder about the wisdom of isolating

muscles and muscle groups for the purpose of stretching -- or, for that

matter, for anything else.) There's the Super Slow strength-training idea

that by training the muscle across its full range of motion, you stretch it

adequately across that range by the very act of training (this is separate

from warming up, though), and then there's Pavel Tsatsouline's system,

brought to our attention by Roman, which purports to be radically different

but which I haven't read about at all yet.

Third, what weight training technique did you use? Obviously any method

that carefully isolates small muscle groups and doesn't move them over

their full normal range of motion is going to constrict motion

undesirably. But what about methods like Super Slow and, I gather,

Tstatsouline's, which involve carefully using the entire range of motion of

the body?

Fourth and finally, I know of a number of Super Slow types who are very

flexible karate black belts and have been at it for years and years. By

your lights isn't that impossible?

>I doubt any weight trainer training 1-5 or even 10

>rep max would be able to ENHANCE their existing flexibilty.

It depends what that flexibility is to start with. Some people are

naturally just not very flexible (I myself come to mind) and probably need

some kind of stretching regimen to achieve sufficient range of motion to

weight train properly, but it seems to me based on what I've read and heard

that it is possible to reach and maintain an optimum degree of flexibility

while high intensity training with few reps, provided the overall system

(including, of course, nutrition) is correct. To reach enhanced (or beyond

normal) flexibility such as that required by gymnasts, perhaps by martial

artists, probably requires a separate, additional stretching regimen, but

what of it?

>When i stopped weight training for mass, and switched to a largely raw

>vegetarian diet, i dumped phlegm, mucus, and tonnes of other junk from all

>channels of elimination for 4 months.

What had you been eating before? This hardly seems like a comment on

weight training by itself.

>I've considered this. Many older people have excellent constitutions, and

>having not lifted weights previously, haven't done the muscle damage, so

>they respond well.

Remember, though, we're not talking about hale and hearty older people, but

about old folks who can't climb stairs, who can't even walk in many

cases. My grandmother is one of those people. She's practically ready to

drop dead, but she'll be starting a Super Slow sort of regimen in a month

or two (along with radical nutritional changes, etc.). We'll see how she

responds.

-

[Guest guest]

Idol wrote:

> Stretching

> past a normal range of motion puts you in a position in which your joints

> are no longer adequately supported and protected by muscle strength unless

> you also adequately strength-train your muscle in that rate

Interestingly, I came across this same point when reading on this topic

recently.

Roman