Re: Lotions/Creams

January 29, 2003

Cool. It almost seems like a whipped body butter. Maybe you created something

really cool here. Awesome, glad everyone liked it.

Bobbi

Lotions/Creams

Hi Everyone,

Just wanted to let you all know about my endeavors with the lotion

and creams expirament.

I made a small batch was going for a lotion but it turned out more

like whipped cream (which is great it almost looks like night cold

cream).

I have a group of friends and family members who love testing my new

expiraments (as long as they are not allergic to the ingredients).

So with my small whipped batch of " whipped cream " or " cream cheese "

(as they all said it reminded them of) I was off to have them test it

for me. I was thinking it might not be quite right, but what better

testers than a pharmacists wife, child care worker, beautician,

coffee shop worker, grocery store clerk and a receptionist, right??!!!

Oh my gosh they are all raving about it. I was shocked being this is

my first real batch that I have made.

Now I did tell them that there was no fragrance at this point nor any

preservatives but in the final product there would be preservatives.

They all took enough for today and are going to try it through out

the day. All of them tried a little bit while I was there and were

already raving about it.

I am so excited.

Here is the recipe that I used (very small batch at this time)

2 Tablespoons of Grapeseed Oil

1 Tablespoon of Shea Butter

1/2 teaspoon of beeswax

Melted these ingredients together to the 160 (for graininess in shea

butter) then mixed in

4 Tablespoons of Distilled Water

1/2 teaspoon of Flax oil

Then I used my stick blender and whipped and whipped and whipped.

Everything incorporated great and it came out looking like whipped

cream. Very light and not heavy feeling.

I am going to make another batch tonight and let it sit to see if I

end up with seperation and what not.

Now granted if this goes I do know I will need to put a preservative

in it to sell to these women. But at this stage just testing and I

am so excited.

Just wanted you all to know how the expiramentations are coming along

and wanted to share with you all.

Thanks

Beth in MN

January 30, 2003

Hi Beth,

WOW! That sounds like a great recipe!!!! Do you make up your own recipes, or

do you find them on the Internet???

ne

> Lotions/Creams

>

> Hi Everyone,

> Just wanted to let you all know about my endeavors with the lotion

> and creams expirament.

>

> I made a small batch was going for a lotion but it turned out more

> like whipped cream (which is great it almost looks like night cold

> cream).

>

> I have a group of friends and family members who love testing my new

> expiraments (as long as they are not allergic to the ingredients).

>

> So with my small whipped batch of " whipped cream " or " cream cheese "

> (as they all said it reminded them of) I was off to have them test it

> for me. I was thinking it might not be quite right, but what better

> testers than a pharmacists wife, child care worker, beautician,

> coffee shop worker, grocery store clerk and a receptionist, right??!!!

>

> Oh my gosh they are all raving about it. I was shocked being this is

> my first real batch that I have made.

>

> Now I did tell them that there was no fragrance at this point nor any

> preservatives but in the final product there would be preservatives.

>

> They all took enough for today and are going to try it through out

> the day. All of them tried a little bit while I was there and were

> already raving about it.

>

> I am so excited.

>

> Here is the recipe that I used (very small batch at this time)

> 2 Tablespoons of Grapeseed Oil

> 1 Tablespoon of Shea Butter

> 1/2 teaspoon of beeswax

> Melted these ingredients together to the 160 (for graininess in shea

> butter) then mixed in

> 4 Tablespoons of Distilled Water

> 1/2 teaspoon of Flax oil

> Then I used my stick blender and whipped and whipped and whipped.

> Everything incorporated great and it came out looking like whipped

> cream. Very light and not heavy feeling.

>

> I am going to make another batch tonight and let it sit to see if I

> end up with seperation and what not.

>

> Now granted if this goes I do know I will need to put a preservative

> in it to sell to these women. But at this stage just testing and I

> am so excited.

> Just wanted you all to know how the expiramentations are coming along

> and wanted to share with you all.

>

> Thanks

> Beth in MN

January 30, 2003

So confused...where do we get these ingredients???

January 31, 2003

Beth,

What exactly does this mean? 160 degrees??? Thanks for the recipe!

J

> Melted these ingredients together to the 160 (for graininess in shea

> butter) then mixed in

August 7, 2011

But vit E and the fruit extracts are really not preservatives...I know of a

soaper that makes lotions and doesn't list the preservatives because she

feels people wouldn't buy her product and her reasoning - the amount is so

small no one really notices..WTF?

Jeanine

Jeanine's Hummingbird Soap Works

_____

From: [mailto: ]

On Behalf Of fruitic2000

Sent: Sunday, August 07, 2011 6:34 AM

Subject: Re: lotions/creams

amen to what Chrissy said!

I'm also wondering if there was some vit. E added to that recipe and was not

listed?

Some people don't like to list all of the ingredients on their labels, the

think that it is the special ingredient that will keep them coming back for

more.

Cheryl

August 7, 2011

I just want to thank everyone for their responses. After posting my

question, I started reading more about some of the ingredients she used and

i see that the beeswax-borax combination goes hand in hand. It rang a bell

because i suddenly remembered the Brambleberry Lotion Workshop at the 2010

(?) HSMG conference where we were put in groups and each worked with a

different emulsifier and compared findings. One site i looked at last night

called borax a natural preservative ... any thoughts on that one?

The way i wrote the ingredients is exactly the way she lists them: olive

oil, well water, beeswax, lanolin, borax, and essential oil. I was also

wondering if using well water is considered a plus in lotion making?

Although she doesn't specifically say rosemary essential oil, peppermint

essential oil, that is the name of the scent of one of the creams. The

second is lavender which seems to have won a blue ribbon for something

although i forget exactly what, and the third one says flavor oil instead of

essential oil and this scent i did not care for very much. It was kind of

fake honey or buttery. But i loved the rosemary mint and i bought it. I have

never read any theories that eo's can be a preservative.

I decided to call her and ask but she wasn't there. I'll try again tomorrow.

However, if you google " beeswax hand cream recipe " you will find many that

contain oils and water but no preservative. Even though i have never made

lotions, i have a huge collection of recipes and i have never seen any

without a preservative. It's one of the reasons i only make body butters. So

that's why i am so curious about this. Anyway, some of these recipes you

will see do have both oils and water and no preservative, some use borax and

some do not, and some do not use water at all and they just seem like body

butters with beeswax added.

Once i talk to her, I will report back!

Donna

On Sat, Aug 6, 2011 at 10:10 PM, Donna <donna.puizina@...> wrote:

> **

>

> Hey, i have a question for all the lotion makers out there. I have never

> made a lotion from scratch although i feel myself inching closer and closer

> to it after getting the LotionCrafter door prize and buying Jeanine's small

> scale ... I'm running out of excuses!

> So I was at our state fair in the tent with all the honey products by the

> beekeepers and one lady makes a hand cream, but i noticed on her list of

> ingredient that she does not use a preservative. Assuing that her list is

> complete, how can this be? The ingredients are olive oil, water, beeswax,

> lanolin, borax, and eo. Is it possible to make a cream with only these

> ingredients? I liked the cream a lot ... it is very rich and emollient ...

> and i would like to make a similar one but just wondered about the use of a

> preservative.

>

> Donna

>

--

Donna Puizina

e k o a r o m a s

in harmony with nature …

www.ekoaromas.com

973 997 5157

August 7, 2011

ok well some think of romesmary oil as a perservative.. i believe. but i still

stick with my first comment, she either didn't use one at all, or she did and

didn't list it or she is assuming the EO will work.

as for the well water. I personally would NOT use it. I use pure distilled water

that I buy from the store. I am going on the assumptions that it is cleaner.

Well water may have yuckies in it. Also while on the subject many recommend you

should at the very least bring your water to a boil and most will say to boil it

for i believe 15 minutes. to kill whatever may be in it. in doing so you will

need to remeasure your water. you will also need your water at boiling temp or

so to make a lotion.and oils must be hotI forgot the exact temps but they should

be the same. melt oils and wax, double boiler is easiest. and boil water,

remeasure quick, add borax and honey or glycerin, let dissolve. I prefer a stand

mixer. turn on very low with oils, slowely add water mix keep mixing when

possible turn up speed it will be ready when it looks like pudding. most will

thicken up more as it sits over night. When I try a new recipe i tend to leave

it in the mixing bowl over night to test consistance. Sometimes it seperates and

needs extra mixing or is too thick or runny then expected.

and yes borax goes with beeswax and steric acid goes with e-wax.they are the

emolsifiers that help hold everything together.they are kind of a thickener

think corn starch or flour when cooking and making gravy. It can be really

confusing i know. When I first started I wanted the ultimate cream so I was

thinking I could use beeswax and borax AND steric acid glycerin and honey

and.... I had everything under the sun. I didn't know it was an either or sort

of thing. I kner very little about any of these ingredients. Then I finally

found a forum like this and finally understood stuff.

>

> > **

> >

> > Hey, i have a question for all the lotion makers out there. I have never

> > made a lotion from scratch although i feel myself inching closer and closer

> > to it after getting the LotionCrafter door prize and buying Jeanine's small

> > scale ... I'm running out of excuses!

> > So I was at our state fair in the tent with all the honey products by the

> > beekeepers and one lady makes a hand cream, but i noticed on her list of

> > ingredient that she does not use a preservative. Assuing that her list is

> > complete, how can this be? The ingredients are olive oil, water, beeswax,

> > lanolin, borax, and eo. Is it possible to make a cream with only these

> > ingredients? I liked the cream a lot ... it is very rich and emollient ...

> > and i would like to make a similar one but just wondered about the use of a

> > preservative.

> >

> > Donna

> >

>

> --

> Donna Puizina

>

> e k o a r o m a s

> in harmony with nature …

> www.ekoaromas.com

> 973 997 5157

>

August 7, 2011

It can't be. . . good. If there's water, there's microbial growth. It's

that simple.

Essential oils do have the ability to curb the growth or kill microbials,

depending upon the eo. HOWEVER, they are volatile for one thing, and in the

percentages necessary for them to do their thing, they would be too strong

for the product, not to mention the time periods we expect our products to

be safe in.

Borax, citric acid, vitamin E, and GSE are products often thought to

preserve product, but their effect is miniscule. Never trust them to do

that job. Borax in a borax/beeswax serves to emulsify by forming a simple

" soap. " Citric acid lowers the pH, which might slow down germ growth a bit.

Vitamin E prevents oils from going rancid as quickly, and GSE retards

rancidity, and since it needs preservation itself, no way will it preserve

lotion.

As Chrissy and Kim said, in order to play and experiment, looking for a

product you like, leaving out the preservative is no problem. Just

refrigerate the lotion/cream and use it up within a few days. Don't subject

it to heat, don't leave it out, don't stick your fingers in it, be sure to

use proper sanitization techniques. Never is proper cleaning/sanitizing

more important than when making products with water as an ingredient.

Do not use well water; use distilled water held at 160 degrees for 20 min.

to kill any nasty stuff. People often think distilled water is sterile, but

it is not, especially once it's been opened. Even to experiment I would do

that.

Let us know how it goes!

Beth Byrne

http://www.SoapAndGarden.com

Garden goodness in every bar!

www/SoapandGarden.blogspot.com

Like Soap and Garden on Facebook & Twitter!

On Sat, Aug 6, 2011 at 10:10 PM, Donna <donna.puizina@...> wrote:

> **

>

> Hey, i have a question for all the lotion makers out there. I have never

> made a lotion from scratch although i feel myself inching closer and closer

> to it after getting the LotionCrafter door prize and buying Jeanine's small

> scale ... I'm running out of excuses!

> So I was at our state fair in the tent with all the honey products by the

> beekeepers and one lady makes a hand cream, but i noticed on her list of

> ingredient that she does not use a preservative. Assuing that her list is

> complete, how can this be? The ingredients are olive oil, water, beeswax,

> lanolin, borax, and eo. Is it possible to make a cream with only these

> ingredients? I liked the cream a lot ... it is very rich and emollient ...

> and i would like to make a similar one but just wondered about the use of a

> preservative.

>

> Donna

>

August 7, 2011

Back when I first started making lotions (I made them long before I made

soap!), I used beeswax/borax. Those were the only recipes out there, and

none of the home crafters knew about preservatives.

It was a short time thereafter that I began seeing emulsifying wax used and

later, BTMS, as they create more stable emulsions. That's also about the

time we realized we needed preservatives and better sterilizing/sanitizing.

I'm sure that's why you have lots of recipes that don't include

preservatives. I can tell you, though, that I had a lotion go visibly bad

and it disturbed me so much because I knew that it was bad before I ever saw

anything. I certainly didn't want to subject anyone else to that so I

changed my ways.

Beth Byrne

http://www.SoapAndGarden.com

Garden goodness in every bar!

www/SoapandGarden.blogspot.com

Like Soap and Garden on Facebook & Twitter!

On Sun, Aug 7, 2011 at 10:40 PM, DONNA <donna.puizina@...> wrote:

> I just want to thank everyone for their responses. After posting my

> question, I started reading more about some of the ingredients she used and

> i see that the beeswax-borax combination goes hand in hand. It rang a bell

> because i suddenly remembered the Brambleberry Lotion Workshop at the 2010

> (?) HSMG conference where we were put in groups and each worked with a

> different emulsifier and compared findings. One site i looked at last night

> called borax a natural preservative ... any thoughts on that one?

>

> The way i wrote the ingredients is exactly the way she lists them: olive

> oil, well water, beeswax, lanolin, borax, and essential oil. I was also

> wondering if using well water is considered a plus in lotion making?

> Although she doesn't specifically say rosemary essential oil, peppermint

> essential oil, that is the name of the scent of one of the creams. The

> second is lavender which seems to have won a blue ribbon for something

> although i forget exactly what, and the third one says flavor oil instead

> of

> essential oil and this scent i did not care for very much. It was kind of

> fake honey or buttery. But i loved the rosemary mint and i bought it. I

> have

> never read any theories that eo's can be a preservative.

>

> I decided to call her and ask but she wasn't there. I'll try again

> tomorrow.

> However, if you google " beeswax hand cream recipe " you will find many that

> contain oils and water but no preservative. Even though i have never made

> lotions, i have a huge collection of recipes and i have never seen any

> without a preservative. It's one of the reasons i only make body butters.

> So

> that's why i am so curious about this. Anyway, some of these recipes you

> will see do have both oils and water and no preservative, some use borax

> and

> some do not, and some do not use water at all and they just seem like body

> butters with beeswax added.

>

> Once i talk to her, I will report back!

>

> Donna

>

> On Sat, Aug 6, 2011 at 10:10 PM, Donna <donna.puizina@...> wrote:

>

> > **

> >

> > Hey, i have a question for all the lotion makers out there. I have never

> > made a lotion from scratch although i feel myself inching closer and

> closer

> > to it after getting the LotionCrafter door prize and buying Jeanine's

> small

> > scale ... I'm running out of excuses!

> > So I was at our state fair in the tent with all the honey products by the

> > beekeepers and one lady makes a hand cream, but i noticed on her list of

> > ingredient that she does not use a preservative. Assuing that her list is

> > complete, how can this be? The ingredients are olive oil, water, beeswax,

> > lanolin, borax, and eo. Is it possible to make a cream with only these

> > ingredients? I liked the cream a lot ... it is very rich and emollient

> ...

> > and i would like to make a similar one but just wondered about the use of

> a

> > preservative.

> >

> > Donna

> >

>

> --

> Donna Puizina

>

> e k o a r o m a s

> in harmony with nature …

> www.ekoaromas.com

> 973 997 5157

>

August 7, 2011

I'm with K Bear Creations on the rosemary oil. Some use it as a

preservative, but I'm not in that school either, and it's usually used in

conjunction with other 'preservative' oils because it's not a broad spectrum

preservative.

I did some searching on Borax because I was curious. Mountain Rose Herbs

has a monograph for Borax

(http://www.mountainroseherbs.com/learn/borax_powder.php) and it mentions

that it is a preservative but does not go as far as saying that it is broad

spectrum. In another sentence it says that Borax is an anti-fungal. I

think the thing to think of here though is that 20 Mule Team Borax found in

the laundry isle of the grocery isn't necessarily cosmetic grade sodium

borate. Although some do use it in their formulations. I'm just sayin'

I think Borax and Bees Wax and olive oil were a part of Galen's cream - the

first cold cream.

I'm with the rest. Just say no to using the well water. Even if you

sterilize it by boiling, it's still going to have some mineral content in

there that could chemically bind with one thing or another and possibly make

things go off or the preservative system you decide on be less effective.

I heat and hold my water at 180 deg F for 20 minutes and bring my oils up to

the same temp before I combine. It makes the emulsification more stable,

and I mix with a high shear stick blender. When you do decide on a

preservative system, make sure you read the tech specs for it because most

want to be added after your emulsification cools down to about 140 deg F or

the preservative will be less effective.

Keep looking around and researching. The more informed decisions you can

make, the better your product will be.

Kim

Avendel Bath & Body

--------------------------------------------------

From: " DONNA " <donna.puizina@...>

Sent: Sunday, August 07, 2011 10:40 PM

< >

Subject: Re: lotions/creams

> I just want to thank everyone for their responses. After posting my

> question, I started reading more about some of the ingredients she used

> and

> i see that the beeswax-borax combination goes hand in hand. It rang a bell

> because i suddenly remembered the Brambleberry Lotion Workshop at the 2010

> (?) HSMG conference where we were put in groups and each worked with a

> different emulsifier and compared findings. One site i looked at last

> night

> called borax a natural preservative ... any thoughts on that one?

>

> The way i wrote the ingredients is exactly the way she lists them: olive

> oil, well water, beeswax, lanolin, borax, and essential oil. I was also

> wondering if using well water is considered a plus in lotion making?

> Although she doesn't specifically say rosemary essential oil, peppermint

> essential oil, that is the name of the scent of one of the creams. The

> second is lavender which seems to have won a blue ribbon for something

> although i forget exactly what, and the third one says flavor oil instead

> of

> essential oil and this scent i did not care for very much. It was kind of

> fake honey or buttery. But i loved the rosemary mint and i bought it. I

> have

> never read any theories that eo's can be a preservative.

>

> I decided to call her and ask but she wasn't there. I'll try again

> tomorrow.

> However, if you google " beeswax hand cream recipe " you will find many that

> contain oils and water but no preservative. Even though i have never made

> lotions, i have a huge collection of recipes and i have never seen any

> without a preservative. It's one of the reasons i only make body butters.

> So

> that's why i am so curious about this. Anyway, some of these recipes you

> will see do have both oils and water and no preservative, some use borax

> and

> some do not, and some do not use water at all and they just seem like body

> butters with beeswax added.

>

> Once i talk to her, I will report back!

>

> Donna

>

> On Sat, Aug 6, 2011 at 10:10 PM, Donna <donna.puizina@...> wrote:

>

>> **

>>

>> Hey, i have a question for all the lotion makers out there. I have never

>> made a lotion from scratch although i feel myself inching closer and

>> closer

>> to it after getting the LotionCrafter door prize and buying Jeanine's

>> small

>> scale ... I'm running out of excuses!

>> So I was at our state fair in the tent with all the honey products by the

>> beekeepers and one lady makes a hand cream, but i noticed on her list of

>> ingredient that she does not use a preservative. Assuing that her list is

>> complete, how can this be? The ingredients are olive oil, water, beeswax,

>> lanolin, borax, and eo. Is it possible to make a cream with only these

>> ingredients? I liked the cream a lot ... it is very rich and emollient

>> ...

>> and i would like to make a similar one but just wondered about the use of

>> a

>> preservative.

>>

>> Donna

>>

>

> --

> Donna Puizina

>

> e k o a r o m a s

> in harmony with nature .

> www.ekoaromas.com

> 973 997 5157

>

August 8, 2011

Thanks Donna. Looking forward to 'the rest of the story'

Jeanine

Jeanine's Hummingbird Soap Works

Re: lotions/creams