Re: Vaccines and formula fed babies

[Guest guest]

Try this thread at Mothering.com

http://www.mothering.com/discussions/showthread.php?t=119922

It is on low milk supply. You might find some info there that will help you.

Also, here is a link to mom on pumping

http://www.kellymom.com/bf/supply/maintainsupply-pump.html

I don't know if any of this will help you, but I sure hope so. I would also

strongly suggest you meet with an IBCLC. The hospital should have an LC on

staff. Make sure you see someone. I DO believe it makes a difference, BF,

that is. Don't try to do it alone though. In your case, I would definitely

suggest consulting someone who has seen this before. Perhaps they will be

able to breastfeed if the NICU docs are " pushed " a little..? ( I don't know

your situation, but believe me, they are not considering your milk supply,

so you have to!)There are herbs and even meds you can take if you feel you

want to do that.

Best wishes to you and to your little miracles!

Jami, Illinois

Vaccines and formula fed babies

> Hi everyone! Been awhile since I have been here. I delivered twin girls

> and they were born 3.5 weeks ago prematurely at 30 weeks gestation. My

> question is, I am not producing enough milk to feed them, actually my

> supply is dwindling. Probably from the fact that I do not have babies

> at home to help stimulate my supply so I am forced to pump every 2

> hours which it isnt doing much. I am still supplying them with breast

> milk but they are being supplemented. My milk supply is very low and I

> am afraid that I will stop producing any milk for them b/c in the

> research I have done they say excessive pumping with no stimulation can

> actually cause a woman to dry up. My girls will be in NICU for several

> weeks yet. Anways my question, I am concerned that not being able to

> breastfeed them for a year will hurt their immune system and causing

> them to become sick from different things. Is this fear warranted or am

> I just making a mountain out of a mole hill? Has anyone else had to

> formula feed their children for whatever reason with no vaccines?

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

First of all, congratulations on your little ones! Regarding the

breastfeeding, it is very important. If you can, read Dr. Fuhrman's *Disease

Proof Your Child.* On his forum (www.drfuhrman.com), I've seen him suggest

giving babies milk from a milk bank or borrowed from a friend if possible,

rather than giving them formula. He says it's extremely important that

children be breastfed in order to protect their body from future diseases

and problems.

I can't imagine how tough this is for you. I'm so sorry that you are even

having to deal with all of this. I don't know the situation, but I'm hoping

that you will be able to breastfeed your babies soon. Do they not suckle

yet? I hope that the doctor's let you try as often as possible.

Eventually, they'll catch on.

I'm sorry I couldn't be of more help, but hang in there.

Jodi

[Guest guest]

First off congrats about the girls, and even though they are early blessings, I

hope they come home soon.

I was never good at pumping for one, I can't imagine two.

Have you checked into goat's milk instead of formula for supplementing? It has

some of the same enzyme's and good for ya stuff that mommy milk has. I have a

new computer from when I was doing the research. I never had a good supply of

milk - so from 6-8.5 months I supplemented with formula - then I switched to

goat's milk (which she still drinks and loves) I doubt I'll be having more

children - but the relief I feel knowing NOW about goats milk doesn't make

nursing look so difficult if there is another time.

Her immunity is amazing. ONE fever - runny noses with teething - and lately a

rash - that I'm pretty sure is laundry related - that's it and she's 29 months

old. So my opinion - is as long as the vaccinations are not added there's

plenty that can be done to boost the immune system no matter how long you nurse.

Best of luck!

Cheryl

[Guest guest]

Congrats on your twins. It must be hard on you not having them home yet. I

agree with Jami that you need to make sure that they let you try to

breastfeed them as soon as possible. Also make sure you hold them close to

your bare skin (google kangaroo care). The doctor should be able to

prescribe breastmilk from a milk bank for them so that they are not given

formula.

As for increasing your milk supply, even if they are not nursing, your milk

should come in more when they start to nurse. I would recommend you drink

some mother's milk tea. It is great for increasing milk supply. I also

agree that you should talk to a lactation consultant to help you.

Sorry I can't be of more help, but will send my thoughts your way.

C

[Guest guest]

> Hi everyone! Been awhile since I have been here. I delivered twin girls

> and they were born 3.5 weeks ago prematurely at 30 weeks gestation. My

> question is, I am not producing enough milk to feed them, actually my

> supply is dwindling. Probably from the fact that I do not have babies

> at home to help stimulate my supply so I am forced to pump every 2

> hours which it isnt doing much. I am still supplying them with breast

> milk but they are being supplemented. My milk supply is very low and I

> am afraid that I will stop producing any milk for them b/c in the

> research I have done they say excessive pumping with no stimulation can

> actually cause a woman to dry up. My girls will be in NICU for several

> weeks yet. Anways my question, I am concerned that not being able to

> breastfeed them for a year will hurt their immune system and causing

> them to become sick from different things. Is this fear warranted or am

> I just making a mountain out of a mole hill? Has anyone else had to

> formula feed their children for whatever reason with no vaccines?

>

Congratulations on your new daughters! I hope that they go from strength to

strength and come home with you soon.

I had issues with my daughter after she was born. I was committed to

breastfeeding but had problem from the word " go " , probably because I didn't

have a clue what I was doing. ( By the time she was 3 weeks old, I had

blocked ducts, then that progressed to mastitis at 6 weeks. Needless to

say, I was " blackmailed " into having a/bs - was told I wouldn't be able to

breastfeed any mor e if the mastitis wasn't cleared up immediately! I took

them and ended up with thrush. While I had thrush, I also got a breast

abscess, so all in all, it was a pretty painful time. Any woman who has

suffered ductal thrush knows what I mean!! But the pain resulted in my not

being able to feed my daughter because it was too painful to hold her. I

stopped feeding her at the breast when I had that mastitis, and she didn't

feed at the breast again for a further nine weeks.

During that time I had to pump to maintain supply, but I did find it hard to

make enough milk so ended up supplementing with formula milk for part of

that time. I wasn't happy about it, but she had to be fed and at least she

was being partly breastfed, which I felt would minimise the damage. She was

actually having around six to eight ounces of formula a day in addition to

what I expressed. However, I honestly and truly believe that had I known

more about breastfeeding, and had I been better informed on the matter of

pumping, I could have easily made enough milk to satisfy her.

It's daunting expressing to feed one baby, so two must seem insurmountable.

However, they aren't going to be taking much at this stage, and I firmly

believe that with the right support and professional help (and I don't mean

doctors), you can do it. It's important to express frequently - you know

that already. I don't think every two hours is excessive at all, given that

you're feeding two babes. You don't say if your delivery was

section/assisted/medicated, but if so, it is quite possible that medication

you received during labour could be interfering with your milk supply.

That will need time to clear your system. There are, as others have said,

herbal preparations - and homoeopathic ones - you can use to stimulate milk

supply. Fenugreek springs to mind as the most obvious, but fennel tea is

also effective, and I have read that agnus castus and raspberry leaf tea are

also good galactagogues. Most importantly, you need a good pump. You don't

say what type of pump you are using, but what you *need* to maintain supply

in a situation like this is a double-pumping unit, preferrably electric. It

isn't true that pumping alone will not maintain your supply, but it's hard

to get the hormones flying and without them it's not as effective. As a

breastfeeding counsellor I came across a few ladies who had exclusively

breastfed prems, maintaining supply just by pumping. It can be done - but

no-one is saying it won't be without challenge. It is hard work and you may

feel for a while that you are chained to a breastpump, but you can do it.

The more you pump, the more you will make. It would help if you could have

your babies with you when you pump, or could see them or even photos of

them - it all aids the hormone production. There is nothing harder than

letting milk down to a breastpump!!! And the more you let down milk, the

more you will produce. Yes, the stress will play a part - keep in focus how

much you want to exclusively breastfeed these babes, but don't let it become

an obsession to the exclusion of all else. Don't beat yourself up for

supplementing - you are doing the best you can right now, and that is what's

important. Look forward to the time when you don't have to. My own

personal experience was that I found myself a skillful breastfeeding

counsellor who said this: I could reduce the formula gradually, which would

take time, or I could do it *cold turkey* - and chuck the bottles away,

which would result in a faster re-establishment of exclusive breastfeeding.

I chose the latter, and when I finally got my baby back to the breast at

fifteen weeks old, she fed like a pro: it was as though she'd never been

off the breast. For several weeks, my supply see-sawed a bit, mostly erring

on oversupply because I fed her as often as she'd take the milk!! ) Poor

thing - she must have got fed up with having a breast in her mouth!!! Then

we carried on until she was 5½ years old.

For weeks, I asked myself if I could keep it up - it seemed soul-destroying

to be chained to a breastpump all the time. I got PND as well, and my dd's

first Christmas was a nightmare. But we got there, and if I had to do it

over again, I would. It may seem to you that you're turning into a milk

machine, but if you decide to stick with it, you'll never regret it. Don't

have too many expectations of yourself though - take it one day at a time

and don't make *plans*. Just remind yourself of all the reasons you want to

breastfeed, and hang in there. It will get better.

Just make sure you have:

* the pump to do the job

* the support of someone skilled in breastfeeding

* the support of your family

* good nourishment

* time - everything else can wait for now

Read up on galactagogues if you can - there are many around. Have a look at

this too, if you can: http://www.h-e-c.com.au/flyers/breastfeeding.pdf - it

might help.

Good luck. Don't lose heart - it is truly worth the work involved. Feel

free to mail me privately if I can be of help.

Love, light and peace,

Sue

" As well consult a butcher on the value of vegetarianism as a doctor on the

worth of vaccination. " - Bernard Shaw

MMRcontactnetworkUK - putting

non-vaccinating UK parents looking for naturally acquired immunity for their

children in touch with each other

Imperfectly_Natural_Parents_UK - for all

imperfectly natural parents everywhere!

OT4VAX - Off-topic conversation for

Vaccinations list members

http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/vaccine.htm - expansive information about

vaccines!

http://www.whale.to - more expansive information about vaccines!

[Guest guest]

This might sound crazy, but do you have a really good friend with a baby who

would let you " wet nurse " him/her to keep your supply going? I know most people

would cringe at this, but it might be the trick to really get your supply up and

running in a more natural way. Maybe I'm nuts.

Sheri B.

mum2mishka <mum2mishka@...> wrote:

> Hi everyone! Been awhile since I have been here. I delivered twin girls

> and they were born 3.5 weeks ago prematurely at 30 weeks gestation. My

> question is, I am not producing enough milk to feed them, actually my

> supply is dwindling. Probably from the fact that I do not have babies

> at home to help stimulate my supply so I am forced to pump every 2

> hours which it isnt doing much. I am still supplying them with breast

> milk but they are being supplemented. My milk supply is very low and I

> am afraid that I will stop producing any milk for them b/c in the

> research I have done they say excessive pumping with no stimulation can

> actually cause a woman to dry up. My girls will be in NICU for several

> weeks yet. Anways my question, I am concerned that not being able to

> breastfeed them for a year will hurt their immune system and causing

> them to become sick from different things. Is this fear warranted or am

> I just making a mountain out of a mole hill? Has anyone else had to

> formula feed their children for whatever reason with no vaccines?

>

Congratulations on your new daughters! I hope that they go from strength to

strength and come home with you soon.

I had issues with my daughter after she was born. I was committed to

breastfeeding but had problem from the word " go " , probably because I didn't

have a clue what I was doing. ( By the time she was 3 weeks old, I had

blocked ducts, then that progressed to mastitis at 6 weeks. Needless to

say, I was " blackmailed " into having a/bs - was told I wouldn't be able to

breastfeed any mor e if the mastitis wasn't cleared up immediately! I took

them and ended up with thrush. While I had thrush, I also got a breast

abscess, so all in all, it was a pretty painful time. Any woman who has

suffered ductal thrush knows what I mean!! But the pain resulted in my not

being able to feed my daughter because it was too painful to hold her. I

stopped feeding her at the breast when I had that mastitis, and she didn't

feed at the breast again for a further nine weeks.

During that time I had to pump to maintain supply, but I did find it hard to

make enough milk so ended up supplementing with formula milk for part of

that time. I wasn't happy about it, but she had to be fed and at least she

was being partly breastfed, which I felt would minimise the damage. She was

actually having around six to eight ounces of formula a day in addition to

what I expressed. However, I honestly and truly believe that had I known

more about breastfeeding, and had I been better informed on the matter of

pumping, I could have easily made enough milk to satisfy her.

It's daunting expressing to feed one baby, so two must seem insurmountable.

However, they aren't going to be taking much at this stage, and I firmly

believe that with the right support and professional help (and I don't mean

doctors), you can do it. It's important to express frequently - you know

that already. I don't think every two hours is excessive at all, given that

you're feeding two babes. You don't say if your delivery was

section/assisted/medicated, but if so, it is quite possible that medication

you received during labour could be interfering with your milk supply.

That will need time to clear your system. There are, as others have said,

herbal preparations - and homoeopathic ones - you can use to stimulate milk

supply. Fenugreek springs to mind as the most obvious, but fennel tea is

also effective, and I have read that agnus castus and raspberry leaf tea are

also good galactagogues. Most importantly, you need a good pump. You don't

say what type of pump you are using, but what you *need* to maintain supply

in a situation like this is a double-pumping unit, preferrably electric. It

isn't true that pumping alone will not maintain your supply, but it's hard

to get the hormones flying and without them it's not as effective. As a

breastfeeding counsellor I came across a few ladies who had exclusively

breastfed prems, maintaining supply just by pumping. It can be done - but

no-one is saying it won't be without challenge. It is hard work and you may

feel for a while that you are chained to a breastpump, but you can do it.

The more you pump, the more you will make. It would help if you could have

your babies with you when you pump, or could see them or even photos of

them - it all aids the hormone production. There is nothing harder than

letting milk down to a breastpump!!! And the more you let down milk, the

more you will produce. Yes, the stress will play a part - keep in focus how

much you want to exclusively breastfeed these babes, but don't let it become

an obsession to the exclusion of all else. Don't beat yourself up for

supplementing - you are doing the best you can right now, and that is what's

important. Look forward to the time when you don't have to. My own

personal experience was that I found myself a skillful breastfeeding

counsellor who said this: I could reduce the formula gradually, which would

take time, or I could do it *cold turkey* - and chuck the bottles away,

which would result in a faster re-establishment of exclusive breastfeeding.

I chose the latter, and when I finally got my baby back to the breast at

fifteen weeks old, she fed like a pro: it was as though she'd never been

off the breast. For several weeks, my supply see-sawed a bit, mostly erring

on oversupply because I fed her as often as she'd take the milk!! ) Poor

thing - she must have got fed up with having a breast in her mouth!!! Then

we carried on until she was 5½ years old.

For weeks, I asked myself if I could keep it up - it seemed soul-destroying

to be chained to a breastpump all the time. I got PND as well, and my dd's

first Christmas was a nightmare. But we got there, and if I had to do it

over again, I would. It may seem to you that you're turning into a milk

machine, but if you decide to stick with it, you'll never regret it. Don't

have too many expectations of yourself though - take it one day at a time

and don't make *plans*. Just remind yourself of all the reasons you want to

breastfeed, and hang in there. It will get better.

Just make sure you have:

* the pump to do the job

* the support of someone skilled in breastfeeding

* the support of your family

* good nourishment

* time - everything else can wait for now

Read up on galactagogues if you can - there are many around. Have a look at

this too, if you can: http://www.h-e-c.com.au/flyers/breastfeeding.pdf - it

might help.

Good luck. Don't lose heart - it is truly worth the work involved. Feel

free to mail me privately if I can be of help.

Love, light and peace,

Sue

" As well consult a butcher on the value of vegetarianism as a doctor on the

worth of vaccination. " - Bernard Shaw

MMRcontactnetworkUK - putting

non-vaccinating UK parents looking for naturally acquired immunity for their

children in touch with each other

Imperfectly_Natural_Parents_UK - for all

imperfectly natural parents everywhere!

OT4VAX - Off-topic conversation for

Vaccinations list members

http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/vaccine.htm - expansive information about

vaccines!

http://www.whale.to - more expansive information about vaccines!

[Guest guest]

Congratulations on the girls! How are you and they doing??

I supplement my daughter (she is now 7 months) with a raw milk

formula (there is also a meat based formula) from Sally Fallon's

Nourishing Traditions book. The recipe can also be found on the

Weston A Price website. She has done exceptionally well with this.

I suppose if you were to do this you'd likely have to wait until you

are home....I suspect the hosptial would not be too keen on you

bring your own supplementation in. When I found the raw milk source

I drank it myself for about 2 weeks before I started to give it to

my daughter. My experience is that it has been great and the right

choice for us.

Kelley

---> Hi everyone! Been awhile since I have been here. I delivered

twin girls

> and they were born 3.5 weeks ago prematurely at 30 weeks

gestation. My

> question is, I am not producing enough milk to feed them, actually

my

> supply is dwindling. Has anyone else had to

> formula feed their children for whatever reason with no vaccines?

>

[Guest guest]

I want to add, as Sue did, that I had quite a hard time breast feeding

as well. We both ended up with thrush (my breasts, her mouth) I was a

C-section. After about 3 weeks of very difficult nursing- I strictly

pumped for 6 weeks and was up once or twice in the middle of the night

while she actually slept! We tried again when she was over 2 months

old and it has been MUCH better since. Again due to supply I do

supplement some- but again- I agree with Sue: we do the best we can.

If they are getting some breast milk that is FANTASTIC. If it can be

all- then great; but don't beat your self up over it. I spent far too

many days crying because I felt like I was failing my daughter.

Kelley

[Guest guest]

Hello. Congrats on your twin girls

I had a preemie myself, at 25 weeks. She was in the NICU for 3 1/2

months. I pumped for her also. Have you contacted a lactation

consulant yet? There are many things you can do to help keep up your

milk supply. I was took fenegruek, mothers milk tea and just those

helped keep my supply up. Also drinking lots of fluids, eating

oatmeal and barley helped me too. There are also some medications

you can get that will help domperidone (sp?) and reglan.

Are they stable enough for kangaroo care? that is immensely

important. Having skin to skin contact may help get your supply

going. I'd also suggest going to mothering.com, think someone

already posted about that. There's also a thread for NICU moms there

if you are interested, i can give you link. Many of us have pumped

for our babies.

Another one posted about anyone nearby that you know that has milk

that could pump for you and give it to your babies. I know I would

in a heartbeat for anyone. I got plenty of milk to go around

Just to let you know I pumped for 9 mths for my baby before we

became successful at nursing. It was hard work but well worth it.

Considering they are preemies, i'd really suggest doing everything

you can to give them breastmilk. I know supplementation is often

necessary and i had to do it myself. I just know that the preemies

in the NICU, the ones feed formula were sicker and needed more meds,

the ones that got bm, seemed healthier, on no meds or very few.

There were quick a few moms there that had twins and was successful

at pumpin enough for them.

Here is the support thread for the NICU at MDC

http://www.mothering.com/discussions/showthread.php?

t=290087 & highlight=nicu+support

it's a long thread don't feel like you have to read it all at once,

just pop in and i'm sure we'll all give you some advice and support!

best of luck to you

>

> Hi everyone! Been awhile since I have been here. I delivered twin

girls

> and they were born 3.5 weeks ago prematurely at 30 weeks

gestation. My

> question is, I am not producing enough milk to feed them, actually

my

> supply is dwindling. Probably from the fact that I do not have

babies

> at home to help stimulate my supply so I am forced to pump every 2

> hours which it isnt doing much. I am still supplying them with

breast

> milk but they are being supplemented. My milk supply is very low

and I

> am afraid that I will stop producing any milk for them b/c in the

> research I have done they say excessive pumping with no

stimulation can

> actually cause a woman to dry up. My girls will be in NICU for

several

> weeks yet. Anways my question, I am concerned that not being able

to

> breastfeed them for a year will hurt their immune system and

causing

> them to become sick from different things. Is this fear warranted

or am

> I just making a mountain out of a mole hill? Has anyone else had

to

> formula feed their children for whatever reason with no vaccines?

>

[Guest guest]

mmm.....btdt..... I felt I had betrayed her....but you just do what you can.

) (((((Hugs)))))

Sue

>

> I want to add, as Sue did, that I had quite a hard time breast feeding

> as well. We both ended up with thrush (my breasts, her mouth) I was a

> C-section. After about 3 weeks of very difficult nursing- I strictly

> pumped for 6 weeks and was up once or twice in the middle of the night

> while she actually slept! We tried again when she was over 2 months

> old and it has been MUCH better since. Again due to supply I do

> supplement some- but again- I agree with Sue: we do the best we can.

> If they are getting some breast milk that is FANTASTIC. If it can be

> all- then great; but don't beat your self up over it. I spent far too

> many days crying because I felt like I was failing my daughter.

>

> Kelley

>

[Guest guest]

Your not nuts at all! I always have said I would do that for a friend...and

ask a friend to do it for me if needed. Of course some friends would be more

open to it than others! LOL.

There was recently an urgent call for donated milk in the Chicago area to

help a sick baby. It happens. I think it is a lovely image. Women helping

women...helping little ones.

Jami

RE: Vaccines and formula fed babies

This might sound crazy, but do you have a really good friend with a baby who

would let you " wet nurse " him/her to keep your supply going? I know most

people would cringe at this, but it might be the trick to really get your

supply up and running in a more natural way. Maybe I'm nuts.

Sheri B.

mum2mishka <mum2mishka@...> wrote:

> Hi everyone! Been awhile since I have been here. I delivered twin girls

> and they were born 3.5 weeks ago prematurely at 30 weeks gestation. My

> question is, I am not producing enough milk to feed them, actually my

> supply is dwindling. Probably from the fact that I do not have babies

> at home to help stimulate my supply so I am forced to pump every 2

> hours which it isnt doing much. I am still supplying them with breast

> milk but they are being supplemented. My milk supply is very low and I

> am afraid that I will stop producing any milk for them b/c in the

> research I have done they say excessive pumping with no stimulation can

> actually cause a woman to dry up. My girls will be in NICU for several

> weeks yet. Anways my question, I am concerned that not being able to

> breastfeed them for a year will hurt their immune system and causing

> them to become sick from different things. Is this fear warranted or am

> I just making a mountain out of a mole hill? Has anyone else had to

> formula feed their children for whatever reason with no vaccines?

>

Congratulations on your new daughters! I hope that they go from strength to

strength and come home with you soon.

I had issues with my daughter after she was born. I was committed to

breastfeeding but had problem from the word " go " , probably because I didn't

have a clue what I was doing. ( By the time she was 3 weeks old, I had

blocked ducts, then that progressed to mastitis at 6 weeks. Needless to

say, I was " blackmailed " into having a/bs - was told I wouldn't be able to

breastfeed any mor e if the mastitis wasn't cleared up immediately! I took

them and ended up with thrush. While I had thrush, I also got a breast

abscess, so all in all, it was a pretty painful time. Any woman who has

suffered ductal thrush knows what I mean!! But the pain resulted in my not

being able to feed my daughter because it was too painful to hold her. I

stopped feeding her at the breast when I had that mastitis, and she didn't

feed at the breast again for a further nine weeks.

During that time I had to pump to maintain supply, but I did find it hard to

make enough milk so ended up supplementing with formula milk for part of

that time. I wasn't happy about it, but she had to be fed and at least she

was being partly breastfed, which I felt would minimise the damage. She was

actually having around six to eight ounces of formula a day in addition to

what I expressed. However, I honestly and truly believe that had I known

more about breastfeeding, and had I been better informed on the matter of

pumping, I could have easily made enough milk to satisfy her.

It's daunting expressing to feed one baby, so two must seem insurmountable.

However, they aren't going to be taking much at this stage, and I firmly

believe that with the right support and professional help (and I don't mean

doctors), you can do it. It's important to express frequently - you know

that already. I don't think every two hours is excessive at all, given that

you're feeding two babes. You don't say if your delivery was

section/assisted/medicated, but if so, it is quite possible that medication

you received during labour could be interfering with your milk supply.

That will need time to clear your system. There are, as others have said,

herbal preparations - and homoeopathic ones - you can use to stimulate milk

supply. Fenugreek springs to mind as the most obvious, but fennel tea is

also effective, and I have read that agnus castus and raspberry leaf tea are

also good galactagogues. Most importantly, you need a good pump. You don't

say what type of pump you are using, but what you *need* to maintain supply

in a situation like this is a double-pumping unit, preferrably electric. It

isn't true that pumping alone will not maintain your supply, but it's hard

to get the hormones flying and without them it's not as effective. As a

breastfeeding counsellor I came across a few ladies who had exclusively

breastfed prems, maintaining supply just by pumping. It can be done - but

no-one is saying it won't be without challenge. It is hard work and you may

feel for a while that you are chained to a breastpump, but you can do it.

The more you pump, the more you will make. It would help if you could have

your babies with you when you pump, or could see them or even photos of

them - it all aids the hormone production. There is nothing harder than

letting milk down to a breastpump!!! And the more you let down milk, the

more you will produce. Yes, the stress will play a part - keep in focus how

much you want to exclusively breastfeed these babes, but don't let it become

an obsession to the exclusion of all else. Don't beat yourself up for

supplementing - you are doing the best you can right now, and that is what's

important. Look forward to the time when you don't have to. My own

personal experience was that I found myself a skillful breastfeeding

counsellor who said this: I could reduce the formula gradually, which would

take time, or I could do it *cold turkey* - and chuck the bottles away,

which would result in a faster re-establishment of exclusive breastfeeding.

I chose the latter, and when I finally got my baby back to the breast at

fifteen weeks old, she fed like a pro: it was as though she'd never been

off the breast. For several weeks, my supply see-sawed a bit, mostly erring

on oversupply because I fed her as often as she'd take the milk!! ) Poor

thing - she must have got fed up with having a breast in her mouth!!! Then

we carried on until she was 5½ years old.

For weeks, I asked myself if I could keep it up - it seemed soul-destroying

to be chained to a breastpump all the time. I got PND as well, and my dd's

first Christmas was a nightmare. But we got there, and if I had to do it

over again, I would. It may seem to you that you're turning into a milk

machine, but if you decide to stick with it, you'll never regret it. Don't

have too many expectations of yourself though - take it one day at a time

and don't make *plans*. Just remind yourself of all the reasons you want to

breastfeed, and hang in there. It will get better.

Just make sure you have:

* the pump to do the job

* the support of someone skilled in breastfeeding

* the support of your family

* good nourishment

* time - everything else can wait for now

Read up on galactagogues if you can - there are many around. Have a look at

this too, if you can: http://www.h-e-c.com.au/flyers/breastfeeding.pdf - it

might help.

Good luck. Don't lose heart - it is truly worth the work involved. Feel

free to mail me privately if I can be of help.

Love, light and peace,

Sue

" As well consult a butcher on the value of vegetarianism as a doctor on the

worth of vaccination. " - Bernard Shaw

MMRcontactnetworkUK - putting

non-vaccinating UK parents looking for naturally acquired immunity for their

children in touch with each other

Imperfectly_Natural_Parents_UK - for all

imperfectly natural parents everywhere!

OT4VAX - Off-topic conversation for

Vaccinations list members

http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/vaccine.htm - expansive information about

vaccines!

http://www.whale.to - more expansive information about vaccines!

[Guest guest]

I just wanted to mention that I pumped for 1 1/2 months for my son

who was preterm, born at 33 1/2 weeks. I also didn't have much

milk, but continued to pump anyway. You can try things to help with

production such as fenugreek (3 tablets, 2 times per day) or you

could check out something called lactatesupport (or something like

that) on herbs.com. I have heard great things on the second one I

mentioned and it helped a mom get back a supply that almost dried up

because of allergy medicine. I used fenugreek but not in large

enough doses to help with my supply. Eating oatmeal is also

supposes to help.

I would keep up with the pumping and then switch to breastfeeding as

soon as possible. If you haven't already, I would ask if they will

allow you to try breastfeeding while they are in the hopital. It

will be hard getting them to switch from the bottle to the breast

but it is done all the time. For me, about a week before his due

date, I decided that I had enough with the pumping and quit cold

turkey and forced him to get nutrition from the breast. It took

some time, but he finally started doing it, even though he wasn't

very good at it at first.

For the first several weeks, he nursed ALL THE TIME, to try to get

my supply up. And things were good from there on out. He is still

nursing at 2 years old. I have never had a large supply and never

had to worry about leaking.

It will definetly be harder with twins, but the concept is the

same. You may get worn out from nursing all the time, but it's

gotta be better than pumping and preparing bottles (at least I

thought so.)

I know this wasn't your question but I wanted to give you some

encouraging words to keep you modivated, since it can be so easy to

give up when you are exhausted.

Congrats on you babies.

Tara

>

> Hi everyone! Been awhile since I have been here. I delivered twin

girls

> and they were born 3.5 weeks ago prematurely at 30 weeks

gestation. My

> question is, I am not producing enough milk to feed them, actually

my

> supply is dwindling. Probably from the fact that I do not have

babies

> at home to help stimulate my supply so I am forced to pump every 2

> hours which it isnt doing much. I am still supplying them with

breast

> milk but they are being supplemented. My milk supply is very low

and I

> am afraid that I will stop producing any milk for them b/c in the

> research I have done they say excessive pumping with no

stimulation can

> actually cause a woman to dry up. My girls will be in NICU for

several

> weeks yet. Anways my question, I am concerned that not being able

to

> breastfeed them for a year will hurt their immune system and

causing

> them to become sick from different things. Is this fear warranted

or am

> I just making a mountain out of a mole hill? Has anyone else had

to

> formula feed their children for whatever reason with no vaccines?

>

[Guest guest]

Thank you everyone for your encouraging words. To try and answer some

questions that I remember...I am using an electric pump (medela pump-

n-style). I have talked with the lactation dept at the hospital my

girls are in and also the nurses who care for my girls. My family is

very supportive and I try to get as must rest as I can.

About the fenugreek. Many people have mentioned it but I have done

some research and no one seems to know the effects it has on mothers

or children so I am a little put off by that. But the longer I go,

the more I am leaning towards it. Today my supply seems better. We

also did kangaroo care this past saturday and that really seemed to

help b/c I was very sore (women, you know what I mean!) I talked to

the nurse last nite and she said that we can do it every evening if I

think it will help my supply so we are going to try that whenever

possible.

I am hoping that they will let my start with the breast when I can.

They are going to start next week with oral feedings but they keep

mentioning a bottle which would probably be easier for them in the

beginning but I am concerned about later on. Both girls are very

impatient when it comes to there tube feedings, I know they will

probably prefer a bottle over breast anyways b/c they will get the

milk faster. And I have heard conflicting ideas on both bottle and

breast feedings...Ahhh...all the different ideas and thoughts that

are out there are enough to make your head spin!

Thank you for asking how they are doing. They are doing wonderful.

Kaytlin hit 4 lbs (born 3 lbs 3 ozs) last nite and Alivea is 3 lbs 15

ozs (born 2 lbs 14 ozs) so she might get there tonite. They are off

all oxygen, and maintaining their body temp although they are still

in isolettes but moving to open cribs in the next few days. We are so

proud of them. They are doing amazingly well and we hope to have them

home shortly. I am just trying to hang in there with the breast

feeding b/c I know I can produce enough but I just need them here to

do so...

>

> I just wanted to mention that I pumped for 1 1/2 months for my son

> who was preterm, born at 33 1/2 weeks. I also didn't have much

> milk, but continued to pump anyway. You can try things to help

with

> production such as fenugreek (3 tablets, 2 times per day) or you

> could check out something called lactatesupport (or something like

> that) on herbs.com. I have heard great things on the second one I

> mentioned and it helped a mom get back a supply that almost dried

up

> because of allergy medicine. I used fenugreek but not in large

> enough doses to help with my supply. Eating oatmeal is also

> supposes to help.

>

> I would keep up with the pumping and then switch to breastfeeding

as

> soon as possible. If you haven't already, I would ask if they will

> allow you to try breastfeeding while they are in the hopital. It

> will be hard getting them to switch from the bottle to the breast

> but it is done all the time. For me, about a week before his due

> date, I decided that I had enough with the pumping and quit cold

> turkey and forced him to get nutrition from the breast. It took

> some time, but he finally started doing it, even though he wasn't

> very good at it at first.

>

> For the first several weeks, he nursed ALL THE TIME, to try to get

> my supply up. And things were good from there on out. He is still

> nursing at 2 years old. I have never had a large supply and never

> had to worry about leaking.

>

> It will definetly be harder with twins, but the concept is the

> same. You may get worn out from nursing all the time, but it's

> gotta be better than pumping and preparing bottles (at least I

> thought so.)

>

> I know this wasn't your question but I wanted to give you some

> encouraging words to keep you modivated, since it can be so easy to

> give up when you are exhausted.

>

> Congrats on you babies.

>

> Tara

>

[Guest guest]

Hi,

I just wanted to tell you how wonderful it is that you are trying so

hard to get the breastfeeding established. Please hang in there, it

will pay off. I am a breastfeeding counsellor and feel passionate

about breastfeeding. For premature babies it is crucial.

Give yourself a pat on the shoulder for having done so well and for

persevering with it. You deserve it.

Kangaroo care is the best thing for your babies right now, it WILL

increase your supply and help you bond with them. Try and do it as

often as you possibly can, several times a day, if possible.

They calm down, grow better, their heart rate improves, the breathing,

everything really, I can't emphazise it enough.

They can also hear your voice, smell you, feel your heartbeat, feel

your breath, all those things that will help them grow and develop. In

some developing countries they use this method allone to look after

premies as they have no incubators there. And the success rate is very

high.

Warmest hugs and lots of love, keep going, you will get there.

Love,

Ingrid

[Guest guest]

Just wanted to suggest that you RENT the hospital grade pump. The

Pump-in-style is meant for MAINTAINING milk suplly, not establishing it.

Ask to use the hospital pump whenever you can, or rent one. They are

MUCH stronger. Glad to hear how great the girls are doing. They may

need bottle feedings at first until they get bigger, but you can make

sure what's in the bottle is YOUR milk, not formula, to a great extent,

if not exclusively. Try pmping at the hospital while you are looking at

them, too. That should help a lot.

Beth