Re: Beginner's questions

[Guest guest]

Hi,

I'm new to this message board. My four-year-old (possible Asbergers,

sometimes hyperactive) has been casein free for almost two years and gluten

free for four months. His episodes of hyperactivity have lessened in both

intensity and frequency, but still occasionally occur. These are the goofy,

happy hyper episodes which make me think phenols. We were Feingold completely

for a while, but have added a few fruits back (peaches, plums, occasional

yelllow delicious apple).

Besides being gfcf, we've eliminated all artificial everything, sugar, yeast,

chocolate, nuts, eggs, corn (kind of sneak that in sometimes with no apparant

reaction), and I can't think what else. Seems like we only eat rice, chicken,

carrots and pears, sometimes!

An OAT showed tremendously high DHPPA (1074), high hippuric (4308), high

citric (1624), slightly high citramalic (2.24), high 3-oxyglutaric (1.40) and

a few other highs. Treatment for two months with Pro-Culture Gold, SCFOS,

Colostrum, Vit. C brought down the DHPPA slightly (726), the hippuric down

(1852), and a few others down sliightly. Stool samples have shown no yeast,

but have shown little beneficial bacteria, even after two months of

probiotics. In fact, one level of bad bacteria showed up recently

(Citrobacter fuerngii) and we are treating that with Uva Ursi (which

incidently comes in a cranberry base which worries me a bit since berries are

a big no no for my son, but my DAN thought it was important to get rid of the

citrobacter and no tremedous poor side effects have shown up from the Uva

Ursi).

My son's main problems are these: 1) A very hot torso and back which feels so

hot it's like touching a sunburn. This has been occuring for over a year and

no explanation had been found. The episodes last a few days during which my

son is very irritable and/or hyper. Sounds like food allergy, maybe, but

we've eliminated so many foods I can't think what we'd eat if we continued to

eliminate. Also, it seems to appear for no apparant reason foodwise. 2)

Occasional episodes of hyperactivity and spaciness 3)

Irritability/antisocial behavior. For instance, at the playground today, my

son (who was having a hot body day) went up to a boy and shoved hiim for no

reason whatsoever, then told me the boy was mean to him (the two boys had

never had any interaction at all). When he couldn't find a toy, he said some

kids who'd been at our house had taken it and were never going to give it

back. (He's never had a friend take a toy and not return it). He screamed at

our completely docile cat for jumping on the sofa and sitting within three

feet of him. This stuff goes on and on endlessly on a bad day until I'm worn

to a frazzle. How can such a well-loved boy in such a wonderful and caring

family have such negative attitudes? I'm usually in tears by the end of these

days.

On the bright side, on good days, he has a wonderful sense of humor, gets

along well with friends, and is extremely bright.

Any suggestions for how to deal with our problems? We're looking into

chelation, but it scares the heck out of me. My son was fully vaccinated (to

my everlasting regret) until recently and has had no shots since two years of

age.

Is there a way to determine if PST deficiency is a problem? Are there safer

methods of chelation than DMSA? Milk thistle? Olejba (sp) tea? Anything?

I've never used any of what I perceive to be the top enzymes (Kirkman's, Pep,

Serenade), though I do have a small container of Kirkman's since my DAN is a

Kirkman guy.

Can phenol problems be controlled by any enzymes?

Thanks in advance for any help,

Debbie

[Guest guest]

Debbie,

My son was on the gfcf diet for one year. Over the course of the

year, I also had to remove corn, nuts, soy, colorings, most

vegetables, sorghum flour, coconut butter, all but three fruits,

etc. He was also on a yeast free, low sugar diet. The diet brought

many improvements in his development. When we added the Peptizyde

and HN-Zyme Prime, we saw a tremendous leap in his awareness, level

of happiness, interaction with his brother, vocal quality, problem-

solving, etc. The enzymes obviously were breaking down foods I was

not aware my son was sensitive to.

My son is very sensitive to phenols. He did not have the reaction

you describe, but he did get very red ears, a very red bottom and

really unpleasant behavior. With enzymes, his reactions are milder.

He rarely gets red ears now, sometimes gets a red bottom, and

exhibits unpleasant behavior, but to a lesser degree. I feel

comfortable giving him some highly phenolic foods now, but I do try

to limit them. At this point, he still does not do well with

peanutbutter, chocolate, or artificial colorings. He can have a

little chocolate or coloring, but I think peanutbutter will have to

be very occasional. My son is also taking MSM, which I think is

helping with the phenols a little, but it is too soon to be sure.

I hope this was helpful.

> Hi,

>

> I'm new to this message board. My four-year-old (possible

Asbergers,

> sometimes hyperactive) has been casein free for almost two years

and gluten

> free for four months. His episodes of hyperactivity have lessened

in both

> intensity and frequency, but still occasionally occur. These are

the goofy,

> happy hyper episodes which make me think phenols. We were Feingold

completely

> for a while, but have added a few fruits back (peaches, plums,

occasional

> yelllow delicious apple).

>

> Besides being gfcf, we've eliminated all artificial everything,

sugar, yeast,

> chocolate, nuts, eggs, corn (kind of sneak that in sometimes with

no apparant

> reaction), and I can't think what else. Seems like we only eat

rice, chicken,

> carrots and pears, sometimes!

>

> An OAT showed tremendously high DHPPA (1074), high hippuric (4308),

high

> citric (1624), slightly high citramalic (2.24), high 3-oxyglutaric

(1.40) and

> a few other highs. Treatment for two months with Pro-Culture Gold,

SCFOS,

> Colostrum, Vit. C brought down the DHPPA slightly (726), the

hippuric down

> (1852), and a few others down sliightly. Stool samples have shown

no yeast,

> but have shown little beneficial bacteria, even after two months of

> probiotics. In fact, one level of bad bacteria showed up recently

> (Citrobacter fuerngii) and we are treating that with Uva Ursi

(which

> incidently comes in a cranberry base which worries me a bit since

berries are

> a big no no for my son, but my DAN thought it was important to get

rid of the

> citrobacter and no tremedous poor side effects have shown up from

the Uva

> Ursi).

>

> My son's main problems are these: 1) A very hot torso and back

which feels so

> hot it's like touching a sunburn. This has been occuring for over a

year and

> no explanation had been found. The episodes last a few days during

which my

> son is very irritable and/or hyper. Sounds like food allergy,

maybe, but

> we've eliminated so many foods I can't think what we'd eat if we

continued to

> eliminate. Also, it seems to appear for no apparant reason

foodwise. 2)

> Occasional episodes of hyperactivity and spaciness 3)

> Irritability/antisocial behavior. For instance, at the playground

today, my

> son (who was having a hot body day) went up to a boy and shoved

hiim for no

> reason whatsoever, then told me the boy was mean to him (the two

boys had

> never had any interaction at all). When he couldn't find a toy, he

said some

> kids who'd been at our house had taken it and were never going to

give it

> back. (He's never had a friend take a toy and not return it). He

screamed at

> our completely docile cat for jumping on the sofa and sitting

within three

> feet of him. This stuff goes on and on endlessly on a bad day until

I'm worn

> to a frazzle. How can such a well-loved boy in such a wonderful and

caring

> family have such negative attitudes? I'm usually in tears by the

end of these

> days.

>

> On the bright side, on good days, he has a wonderful sense of

humor, gets

> along well with friends, and is extremely bright.

>

> Any suggestions for how to deal with our problems? We're looking

into

> chelation, but it scares the heck out of me. My son was fully

vaccinated (to

> my everlasting regret) until recently and has had no shots since

two years of

> age.

>

> Is there a way to determine if PST deficiency is a problem? Are

there safer

> methods of chelation than DMSA? Milk thistle? Olejba (sp) tea?

Anything?

>

> I've never used any of what I perceive to be the top enzymes

(Kirkman's, Pep,

> Serenade), though I do have a small container of Kirkman's since my

DAN is a

> Kirkman guy.

>

> Can phenol problems be controlled by any enzymes?

>

> Thanks in advance for any help,

> Debbie

[Guest guest]

Hi, Beginner - we were all beginner's at some time.

Wow, if your son is not a good candidate for success with enzymes, I

don't know what kind of a profile would be. Sorry to hear he is

having so much trouble. I saw a tremendous improvement in behavior

with both my boys (my husband will comment the same for me, but I am

ignoring him at the moment on this, LOL). I could never figure out

why my oldest was so fussed up and complained and cried over

everything. Now he is such a wonderful joy - so pleasant and helpful.

Laughs all the time. I certainly hope you will see the same Happy

Child effect that many of us do.

The episodes of hyperactivity and silliness sound like phenols. Are

you still Feingold diet? I started that about 2-3 weeks ago, although

I had eliminated a lot of the obvious chemicals and additives. It is

going over well here.

My younger son had/has constant bowel problems. The stench was

horrid. We could only get rid of the smell (and presumably any

bacteria/yeast overgrowth) by using the enzymes and Culturelle. He

gets 3/day now. Any time I try a different brand the smell returns. I

am giving him grapefruit seed extract now - started 3 days ago, but

can't tell that it is helping yet. Also am giving him the scFOS. If

your son is feeling that bad, no wonder he has a behavior problem.

Our kids behavior improved when we got the insides working better.

> Is there a way to determine if PST deficiency is a problem?

Not that I know of besides eliminating the foods one at a time.

> Can phenol problems be controlled by any enzymes?

The only enzymes I have heard of that might help with phenols

specifically is Zyme Prime from www.houstonni.com. This helps some

people somewhat, so it is not a clear cut definite solution. However,

some people do see some improvement. Like maybe you can give him

slightly more than before, or maybe he can tolerate a couple new

phenols than before. I use the Peptizyde and Zyme Prime both

regularly and we are really thrilled about it to say the least. My

boys and I have a big problem with dairy and now we have dairy all

the time with no problem. I don't know that we have a specific

problem with anything else because I started with these products and

everything got so much better we didn't need to keep looking. I think

you may do well with enzymes because your foods are so very limited

now.

There are several helpful documents in the Files section. Let me know

if you are on email only, or have any more questions.

best,

.

[Guest guest]

These are the

goofy,

> happy hyper episodes which make me think phenols. We were Feingold

completely

> for a while, but have added a few fruits back (peaches, plums,

occasional

> yelllow delicious apple).

Plums would send my son just like you describe for yours.

>

> My son's main problems are these: 1) A very hot torso and back which

feels so

> hot it's like touching a sunburn. This has been occuring for over a

year and

> no explanation had been found. The episodes last a few days during

which my

> son is very irritable and/or hyper. Sounds like food allergy, maybe,

but

> we've eliminated so many foods I can't think what we'd eat if we

continued to

> eliminate. Also, it seems to appear for no apparant reason foodwise.

To me, this sounds like an environmental inhalant allergy, because he

is hot above the waist, where the lungs are. I get like this when the

grass is fresh-cut, or a certain tree is releasing pollens, or for

certain cleaning chemicals. I get irritable, altho not hyper, and

occasionally a very strong histamine reaction which causes me to be

unable to breathe.

This stuff goes on and on endlessly on a bad day until

I'm worn

> to a frazzle. How can such a well-loved boy in such a wonderful and

caring

> family have such negative attitudes? I'm usually in tears by the end

of these

> days.

I would suggest you do try enzymes, remove the plums, my son tolerates

corn so you can try re-introducing that with enzymes, and check for

environmental allergies.

>

> Is there a way to determine if PST deficiency is a problem?

Remove the foods, then add back. Here is my phenol information.

http://home.pacbell.net/cscomp/phenol.htm

Are

there safer

> methods of chelation than DMSA? Milk thistle? Olejba (sp) tea?

Anything?

Here is my chelation FAQ, which I will include on my site when I

finally get time to do it LOL. This link is long, you will have to

copy it into your browser [don't just click on the link here] and then

type the Q on the end, the last three letters should read FAQ. This

link does discuss other chelation methods. Also several people on

this forum are using that tea, but I don't know why they are using it,

so maybe they can give you information on that.

/files/Mercury-Autism%20FA

Q

>

> I've never used any of what I perceive to be the top enzymes

(Kirkman's, Pep,

> Serenade), though I do have a small container of Kirkman's since my

DAN is a

> Kirkman guy.

I use enzymes from this url for my children

http://www.houstonni.com/

They work very well for most of their food intolerances, but not all.

>

> Can phenol problems be controlled by any enzymes?

Some people report some control with Zyme Prime enzyme, but not all

children, and not for all highly phenolic foods. There are other

ideas on helping with PST issues on the phenol link I gave you above.

> Thanks in advance for any help,

> Debbie

I hope that helps.

Dana