Re: NEED EVALUATION: ISAC & HTRP Panels !

[Guest guest]

We have been through this discussion before, but it seems like

almost everyone, except for about two people, had some abnormal

tests from Hemex. I am tempted to send my healthy wife's blood to

them to see what comes back abnormal. I really don't know that

much about your results, but the fibrinogen reading is only about

10% above the high end of normal. Have you tried aspirin yet

as a blood thinner??

Mike

> Following are my results that any & all are free to assist me in

> interpreting:

>

> ISAC:

> Fibrinogen: 346 H 180-310

> Prothrombin Fragment 1+2: 2.7 H 0.4-1.1

> Thrombin/AntiThrombin Complexes: 2.1 1.0-4.1

> Soluble Fibrin Monomer: 25 H 0-17

> PLATELET ACTIVATION by Flow

> CD62P: 16 0-27

> CD62P + ADP 69 39-80

> Plt Activation Index: NORMAL NORMAL

>

> HTRP:

> ANTITHROMBIN ACTIVITY: 108 75-125

> PROTEIN C ACTIVITY: 165 H 60-140

> PROTEIN S ACTIVITY: 95 65-150

> APC RESISTANCE: NEGATIVE Negative

> FACTOR II ACTIVITY: 102 60-120

> Lp(a) - LIPOPROTEIN (a): 72 H 0-30

> PAI-1 ACTIVITY: 0.0 0.0-15.5

> HOMOCYSTEINE:

[Guest guest]

> Mike

> For what it's worth, I have had some of my results corroborated.

Twice I

> have had lp(a) measured elsewhere, and it is high as he said. My

family

> is being measured and they so far are high. I have also had my

fibrinogen

> measured twice by other labs and they agreed with his result.

>

> Cindi

Cindi, this is my point. You say your family's lp(a) is all high

but are they sick? It might just be that you (and your family)

are out of range and you would be anyway even if all of you were

perfectly healthy. My point was that I think if 'we' sent the

blood of healthy people to Hemex that we would get back some

abnormal results. It's just that Hemex is a self serving business

(no harm in that), but they haven't done a controlled study, which

would be easy to do, that says that healthy controls don't have

any (or few) abnormal test results, and PWCs are abnormal. It would

be a blind study. A doc would send them say 100 PWCs blood and

100 healthy people's blood, and if Hemex could figure out who was

ill, then Hemex would have more credibility, at least from me.

Mike

[Guest guest]

I agree, there should be some controlled studies.

But, it sounded like you were questioning the results of the lab. Whether

they were accurate. I guess you're saying the results don't matter

because many people have abnormalities.

But nobody says that you have to have CFIDS if you have high lp(a) or some

of the other things that are tested. But my family all dies early from

heart attacks, so I think it is very important for them to know this so

they can take measures to reduce the risks. I'm very glad I found this

out. But it is aside from the fact that I have CFIDS. The whole point is

that it is harder to fight viruses and bacteria if your blood is so thick

it isn't flowing.

Sorry, I'm not writing clearly. You are saying Hemex should be able to

DIAGNOSE who has CFIDS from those test results. I completely disagree.

They do not prove you are sick. They just show that your blood is

coagulated. It might be coagulated and you do not have CFIDS. You might

die anyway from heart attack or stroke, but it doesn't prove you have

CFIDS. If you think it should I think you are missing the point.

Cindi

kmcamp22@...

06/23/01 09:23 AM

Please respond to

cc:

Subject: Re: NEED EVALUATION: ISAC & HTRP

Panels !

> Mike

> For what it's worth, I have had some of my results corroborated.

Twice I

> have had lp(a) measured elsewhere, and it is high as he said. My

family

> is being measured and they so far are high. I have also had my

fibrinogen

> measured twice by other labs and they agreed with his result.

>

> Cindi

Cindi, this is my point. You say your family's lp(a) is all high

but are they sick? It might just be that you (and your family)

are out of range and you would be anyway even if all of you were

perfectly healthy. My point was that I think if 'we' sent the

blood of healthy people to Hemex that we would get back some

abnormal results. It's just that Hemex is a self serving business

(no harm in that), but they haven't done a controlled study, which

would be easy to do, that says that healthy controls don't have

any (or few) abnormal test results, and PWCs are abnormal. It would

be a blind study. A doc would send them say 100 PWCs blood and

100 healthy people's blood, and if Hemex could figure out who was

ill, then Hemex would have more credibility, at least from me.

Mike

[Guest guest]

Cindi:

I have been battling a 20-year long candida infection, and showed

prior active HHV-6 (which Berg says is the chief culprit causing the

hypercoagulation). I was using Nystatin for 15 years and was " in

remission " for 10 years, then relapsed last year and have been

struggling to get back to my " base " . My hopes are that the blood

thinners such as heparin will allow the new antifungals to work

better, and thus get these pathogens under control once & for all!

> I don't know if you can say your root cause is hereditary. You

have

> genetic things which make you suseptible. But without a pathogen

> (bacteria or virus) you might have never become hypercoagulative.

Or

> maybe you would have. I don't think any of us knows.

>

> Cindi

>

>

>

> I guess what I want to know first off is, is my root cause

hereditary?

>

>

> > >

> > > ISAC:

> > > Fibrinogen: 346 H 180-310

> > > Prothrombin Fragment 1+2: 2.7 H 0.4-1.1

> > > Thrombin/AntiThrombin Complexes: 2.1 1.0-4.1

> > > Soluble Fibrin Monomer: 25 H 0-17

> > > PLATELET ACTIVATION by Flow

> > > CD62P: 16 0-27

> > > CD62P + ADP 69 39-80

> > > Plt Activation Index: NORMAL NORMAL

> > >

> > > HTRP:

> > > ANTITHROMBIN ACTIVITY: 108 75-125

> > > PROTEIN C ACTIVITY: 165 H 60-140

> > > PROTEIN S ACTIVITY: 95 65-150

> > > APC RESISTANCE: NEGATIVE Negative

> > > FACTOR II ACTIVITY: 102 60-120

> > > Lp(a) - LIPOPROTEIN (a): 72 H 0-30

> > > PAI-1 ACTIVITY: 0.0 0.0-15.5

> > > HOMOCYSTEINE:

> > >

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

My doc spoke to Berg today. His interpretation of my test results

below:

1) Definitely a genetic defect as shown in the high Lpa level which

makes me high risk for heart attacks. This is the root cause and is

also why I have not been able to eliminate the candida infection I've

had for 20 years and why I've had bad hay fever in past.

2) I am generating too much thrombin and have lots of fibrin buildup.

3) Increased Protein C means my body is trying to compensate for the

increased hypercoagulation.

4)He said mine is one of the most difficult profiles to work with.

5)Protocol: Wobenzyme, Lysine, Proline, Inositol Hexaniacinate, and

low dose heparin.

6)This therapy should allow the antifungals and immune boosters to

finally work to eradicate the infection(s), but it will take time.

Feedback, anyone?

> > Following are my results that any & all are free to assist me in

> > interpreting:

> >

> > ISAC:

> > Fibrinogen: 346 H 180-310

> > Prothrombin Fragment 1+2: 2.7 H 0.4-1.1

> > Thrombin/AntiThrombin Complexes: 2.1 1.0-4.1

> > Soluble Fibrin Monomer: 25 H 0-17

> > PLATELET ACTIVATION by Flow

> > CD62P: 16 0-27

> > CD62P + ADP 69 39-80

> > Plt Activation Index: NORMAL NORMAL

> >

> > HTRP:

> > ANTITHROMBIN ACTIVITY: 108 75-125

> > PROTEIN C ACTIVITY: 165 H 60-140

> > PROTEIN S ACTIVITY: 95 65-150

> > APC RESISTANCE: NEGATIVE Negative

> > FACTOR II ACTIVITY: 102 60-120

> > Lp(a) - LIPOPROTEIN (a): 72 H 0-30

> > PAI-1 ACTIVITY: 0.0 0.0-15.5

> > HOMOCYSTEINE:

[Guest guest]

> My doc spoke to Berg today. His interpretation of my test results

> below:

>

> 1) Definitely a genetic defect as shown in the high Lpa level which

> makes me high risk for heart attacks. This is the root cause and is

> also why I have not been able to eliminate the candida infection

I've

> had for 20 years and why I've had bad hay fever in past.

>

> 2) I am generating too much thrombin and have lots of fibrin

buildup.

> 3) Increased Protein C means my body is trying to compensate for

the

> increased hypercoagulation.

> 4)He said mine is one of the most difficult profiles to work with.

> 5)Protocol: Wobenzyme, Lysine, Proline, Inositol Hexaniacinate, and

> low dose heparin.

> 6)This therapy should allow the antifungals and immune boosters to

> finally work to eradicate the infection(s), but it will take time.

>

> Feedback, anyone?

I don't have any ideas, but it sounds like the protocol should work.

The question I have is this. It seems to me like 'thick blood', and

fibrin would cause a person's heart to beat harder and cause high

blood pressure, whereas thin blood should be easier for the heart to

deal with. Since most PWCs have low blood pressure, has there been

any discussion/answer for this? Has Berg even discussed blood

pressure as it relates to abnormal Hemex test values?

Mike

[Guest guest]

I hear what you're saying Mike, the theory sounds good, but I have yet to

hear of a person with thick blood who has high blood pressure. We all

seem to have low bp. Mine has improved since I have been on heparin.

Cindi

---------

I don't have any ideas, but it sounds like the protocol should work.

The question I have is this. It seems to me like 'thick blood', and

fibrin would cause a person's heart to beat harder and cause high

blood pressure, whereas thin blood should be easier for the heart to

deal with. Since most PWCs have low blood pressure, has there been

any discussion/answer for this? Has Berg even discussed blood

pressure as it relates to abnormal Hemex test values?

Mike

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 6/26/01 10:28:17 PM Pacific Daylight Time,

yeastbuster2000@... writes:

> My doc spoke to Berg today. His interpretation of my test results

> below:

>

> 1) Definitely a genetic defect as shown in the high Lpa level which

> makes me high risk for heart attacks. This is the root cause and is

> also why I have not been able to eliminate the candida infection I've

> had for 20 years and why I've had bad hay fever in past.

>

> 2) I am generating too much thrombin and have lots of fibrin buildup.

> 3) Increased Protein C means my body is trying to compensate for the

> increased hypercoagulation.

> 4)He said mine is one of the most difficult profiles to work with.

> 5)Protocol: Wobenzyme, Lysine, Proline, Inositol Hexaniacinate, and

> low dose heparin.

> 6)This therapy should allow the antifungals and immune boosters to

> finally work to eradicate the infection(s), but it will take time.

>

> Feedback, anyone?

>

Hello, I also have seriously high Lipoprotein (a) levels but I had no idea

this was making my candida worse...how so? Did he explain this? I have

terrible candida and can't seem to get rid of it. Also, which part of that

protocol will help with the Lp (a)...the proline and the Lysine? Thanks, karen

[Guest guest]

> I hear what you're saying Mike, the theory sounds good, but I have

yet to

> hear of a person with thick blood who has high blood pressure. We

all

> seem to have low bp. Mine has improved since I have been on

heparin.

>

> Cindi

>

Mike/Cindi

Cheney makes mention in his protocol/discussion at the Dallas/Fort

Worth CFS/FM website of people with high blood pressure who have

orthostatic intolerance (also known as NMH). Orthostatic intolerance

is the result presumedly of thick blood and low blood VOLUME. I have

3 abnormal Hemex parameters (Fibrin/Fibrinogen being one of them),

and I have HIGH blood pressure. I take Lotrel morning and night, but

that doesn't get my blood pressure down to desirable a level. But,

when I am upright, my blood pressure drops, and I get light-headed,

dizzy, mentally addled, and nauseated. Lovenox and Gookinaid have

helped.

H.