Re: Call a scam a scam - an Immunotec story (LONG)

[Guest guest]

> Dear

>

> You wrote, " Dude closes his practice. Why - not enought people can fork out

> $12K? Screw that - L.A. is loaded with homeopaths anyway. If I was going

> back to NY, I'd see Dr. Mazlen. "

>

> I love what you wrote! I love your attitude! I really resent these scam

> artists.

>

> Sue B.

> upstate New York

Thank you, Sue, (or not) for getting me started. Speaking of people trying to

" milk " us...

A gal on the Guai List inquired about my choice of whey. (Note; CFS gave me a

dairy allergy, so I'm not sure whether my reaction was die-off-overkill or an

allergic one. So I don't quite know where I'm headed yet with whey.)

One can read about the different wheys starting at

http://pages.cthome.net/xx/guait.htm. I chose Immunocal because

1) It was the original in Cheney's study, and has a new CFS study with Dr.

Mazlen that's should be substantially larger. I had also heard, I forget

where, that Cheney was starting to back off from ImmunePro because it was

simply too powerful for some to stick with, and his experience with IMUplus was

limited.

2) Thanks to someone on this list, I found a cheap source. However, Immunotec

has done us a good-business favor and markedly reduced their price anyway, and

the cost difference may be negligible. Read on, though.

3) It also appeared to me that ImmunePro was " adding stuff. " However, now that

I've got the Physician's Desk Reference info on Immunocal (IMUplus is in there

too), ImmunePro and Immunocal seem very similar; the former lists alpha

lactabulmin while the other has " IgGs, " but otherwise, 'same basic deal if

you're not a chemist with the actual formulas.

Now - The Curd (This might make you wonder about Cheney, Mazlen, or any of the

" experts. " )

After those 10g of Immunocal sent my brain to Mars - twice - I decided, since

I'm looking for a new M.D, to see if I could find one locally who was using

Immunocal, and could tell perhaps with more certainty what my reaction was

from, and if allergic, what might be done about it. (Similarly, I've called

certain labs to see which doctors use them.)

Well, the multi-level-marketers in Montreal were not set up for such an

inquiry. Their customer service did kindly refer me to Dr. Bounous, their R & D

lead, who called back and was very nice in explaining whatever he could without

being my doctor. (He'd talked to me before about his company's wasting study

with cancer patients, another reason I went with them. It speaks very highly

of HIM.) They also said they'd refer one of their CA distributors to me. I

said, fair enough.

I was called by Salesman X, who claimed to be " pretty much it " for the most

populous state in this country, though he sold nation-wide. (I'm being

benevelont here, because near Salesman X they sacrifice goats in woods. That

said, if you dig far enough into Immunotec's web site, it lists Salesman X as a

2000 " Market Leader " - along with two others in the state.) He claimed to know

my area (we're within 30 minutes of eachother, so like that mattered), because

he worked at several local hospitals (I don't recall him saying doing what),

and to do all but sleep with Dr. Bounous and the corporate big-wigs in Canada.

Dealing with the " health side as well as the sales side, " he offered his own

opinion of what to do - back off on the dose, if your not lactose-intolerant

you should be fine, yadda-yadda.

OK - fine. 10 minutes into the conversation, I felt I'd better be up front:

Dude, I know you'd rather be selling, but I've already got 1.2 kilos of powder,

and right now I'd be more comfy with a doctor's advice, which is why you were

asked to call me. He wanted my source - then told me that Green Bros. Pharmacy

(in Stockton, CA) got their hands slapped for underselling Immunocal while

trying to offload an over-shipment from New York. (New York? Confusing, but

this would explain why their price just went up from $40-something per box.)

The official going price was now $59.40 under certain discount conditions

(year's supply, etc.). And oh, he said he didn't want us to be just " spinning

wheels " here.

Fine. Dude, I don't care who I get the stuff from in the future, if I'm still

hooked, but right now I'm looking for a doctor. DO YOU SELL TO ONE, SAY,

WITHIN AN HOUR'S RADIUS FROM HERE? (I really wasn't calling him Dude; in fact,

having sales experience myself, I was actually being empathetically cordial.)

He got his sales partner on the line for a one-minute hi-cutie conference call,

since she supposedly had all the juicy contacts; then he referred me to her own

product web site and said she'd call back. He then proceeded to tell me

everything patients already know about CFS. He bashed the rival whey-makers

for using European cows. He bashed Dr. Cheney for using those other brands,

saying Cheney must be finally waking up to his public responsibilities, using a

safer product with studies behind it. (Yet it was Cheney's own little study

that alerted the CFS world to Immunocal.) I kindly let this guy play his game

for 30 minutes (on his dime). I even asked him about his partner's other

products: DO YOU CARRY PREGNENOLONE? " Oh, I think I saw some on her desk. "

All I came away with after a half-hour was the name of a candida-chiropractor,

the area code for one doctor in L.A., and well, that was it. His partner never

called back, and you bet I never looked up that web site.

When (if) I next take Immunocal, I'm guaranteed a cerebral reaction - thinking

not of Dr. Buonous who really knows something about AIDS, cancer, and CFS, but

of heartless corporate greed on par with any American drug company. (Read on.)

To Immunotec:

In his pitch, Salesman X actually let on to me that your company suffers from

an image problem as a multi-level-marketer. Well, I don't believe USANA as a

vitamin MLM has any comparable problem as such. Then again, they're not

necessarily " catering " to a population with mortal illnesses; you are. The

price cut is a big step in the right direction - thank you. Other suggestions:

Salesmax X personified your problem, but when one looks at your web site, it's

obvious where he's coming from. http://www.immunotec.com is 5% chemistry and

product benefits and 95% sales. That's great for you guys; for us patients,

its enough to make us vomit all our other medications. (Is that the idea?)

There's one page dedicated to how your main product works, and one simplistic

Q & A page it shares with your other goods. The rest of the site is strewn with

corporate garbage about sales tactics, payoffs and bonuses, buzzwords for those

of us left in the new century, and gala parties at company headquarters. Hey,

business is business, but this stuff royally reeks - all the way down to that

little piggy bank picture in the Winter 2000 Enterpreneur, page 2

(http://www.immunotec.com/usa/pdf/winter.pdf ).

Yet, not all in The Entrepreneur is bad, such as Immunotec's representation at

the U.S. AIDS conference, Dr. Glutman's antioxidant article, Mrs. Dion's

husband's struggle with cancer (I wish him the best, whatever he's using),

etc. There's good information there that many patients, homebound to the

internet, would rather peruse before forking out whatever bucks we have left to

telemarketers. There's even better stuff on Immunocal at Dr. Mazlen's site and

at Dallas/FW CFIDS. Why not put this positive information - current data,

promising past and future studies, etc. - up front on your own site for your

customer base, rather than omit it or bury it under marketers' material? What

a concept! Why not link to some of the studies listed on your PDR page? Heck,

why not just post your PDR product description? What are you afraid of? Do

you think someone will steal the formula? Or will we all find out too soon

(too late) that your product is just another rip-off scam? ('Word to the

public - this brain required no special mixer to get hammered off 10g.)

Your entire corporate attitude could use a transfusion. (How about one where

Salesman X recieves 1 CC of blood from one of us; we wait a couple of years,

then give him some Immunocal after his entire mind, body, family, and life have

gone through utter hell, and see how fast he recovers? Hell - I'm actually one

of the lucky ones, so far, or I wouldn't be writing this. Pardon my sudden

maliciousness, but I just met a " recovered " victim of GWI today, face-to-face,

and I wouldn't yet wish to trade places with what's left of him.)

However, you can change your corporate image rather easily, and we could all

benefit. Consult your doctors.

A Last Word...

For those still interested in Immunocal, you can e-mail the company with your

own marketing advice if you wish, then call Green Bros. at 209-948-3174 to see

what their deal is now. And if you suddenly find them no longer in the mix,

e-mail the National CFIDS Foundation (www.ncf-net.org) - they'll spread the

word on anyone screwing with us.

- N.

P.S. - Will be copied to Immunotec soon; have a look at that piggy bank first

if you'd like.