Re: Mayo Clinic Study used one tenth the dosage of Antineoplastons needed

[Guest guest]

Hey Kees; Where's your proof that this actress did all the things she was

told to do by these alternative docs.? This is a big problem in the health

industry. If some one dies of the effects of the chemo treatment, while in a

medical doctors care, It's ok because the doctors did all they could do. but

if that same person were to die under an alternative doctors care, They were

kept from proper medical care, and the alternative doctor goes under full

scrutiny by the authorities.

Kees; I wish you'd get a life.

Klaus

In a message dated 9/4/01 8:05:44 AM, redactie@... writes:

>I know now I get probably a nasty answermail again. But the last week in

>the

>Netherlands a wellknown actrice died of breastcancer because she refused

>regular treatment like chemo and surgery. She consulted all kind of

>'alternative' doctors and healthpractisers and till three months before

>she

>died. A few of them told this actrice that her kind of cancer wasn't cancer.

>When she should treat herself well with all kind of'altenative methods'

>she

>would cure soon.

>Her partner burried her last week.

[Guest guest]

Maybe this answer from Arnold, thanks for that, should warn us all that

advices for what kind of therapy or curing method in this group should only

be given by a medical specialist and doctor. I haven't answered latest

mailmessages because at all questions in this group it seems that Moonbeam

has the solution. Pity that he doesn't want to say if he is a doctor or not.

Though still I think that his contribution to this site is sometimes

valuable, he should be more clear whom he is and how he is able to give all

these advises . Where is it all based on accept the studies he copies out of

Medline and other sources at internet. And how does he make the

interpretation of all those studies. I think Moonbeam and others, also

myself should be more critical to themselves before they give all those

advices

I know now I get probably a nasty answermail again. But the last week in the

Netherlands a wellknown actrice died of breastcancer because she refused

regular treatment like chemo and surgery. She consulted all kind of

'alternative' doctors and healthpractisers and till three months before she

died. A few of them told this actrice that her kind of cancer wasn't cancer.

When she should treat herself well with all kind of'altenative methods' she

would cure soon.

Her partner burried her last week.

And one of this 'alternative' men is a doctor and wellknown here in the

Netherlands. And many people adore him. And all kind of stories about how

good he is etc. That's the reason I write this message to this group. I'm

not a doctor or medical specialist and that's why I try to be carefull in

what I tell others. What doesn't mean that we shouldn't tell our

experiences, but please lets be clear and honest about our background. For

me is the solution for curing cancer a mix of regular and alternative,

integrated treatments isn't that the right word in english.

I'm very surprised that nobody in this group reacted to my message about the

big conference in october about comprehensive cancer care. Intergrating

complementary and alternative therapies. Why not. This is the most important

conference there is in the last five years. This is so important for the

coming years. I really don't understand why in this group nobody has given

any reaction. And to be clear I'm not one of the organisers, I'm just a

Dutch person who read this at internet and got information from all kind of

wellknown doctors that this is the big conference.

Gr. Kees Braam

webmaster www.kanker-actueel.nl/index_e.html

Re: glioblastoma - Stage IV

> > >

> > >

> > > look www.bio-bac.com=20

> > > poldiv17@... wrote:=20

> > >

> > > Has anyone had experience with a glioblastoma? A co-worker of

mine

> > > has=

> > > a=20

> > > relative who was diagnosed with Stage IV brain tumor. Any advice

> > > would=

> > > be=20

> > > most welcomed.=20

> > > Thank You,=20

> > > Melinda C.=20

> > >

> > > Get HUGE info at http://www.cures for cancer.ws and post your own links

> > > there=

> > > . Unsubscribe by sending email to cures for cancer-unsubscribeegroups

or

> by

> > > = visiting http://www.bobhurt.com/subunsub.mv=20

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

Hi Moonbeam & List,

The Mayo Clinic Study you cited. deliberately used only one tenth the dosage

of antineoplastons used in Dr.butzynski's protocol. The study was originally

supposed to admit only much milder smaller tumors, they changed the criteria

in midstream. admitted much more advanced multiple nodules larger tumors

greater than the 5cm originally proposed, and refused to increase the

dosage as Dr.Burzynski had urged. Dr.Burzynski felt this trial was

unethically using patients without warning them that the manufacturer and

originator of the therapy felt it would not work and patients should have

been told that. Most patients were on the inadequate dosage for only very

short periods of time. Almost all the patients received less than 30 days of

treatment one patient only 9 days and a median of only 25 days. This was

clearly a hatchet job to discredit the therapy with the BEST statistical

results in the clinical trials conducted. It should also be noted that even

with these limitations two patients with recurrent Glioblastoma survived

for over a year in spite of an average life expectancy of 3 to 6 months.

It is very unethical, bordering on criminal conductfor a researcher to

deliberately ignore the the welfare of a patient in order to prove that the

therapy did not work!! THIS SHOULD HAVE RECEIVED INTENSE SCRUTINY IN THE

PRESS.

Arnold Gore

Consumers Health Freedom Coalition

Re: glioblastoma - Stage IV

> >

> >

> > look www.bio-bac.com=20

> > poldiv17@... wrote:=20

> >

> > Has anyone had experience with a glioblastoma? A co-worker of mine

> > has=

> > a=20

> > relative who was diagnosed with Stage IV brain tumor. Any advice

> > would=

> > be=20

> > most welcomed.=20

> > Thank You,=20

> > Melinda C.=20

> >

> > Get HUGE info at http://www.cures for cancer.ws and post your own links

> > there=

> > . Unsubscribe by sending email to cures for cancer-unsubscribeegroups or

by

> > = visiting http://www.bobhurt.com/subunsub.mv=20

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Dear Klaus,

I agree with you. Also I fight against the image that alternative doctors

aren't allowed to do anything, though it is changing, at least here in the

Netherlands. The problem with this actrice is that she refused any regular

treatment, maybe I would do the same in her circumstances, she had

breastcancer in a late stage, but the 'alternative doctor/homeopate and

acupuncturist told her clear, and he told that to some other cancerpatients

who I know personal, he told her she had no cancer. The diagnosis of the

regular doctor was in his eyes a mistake, it was just a bacteria which

showed the same behaviour as a cancercell. Beside that she went to an

alternative 'healer', I don't know how to say that he is just a man who says

he has discovered the solution for cancer with adding a lot of salt. Now I

think that a lot of people know that salt is one of the worst things you can

eat when you have cancer, at least that's all what is told in books, at

internet etc. But this man did some study with help of a wellknown

organisation in vitro. I read the report and asked two people to analyse the

report. And both people, a doctor/biologist and a man who is specilised in

statistics told me that this report/study didn't say anything. The man in

question however tells his patients that he has a report, shows that and

tell them his method is the solution. I think than you do wrong to all those

people who are so vulnerable and seeking for that small chance. I'm sorry I

cann't explain so well in english, but believe me Klaus, I believe like you

in a integrated way of treating cancer. and maybe in certain circumstances

(see the story of a woman with non-Hogdkin at my site, it is even better not

to do any regular treartment. But still I think you always should consult a

reliable doctor. . But I tell too much, I hope I'm clear.

Gr. Kees Braam

webmaster www.kanker-actueel.nl

Re: Mayo Clinic Study used one tenth the dosage of

Antineoplastons needed

> Hey Kees; Where's your proof that this actress did all the things she

was

> told to do by these alternative docs.? This is a big problem in the

health

> industry. If some one dies of the effects of the chemo treatment, while in

a

> medical doctors care, It's ok because the doctors did all they could do.

but

> if that same person were to die under an alternative doctors care, They

were

> kept from proper medical care, and the alternative doctor goes under full

> scrutiny by the authorities.

>

> Kees; I wish you'd get a life.

>

> Klaus

> In a message dated 9/4/01 8:05:44 AM, redactie@... writes:

>

> >I know now I get probably a nasty answermail again. But the last week in

> >the

> >Netherlands a wellknown actrice died of breastcancer because she refused

> >regular treatment like chemo and surgery. She consulted all kind of

> >'alternative' doctors and healthpractisers and till three months before

> >she

> >died. A few of them told this actrice that her kind of cancer wasn't

cancer.

> >When she should treat herself well with all kind of'altenative methods'

> >she

> >would cure soon.

> >Her partner burried her last week.

>

>

> Get HUGE info at http://www.cures for cancer.ws, and post your own links there.

Unsubscribe by sending email to cures for cancer-unsubscribeegroups or by

visiting http://www.bobhurt.com/subunsub.mv

>

>

[Guest guest]

<cures for cancer >

Copies to: <poldiv17@...>

From: " Arnold Gore " <arnoldgore@...>

Date sent: Tue, 4 Sep 2001 08:35:53 -0700

Send reply to: cures for cancer

Subject: Re: Mayo Clinic Study used one tenth the dosage of

Antineoplastons needed

> Hi Moonbeam & List,

> The Mayo Clinic Study you cited. deliberately used only one tenth the

> dosage of antineoplastons used in Dr.butzynski's protocol. The study was

Hi Arnold,

i had no idea about the history of this trial. The same

thing

happened with Dr Gold and the trials of Hydrazine. He turned up at the hospital

doing a

trial of Hydrazine and found that they had completely changed his protocol. He

wrote a

letter of protest saying the trials would fail because the protocol was changed;

the

trials did fail as he predicted. Yet in his own trials on 84 patients, Gold

showed

hydrazine achieved 70% subjective improvement and 17% objective improvement.

Please do not think I am being critical of antineoplastons.

moonbeam

> originally supposed to admit only much milder smaller tumors, they changed

> the criteria in midstream. admitted much more advanced multiple nodules

> larger tumors greater than the 5cm originally proposed, and refused to

> increase the dosage as Dr.Burzynski had urged. Dr.Burzynski felt this

> trial was unethically using patients without warning them that the

> manufacturer and originator of the therapy felt it would not work and

> patients should have been told that. Most patients were on the inadequate

> dosage for only very short periods of time. Almost all the patients

> received less than 30 days of treatment one patient only 9 days and a

> median of only 25 days. This was clearly a hatchet job to discredit the

> therapy with the BEST statistical results in the clinical trials

> conducted. It should also be noted that even with these limitations two

> patients with recurrent Glioblastoma survived for over a year in spite

> of an average life expectancy of 3 to 6 months. It is very unethical,

> bordering on criminal conductfor a researcher to deliberately ignore the

> the welfare of a patient in order to prove that the therapy did not work!!

> THIS SHOULD HAVE RECEIVED INTENSE SCRUTINY IN THE PRESS.

> Arnold Gore

> Consumers Health Freedom Coalition

[Guest guest]

Hello all,

What's the meaning of being so suspicious against all what is done for

research in the 'regular' world? And why not to question all what is said

about the research of the alternatives?

In both worlds there will be human beings with bad motivation, but I refuse

to believe that in the 'regular' world will be more people with a bad

motivation than in the alternative world.

Personally I believe that 90%, maybe more, of the people involved in

figthing against cancer are good willing and try to find a solution for

cancer. Maybe some people in this group call me now 'stupid', but I believe

strongly that an integrated treatment wil give the best possibilities for

conquering cancer.

To generalise a single event or happening is in my eyes a bad way of

discussion.

Gr. Kees Braam

webmaster www.kanker-actueel.nl/index_e.html

Re: Mayo Clinic Study used one tenth

> >the dosage of Antineoplastons needed

> >

> > > Hi Moonbeam & List,

> > > The Mayo Clinic Study you cited. deliberately used only one tenth the

> > > dosage of antineoplastons used in Dr.butzynski's protocol. The study

was

>

> This has been done with MANY treatments to make them fail. And if they

dont

> fail, the doctors are discredited and/or harassed into selling out or

> giving up.

> Have a read on

> Politics in Healing : The Suppression & Manipulation of American Medicine

> by Haley

> Potomac Valley Pr; ISBN: 0970115008

>

> Or any of the books on Hoxsey.

>

> Rob

> AA3 on hold(and the way out) with natural treatment.

>

>

>

> Get HUGE info at http://www.cures for cancer.ws, and post your own links there.

Unsubscribe by sending email to cures for cancer-unsubscribeegroups or by

visiting http://www.bobhurt.com/subunsub.mv

>

>

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/4/01 10:38:37 AM, redactie@... writes:

Yes Kees; But you didn't answer my question. Did this actress do what the

alt. docs. told her to do. Maybe these docs. told her this because they

felt that it would take stress off of her. (Everyone know that stress is a

deterant to acheaving health) And the the treatments that they suggested may

have been their protocol for cancer. Without knowing any of this you really

don't have any right to judge these doctors.

I'm speaking from experience. About half of the time I feel like I'm so fed

up with this stinkin BS world that i see no reason to stay. I can't remember

the last time I realy enjoyed myself. And i find it harder and harder to do

all of the protocol. Alot of the time I'm quite depressed. I work all day

trying to make enough money to keep my bills paid, and pay for my supps, and

other treatments. I don't always have enough cash flow to make ends meet. I

find it difficult to prepare foods myself, because my cancer is in my right

hand, I don't have much strength in it.

What I'm trying to say is that alot of the time i just feel like giving up.

(Does anyone know how I can get a hold of dr. Kavorkian?) And posssibly this

actress that you talk about was in the same boat as I am. So she wasn't

doing everything that she was told to do.

Maybe the docs. missread her and shouldn't have told her that it wasn't

cancer?

You leave a lot of unanswered question with this report.

>Dear Klaus,

>

>I agree with you. Also I fight against the image that alternative doctors

>aren't allowed to do anything, though it is changing, at least here in

>the

>Netherlands. The problem with this actrice is that she refused any regular

>treatment, maybe I would do the same in her circumstances, she had

>breastcancer in a late stage, but the 'alternative doctor/homeopate and

>acupuncturist told her clear, and he told that to some other cancerpatients

>who I know personal, he told her she had no cancer. The diagnosis of the

>regular doctor was in his eyes a mistake, it was just a bacteria which

>showed the same behaviour as a cancercell. Beside that she went to an

>alternative 'healer', I don't know how to say that he is just a man who

>says

>he has discovered the solution for cancer with adding a lot of salt. Now

>I

>think that a lot of people know that salt is one of the worst things you

>can

>eat when you have cancer, at least that's all what is told in books, at

>internet etc. But this man did some study with help of a wellknown

>organisation in vitro. I read the report and asked two people to analyse

>the

>report. And both people, a doctor/biologist and a man who is specilised

>in

>statistics told me that this report/study didn't say anything. The man

>in

>question however tells his patients that he has a report, shows that and

>tell them his method is the solution. I think than you do wrong to all

>those

>people who are so vulnerable and seeking for that small chance. I'm sorry

>I

>cann't explain so well in english, but believe me Klaus, I believe like

>you

>in a integrated way of treating cancer. and maybe in certain circumstances

>(see the story of a woman with non-Hogdkin at my site, it is even better

>not

>to do any regular treartment. But still I think you always should consult

>a

>reliable doctor. . But I tell too much, I hope I'm clear.

[Guest guest]

Did you try Cansema III? or Salves? Look at the pictures. A

cancer on the hand may be easily cured.

http://www.altcancer.com/cansema.htm

http://www.cancersalves.com/directory.html

The Water Diet is Free. It's the easiest way to clean out

toxins. Add Alka-Mine to the water if your body is too acid.

http://watercure2.com/

Here are support groups you can join.

http://curezone.com/diseases/support_groups.html

Cancer is caused or promoted by toxins from packaged foods,

sausageas, shampoos, cosmetics, soda/cola, etc....All these can

be easily prevented if you don't eat them or use them. Instead,

start drinking more natural raw foods, like carrot and other

vegetable juices.

http://www.living-foods.com/links.html

http://drday.com

http://hacres.com

An easy way to clean out rotten foods in your digestive track is

to take Ascorbate (Vitamin C) to just below your diarrhea

level. Then, lower it and maintain it to just below the diarrhea

level. Lack of Vitamin C causes many diseases, including

cancer. Or you can spend a lot to get a " professional cleaning. "

http://www.PrimalDefense.net

Vitamin C works synergistically with bioflavanoids which is in

the skins of citrus fruits. Use lemon or grapefruit. Cut the

tips off, and cut into pieces. Put in blender. Strain and

dilute with water. (I dilute with Alka-Mine water, and sweeten

with natural frozen concentrate, or I put this into orange juice

or other naturally sweet juice.) This is VERY EFFECTIVE and

cheap. You can grow your own lemon trees.

http://www.wwfrf.org/html/nursery.htm

Don't be discouraged. My pastor said satan comes hardest when

God has great things in mind for you to do. Once, he broke a toe

when he fell down the stairs, but he refused to cancel his prayer

walk around the city that day. Visit his site at:

http://www.wysiwygfilmworks.com

--------------------------------------------------------------------

>

>In a message dated 9/4/01 10:38:37 AM, redactie@... writes:

>Yes Kees; But you didn't answer my question. Did this actress do what the

>alt. docs. told her to do. Maybe these docs. told her this because they

>felt that it would take stress off of her. (Everyone know that stress is a

>deterant to acheaving health) And the the treatments that they suggested may

>have been their protocol for cancer. Without knowing any of this you really

>don't have any right to judge these doctors.

>

>I'm speaking from experience. About half of the time I feel like I'm so fed

>up with this stinkin BS world that i see no reason to stay. I can't remember

>the last time I realy enjoyed myself. And i find it harder and harder to do

>all of the protocol. Alot of the time I'm quite depressed. I work all day

>trying to make enough money to keep my bills paid, and pay for my supps, and

>other treatments. I don't always have enough cash flow to make ends meet. I

>find it difficult to prepare foods myself, because my cancer is in my right

>hand, I don't have much strength in it.

>

>What I'm trying to say is that alot of the time i just feel like giving up.

>(Does anyone know how I can get a hold of dr. Kavorkian?) And posssibly this

>actress that you talk about was in the same boat as I am. So she wasn't

>doing everything that she was told to do.

>Maybe the docs. missread her and shouldn't have told her that it wasn't

>cancer?

>

>You leave a lot of unanswered question with this report.

>>Dear Klaus,

>>

>>I agree with you. Also I fight against the image that alternative doctors

>>aren't allowed to do anything, though it is changing, at least here in

>>the

>>Netherlands. The problem with this actrice is that she refused any regular

>>treatment, maybe I would do the same in her circumstances, she had

>>breastcancer in a late stage, but the 'alternative doctor/homeopate and

>>acupuncturist told her clear, and he told that to some other cancerpatients

>>who I know personal, he told her she had no cancer. The diagnosis of the

>>regular doctor was in his eyes a mistake, it was just a bacteria which

>>showed the same behaviour as a cancercell. Beside that she went to an

>>alternative 'healer', I don't know how to say that he is just a man who

>>says

>>he has discovered the solution for cancer with adding a lot of salt. Now

>>I

>>think that a lot of people know that salt is one of the worst things you

>>can

>>eat when you have cancer, at least that's all what is told in books, at

>>internet etc. But this man did some study with help of a wellknown

>>organisation in vitro. I read the report and asked two people to analyse

>>the

>>report. And both people, a doctor/biologist and a man who is specilised

>>in

>>statistics told me that this report/study didn't say anything. The man

>>in

>>question however tells his patients that he has a report, shows that and

>>tell them his method is the solution. I think than you do wrong to all

>>those

>>people who are so vulnerable and seeking for that small chance. I'm sorry

>>I

>>cann't explain so well in english, but believe me Klaus, I believe like

>>you

>>in a integrated way of treating cancer. and maybe in certain circumstances

>>(see the story of a woman with non-Hogdkin at my site, it is even better

>>not

>>to do any regular treartment. But still I think you always should consult

>>a

>>reliable doctor. . But I tell too much, I hope I'm clear.

>

>

>Get HUGE info at http://www.cures for cancer.ws, and post your own links there.

Unsubscribe by sending email to cures for cancer-unsubscribeegroups or by

visiting http://www.bobhurt.com/subunsub.mv

>

>