Guest guest Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 In a message dated 16/09/2006 17:08:35 GMT Daylight Time, cindi22595@... writes: whereas alternative may just waste your money. Oh I don't know Cindi. Depends on the objective? Sort out hypoT, well no, that is not my experience of complementary medicine. BUT, having said that, I wonder if all the alt. med. I have had has not helped me emotionally and spiritually and to perhaps have stopped me from getting a lot worse. There is still a gap in the understanding in complementary medicine in the UK about the use of hormones - mind the gap! Mo HEPACTION Counselling & Healing Serviceshttp://www.hepactionuk.blogspot.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 Totally agree, Abbe. Always wise to be questioning and mindful of the flow of money. Sharon > I have no doubt there are people in the professions > that should not be there, people who are incompetent, > immoral, and dangerous. The point is, however, these > kind of people are everywhere and I have no doubt > there are just as many in alternative health care. > Maybe more since there is little if any regulation of > alternative health care. > > Personally, I trust myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 I don't think people who do their homework believe that at all. They know the alternative market is a jungle also as is conventional medicine. In fact I think the majority of people would think negatively and have more doubts about alternative medicine. LinnOn Sep 16, 2006, at 8:37 AM, Abbe wrote:I wonder why it is people seem to think only doctors,dentists, and Big Pharma could be guilty of endorsingtreatments and substances that not only do not workbut may be harmful.At least these are regulated to some degree. Thinkabout what *could* be going on in alternative healthcare.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 Probly not but for the most part alternative meds do not kill or maim on the large scale that conventional meds do. You might waste your money on something, but not lose years off your life. Gracia I don't think people who do their homework believe that at all. They know the alternative market is a jungle also as is conventional medicine. In fact I think the majority of people would think negatively and have more doubts about alternative medicine. Linn On Sep 16, 2006, at 8:37 AM, Abbe wrote: I wonder why it is people seem to think only doctors,dentists, and Big Pharma could be guilty of endorsingtreatments and substances that not only do not workbut may be harmful.At least these are regulated to some degree. Thinkabout what *could* be going on in alternative healthcare. .. No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.12.3/446 - Release Date: 9/12/2006 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 ah...the emotional/spiritual aspect..i wasn't factoring that aspect in...you are right. I don't think any alternative doc could affect me like some mainstream docs have in those areas. cindihepaction@... wrote: In a message dated 16/09/2006 17:08:35 GMT Daylight Time, cindi22595@... writes: whereas alternative may just waste your money. Oh I don't know Cindi. Depends on the objective? Sort out hypoT, well no, that is not my experience of complementary medicine. BUT, having said that, I wonder if all the alt. med. I have had has not helped me emotionally and spiritually and to perhaps have stopped me from getting a lot worse. There is still a gap in the understanding in complementary medicine in the UK about the use of hormones - mind the gap! Mo HEPACTION Counselling & Healing Serviceshttp://www.hepactionuk.blogspot.com/ __________________________________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 ya know what i can't figure out...why is mainstream medicine so totally ignorant about hormones. To me...if your endocrine system has gone wonky, all sorts of things go wonky (love that word) with your body..and they (maintstream) seem to have no grasp of this...it's just "here, take this pill" if you have a symptom....never "let's balance your hormones". venting, cindi hepaction@... wrote: In a message dated 16/09/2006 17:08:35 GMT Daylight Time, cindi22595@... writes: There is still a gap in the understanding in complementary medicine in the UK about the use of hormones - mind the gap! How low will we go? Check out Messenger’s low PC-to-Phone call rates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 I think the way Armour has been marketed is genius. It is big pharm but is trying (successfully) to maintain the anti-establishment vibe and relies on word of mouth and possibly runs websites like stopthethyroidmadness.com. Get the patient to ask for it and maybe the lazy doctor will work through the difficulties of taking it and maybe they won't. The patient switches doctors if not. Armour is made side by side with anti-depressants by Forest pharmaceuticals. " Forest Pharmaceutical, the manufacturer of Lexapro, continues to downplay the drug's dangers. " They're as dirty as the rest of them. http://www.yourlawyer.com/topics/overview/lexapro --- Cindi <cindi22595@...> wrote: > in total agreement on that...i'd also say mainstream medicine harms more whereas alternative may > just waste your money. of course mainstream does too. > cindi > > > Gracia <circe@...> wrote: > > Probly not but for the most part alternative meds do not kill or maim on the large scale > that conventional meds do. You might waste your money on something, but not lose years off your > life. > Gracia > > I don't think people who do their homework believe that at all. They know the alternative > market is a jungle also as is conventional medicine. In fact I think the majority of people > would think negatively and have more doubts about alternative medicine. > > Linn > > On Sep 16, 2006, at 8:37 AM, Abbe wrote: > > I wonder why it is people seem to think only doctors, > dentists, and Big Pharma could be guilty of endorsing > treatments and substances that not only do not work > but may be harmful. > > At least these are regulated to some degree. Think > about what *could* be going on in alternative health > care. > > > > > > . > > > > > > > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.12.3/446 - Release Date: 9/12/2006 > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Do you ? > Everyone is raving about the all-new . __________________________________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 >From: <kennio@...> >Armour is made side by side with anti-depressants by Forest >pharmaceuticals. " Forest >Pharmaceutical, the manufacturer of Lexapro, continues to downplay the >drug's dangers. " They're >as dirty as the rest of them. That doesn't make it a bad product. Skipper _________________________________________________________________ Call friends with PC-to-PC calling -- FREE http://imagine-msn.com/messenger/launch80/default.aspx?locale=en-us & source=wlmai\ ltagline Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 Sick and out of balanced peoplear called " patients " . Patients allow doctors to buy a new Mercedes, make monthy payents on their home, and send their kids to college. People who are healthy don't support doctors in the lifestyle they like to live at. So, consciously or unconsciously, doctors like people who are out of balance, sickly, and spend lots of money on doctors. The drug companies provide MOST of a doctor's information-- in Med School, from sales reps, from literature. Do docs are turned into pushers for the drug companies. Orthomolecular medicine is a branch of medicine dealing with high dose vitamins. They have a publication, the Journal of Orthomolecular Medicine. Copies were sent to PubMed so others could learn from the peer reviewed articles. But PubMed refused to index or mention the Journal of Orthomolecular Mediine in their database (http://www.doctoryourself.com/medline.htmlbulletin). So even docs who want to learn more about nutritional approaches are thwarted by PubMed's lack of indexing of important articles. Alobar On 9/16/06, Cindi <cindi22595@...> wrote: > > > > ya know what i can't figure out...why is mainstream medicine so totally ignorant about hormones. To me...if your endocrine system has gone wonky, all sorts of things go wonky (love that word) with your body..and they (maintstream) seem to have no grasp of this...it's just " here, take this pill " if you have a symptom....never " let's balance your hormones " . > venting, > > cindi > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 Not at all. I was commenting on the brilliant stealth marketing by big pharm. In fact this group could have shills for the company... hmmm. --- Skipper Beers <lsb149@...> wrote: > >From: <kennio@...> > > >Armour is made side by side with anti-depressants by Forest > >pharmaceuticals. " Forest > >Pharmaceutical, the manufacturer of Lexapro, continues to downplay the > >drug's dangers. " They're > >as dirty as the rest of them. > > That doesn't make it a bad product. > > Skipper > > _________________________________________________________________ > Call friends with PC-to-PC calling -- FREE > http://imagine-msn.com/messenger/launch80/default.aspx?locale=en-us & source=wlmai\ ltagline > > __________________________________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 No, but it does make their claims suspect. Alobar On 9/16/06, Skipper Beers <lsb149@...> wrote: > >From: <kennio@...> > > >Armour is made side by side with anti-depressants by Forest > >pharmaceuticals. " Forest > >Pharmaceutical, the manufacturer of Lexapro, continues to downplay the > >drug's dangers. " They're > >as dirty as the rest of them. > > That doesn't make it a bad product. > > Skipper > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 Has it Been marketed? I didn't think they did anything to market it at all...just took over the production of it. I remember someone telling me about Forest not knowing why sales had gone Up....and a patient had to explain to them it was "word of mouth". but forest doesn't run stopthethyroidmadness. that's purely one happy user of Armour who got together with other satisfied users and she started the site to help others. cindi <kennio@...> wrote: I think the way Armour has been marketed is genius. It is big pharm but is trying (successfully)to maintain the anti-establishment vibe and relies on word of mouth and possibly runs websiteslike stopthethyroidmadness.com. All-new - Fire up a more powerful email and get things done faster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 what claims? cindiAlobar <Alobar@...> wrote: No, but it does make their claims suspect.AlobarOn 9/16/06, Skipper Beers wrote:> >From: >> >Armour is made side by side with anti-depressants by Forest> >pharmaceuticals. "Forest> >Pharmaceutical, the manufacturer of Lexapro, continues to downplay the> >drug's dangers." They're> >as dirty as the rest of them. Talk is cheap. Use Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1¢/min. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 What stealth marketing? what are you talking about? for armour? you're obviously not a hypo patient who was miserable for over a decade on T4 only meds...and found total elimination of symptoms with all the thyroid hormones found in Armour. That tends to make for fervent testimony...and understandably so. cindi <kennio@...> wrote: Not at all. I was commenting on the brilliant stealth marketing by big pharm. In fact this groupcould have shills for the company... hmmm. --- Skipper Beers wrote:> >From: > > >Armour is made side by side with anti-depressants by Forest > >pharmaceuticals. "Forest> >Pharmaceutical, the manufacturer of Lexapro, continues to downplay the > >drug's dangers." They're> >as dirty as the rest of them.> > That doesn't make it a bad product.> > Skipper> > _________________________________________________________________> Call friends with PC-to-PC calling -- FREE > http://imagine-msn.com/messenger/launch80/default.aspx?locale=en-us & source=wlmailtagline> > __________________________________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 I distrust claims of safety and usefulness of all drugs, whether they are hormonal extacts or synthetic. Marketing gets people to want drugs. And that puts money in the maniufatureres' pockets. So I don't trust any ot them to be honest and to reveal any researech which might show safety problems for those taking their drug. Alobar On 9/16/06, Cindi <cindi22595@...> wrote: > > > > what claims? > cindi > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 I don't believe for a minute that Forest pharmaceuticals is in the dark about sales of one of their products. The point was that the apparent LACK of marketing helps Armour maintain it anti-big pharm aura.... when in fact it is big pharm. I am sure they are active on the internet with stealth promotion, that's the way things are done nowadays; products, movies, drugs, etc. Again nothing against the drug, it seems to work for most. --- Cindi <cindi22595@...> wrote: > Has it Been marketed? I didn't think they did anything to market it at all...just took over the > production of it. > I remember someone telling me about Forest not knowing why sales had gone Up....and a patient > had to explain to them it was " word of mouth " . but forest doesn't run stopthethyroidmadness. > that's purely one happy user of Armour who got together with other satisfied users and she > started the site to help others. > cindi > > <kennio@...> wrote: > I think the way Armour has been marketed is genius. It is big pharm but is trying > (successfully) > to maintain the anti-establishment vibe and relies on word of mouth and possibly runs websites > like stopthethyroidmadness.com. > > > > > --------------------------------- > All-new - Fire up a more powerful email and get things done faster. __________________________________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 In a message dated 9/16/2006 8:33:56 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, ladybugsandbees@... writes: That may be true but if you look at the track record of Synthroid it has a far worse reputation for potency inconsistencies. That was Armour's first recall EVER. It was for loss of potency after almost 3 years. That's pretty good IMHO. levothyroxine Had a voluntarily recall two weeks ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 well i totally agree that i don't trust pharmaceutical claims...i just wasn't aware Forest did any marketing at all on armour...other than to say it's a hypothyroidism treatment. I guess the safety of Armour is it has been used for over 100 years..safely and effectively. one of those old timey remedies before big pharm needed a patented product i guess. can ya tell i use Armour? :-) cindi Alobar <Alobar@...> wrote: I distrust claims of safety and usefulness of all drugs, whether theyare hormonal extacts or synthetic. Marketing gets people to wantdrugs. And that puts money in the maniufatureres' pockets. So Idon't trust any ot them to be honest and to reveal any researech whichmight show safety problems for those taking their drug.AlobarOn 9/16/06, Cindi wrote:>>>> what claims?> cindi>>Iodine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 Calm yourself. Armour is made by BIG PHARM. Big pharm promotes their products one way or the other. I am not commenting on it's efficacy. Where exactly are you getting the impression that I am saying Armour doesn't work?? Read the my posts. --- Cindi <cindi22595@...> wrote: > What stealth marketing? what are you talking about? for armour? you're obviously not a hypo > patient who was miserable for over a decade on T4 only meds...and found total elimination of > symptoms with all the thyroid hormones found in Armour. That tends to make for fervent > testimony...and understandably so. > cindi > > > <kennio@...> wrote: > Not at all. I was commenting on the brilliant stealth marketing by big pharm. In fact this > group > could have shills for the company... hmmm. > > --- Skipper Beers wrote: > > > >From: > > > > >Armour is made side by side with anti-depressants by Forest > > >pharmaceuticals. " Forest > > >Pharmaceutical, the manufacturer of Lexapro, continues to downplay the > > >drug's dangers. " They're > > >as dirty as the rest of them. > > > > That doesn't make it a bad product. > > > > Skipper > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > Call friends with PC-to-PC calling -- FREE > > http://imagine-msn.com/messenger/launch80/default.aspx?locale=en-us & source=wlmai\ ltagline > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 I think you're totally wrong...but you'd probably have to listen to all the satisfied users I have who changed from a T4 med to Armour - to change your mind. But there's no denying it was in use long before big pharma started trying to make profits from patented drugs. I tell ya...I wish Forest WAS into stealth promotion...because there are sure a lot of women out there who need to hear about it...but i've never run across anything like you're talking about. just happy armour users. I'd lie, cheat, and steal to keep my armour...and ordinarily, i'm an honest woman. ok...stepping off armour soapbox, cindi <kennio@...> wrote: I don't believe for a minute that Forest pharmaceuticals is in the dark about sales of one oftheir products. The point was that the apparent LACK of marketing helps Armour maintain itanti-big pharm aura.... when in fact it is big pharm. I am sure they are active on the internetwith stealth promotion, that's the way things are done nowadays; products, movies, drugs, etc. Messenger with Voice. Make PC-to-Phone Calls to the US (and 30+ countries) for 2¢/min or less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 Hi cindi,I like the word wonky too. That was all I heard for 2 years " take a pill " until I came back with some wacked out blood work.Because I hadn't gained any weight yet nobody looked into anything but depression. LOL Debbie In iodine , Alobar <Alobar@...> wrote: > > Sick and out of balanced peoplear called " patients " . Patients allow > doctors to buy a new Mercedes, make monthy payents on their home, and > send their kids to college. > > People who are healthy don't support doctors in the lifestyle they > like to live at. > > So, consciously or unconsciously, doctors like people who are out of > balance, sickly, and spend lots of money on doctors. > > The drug companies provide MOST of a doctor's information-- in Med > School, from sales reps, from literature. Do docs are turned into > pushers for the drug companies. > > Orthomolecular medicine is a branch of medicine dealing with high dose > vitamins. They have a publication, the Journal of Orthomolecular > Medicine. Copies were sent to PubMed so others could learn from the > peer reviewed articles. But PubMed refused to index or mention the > Journal of Orthomolecular Mediine in their database > (http://www.doctoryourself.com/medline.htmlbulletin). So even docs who > want to learn more about nutritional approaches are thwarted by > PubMed's lack of indexing of important articles. > > Alobar > > > > On 9/16/06, Cindi <cindi22595@...> wrote: > > > > > > > > ya know what i can't figure out...why is mainstream medicine so totally ignorant about hormones. To me...if your endocrine system has gone wonky, all sorts of things go wonky (love that word) with your body..and they (maintstream) seem to have no grasp of this...it's just " here, take this pill " if you have a symptom....never " let's balance your hormones " . > > venting, > > > > cindi > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 Armour may relieve symptoms but it in now way promotes healing. May be eeded by some. But geting one's body to make its own hormones is, imo, far superior, if that is possible. If docs have desrtroyed one's thyroid or removed it, there probably no other choices. But of one still has a thyroid, even if it is not functioning at a high level, it may be worth the effort to try to get it working properly rather than taking Armour. Alobar On 9/16/06, Cindi <cindi22595@...> wrote: > > > > I think you're totally wrong...but you'd probably have to listen to all the satisfied users I have who changed from a T4 med to Armour - to change your mind. > But there's no denying it was in use long before big pharma started trying to make profits from patented drugs. > I tell ya...I wish Forest WAS into stealth promotion...because there are sure a lot of women out there who need to hear about it...but i've never run across anything like you're talking about. just happy armour users. I'd lie, cheat, and steal to keep my armour...and ordinarily, i'm an honest woman. > ok...stepping off armour soapbox, > > cindi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 I'm all calm...pretty mellow actually. but Armour gets enough of a bad rep from the pharm. reps when they talk to docs ...so those of us who use it are fairly protective of it. and we users of it wish Forest Would promote it...but it's not a very profitable product I wouldn't think. cindi <kennio@...> wrote: Calm yourself. Armour is made by BIG PHARM. Big pharm promotes their products one way or theother. I am not commenting on it's efficacy. All-new - Fire up a more powerful email and get things done faster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 no disagreement...but one problem with us Hashi's folks is so many of get diagnosed after a decade or two of symtoms...and the fibrous infiltration of the gland...or outright gland atrophy from the disease....doesn't leave us much option other than supplement missing hormone. but true, endocrine replacement is Never as good as the body doing it. But at age 50, trying to undo the damage ASAP to my body from not enough thyroid hormone for 15 years or so seemed to take priority for me. cindi Alobar <Alobar@...> wrote: Armour may relieve symptoms but it in now way promotes healing. Maybe eeded by some. But geting one's body to make its own hormones is,imo, far superior, if that is possible. If docs have desrtroyedone's thyroid or removed it, there probably no other choices. But ofone still has a thyroid, even if it is not functioning at a highlevel, it may be worth the effort to try to get it working properlyrather than taking Armour. Get your own web address for just $1.99/1st yr. We'll help. Small Business. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 I messed up my body's ability to handle carbs thru a lifetime of bad diet. I only began to use supplements to revitalize my pancreas and change my diet to assist my cells to become less insulin resistent when I was 56. Now, at 61, I can see that I am making progress. It took decades to get into bad shape, so I should not expect to reverse the problem in a few months. Everyone is different. For some, it may not be possible to revitalize the thyroid, so Armour may be the way to go. I just like to remind folks that while Armour may be better than artificial Thyroid hormone, not needing to take any hormones seems to me to be far better, if possible. Alobar On 9/16/06, Cindi <cindi22595@...> wrote: > > > > no disagreement...but one problem with us Hashi's folks is so many of get diagnosed after a decade or two of symtoms...and the fibrous infiltration of the gland...or outright gland atrophy from the disease....doesn't leave us much option other than supplement missing hormone. but true, endocrine replacement is Never as good as the body doing it. But at age 50, trying to undo the damage ASAP to my body from not enough thyroid hormone for 15 years or so seemed to take priority for me. > > cindi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.