Re: iodine and water retention

[Guest guest]

>

Hi Olif

I didn't make the connection until i read your post, but i've been on

iodoral about two weeks, 50mg for one. I have noticed i've gone up a

couple of pounds in weight, could just be coincidence though.

> I have been retaining water, since I started supplementing with

Lugol's. My ring is tight in the evening, throughout the night, and

in the morning. I am also noticing my jeans getting tighter. :-( Has

anyone else noticed this, and what is the explanation? It doesn't

seem to correspond with my cycle either.

>

> Thanks,

> Olif

>

[Guest guest]

Years ago when I was on Synthroid this happened to me, and never

went away. Most of the retention was in my ankles and face.

I Was on it for a few years and then switched to Armour. The

Armour helped me to not feel so cold, but that's about the only

good thing I feel it did. Recently I started iodine supplementation,

and had been off the Armour completely for around six weeks.

The swelling (edema) was greatly reduced. The skin on my ankles

was actually "shiny" because its stretched so tight. For the last

three days though it has been so cold here in Colorado that I just

can't warm up, and had taken some Armour to see if it would help

and the retention is back. I feel like someone poured cement down

my throat. Really heavy feeling.

[Guest guest]

Hi AG,

I never had this symptoms before either, except occasionally around my period. I am not on thyroid hormones and I salt my foods using Real Salt, but I have not tried making sure I get a certain amount of salt daily.

It is really strange. I can feel my hands get tight in the evening. My rings are very tight on my fingers, and I wake up this way in the morning. After I have been up for a while, it is gone but returns every evening. I have never had anything like this before.

Maybe I should cut back on the Lugol's? I am taking 4 drops- 25 mg- for 5-6 weeks now. I tried cutting back once, but I got awful fatigue again. Then I realized that somewhere around that time, I drank some chocolate almond milk that had cane sugar in it (I have an IgG "allergy" to cane sugar). That could have caused the fatigue instead of lowering the Lugol's. I will have to experiment again. Maybe I should gradually cut down though, like 3 drops for a while, then 2 drops. When I started, I started with 4 drops right away- oops! I did have hot hands and face at times, but this subsided. The water retention hasn't though...

Thanks,

Olif

[Guest guest]

why not take 8 drops of Lugols? I think it's the most beneficial dose, but you might need thyroid meds too.

Gracia

Hi AG,

I never had this symptoms before either, except occasionally around my period. I am not on thyroid hormones and I salt my foods using Real Salt, but I have not tried making sure I get a certain amount of salt daily.

It is really strange. I can feel my hands get tight in the evening. My rings are very tight on my fingers, and I wake up this way in the morning. After I have been up for a while, it is gone but returns every evening. I have never had anything like this before.

Maybe I should cut back on the Lugol's? I am taking 4 drops- 25 mg- for 5-6 weeks now. I tried cutting back once, but I got awful fatigue again. Then I realized that somewhere around that time, I drank some chocolate almond milk that had cane sugar in it (I have an IgG "allergy" to cane sugar). That could have caused the fatigue instead of lowering the Lugol's. I will have to experiment again. Maybe I should gradually cut down though, like 3 drops for a while, then 2 drops. When I started, I started with 4 drops right away- oops! I did have hot hands and face at times, but this subsided. The water retention hasn't though...

Thanks,

Olif

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[Guest guest]

"why not take 8 drops of Lugols?"

Honestly I am totally confused how I should be finding the right dose of iodine for me. I didn't start slowly, for one, which was probably a mistake. I am having weird symptoms right now, like feeling hot in the face and hands but body temp is still only 97.9 (not constant, just different times throughout the day). This water retention is weird too.

Other than that, my energy has increased. Since my fatigue is so bad usually, right now I will take water retention and hot face/hands over fatigue any day! I am just really confused about what this means.

I am also dealing with metal toxicity and am getting my amalgams replaced at the end of the month. I am hoping this will help, but I really want to get my iodine dosage figured out before then or I am going to have so many changes going on, I won't know what is causing what. I should probably just get an iodine loading test done, but all of this costs money and getting my fillings replaced is top priority right now.

Thanks,

Olif

[Guest guest]

you will get annoying symptoms when you give your body less than it needs. how else can it communicate to you? you might get lots of relief from 50mg Iodoral and then find the right dose of Armour.

Gracia.

Olif: This is an interesting post to me. I just posted a question concerning this on the thyroid board. I'm on 12.5 mg Iodoral, 5 1/2 grains armour. I began them both around the same time. I also have developed a water retention issue. Sometimes worse than other times. In an effort to isolate the villain here I cut out my celtic sea salt that I had upped to 3/4 t a day. I'm taking this along with 6 gms of Vit C a day. It's a bit too early to say for sure, but I already note a lessening here. Am very interested to hear what others might have to say on this. On the thyroid board I was told it might mean a need to up armour as this might be a hypoT symptom, yet I never had this as a symptom BEFORE Iodoral and armour.AG

Fri Feb 2, 2007 7:21 am (PST)I have been retaining water, since I started supplementing with Lugol's. My ring is tight in the evening, throughout the night, and in the morning. I am also noticing my jeans getting tighter. :-( Has anyone else noticed this, and what is the explanation? It doesn't seem to correspond with my cycle either.

Thanks,

Olif

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[Guest guest]

you might also get annoying symptoms when you give your body More than

it needs.

cindi

>

>

> you will get annoying symptoms when you give your body less than it

needs. how else can it communicate to you? you might get lots of

relief from 50mg Iodoral and then find the right dose of Armour.

> Gracia.

>

[Guest guest]

"you will get annoying symptoms when you give your body less than it needs. how else can it communicate to you? you might get lots of relief from 50mg Iodoral and then find the right dose of Armour."

But then why didn't I get those annoying symptoms when I was giving my body virtually zero iodine? These symptoms are new since supplementing with iodine.

If I go up to 50 mg, how do I do it? Should I increase by one drop a week until I get there, or what? If I am already getting some symptoms, what do I look for while I am increasing?

Thanks,

Olif

[Guest guest]

>

Olif,

I went up to 50mg quite quickly, in about a week, and actually feel

better on the higher dose.

You could try it for a few days and see how you feel, you can always

cut back down.

I'm sure someone said you get sneezes and runny nose if you are

getting too much. You will never know unless you try the higher dose

if you will feel better on it. Obviously it is up to you, and i was

a bit dubious when Gracia gave me the same advice, but i'm glad i did

increase it.

> " you will get annoying symptoms when you give your body less than

it needs. how else can it communicate to you? you might get lots

of relief from 50mg Iodoral and then find the right dose of Armour. "

>

> But then why didn't I get those annoying symptoms when I was giving

my body virtually zero iodine? These symptoms are new since

supplementing with iodine.

>

> If I go up to 50 mg, how do I do it? Should I increase by one drop

a week until I get there, or what? If I am already getting some

symptoms, what do I look for while I am increasing?

>

> Thanks,

> Olif

>

[Guest guest]

>

Olif,

I went up to 50mg quite quickly, in about a week, and actually feel

better on the higher dose.

You could try it for a few days and see how you feel, you can always

cut back down.

I'm sure someone said you get sneezes and runny nose if you are

getting too much. You will never know unless you try the higher dose

if you will feel better on it. Obviously it is up to you, and i was

a bit dubious when Gracia gave me the same advice, but i'm glad i did

increase it.

> " you will get annoying symptoms when you give your body less than

it needs. how else can it communicate to you? you might get lots

of relief from 50mg Iodoral and then find the right dose of Armour. "

>

> But then why didn't I get those annoying symptoms when I was giving

my body virtually zero iodine? These symptoms are new since

supplementing with iodine.

>

> If I go up to 50 mg, how do I do it? Should I increase by one drop

a week until I get there, or what? If I am already getting some

symptoms, what do I look for while I am increasing?

>

> Thanks,

> Olif

>

[Guest guest]

cindi, how did you feel on lower dose Iodine as compared to higher dose? And

how long did it take you to get up to the higher dose?

--- cindi22595 <cindi22595@...> wrote:

> you might also get annoying symptoms when you give your body More than

> it needs.

> cindi

>

>

> >

> >

> > you will get annoying symptoms when you give your body less than it

> needs. how else can it communicate to you? you might get lots of

> relief from 50mg Iodoral and then find the right dose of Armour.

> > Gracia.

> >

>

>

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[Guest guest]

No iodine for me.

I feel ill within 2-3 days of supplementing any iodine.

in fact I tried it again just recently with Lugol's...and no thank

you...never again.

I react like shoman has described...and CarolWillis here also

has the same negative iodine reaction.

Of course this is no surprise given the medical literature about

possible adverse reaction to iodine for hashimoto's folks.

But interestingly, I have none of the symptoms that folks talk about

here that have been relieved with iodine. i sleep great...have good

energy...and have no brain fog, etc.

Cindi

>

> > you might also get annoying symptoms when you give your body

More than

> > it needs.

[Guest guest]

"I went up to 50mg quite quickly, in about a week, and actually feel better on the higher dose.You could try it for a few days and see how you feel, you can always cut back down."

Well, I have been on 4 drops for a while now, so I am sure I could tell if I was improving or getting worse on a higher dose. I also like experimenting. :-) I will try adding a few more drops today and do 8 drops a day until I notice any changes, good or bad.

-Olif

[Guest guest]

>

Well I'm far enough along in " doing stuff " to cut out one thing at a

time.... so out went the celtic sea salt in water that I mentioned to

you about a week ago and I have yet to have another episode of edema.

Lower legs, ankles and feet are normal. The description you tell of

late afternoon swelling, waking with morning swelling, was the same for

me exactly! I found it very alarming to wake up with swollen feet. I

started the celtic salt after the Iodoral/armour so it might have been

the salt all along. Time will tell. Maybe the iodoral does something

with the salt/potassium ratio. I was unable to tolerate more than 1

and 1/2 Iodoral. It blocked my estrogen waking me at night with

sweats. I am below side effects dose now.

I'll let you know if this edema stays gone.

AG

> Hi AG,

>

> I never had this symptoms before either, except occasionally around

> my period. I am not on thyroid hormones and I salt my foods using Real

> Salt, but I have not tried making sure I get a certain amount of salt

> daily.

>

> It is really strange. I can feel my hands get tight in the evening.

> My rings are very tight on my fingers, and I wake up this way in the

> morning. After I have been up for a while, it is gone but returns

> every evening. I have never had anything like this before.

>

> Maybe I should cut back on the Lugol's? I am taking 4 drops- 25 mg-

> for 5-6 weeks now. I tried cutting back once, but I got awful fatigue

> again. Then I realized that somewhere around that time, I drank some

> chocolate almond milk that had cane sugar in it (I have an IgG

> " allergy " to cane sugar). That could have caused the fatigue instead

> of lowering the Lugol's. I will have to experiment again. Maybe I

> should gradually cut down though, like 3 drops for a while, then 2

> drops. When I started, I started with 4 drops right away- oops! I did

> have hot hands and face at times, but this subsided. The water

> retention hasn't though...

>

> Thanks,

> Olif

>

growhair/

[Guest guest]

>

April.... any idea why the armour would do this? I have read that a

symptom of hypoT is edema. Do you think this could be an allergic

reaction of some sort to the armour? I just don't get it!

AG

> Sat Feb 3, 2007 6:24 am (PST)

> Years ago when I was on Synthroid this happened to me, and never

> went away. Most of the retention was in my ankles and face.

> I Was on it for a few years and then switched to Armour. The

> Armour helped me to not feel so cold, but that's about the only

> good thing I feel it did. Recently I started iodine supplementation,

> and had been off the Armour completely for around six weeks.

> The swelling (edema) was greatly reduced. The skin on my ankles

> was actually " shiny " because its stretched so tight. For the last

> three days though it has been so cold here in Colorado that I just

> can't warm up, and had taken some Armour to see if it would help

> and the retention is back. I feel like someone poured cement down

> my throat. Really heavy feeling.

growhair/

[Guest guest]

What are your symtoms, with the iodine? I am taking 1 iodoral and

having stomach ache from it...I was ok with 2 drps of lugols, but

wondering what your symtoms being you have Hashi's?

Thanks,

> >

> > > you might also get annoying symptoms when you give your body

> More than

> > > it needs.

>

[Guest guest]

shoman's description of her reaction accurately describes my

reaction...only last time I tried Lugol's, i didn't notice the

goiter, but then my gland is atrophic now:

But the several times I have tried iodine or kelp supplementation

in any form -- beyond the very small amounts of iodine contained in

some supplements -- I have had what I call an " iodine crash. "

Within a day, I noticed my thyroid enlarging slightly (goiter), and

feeling tender. Within three days, I became exhausted and achy all

over my body.

Cindi

>

> What are your symtoms, with the iodine? I am taking 1 iodoral and

> having stomach ache from it...I was ok with 2 drps of lugols, but

> wondering what your symtoms being you have Hashi's?

[Guest guest]

We all experienced that as detox symptoms... passes quickly. Certainly

understandable if it scares you.

--- cindi22595 <cindi22595@...> wrote:

> shoman's description of her reaction accurately describes my

> reaction...only last time I tried Lugol's, i didn't notice the

> goiter, but then my gland is atrophic now:

>

> But the several times I have tried iodine or kelp supplementation

> in any form -- beyond the very small amounts of iodine contained in

> some supplements -- I have had what I call an " iodine crash. "

>

> Within a day, I noticed my thyroid enlarging slightly (goiter), and

> feeling tender. Within three days, I became exhausted and achy all

> over my body.

>

> Cindi

>

>

>

> >

> > What are your symtoms, with the iodine? I am taking 1 iodoral and

> > having stomach ache from it...I was ok with 2 drps of lugols, but

> > wondering what your symtoms being you have Hashi's?

>

>

________________________________________________________________________________\

____

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[Guest guest]

you folks who don't get that Hashi's folks can have a negative

reaction to iodine and feel quite sick...and realize one would have

to be a fool to keep taking something that makes you that ill (and

especially when you were very well before trying the iodine)...and

you folks who refuse to acknowledge that the medical literature

clearly shows iodine can aggravate Hashimoto's...well that type of

mentality just amazes me.

It's also dangerous imo because I've had several folks

from " thyroid " group who have written me who were so sick from the

zealously pushed 50 mg. iodine one size fit all protocol...and

couldn't understand why...and are amazed to learn that it is the

iodine making them ill. All it takes is letting them know that some

Hashi's folks have problems with it. Once they stop it, they get

better within days. I suppose you would tell them to stick with

it.

Me, I listen to my body. And use common sense.

cindi

> > >

> > > What are your symtoms, with the iodine? I am taking 1 iodoral

and

> > > having stomach ache from it...I was ok with 2 drps of lugols,

but

> > > wondering what your symtoms being you have Hashi's?

> >

> >

>

>

>

>

>

_____________________________________________________________________

_______________

> Any questions? Get answers on any topic at www.Answers..

Try it now.

>

[Guest guest]

hi Olif

I didn't start Iodoral slowly. Within a few days I was taking 25mg 2X a day. I never did the testing but I immediately knew that I needed 50mg/day. This is the recommended loading dose to saturate tissues. This works. Really.

Gracia

"why not take 8 drops of Lugols?"

Honestly I am totally confused how I should be finding the right dose of iodine for me. I didn't start slowly, for one, which was probably a mistake. I am having weird symptoms right now, like feeling hot in the face and hands but body temp is still only 97.9 (not constant, just different times throughout the day). This water retention is weird too.

Other than that, my energy has increased. Since my fatigue is so bad usually, right now I will take water retention and hot face/hands over fatigue any day! I am just really confused about what this means.

I am also dealing with metal toxicity and am getting my amalgams replaced at the end of the month. I am hoping this will help, but I really want to get my iodine dosage figured out before then or I am going to have so many changes going on, I won't know what is causing what. I should probably just get an iodine loading test done, but all of this costs money and getting my fillings replaced is top priority right now.

Thanks,

Olif

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[Guest guest]

What YOU don't get is that some of us Hashi folks have experienced the tender

thyroid, the fatigue and the achy muscles and stuck with it. It passed as the

literature said it would. Now I know that bothers you for some reason, but I

certainly hope you are not telling me to keep my experience or opinion to

myself, after all this is an Iodine forum. People come here to be advised on

how to take iodine and what to expect.

While I think it admirable that you have appointed yourself a hashi

spokesperson but as someone who has only taken iodine for 3 days and having

virtually no experience with Orthoiodosupplementation you seem least qualified

to advise others in this matter, IMO.

Iodine is clearly not for everyone, that is obvious. Everyone megadosing

iodine needs to do some due diligence and research to assess the risks. If a

year ago I had mistaken you for someone knowledgeable on iodine supplementing I

might have given up immediately as you yourself did.

As for your reliance on mainstream medical literature when it concerns

iodine... it funny how mainstream goes out the window when you are posting in

other forums. Like the `TSH near 0' concept you promote around the internet

and the various outlier concepts you espouse. Therefore, I think it is

hilarious when you point to both mainstream medical literature AND Shomon

to back up your argument against Iodine.

Iodine antagonists: fluoride, bromine, cindi, etc.

--- cindi22595 <cindi22595@...> wrote:

> you folks who don't get that Hashi's folks can have a negative

> reaction to iodine and feel quite sick...and realize one would have

> to be a fool to keep taking something that makes you that ill (and

> especially when you were very well before trying the iodine)...and

> you folks who refuse to acknowledge that the medical literature

> clearly shows iodine can aggravate Hashimoto's...well that type of

> mentality just amazes me.

>

> It's also dangerous imo because I've had several folks

> from " thyroid " group who have written me who were so sick from the

> zealously pushed 50 mg. iodine one size fit all protocol...and

> couldn't understand why...and are amazed to learn that it is the

> iodine making them ill. All it takes is letting them know that some

> Hashi's folks have problems with it. Once they stop it, they get

> better within days. I suppose you would tell them to stick with

> it.

>

> Me, I listen to my body. And use common sense.

> cindi

>

>

>

> > > >

> > > > What are your symtoms, with the iodine? I am taking 1 iodoral

> and

> > > > having stomach ache from it...I was ok with 2 drps of lugols,

> but

> > > > wondering what your symtoms being you have Hashi's?

> > >

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> _____________________________________________________________________

> _______________

> > Any questions? Get answers on any topic at www.Answers..

> Try it now.

> >

>

>

>

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[Guest guest]

I was just thinking tonight that I find the misinformation about iodine far more dangerous than iodine. It seems to be at the level that cortef was a few years ago.

I have had LOTS of symptoms taking 50mg/day Iodoral but it sure hasn't been b/c I don't need it.

Gracia

What YOU don't get is that some of us Hashi folks have experienced the tenderthyroid, the fatigue and the achy muscles and stuck with it. It passed as theliterature said it would. Now I know that bothers you for some reason, but Icertainly hope you are not telling me to keep my experience or opinion tomyself, after all this is an Iodine forum. People come here to be advised onhow to take iodine and what to expect. While I think it admirable that you have appointed yourself a hashispokesperson but as someone who has only taken iodine for 3 days and havingvirtually no experience with Orthoiodosupplementation you seem least qualifiedto advise others in this matter, IMO. Iodine is clearly not for everyone, that is obvious. Everyone megadosingiodine needs to do some due diligence and research to assess the risks. If ayear ago I had mistaken you for someone knowledgeable on iodine supplementing Imight have given up immediately as you yourself did.As for your reliance on mainstream medical literature when it concernsiodine... it funny how mainstream goes out the window when you are posting inother forums. Like the `TSH near 0' concept you promote around the internetand the various outlier concepts you espouse. Therefore, I think it ishilarious when you point to both mainstream medical literature AND Shomonto back up your argument against Iodine.Iodine antagonists: fluoride, bromine, cindi, etc.

..

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[Guest guest]

"I never did the testing but I immediately knew that I needed 50mg/day."

Thanks Gracia. How did you know you needed 50mg? I took 50mg yesterday in 2 divided doses. I don't notice anything good or bad today, so I will continue with 50 mg. I would get anxiety and really hot from 2 drops, but that subsided within a couple weeks, except I get a little warm now and this water retention- still beats fatigue!

Will this water retention eventually go away? It is really strange. I will ask my ND about it, but I don't see her until March. BTW, she didn't even blink an eye when I told her I was doing 25 mg Lugol's. She is really awesome and open-minded! :-) She has heard Dr. Brownstein speak, so she was familiar with his work, but hopefully she will become more familiar with it and incorporate it in her office.

My 11 year old daughter (weighs about 100 pounds, and is 5' 4") has been doing 4 drops of Lugol's. At 2 drops, nothing was happening. Now at 4 drops, it appears that her temps are rising. We need to keep an eye on it. If she is in puberty but not menstruating yet, do/should her temps fluctuate throughout the month? I can only find info relating to menstruating women and menopausal women, not pre teens in puberty. :-)

Thanks,

Olif

[Guest guest]

As with any supplement, or medication etc....dosing and usage recommendations

always have the presupposition of "normal" blood chemistry. Those persons

with Hashis or any other illness or deficiency are not going to have normal

chemistry to start with, so I think it's just a given that some people will not

be able to tolerate the same amount if any at all of something someone else

can.

I also believe that once a person has adapted to a chemical situation that

is occuring in their body, it is very difficult to reverse it, even when ideal

conditions and alternatives are presented.

[Guest guest]

First of all, I have not appointed myself a Hashi's spokesperson.

I am only one Hashi's patient and have just my story. I am one who

has recovered from over 15 years of undiagnosed hypothyroidism. My

condition was severe. But with Armour and time, I have recovered

exceedingly well. To tell the truth, I consider the fact that I am

still alive a miracle. Doctors did not help me accomplish that

miracle. My research and sharing with other thyroid patients and my

common sense is what has enabled me to become a fully functioning

human being again. Iodine played no part in my miraculous recovery.

So I know one does not have to have iodine to recover from severe

Hashimoto's/hypothyroidism.

Having realized that doctors would have kept me sick (and probably

killed me off), I do not accept anything any doctor says without

careful consideration. And I have studied Browntein's Iodine book

as well as all the available literature on the subject. I was

interested. And what I find most often is that folks don't even

follow what the iodine docs have said. Repeatedly, I have had to

quote for folks the actual dosing information that they give.

Repeatedly I have had to remind folks that it is advised iodine

dosing be done under a doctor's care. I could go on and on. But I

think the saddest thing is that you discount my experience. Because

I'm one who is not afraid to speak up and share that iodine

supplementation is not for me. I believe Carol here has done that

too. But I also know others who have had a negative mega-dosing

iodine experience who have written to me that they are afraid of

sharing their story because of being beat down (or just told to take

more!)

So this is simple to me, . Bottom line, iodine supplementation

makes me feel sick. It makes others feel sick. We see no reason to

take something that makes us sick. In fact that sounds downright

stupid to me. I also have no conditions whatsoever that would

indicate I have any iodine deficiency. I am healthy. I am happy.

And I keep wondering why folks get mad and belligerent when i tell

my experience.

If you are unwell...and iodine is making you well...I'm happy for

you.

As for using the term " TSH near 0 " , you are mistaking me for someone

else. I have used the term " suppressive TSH therapy " and said that

an 80s edition of Werners and Ingbar lists that as a Hashi's

treatment. But I always speak about optimization of Free levels and

elimination of hypo symptoms as goals of treatment.

Cindi

> > > > >

> > > > > What are your symtoms, with the iodine? I am taking 1

iodoral

> > and

> > > > > having stomach ache from it...I was ok with 2 drps of

lugols,

> > but

> > > > > wondering what your symtoms being you have Hashi's?

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

_____________________________________________________________________

> > _______________

> > > Any questions? Get answers on any topic at

www.Answers..

> > Try it now.

> > >

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

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