RE: swelling lower ankles feet

[Guest guest]

--- Alobar <Alobar@...> wrote:

> " Labs " implies doctors. I can't afford doctors.

> Back about 6 years

> ago I took some time off work, stayed home, wrote a

> lot at the

> computer, and ate canned food. My ankles swelled

> up. I asked a

> friend who was a nurse. He said, " Try cutting back

> on Sodium. " I

> did so. Edema went away, and has not been back

> since.

>

> By no means am I saying that high sodium is the

> onlyu cause of ankle

> swelling. But it is one of the causes which might

> be looked at.

>

> Alobar

When I woke this morning all of the swelling in my

feet and ankles was gone. I don't know if you saw my

other message (I have not gotten to all of the

messages yet) in which I wrote that when I went on my

walk the swelling went down. This is about more than

salt. I think your comment about sitting at the

computer is related as is the problem people

experience on long airplane flights or postural.

There is something called postural hypotension which I

believe is part of this illness.

If it was the salt, well I had a 1/4 teaspon Celtic

Seal in 8 oz of water just before bed.

Yes, I am standing at the computer

Abbe

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

>

> Abbe I have been on HC for almost 2 years. It has done nothing but

GOOD

> for me. I have lost 93 pounds in the last year and have not had a

sick

> day in a LONG time. Haven't bee to a doctor except for ONCE for a

check

> up fro anesthesia to have my teeth out in EIGHT years! But I take

alot

> of meds. Armour 6.5 grains a day and 30MG HC a day. I no longer

have

> swelling or fluid retention or pain in my legs, feet or anywhere.

No

> more headaches, and I love water where as before I couldn't drink

it as

> it tasted bad to me. ANY of it! I do use Lugol's topically, mainly

> because it lowered my need for extra T3 meds but I still take 50-

70MCG a

> day of Tertroxin (a T3 med) which works perfectly for my weird

system.

> When I took it orally, I felt worse, so I went back to topical

> application and will most likely stay there. A couple weeks ago I

tried

> a different T3 med and man did I swell and my BP shot up really

bad, but

> I am back on my old meds now and all that is gone. this is why I

know T3

> levels have ALOT to do with swelling and high BP.

>

Thanks ,

I do not doubt your good results with HC. I may change my mind.

Right now, though, I still have the sense that it is not for me.

More and more I am moving toward *no* medication. I do not consider

Iodoral a medication but a natural substance to replenish my body.

Maybe it will not work but I am going to try. Since I am not taking

any medication responses to whatever I eat or take is much easier to

figure out. Perhaps you did not notice a message I wrote in

response to one of your messages. It contained test results (which,

frankly I don't give much importance to but most everyone else seems

to) my T3 is normal.

Damn, standing rather than sitting at the computer is not easy.

Abbe

[Guest guest]

>

>

> Abbe....I had a horrible problem with swollen ankle last summer

when

> my TSH was around 13.5. When I got it back down to normal levels

the

> swelling went away. I've not had much of problem since. I have

serious

> osteoarthritis in one ankle from an old break so swelling and

damage

> from that is very serious for me and I pay attention to my ankles.

>

> My TH was temporarily high from oral estrogen I was experimenting

with

> during the summer. I'm back on transdermal now with no problems and

> feeling great.

>

> I'm curious why you don't see 23.68 as high?

>

> Lynn

>

Hi Lynn,

Yes I had broken bones in one of my feet and that one was worse, but

this is more than the old injury.

I have read of people with TSH of 400-500, comparatively 23.68 is

not high at all. I only quote the numbers on lists because of the

high importance list-people seem to place on them. I don't.

Abbe

[Guest guest]

It sounds like you changed several variables at once

(exercise, standing instead of sitting, and extra salt).

This, unfortunately, makes it difficult to determine

which is the causative factor in relieving your swelling.

On the other hand, if you are willing to keep them all up

(and they don't cause any untoward side-effects), then it

is a moot point.

-

>

> When I woke this morning all of the swelling in my

> feet and ankles was gone. I don't know if you saw my

> other message (I have not gotten to all of the

> messages yet) in which I wrote that when I went on my

> walk the swelling went down. This is about more than

> salt. I think your comment about sitting at the

> computer is related as is the problem people

> experience on long airplane flights or postural.

> There is something called postural hypotension which I

> believe is part of this illness.

>

> If it was the salt, well I had a 1/4 teaspon Celtic

> Seal in 8 oz of water just before bed.

>

> Yes, I am standing at the computer

>

>

> Abbe

[Guest guest]

No. I do not know how you got the idea that I changed

a number of things. I did not change anything except

the sitting. I continued exactly the same amount of

salt intake. The only thing I did different was spend

little time at the computer and when I did I stood. I

also walked around more than I usually do. I mean in

addition to my regular daily walks.

I had no swelling all day and woke this morning with

no swelling whatsoever.

It appears to me Alobar nailed it with too much time

at the computer.

Abbe

--- <truepatriot@...> wrote:

> It sounds like you changed several variables at once

> (exercise, standing instead of sitting, and extra

> salt).

> This, unfortunately, makes it difficult to determine

> which is the causative factor in relieving your

> swelling.

> On the other hand, if you are willing to keep them

> all up

> (and they don't cause any untoward side-effects),

> then it

> is a moot point.

>

> -

>

>

>

> >

> > When I woke this morning all of the swelling in my

> > feet and ankles was gone. I don't know if you saw

> my

> > other message (I have not gotten to all of the

> > messages yet) in which I wrote that when I went on

> my

> > walk the swelling went down. This is about more

> than

> > salt. I think your comment about sitting at the

> > computer is related as is the problem people

> > experience on long airplane flights or postural.

> > There is something called postural hypotension

> which I

> > believe is part of this illness.

> >

> > If it was the salt, well I had a 1/4 teaspon

> Celtic

> > Seal in 8 oz of water just before bed.

> >

> > Yes, I am standing at the computer

> >

> >

> > Abbe

>

>

>

>

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

>From: <artisticgroomer@...>

>I take sea salt daily at about 1/2 to one full tsp. twice a day and it

>has NEVER caused swelling. What HAS caused it is hypothyroidism. And

>basically low T3. Bump my meds up and it stops.

I believe this swelling (edema) is caused by the poor heart function of low

thyroid. When the thyroid is low, the peripheral blood vessels constict

causing cold hands and feet and poor mental function, and the blood volume

drops. At the same time, edema increases because somehow adequate blood

flow is necessary to clean that up.

Skipper

_________________________________________________________________

Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE!

http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

[Guest guest]

>From: Abbe <abbe_online@...>

>I know swelling in the ankles/feet can be related to

>heart problems but for a number of reasons I do not

>think it is for me.

>

>I suspect either hypothyroidism, adrenals or both.

The edema in hpothyroidism has a lot to do with the lowered heart function

while hypothyroid.

Skipper

_________________________________________________________________

Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE!

http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

[Guest guest]

>>I believe this swelling (edema) is caused by the poor heart function

of low

thyroid. When the thyroid is low, the peripheral blood vessels constict

causing cold hands and feet and poor mental function, and the blood volume

drops. At the same time, edema increases because somehow adequate blood

flow is necessary to clean that up.<<

I think you are right except for one thing, I am not sure about lower

blood volume as wouldn't that LOWER BP? Mine always goes very high when

I have edema.

--

Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV

My Ebay Jewelry Store http://stores.ebay.com/valeriescrystalcreations

The BEST thyroid website! http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com

NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

[Guest guest]

--- Skipper Beers <lsb149@...> wrote:

>

>

>

> >From: Abbe <abbe_online@...>

>

> >

> >I suspect either hypothyroidism, adrenals or both.

>

> The edema in hpothyroidism has a lot to do with the

> lowered heart function

> while hypothyroid.

>

> Skipper

>

Thank you, Skipper

It is suggested that Mitral Valve Proplapse is related

to hypothyroidism. I was diagnosed with that many

years ago. It went away. About six months ago I

experienced extreme stress. This led to what I am and

have been experiencing, no doubt. During the health

work-up I found out the Mitral Valve Prolapse had

returned. Otherwise, however, my heart is in good

condition, so the cardiologist said.

Maybe you read my other messages (?) Since I stopped

sitting at the computer for hours on end all of the

swelling in ankles and feet is gone. I do still have

swelling around my eyes, however. Do you think the

swelling around the eyes is related to 'lowered heart

function while hypothyroid'?

I started Iodoral today at much less than the

recommended dose because I had been reacting to so

many things. We'll see.

Abbe

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

>From: " Abbe " <abbe_online@...>

>I have read of people with TSH of 400-500, comparatively 23.68 is

>not high at all. I only quote the numbers on lists because of the

>high importance list-people seem to place on them. I don't.

Comparatively. Yet, it is high enough for one to find themselves in a

myxedema coma, if it's matched by low T3.

The MEDIAN TSH when known hypos are excluded in large studies is 1.5. Very

few have TSH over 3. And there's no question that since 5.5 is usually the

high side of normal TSH, that only 2.25% of the population exceed 5.5. So,

those people your " comparitively " comparing to are quite rare.

Skipper

_________________________________________________________________

Don’t just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search!

http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/

[Guest guest]

--- Skipper Beers <lsb149@...> wrote:

> >From: " Abbe " <abbe_online@...>

>

> >I have read of people with TSH of 400-500,

> comparatively 23.68 is

> >not high at all. I only quote the numbers on lists

> because of the

> >high importance list-people seem to place on them.

> I don't.

>

> Comparatively. Yet, it is high enough for one to

> find themselves in a

> myxedema coma, if it's matched by low T3.

Thanks for pointing this out, Skipper

They had not been testing T3 but when I changed

doctors I insisted on a complete work up. My T3

was/is normal. I had read a bit by then questioned

myxedema. My doctor said he was not at all concerned

about it.

As you can see I do the medical thing. I am

responsible and realize I do not know everything

Abbe

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

>>. My T3

was/is normal<<

Oh Abbe, don;t let them just give you a " normal " .. I was dying of low

thyroid but my labs were within " normal " ranges. You need your free T3

at the ver top if not slightly over the range for normal.

--

Artistic Grooming * Hurricane, WV

My Ebay Jewelry Store http://stores.ebay.com/valeriescrystalcreations

The BEST thyroid website! http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com

NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS/

[Guest guest]

> > >

> > > When I woke this morning all of the swelling in my

> > > feet and ankles was gone. I don't know if you saw

> > my

> > > other message (I have not gotten to all of the

> > > messages yet) in which I wrote that when I went on

> > my

> > > walk the swelling went down. This is about more

> > than

> > > salt. I think your comment about sitting at the

> > > computer is related as is the problem people

> > > experience on long airplane flights or postural.

> > > There is something called postural hypotension

> > which I

> > > believe is part of this illness.

> > >

> > > If it was the salt, well I had a 1/4 teaspon

> > Celtic

> > > Seal in 8 oz of water just before bed.

> > >

> > > Yes, I am standing at the computer

> > >

> > >

> > > Abbe

[Guest guest]

--- <truepatriot@...> wrote:

<snip>

>

> OK, my apologies. Where I got the idea was your

> comment

> regarding the 1/4 tsp salt at night. I didn't

> realize this

> was something you've always done. Alas, the concept

> of trying

> one thing at a time is good to keep in mind, but it

> seems it

> does not apply here, as that is exactly what you

> have done.

<snip>

No problem, . I just didn't understand why you

thought I was doing a number of things. I had been

doing the Celtic Sea Salt. I agree with you 100%

about trying one thing at a time. I don't see how

else I could figure out what is going on with me.

Thanks,

Abbe

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

>From: Abbe <abbe_online@...>

>

>It is suggested that Mitral Valve Proplapse is related

>to hypothyroidism.

My wife was diagnosed with MVP by an ultrasound by a cardiologist. After

adequate thyroid treatment a different cardiologist told her he doubted she

had MVP, it only sounded like a mild murmer.

Hypothyroidism makes the heart weak.

To conserve energy and maintain BP, the periphehral blood vessels constrict

and the blood volume decreases.

>Maybe you read my other messages (?) Since I stopped

>sitting at the computer for hours on end all of the

>swelling in ankles and feet is gone. I do still have

>swelling around my eyes, however. Do you think the

>swelling around the eyes is related to 'lowered heart

>function while hypothyroid'?

Edema, including of the face is common in hypothyroidism. The original name

for hypothyroidism was myxedema because of the swelling.

>

>I started Iodoral today at much less than the

>recommended dose because I had been reacting to so

>many things. We'll see.

If you have an iodine deficiency, that will fix the problem completely.

Selenium is also important (it helps convert inactive T4 to active T3) and

commonly low in iodine deficient areas.

The lab numbers don't mean nearly as much as they say, but the problem for

the hypothyroid tends to be difficulty getting diagnosed in spite of TSH in

the normal range. That being said, not everyone with elevated TSH is

hypothyroid. But, I suspect most are. And only 2.25% of the population has

a TSH in excess of 5.5.

Skipper

_________________________________________________________________

Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE!

http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

[Guest guest]

--- Skipper Beers <lsb149@...> wrote:

<snip>

> My wife was diagnosed with MVP by an ultrasound by a

> cardiologist. After

> adequate thyroid treatment a different cardiologist

> told her he doubted she

> had MVP, it only sounded like a mild murmer.

>

About five years ago a doctor wanted me to have

another ultrasound because the equipment had been

improved. I did and the tech said I did not have MVP

and I had never had it, because it does not come and

go. The recent test indicated I do have MVP and I saw

with my own eyes whatever it is they are calling MVP.

The cardiologist told me, indeed, MVP can come and go.

I told the cardiologist my view that under extreme

stress the valve was blown out and perhaps relaxes

back into place after an extended period with no

stress. He said this is possible.

Do you think the

> >swelling around the eyes is related to 'lowered

> heart

> >function while hypothyroid'?

>

> Edema, including of the face is common in

> hypothyroidism. The original name

> for hypothyroidism was myxedema because of the

> swelling.

Thank you. I did not know about the original name. I

do recall being frightened by what I read on myxedema

and that is why I brought it up at the doctor's.

<snip>

>

> Selenium is also important (it helps convert

> inactive T4 to active T3) and

> commonly low in iodine deficient areas.

I tried selenium a number of weeks ago. I stopped

because it seemed my response to it was not good. My

health was not at all good at that point. There has

been significant improvement and I may try it again.

I just started Iodoral and do not want to mix things

right now. I will see how it goes with Iodoral.

>

> The lab numbers don't mean nearly as much as they

> say, but the problem for

> the hypothyroid tends to be difficulty getting

> diagnosed in spite of TSH in

> the normal range.

Yes, I have read numerous messages from people

complaining they were unable to get treatment. I had

no complaint. One of my doctors was watching the

levels during general physical exams and telling me

they were close to the point where I should be treated

and finally recommended replacement. At the point

treatment was recommended the only complaint I had was

weight gain. If he had not prescribed replacement I

would have only continued to adjust diet and exercise

to address the weight gain.

That being said, not everyone

> with elevated TSH is

> hypothyroid. But, I suspect most are. And only

> 2.25% of the population has

> a TSH in excess of 5.5.

>

> Skipper

>

I understand there are other issues with TSH, such as

pituitary. I did not know, though, one could have

elevated TSH and not be hypothyroid. Thanks, Skipper

Not sitting at the computer for hours on end appears

to have resolved my original complaint about swelling

in lower ankles and feet. None whatsoever last two

days. On waking, still swelling around the eyes,

though, which seems to diminish as the day goes on.

Abbe

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

>From: Abbe <abbe_online@...>

>Reply-iodine

>They had not been testing T3 but when I changed

>doctors I insisted on a complete work up. My T3

>was/is normal. I had read a bit by then questioned

>myxedema. My doctor said he was not at all concerned

>about it.

Can I assume you know what your actual lab reading of fT3 is? If you're at

the very edge of low on the normal curve, you are still " normal " but only

2.25% of the population may have lower numbers than you. Which would not

likely be a good place to be.

I suppose the doctor that was treating my mother " was not at all concerned

about it " either. Of course, the critical care doctor thought he had better

give her thyroid meds when she went into the coma. He knew why she was in

the coma.

Skipper

_________________________________________________________________

Don’t just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search!

http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/

[Guest guest]

HELLO HELLO

TSH of 23 is coma inducing. The #s are not important at all, except when they are as high as this. Many of us (like me) have been extremely ill, with a very low TSH, and were not allowed treatment. #s is just part of the language we use.

gracia

>> > Abbe....I had a horrible problem with swollen ankle last summer when> my TSH was around 13.5. When I got it back down to normal levels the> swelling went away. I've not had much of problem since. I have serious> osteoarthritis in one ankle from an old break so swelling and damage> from that is very serious for me and I pay attention to my ankles.> > My TH was temporarily high from oral estrogen I was experimenting with> during the summer. I'm back on transdermal now with no problems and> feeling great.> > I'm curious why you don't see 23.68 as high?> > Lynn>Hi Lynn,Yes I had broken bones in one of my feet and that one was worse, but this is more than the old injury.I have read of people with TSH of 400-500, comparatively 23.68 is not high at all. I only quote the numbers on lists because of the high importance list-people seem to place on them. I don't.Abbe

No virus found in this outgoing message.

Checked by AVG Free Edition.

Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.3/374 - Release Date: 6/23/2006

[Guest guest]

> TSH of 23 is coma inducing. The #s are not important at all,

>except when they are as high as this. Many of us (like me) have

>been extremely ill, with a very low TSH, and were not allowed

>treatment. #s is just part of the language we use.

> gracia

I was practically in coma at a MUCH lower TSH, within old ref

range.

Carol

[Guest guest]

--- cbwillis9 <cbwillis9@...> wrote:

>

> > TSH of 23 is coma inducing. The #s are not

> important at all,

> >except when they are as high as this. Many of us

> (like me) have

> >been extremely ill, with a very low TSH, and were

> not allowed

> >treatment. #s is just part of the language we

> use.

> > gracia

>

>

> I was practically in coma at a MUCH lower TSH,

> within old ref

> range.

>

> Carol

Okay, but what is the total picture?

I mean, for example, do you have a thyroid gland?

Do you have hypothalamus or pituitary dysfunction?

Are you hyperthyroid or hypothyroid?

What are your other numbers or T4, T3?

What, if any, other health conditions do you have?

Things like that...

Abbe

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

ABBE

I don't think you are understanding what you are dealing with, and this is often the case when severely hypo. Reality becomes elusive.

I had an unnecessary partial thyroidectomy at age 22 and then no meds b/c my TSH was low normal. I almost died and lost 30 years of my life---lost, gone. I have been both hyper and hypo---we know both conditions require iodine. Thyroid hormone affects every cell in the body--doesn't matter if you have other damage to H-P-A axis.

You need to look at your symptoms plus TSH test and treat accordingly.

gracia

--- cbwillis9 <cbwillis9 > wrote:> > > TSH of 23 is coma inducing. The #s are not> important at all, > >except when they are as high as this. Many of us> (like me) have > >been extremely ill, with a very low TSH, and were> not allowed > >treatment. #s is just part of the language we> use.> > gracia> > > I was practically in coma at a MUCH lower TSH,> within old ref> range.> > CarolOkay, but what is the total picture?I mean, for example, do you have a thyroid gland?Do you have hypothalamus or pituitary dysfunction?Are you hyperthyroid or hypothyroid?What are your other numbers or T4, T3?What, if any, other health conditions do you have?Things like that...Abbe__________________________________________________