Re: Danger exists for QXCI/SCIO practitioners

April 14, 2007

How do you define trained? I have been to 7 doctors for a skin condition I have and each one has given me a different diagnosis. I also had a condition previously that doctors ie GP's Gynaecologists Cardiologists and Gastroenterologists could not help me with. They all achknowledged I had a serious health condition but all eventually gave up on me.As a result I have no faith in doctors and tend to have more success at the health shop or homeopath.Dr Renier du Toit <natmed@...> wrote: A very real danger exists for the future of QXCI/SCIO Therapists/practitioners because untrained people are buying QXCI/SCIO machines, believing that they do not need any academic knowledge of pathology or remedies because the QXCI/SCIO machine is capable of infallible information. Unlike the Allopathic/orthodox medical profession, any lay person has access to the QXCI/SCIO machines. Short seminars by the brokers are regulary attended by these lay people who then have ready access to such machines. This situation reflects adversely on well-trained therapists and practitioners who, due to their knowledge of anatomy, physiology and pathology and methods of treatment, have a reference point for any illness and remedy selection made by an instrument. In this setting, dangers from the subjective factor are minimised and an approach such as

the QXCI/SCIO becomes a valuable addition to the other skills of the therapist/practitioner. Dr Renier du Toit Send instant messages to your online friends http://au.messenger.

April 14, 2007

Those of us who are trainers (and I wish I could say all) but at least the Masters/Advanced instructors, should be encouraging ALL students to get further education when operating this machine. Even Medical Doctors are encouraged to take classes in alternative health and the non medical practitioner should be studying not only anatomy, physiology and pathology but homeopathic, naturapathic studies in herbs, oils, back flower remedies, etc. I agree with you this device by itself is NOT enough for anyone who owns it, but there are many out there who are advancing in their studies and should be not only rewarded for this but commended. The rest need to be encouraged. Yours in Health, Kathy , ND, IMUNE International Advanced Master InstructorDr Renier du Toit <natmed@...> wrote: A very real danger exists for the future of QXCI/SCIO Therapists/practitioners because untrained people are buying QXCI/SCIO machines, believing that they do not need any academic knowledge of pathology or remedies because the QXCI/SCIO machine is capable of infallible information. Unlike the Allopathic/orthodox medical profession, any lay person has access to the QXCI/SCIO machines. Short seminars by the brokers are regulary attended by these

lay people who then have ready access to such machines. This situation reflects adversely on well-trained therapists and practitioners who, due to their knowledge of anatomy, physiology and pathology and methods of treatment, have a reference point for any illness and remedy selection made by an instrument. In this setting, dangers from the subjective factor are minimised and an approach such as the QXCI/SCIO becomes a valuable addition to the other skills of the therapist/practitioner. Dr Renier du Toit

April 16, 2007

Trained in at least Anatomy, Physiology, Pathology and Differential Diagnosis.

Re: Danger exists for QXCI/SCIO practitioners

How do you define trained? I have been to 7 doctors for a skin condition I have and each one has given me a different diagnosis. I also had a condition previously that doctors ie GP's Gynaecologists Cardiologists and Gastroenterologists could not help me with. They all achknowledged I had a serious health condition but all eventually gave up on me.As a result I have no faith in doctors and tend to have more success at the health shop or homeopath.Dr Renier du Toit <natmedmweb (DOT) co.za> wrote:

A very real danger exists for the future of QXCI/SCIO Therapists/practitioners because untrained people are buying QXCI/SCIO machines, believing t hat they do not need any academic knowledge of pathology or remedies because the QXCI/SCIO machine is capable of infallible information. Unlike the Allopathic/orthodox medical profession, any lay person has access to the QXCI/SCIO machines. Short seminars by the brokers are regulary attended by these lay people who then have ready access to such machines. This situation reflects adversely on well-trained therapists and practitioners who, due to their knowledge of anatomy, physiology and pathology and methods of treatment, have a reference point for any illness and remedy selection made by an instrument. In this setting, dangers from the subjective factor are minimised and an approach such as the QXCI/SCIO becomes a valuable addition to the other skills of the therapist/practitioner.

Dr Renier du Toit

Send instant messages to your online friends http://au.messenger.

April 16, 2007

I studied these subjects for years BEFORE I bought the device, which is one reason I was interested in it. It combines many of my interests. I think doing it the other way around is a lot more difficult, because there is SO MUCH to learn. Even with a great deal of knowledge behind me I have more than enough to learn just about what the device can do, as well as much information in the matrix that I was not yet familiar with. This is a lifetime of learning, not quick fix for health. I am in disagreement in the sales pitch that I've heard that "every home should have one"--most people are not sophisticated enough to use it properly, and many people will not take the time to learn. I know people who have spent $20,000 to have them sitting unused. I totally agree we should be more than button pushers. Regarding licensing, certifications etc., I'm not sure what is the best way to handle that, but

since it has become a concern the teaching available has become excellent. I especially like the programs given by Kathy , Gage Tarrant and Levi.Aurelie ce, PhD, CMT, CNHP, RSp, QBS727 232 0504Kathy <kathyqx@...> wrote: Those of us who are trainers (and I wish I could say all) but at least the Masters/Advanced instructors, should be encouraging ALL students to get further education when operating this machine. Even Medical Doctors are encouraged to take classes in

alternative health and the non medical practitioner should be studying not only anatomy, physiology and pathology but homeopathic, naturapathic studies in herbs, oils, back flower remedies, etc. I agree with you this device by itself is NOT enough for anyone who owns it, but there are many out there who are advancing in their studies and should be not only rewarded for this but commended. The rest need to be encouraged. Yours in Health, Kathy , ND, IMUNE International Advanced Master InstructorDr Renier du Toit <natmedmweb (DOT) co.za> wrote: A very real

danger exists for the future of QXCI/SCIO Therapists/practitioners because untrained people are buying QXCI/SCIO machines, believing that they do not need any academic knowledge of pathology or remedies because the QXCI/SCIO machine is capable of infallible information. Unlike the Allopathic/orthodox medical profession, any lay person has access to the QXCI/SCIO machines. Short seminars by the brokers are regulary attended by these lay people who then have ready access to such machines. This situation reflects adversely on well-trained therapists and practitioners who, due to their knowledge of anatomy, physiology and pathology and methods of treatment, have a reference point for any illness and remedy selection made by an instrument. In this setting, dangers from the subjective factor are minimised and an approach such as the QXCI/SCIO becomes a valuable addition to the other skills of the therapist/practitioner. Dr Renier du Toit

April 17, 2007

I acknowledge what you're saying but have to tell you that there are

renegades in every profession. There are medical doctors who are

totally out to lunch and do more harm than good, there are

acupuncturists who just use needles and have no idea how to use

remedies or herbs. People have to start somewhere and we can only

hope that they will see how important it is to grow and learn. That's

why most professions require CEUs (continuing education credits). I'm

sure we've all been in situations when we were in a crisis situation

where we met practitioner after practitioner who couldn't help us,

some of them we'd label quacks, but that seems to be part of our

evolution. There will always be gullible people and practitioners of

every art who welcome them with open arms. But I'm an optimist: I

think most people who use the SCIO/QXCI sooner or later realize they

can't tread water. Plus, who says you have to have just one

practitioner? Someone may go to a SCIO practitioner, and still see

several other people like cranial sacral professionals, chiros,

ancupunks. We can mix and match and that's what most people do. Few

these days are going to sock all their money into one person's

modality esp. if they're not feeling better.

>

> A very real danger exists for the future of QXCI/SCIO

Therapists/practitioners because untrained people are buying QXCI/SCIO

machines, believing that they do not need any academic knowledge of

pathology or remedies because the QXCI/SCIO machine is capable of

infallible information. Unlike the Allopathic/orthodox medical

profession, any lay person has access to the QXCI/SCIO machines. Short

seminars by the brokers are regulary attended by these lay people who

then have ready access to such machines. This situation reflects

adversely on well-trained therapists and practitioners who, due to

their knowledge of anatomy, physiology and pathology and methods of

treatment, have a reference point for any illness and remedy selection

made by an instrument. In this setting, dangers from the subjective

factor are minimised and an approach such as the QXCI/SCIO becomes a

valuable addition to the other skills of the therapist/practitioner.

>

> Dr Renier du Toit

>

April 17, 2007

Greetings,

I think Dr. Gilbert had the right idea. He taught that basic, intermediate and advanced training should include 80 hours of face-to-face instruction plus 40 hours of anatomy plus 40 hours of coaching plus an approved informed consent form and that was just the beginning. His ideas are used by the Natural Therapies Certificaiton Board (NTCB.org) to gain certification.

I believe everybody should learn all of these skills whether they become certified or not.

Bright Blessings,

Exercise your brain! Try Flexicon.

April 18, 2007

I have been saying this for the past 8 years. Thanks for putting it so clearly Dr. du Toit.

Dr. SmallSee what's free at AOL.com.

April 18, 2007

In a message dated 4/18/2007 6:46:04 AM Pacific Standard Time, coachaurelie@... writes:

totally agree we should be more than button pushers. Regarding licensing, certifications etc., I'm not sure what is the best way to handle that, but since it has become a concern the teaching available has become excellent.

It is exactly what I teach in my Seminars at the Conferences and classes I conduct. I will be speaking next at the Congress of Masters in Puerto Vallarta next Wed. and then in Minneapolis, MN on May 19-20th.

Dr. SmallSee what's free at AOL.com.

April 18, 2007

I applaud you for your insight. There are many ways of learning the device. Some of which work better than others. But, much variety for the needs of our technicians. I myself recommend 25 hours of at home learning, that I recommend they do 3 times, (remember the brain needs to see something 3 to 5 times to really retain it) so that the student is prepared when they come to class. About 40+ hours in-class training and 10 hours of practicum which is supervised and discussed. For most of my students it works very well. That is 125 hours of study. BUT, it is not enough. The students still need to take outside classes by an accredited school in Anatomy, Physiology, Pathology and then study in ANY area that they are lacking or may end up specializing in with their clientele. Since most of us choose the types of clients we wish to have, by intent and by word or mouth success and we also resonate to these

type of clients choosing the classes should be easy. There is no set governmental regulations on the way the trainings must be, and even if they were there would be some out there that would abuse that, so we need to take as much education as WE the technician feels comfortable with. And by comfortable I am referring to feeling sufficiently trained that when someone comes to you that there is an easy understanding of their bodies condition, and enough knowledge to understand that when it is out of our league we refer to someone else or investigate the situation to be able to properly help the client. Someone who was trained to be a button pusher and not understand the "why" the device works or "how" should proceed with caution until they understand more of what they are doing. There are trainers out here that do just that help you understand more than just the push of a button. I am proud to say I am one of

them. Some believe that we must require a class in coaching, or ethics. This again has many options. Those who studied in Psychology, Sociology, religion, etc. have probably had courses that are much more in depth than a simple coaching class, but it is definitely a good idea to take some form of study in how to deal with a client, how to be professional, and what we legally and morally are able to say without getting ourselves in trouble. Staying within the law is imperative. Certifications are recommended (but still not a legal requirement) they give the client a sense of credibility to our field. But, even training certifications from any course gives much to that credibility. Some insurances may require a "board" certification which is outside of the company, some do not, the only issue is making sure the technician understands what that certification is that they get. If we try and

pass off a certificate as a "required legal document" we can also get ourselves into a pickle. We are not allowed to present ourselves as anything more than we are trained as, and for most of us that is a Biofeedback Technician. Any other name is simply given by the board that chose that name. Some say Master, Specialist etc. But, that only designates the degree or the length we've taken to our study. Heck, I remember when we took an 6 hour course and we were classified as Biofeedback Technicians; WE'VE COME A LONG WAY BABY, as the saying goes. Hopefully, we'll continue to go a lot futher. We should all be in this field for one reason. To help our clients. To do so, we must be educated. Yours in Health, KathyDr Renier du Toit <natmed@...> wrote: Trained in at least Anatomy, Physiology, Pathology and Differential Diagnosis. Re: Danger exists for QXCI/SCIO practitioners How do you define trained? I have been to 7 doctors for a skin condition I have and each one has given me a different diagnosis. I also had a condition previously that doctors ie GP's Gynaecologists Cardiologists and Gastroenterologists could not help me with. They all achknowledged I had a serious health condition but all eventually gave up on me.As a result I have no faith in doctors and tend to have more success at the health shop or homeopath.Dr Renier du Toit <natmedmweb (DOT) co.za> wrote: A very real danger exists for the future of QXCI/SCIO Therapists/practitioners because untrained people are buying QXCI/SCIO machines, believing t hat they do not need any academic knowledge of pathology or remedies because the QXCI/SCIO machine is capable of infallible information. Unlike the Allopathic/orthodox medical profession, any lay person has access to the QXCI/SCIO machines. Short seminars by the brokers are regulary attended by these lay people who then have ready access to such machines. This situation reflects adversely on well-trained therapists and practitioners who, due to their knowledge of anatomy, physiology and pathology and methods of treatment, have a reference point for any illness and remedy selection made by an instrument. In this setting, dangers from the subjective factor are minimised and an approach such as the QXCI/SCIO becomes a valuable addition to the other skills of the

therapist/practitioner. Dr Renier du Toit Send instant messages to your online friends http://au.messenger.

April 18, 2007

In a message dated 4/18/2007 6:46:04 AM Pacific Standard Time, coachaurelie@... writes:

I studied these subjects for years BEFORE I bought the device, which is one reason I was interested in it. It combines many of my interests. I think doing it the other way around is a lot more difficult, because there is SO MUCH to learn. Even with a great deal of knowledge behind me I have more than enough to learn just about what the device can do, as well as much information in the matrix that I was not yet familiar with. This is a lifetime of learning, not quick fix for health.

My new Compendium/Manual will be available shortly entitled "Decoding The Matrix, The Essential Guide to Unlocking The Secrets of the EPFX/SCIO" I was the person responsible for supplying many of the items in the Test Matrix including The Stem Cell Program. Finally, there will be a detailed guide to each of the over 10,000 items in the Test Matrix including how and when to use the chosen remedies and case correlations and conditions to assist in cracking even the most difficult cases. We are taking preorders at next weeks Congress of Masters in Puerto Vallarta.See what's free at AOL.com.

April 18, 2007

I agree aurelie.This is very frustrating. In my area people in need are writing off this device because they went to someone who was rather incompetent and didn't get results. Now they refuse to see anyone else with the device because of a bad first experience.I have recently had a patient in my office who was given a printout of all her 'diseases' by an operator of the device. She was in a panic. Noone should be receiving long printouts and being told that this is what is wrong with them.Another couple of people weren't even hooked up to the device even though they were sitting right there in the room. Their daughter finally convinced them to come see me.Thank goodness these three decided to give it another shot.Especially where I am, there is very INTENSE marketing of the device to just anyone. All we can do is hope that people in need reach people who are

trained.aurelie <coachaurelie@...> wrote: I studied these subjects for years BEFORE I bought the device, which is one reason I was interested in it. It combines many of my interests. I think doing it the other way around is a lot more difficult, because there is SO MUCH to learn. Even with a great deal of knowledge behind me I have more than enough to learn just about what the device can do, as well as much information in the matrix that I was not yet familiar with. This is a

lifetime of learning, not quick fix for health. I am in disagreement in the sales pitch that I've heard that "every home should have one"--most people are not sophisticated enough to use it properly, and many people will not take the time to learn. I know people who have spent $20,000 to have them sitting unused. I totally agree we should be more than button pushers. Regarding licensing, certifications etc., I'm not sure what is the best way to handle that, but since it has become a concern the teaching available has become excellent. I especially like the programs given by Kathy , Gage Tarrant and Levi.Aurelie ce, PhD, CMT, CNHP, RSp, QBS727 232 0504Kathy <kathyqxsbcglobal (DOT) net> wrote: Those of us who are trainers (and I wish I could say all) but at least the Masters/Advanced instructors, should be encouraging ALL students to get further education when operating this machine. Even Medical Doctors are encouraged to take classes in alternative health and the non medical practitioner should be studying not only anatomy, physiology and pathology but homeopathic, naturapathic studies in herbs, oils, back flower remedies, etc. I agree with you this device by itself is NOT enough for anyone who owns it, but there are many out there who are advancing in their studies and should be not only rewarded for this but commended. The rest need to be encouraged. Yours in Health, Kathy , ND, IMUNE International Advanced Master InstructorDr Renier du Toit <natmedmweb (DOT) co.za> wrote: A very real danger exists for the future of QXCI/SCIO Therapists/practitioners because untrained people are buying QXCI/SCIO machines, believing that they do not need any academic knowledge of pathology or remedies because the QXCI/SCIO machine is capable of infallible information. Unlike the Allopathic/orthodox medical profession, any lay person has access to the QXCI/SCIO machines. Short seminars by the brokers are regulary attended by these lay people who then have ready access to such machines. This situation reflects adversely on well-trained therapists and practitioners who, due to their knowledge of anatomy, physiology and pathology and methods of treatment, have a reference point for any

illness and remedy selection made by an instrument. In this setting, dangers from the subjective factor are minimised and an approach such as the QXCI/SCIO becomes a valuable addition to the other skills of the therapist/practitioner. Dr Renier du Toit

April 18, 2007

I stopped myself from purchasing this device because I didn't have credentials,

or any " formal " education. Until I realized that I had great intentions, that I

wanted to help animals, that I will never know as much as some, but that is OK.

I will know what I need to know.

I'm just happy that my lack of credentials didn't stop me from purchasing this

device. I know I have a lot to learn, I continue to educate myself. And there

are a lot of animals that are thankful I have this device!!!!!

--

MacLaughlin, CBT

Pawsitive Healing

Karera Ridgebacks and

French Bulldogs

April 20, 2007

I understand the opinions voiced, that only licensed medical people

should buy the device, BUT there is another side.

There are people like me,who have discovered this device and have an

intense passion for it. In high school, I had two years of anatomy

and physiology in the college prep course, and loved it. However, I

couldn't stand blood and needles, so I went into teaching. Back in

1956 the options for me seemed to be teacher, nurse, secretary,

waitress, or factory worker. My guidance counselor,(not worthy of

the name)just said I was smart, so go be a teacher. Ok.

I did teach biology for some years and have had other experiences,

too. Although I enjoyed everything I did, I felt I was missing

something. Why was there no passion? What was wrong with me? I

was interested in all the complementary fields--- massage, applied

kinesiolagy, ayurvedic, the mind-body connection, but did not want to

just pick one. I liked them all and kept reading and learning, but

with no definite purpose.

When I heard the executive director of my state's medical association

say, in 1990, that old people have got to realize that they will die,

and that money can't be spent on them as much, but channeled to the

young. Well, I could have accepted that, if I had felt that the

medical system was doing the best for people. I hadn't heard about

the " functional 75% " , those not well, but not sick, but I knew that's

where I was. By being neglected, as functional and not sick,

eventually, the neglect would eventually manifest in some way. If

this happened after age 56, should I be then told, sorry, too late?

No way. I was angry and decided there needs to be a better way,so

that the chronic and metabolic issues that rob us of our quality if

life, in the functional realm, need to be addressed. I wanted to be

part of the paradyme shift that would start addressing this. It was

just not clear how I could be involved.

It took 15 years for it to be clear. Last year I had found the EPFX-

SCIO ! From that moment, I have felt a joy in my life that I will

not let go. Thank goodness, purchasing this device not restricted to

just medical people. Retirement money is never enough and I had to

borrow, but I had to have this.

I am sure I am not alone. There are many of us who will be

dedicated, study hard, thirsty for more knowledge, who will convey

enthusiasm and passion for what this high tech device can do.

PLEASE keep us in mind. It is easy to be elitist, and there is a

basis for you feelings, but please be compassionate towards those of

us who missed our calling, and have finally found it. I cannot

imagine being alive without having the joy from this work.

Very sincerely,

Szigeti-

my personal email is cj.szigetijohnson@...

>

> A very real danger exists for the future of QXCI/SCIO

Therapists/practitioners because untrained people are buying

QXCI/SCIO machines, believing that they do not need any academic

knowledge of pathology or remedies because the QXCI/SCIO machine is

capable of infallible information. Unlike the Allopathic/orthodox

medical profession, any lay person has access to the QXCI/SCIO

machines. Short seminars by the brokers are regulary attended by

these lay people who then have ready access to such machines. This

situation reflects adversely on well-trained therapists and

practitioners who, due to their knowledge of anatomy, physiology and

pathology and methods of treatment, have a reference point for any

illness and remedy selection made by an instrument. In this setting,

dangers from the subjective factor are minimised and an approach such

as the QXCI/SCIO becomes a valuable addition to the other skills of

the therapist/practitioner.

>

> Dr Renier du Toit

>

April 20, 2007

Hi,

I’ve been using the QXCI/SCIO for

about half a year in my practice and I have found it to be an amazing device.

After reading this post I was reminded of the ongoing concern that I have about

anyone being able to employ the use of the SCIO without proper training and

education. For me the training was a waste of time that resulted in my walking

away with a great deal of concern and anger towards the quantum alliance. If

you have 20K and a pulse you can get a SCIO. There are no constraints on the

user and no competency requirements. I have created a waiver in my practice

stating that the device is experimental and that it has not been shown through

consistent research to be reliable and valid. I have done this because of

practitioners who have managed to screw up the creditability of this device. In

my area I am the only SCIO practitioner and I have been very cautious about

using this device with my patients. I have taken a great deal of time to train

myself up on it use so that I can provide good services. As a result of this

caution I have had good outcomes with some very difficult cases. Actually

amazing results when I think about it. However, there was one of my clients

who had seen a practitioner who did what was posted below. They disclosed the

list of pathology and scared the hell out of the person. When this person came

to me they asked for the list and I explained why they were not allowed to have

it. The person was angered and relieved at the same time.

The need to challenge allopathic medicine

is absolutely necessary in this day and age where big pharma rules as king and

the alternative is not discussed in the MD’s office. However, in order

to create creditability the powers that be who make decisions regarding the

SCIO need to create a system that ensures ongoing competency of the SCIO user

with some minimal requirements for being able to obtain the device. This will

help to ensure a standard of use that will benefit us all. When I went to the

training I completed all of the pre-training reading and lessons. Other than myself,

maybe two or three others out of 17 did the same. Nothing was said about it

and the class simply went on. That’s a problem.

Dogris, Ph.D.

Neuropsychologist

Re: Danger

exists for QXCI/SCIO practitioners

I agree aurelie.

This is very frustrating. In my area people in need are writing off this

device because they went to someone who was rather incompetent and didn't get

results. Now they refuse to see anyone else with the device because of a

bad first experience.

I have recently had a patient in my office who was given a printout of all her

'diseases' by an operator of the device. She was in a panic. Noone

should be receiving long printouts and being told that this is what is wrong

with them.

Another couple of people weren't even hooked up to the device even though they

were sitting right there in the room. Their daughter finally convinced

them to come see me.

Thank goodness these three decided to give it another shot.

Especially where I am, there is very INTENSE marketing of the device to just

anyone.

All we can do is hope that people in need reach people who are trained.

aurelie <coachaurelie >

wrote:

I studied these subjects for years BEFORE I bought the

device, which is one reason I was interested in it. It combines many of

my interests.

I think doing it the other way around is a lot more difficult, because there is

SO MUCH to learn. Even with a great deal of knowledge behind me I have more

than enough to learn just about what the device can do, as well as much

information in the matrix that I was not yet familiar with.

This is a lifetime of learning, not quick fix for health.

I am in disagreement in the sales pitch that I've heard that " every home

should have one " --most people are not sophisticated enough to use it

properly, and many people will not take the time to learn.

I know people who have spent $20,000 to have them sitting unused.

I totally agree we should be more than button pushers. Regarding

licensing, certifications etc., I'm not sure what is the best way to handle

that, but since it has become a concern the teaching available has become

excellent. I especially like the programs given by Kathy , Gage

Tarrant and Levi.

Aurelie ce, PhD, CMT, CNHP, RSp, QBS

727 232 0504

Kathy

<kathyqxsbcglobal (DOT) net> wrote:

Those of us who are trainers (and I wish I could say

all) but at least the Masters/Advanced instructors, should be encouraging ALL

students to get further education when operating this machine. Even

Medical Doctors are encouraged to take classes in alternative health and the

non medical practitioner should be studying not only anatomy, physiology and

pathology but homeopathic, naturapathic studies in herbs, oils, back flower

remedies, etc.

I agree with you this device by itself is NOT enough

for anyone who owns it, but there are many out there who are advancing in their

studies and should be not only rewarded for this but commended. The rest

need to be encouraged.

Yours in Health,

Kathy , ND, IMUNE International Advanced Master

Instructor

Dr Renier du Toit

<natmedmweb (DOT) co.za> wrote:

A very real danger exists for the future of QXCI/SCIO

Therapists/practitioners because untrained people are buying QXCI/SCIO

machines, believing that they do not need any academic knowledge of pathology

or remedies because the QXCI/SCIO machine is capable of infallible information.

Unlike the Allopathic/orthodox medical profession, any lay person has access to

the QXCI/SCIO machines. Short seminars by the brokers are regulary attended by

these lay people who then have ready access to such machines. This situation

reflects adversely on well-trained therapists and practitioners who, due to

their knowledge of anatomy, physiology and pathology and methods of treatment,

have a reference point for any illness and remedy selection made by an

instrument. In this setting, dangers from the subjective factor are minimised and

an approach such as the QXCI/SCIO becomes a valuable addition to the other

skills of the therapist/practitioner.

Dr

Renier du Toit

April 21, 2007

Dear All Readers

Please remember that the device is registered in the United States and Canada as

the EPFX, and in the rest of the world as the SCIO. It is important to refer to

it this way so as not to jeopardize the registration.

Thank you,

Lloyd

Office Manager

Eclosion Kft.

Budapest, Hungary

No matter how much training and coaching that is given, there will

always be those irresponsible few who will not put the information

into practice---in any profession. Those people get overly excited

about the power of the tool they've been given and want to go into

the world and " treat " and " cure " everyone. The power is too

seductive and they don't seem to be able to stick to the simple idea

of " stress reduction " . Quantum has made it quite clear that unless

you are a licensed medical professional you cannot say anything other

than " stress reduction " (and I have not had the formal training, only

the printed info that came with the package). I've found no fault in

their intention.

Thank goodness Quantum sells to anyone and everyone!!! I bought the

device simply for my own health, and it has saved my life. What

criteria must I have fallen under if Quantum was picking and choosing

based upon some set of rules as to who could and could not purchase

the device? Must I be a licensed medical professional? Here in

California biofeedback is deregulated. As far as I know, there are

no rules unless you personally want to protect yourself from

liability. It is your own responsibility.

Now that I have had the SCIO for a few months and am making a

recovery from a long list of problems, Lupus being among them, I know

that I will continue on with all of the training and on to an N.D.

and masters program. I thank God everyday that this wonderful device

came into my life. (My family also had great success with it when we

all came down with a stomach virus.) I would never want to keep this

device from helping every single person it could possibly reach.

The best you can do is to keep at the coaching. When you hear

someone using the words " treat " and " cure " and hear that they are

giving out reports, give them an earful----perhaps gently, perhaps

not. Help them to know that they are putting themselves in great

jeopardy liability-wise. Make the consequences of their actions

personal for them. I don't think anyone wants to be sued or have

jail time because they have been impersonating an M.D.

Thanks for listening to one very grateful person's two cents )

DeAnn Upton

P.S. Does anyone else have personal success stories, or is most

everyone here a practitioner???? I have a lot, but am shy about

sharing....

April 21, 2007

I could not agree more with your comments they are spot on on what is going on with the SCIO.

The Machine is absolutely amazing and I agree that some form of competence test should be put in place before a person can purchase such equipment.

But like most business concerns bucks before all else. I believe that the people concern with this kind of business do not know the damage that they are doing to the long term credibility of the Holistic Health Field and the SCIO in particular.

Best regards Branco LCPH MARH FBIH London Consulting in Energetic Medicine Tel.: +49 030 30101163 Mobile: +49 01631580283http://spaces.msn.com/brancofernando This e-mail is confidential and may contain privileged information.

If you are not the addressee it may be unlawful for you to read, copy, distribute, disclose or otherwise use the information in this e-mail.

If you are not the intended recipient please notify us immediately.

From: " Dogris, Ph.D." <nicholasdogris@...>Reply-qxci-english To: <qxci-english >Subject: RE: Danger exists for QXCI/SCIO practitionersDate: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 10:27:07 -0700

Hi,

I’ve been using the QXCI/SCIO for about half a year in my practice and I have found it to be an amazing device. After reading this post I was reminded of the ongoing concern that I have about anyone being able to employ the use of the SCIO without proper training and education. For me the training was a waste of time that resulted in my walking away with a great deal of concern and anger towards the quantum alliance. If you have 20K and a pulse you can get a SCIO. There are no constraints on the user and no competency requirements. I have created a waiver in my practice stating that the device is experimental and that it has not been shown through consistent research to be reliable and valid. I have done this because of practitioners who have managed to screw up the creditability of this device. In my area I am the only SCIO practitioner and I have been very cautious about using this device with my patients. I have taken a great deal of time to train myself up on it use so that I can provide good services. As a result of this caution I have had good outcomes with some very difficult cases. Actually amazing results when I think about it. However, there was one of my clients who had seen a practitioner who did what was posted below. They disclosed the list of pathology and scared the hell out of the person. When this person came to me they asked for the list and I explained why they were not allowed to have it. The person was angered and relieved at the same time.

The need to challenge allopathic medicine is absolutely necessary in this day and age where big pharma rules as king and the alternative is not discussed in the MD’s office. However, in order to create creditability the powers that be who make decisions regarding the SCIO need to create a system that ensures ongoing competency of the SCIO user with some minimal requirements for being able to obtain the device. This will help to ensure a standard of use that will benefit us all. When I went to the training I completed all of the pre-training reading and lessons. Other than myself, maybe two or three others out of 17 did the same. Nothing was said about it and the class simply went on. That’s a problem.

Dogris, Ph.D.

Neuropsychologist

-----Original Message-----From: qxci-english [mailto:qxci-english ] On Behalf Of Raskin DCSent: Wednesday, April 18, 2007 8:49 AMqxci-english Subject: Re: Danger exists for QXCI/SCIO practitioners

I agree aurelie.This is very frustrating. In my area people in need are writing off this device because they went to someone who was rather incompetent and didn't get results. Now they refuse to see anyone else with the device because of a bad first experience.I have recently had a patient in my office who was given a printout of all her 'diseases' by an operator of the device. She was in a panic. Noone should be receiving long printouts and being told that this is what is wrong with them.Another couple of people weren't even hooked up to the device even though they were sitting right there in the room. Their daughter finally convinced them to come see me.Thank goodness these three decided to give it another shot.Especially where I am, there is very INTENSE marketing of the device to just anyone. All we can do is hope that people in need reach people who are trained.aurelie <coachaurelie > wrote:

I studied these subjects for years BEFORE I bought the device, which is one reason I was interested in it. It combines many of my interests. I think doing it the other way around is a lot more difficult, because there is SO MUCH to learn. Even with a great deal of knowledge behind me I have more than enough to learn just about what the device can do, as well as much information in the matrix that I was not yet familiar with. This is a lifetime of learning, not quick fix for health. I am in disagreement in the sales pitch that I've heard that "every home should have one"--most people are not sophisticated enough to use it properly, and many people will not take the time to learn. I know people who have spent $20,000 to have them sitting unused. I totally agree we should be more than button pushers. Regarding licensing, certifications etc., I'm not sure what is the best way to handle that, but since it has become a concern the teaching available has become excellent. I especially like the programs given by Kathy , Gage Tarrant and Levi.Aurelie ce, PhD, CMT, CNHP, RSp, QBS727 232 0504Kathy <kathyqxsbcglobal (DOT) net> wrote:

Those of us who are trainers (and I wish I could say all) but at least the Masters/Advanced instructors, should be encouraging ALL students to get further education when operating this machine. Even Medical Doctors are encouraged to take classes in alternative health and the non medical practitioner should be studying not only anatomy, physiology and pathology but homeopathic, naturapathic studies in herbs, oils, back flower remedies, etc.

I agree with you this device by itself is NOT enough for anyone who owns it, but there are many out there who are advancing in their studies and should be not only rewarded for this but commended. The rest need to be encouraged.

Yours in Health,

Kathy , ND, IMUNE International Advanced Master InstructorDr Renier du Toit <natmedmweb (DOT) co.za> wrote:

A very real danger exists for the future of QXCI/SCIO Therapists/practitioners because untrained people are buying QXCI/SCIO machines, believing that they do not need any academic knowledge of pathology or remedies because the QXCI/SCIO machine is capable of infallible information. Unlike the Allopathic/orthodox medical profession, any lay person has access to the QXCI/SCIO machines. Short seminars by the brokers are regulary attended by these lay people who then have ready access to such machines. This situation reflects adversely on well-trained therapists and practitioners who, due to their knowledge of anatomy, physiology and pathology and methods of treatment, have a reference point for any illness and remedy selection made by an instrument. In this setting, dangers from the subjective factor are minimised and an approach such as the QXCI/SCIO becomes a valuable addition to the other skills of the therapist/practitioner.

Dr Renier du Toit

Could you be the guest MSN Movies presenter? Click Here to Audition

April 22, 2007

Hello, I've been reading the group's messages and was amazed to read this major concern over the usage of the SCIO. I purchased one almost a year ago, I guess my enthusiasm was more than my abilities. Although my intentions were not to become a practicioner, I wanted to first help my family and later others with it. However, like I've read, there is so much information, so much to learn that someone like myself becomes overwhelmed quickly, that discouragement sets in. So much that now I am actually considering trying to sell it. I truly believe in it and how it can help. Unfortunately, because it is sold for profit, after I bought it, I was left to my own without much support. Cruz " Dogris, Ph.D." <nicholasdogris@...> wrote: Hi, I’ve been using the QXCI/SCIO for about half a year in my practice and I have found it to be an amazing device. After reading this post I was reminded of the ongoing concern that I have about anyone

being able to employ the use of the SCIO without proper training and education. For me the training was a waste of time that resulted in my walking away with a great deal of concern and anger towards the quantum alliance. If you have 20K and a pulse you can get a SCIO. There are no constraints on the user and no competency requirements. I have created a waiver in my practice stating that the device is experimental and that it has not been shown through consistent research to be reliable and valid. I have done this because of practitioners who have managed to screw up the creditability of this device. In my area I am the only SCIO practitioner and I have been very cautious about using this device with my patients. I have taken a great deal of time to train myself up on it use so that I can provide good services. As a result of this caution I have had good outcomes with some very difficult cases. Actually amazing results when I

think about it. However, there was one of my clients who had seen a practitioner who did what was posted below. They disclosed the list of pathology and scared the hell out of the person. When this person came to me they asked for the list and I explained why they were not allowed to have it. The person was angered and relieved at the same time. The need to challenge allopathic medicine is absolutely necessary in this day and age where big pharma rules as king and the alternative is not discussed in the MD’s office. However, in order to create creditability the powers that be who make decisions regarding the SCIO need to create a system that ensures

ongoing competency of the SCIO user with some minimal requirements for being able to obtain the device. This will help to ensure a standard of use that will benefit us all. When I went to the training I completed all of the pre-training reading and lessons. Other than myself, maybe two or three others out of 17 did the same. Nothing was said about it and the class simply went on. That’s a problem. Dogris, Ph.D. Neuropsychologist -----Original Message-----From: qxci-english [mailto:qxci-english ] On Behalf Of Raskin DCSent: Wednesday, April 18, 2007 8:49 AMqxci-english Subject: Re: Danger exists for QXCI/SCIO practitioners I agree aurelie.This is very frustrating. In my area people in need are writing off this device because they went to someone who was rather incompetent and didn't get results. Now they refuse to see anyone else with the device because of a bad first experience.I have recently had a patient in my office who was given a printout of all her 'diseases' by an operator of the device. She was in a panic. Noone should be receiving long printouts and being told that this is what is wrong with them.Another couple of people weren't even hooked up to the device even though they were sitting right there in the room. Their daughter finally convinced them to come see me.Thank goodness these three decided to give it another shot.Especially where I am, there is

very INTENSE marketing of the device to just anyone. All we can do is hope that people in need reach people who are trained.aurelie <coachaurelie > wrote: I studied these subjects for years BEFORE I bought the device, which is one reason I was interested in it. It combines many of my interests. I think doing it the other way around is a lot more difficult, because there is SO MUCH to learn. Even with a great deal of knowledge behind me I have more than enough to learn just about what the device can do, as well as much information in the matrix that I was not yet familiar with. This is a lifetime of

learning, not quick fix for health. I am in disagreement in the sales pitch that I've heard that "every home should have one"--most people are not sophisticated enough to use it properly, and many people will not take the time to learn. I know people who have spent $20,000 to have them sitting unused. I totally agree we should be more than button pushers. Regarding licensing, certifications etc., I'm not sure what is the best way to handle that, but since it has become a concern the teaching available has become excellent. I especially like the programs given by Kathy , Gage Tarrant and Levi.Aurelie ce, PhD, CMT, CNHP, RSp, QBS727 232 0504Kathy <kathyqxsbcglobal (DOT) net> wrote: Those of us who are trainers (and I wish I could say all) but at least the Masters/Advanced instructors, should be encouraging ALL students to get further education when operating this machine. Even Medical Doctors are encouraged to take classes in alternative health and the non medical practitioner should be studying not only anatomy, physiology and pathology but homeopathic, naturapathic studies in herbs, oils, back flower remedies, etc. I agree with you this device by itself is NOT enough for anyone who owns it, but there are many out there who are advancing in their studies and should be not only rewarded

for this but commended. The rest need to be encouraged. Yours in Health, Kathy , ND, IMUNE International Advanced Master InstructorDr Renier du Toit <natmedmweb (DOT) co.za> wrote: A very real danger exists for the future of QXCI/SCIO Therapists/practitioners because untrained people are buying QXCI/SCIO machines, believing that they do not need any academic knowledge of pathology or remedies because the QXCI/SCIO machine is capable of infallible information. Unlike the Allopathic/orthodox medical profession, any lay person has access to the QXCI/SCIO machines. Short seminars by the brokers are regulary attended by these lay people who then have ready access to such machines. This situation reflects adversely on well-trained therapists and practitioners who, due to their knowledge of anatomy, physiology and pathology and methods of treatment, have a reference point for any illness and remedy selection made by an instrument. In this setting, dangers from the subjective factor are minimised

and an approach such as the QXCI/SCIO becomes a valuable addition to the other skills of the therapist/practitioner. Dr Renier du Toit

Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell? Check out

new cars at Autos.

April 22, 2007

Dear All Readers

Please remember that the device is registered in the United States and Canada as

the EPFX, and in the rest of the world as the SCIO. It is important to refer to

it this way so as not to jeopardize the registration.

Thank you,

Lloyd

Office Manager

Eclosion Kft.

Budapest, Hungary

Greetings,

I had the same problem in Southern California with people who first visited a poorly-trained SCIO operator. I chose not to mention anything about it being experimental or that it had not been proven by scientific research because I didn't want to send out that negative energy.

Instead I followed Dr. Gilbert's advice and spent $79.00 and bought a $29 digital thermometer and a$50 GSR. When I have clients that don't trust my SCIO, I let them use the GSR and Temp trainers. They concentrate on that and I concentrate on my SCIO.

Happy clients keep coming back, so that works for me.

Love and Laughter,

Mortgage rates near historic lows. Refinance $200,000 loan for as low as $771/month*

April 23, 2007

Me too! I feel abandoned and feel that my sale was agreed by someone who was very

aware of my cirmumstances very quickly but I have not been offered anything approaching

adequate after sales support that will enable me to use my SCIO As a result I have to

learn by doing and reading everyone's contributions in this fantastic newsgroup

- good but far from ideal.

RE: Danger exists for QXCI/SCIO practitioners

Hello, I've been reading the group's messages and was amazed to read this major concern over the usage of the SCIO. I purchased one almost a year ago, I guess my enthusiasm was more than my abilities. Although my intentions were not to become a practicioner, I wanted to first help my family and later others with it. However, like I've read, there is so much information, so much to learn that someone like myself becomes overwhelmed quickly, that discouragement sets in. So much that now I am actually considering trying to sell it. I truly believe in it and how it can help. Unfortunately, because it is sold for profit, after I bought it, I was left to my own without much support.

Cruz

" Dogris, Ph.D." <nicholasdogrisverizon (DOT) net> wrote:

Hi,

I’ve been using the QXCI/SCIO for about half a year in my practice and I have found it to be an amazing device. After reading this post I was reminded of the ongoing concern that I have about anyone being able to employ the use of the SCIO without proper training and education. For me the training was a waste of time that resulted in my walking away with a great deal of concern and anger towards the quantum alliance. If you have 20K and a pulse you can get a SCIO. There are no constraints on the user and no competency requirements. I have created a waiver in my practice stating that the device is experimental and that it has not been shown through consistent research to be reliable and valid. I have done this because of practitioners who have managed to screw up the creditability of this device. In my area I am the only SCIO practitioner and I have been very cautious about using this device with my patients. I have taken a great deal of time to train myself up on it use so that I can provide good services. As a result of this caution I have had good outcomes with some very difficult cases. Actually amazing results when I think about it. However, there was one of my clients who had seen a practitioner who did what was posted below. They disclosed the list of pathology and scared the hell out of the person. When this person came to me they asked for the list and I explained why they were not allowed to have it. The person was angered and relieved at the same time.

The need to challenge allopathic medicine is absolutely necessary in this day and age where big pharma rules as king and the alternative is not discussed in the MD’s office. However, in order to create creditability the powers that be who make decisions regarding the SCIO need to create a system that ensures ongoing competency of the SCIO user with some minimal requirements for being able to obtain the device. This will help to ensure a standard of use that will benefit us all. When I went to the training I completed all of the pre-training reading and lessons. Other than myself, maybe two or three others out of 17 did the same. Nothing was said about it and the class simply went on. That’s a problem.

Dogris, Ph.D.

Neuropsychologist

-----Original Message-----From: qxci-english [mailto:qxci-english ] On Behalf Of Raskin DCSent: Wednesday, April 18, 2007 8:49 AMqxci-english Subject: Re: Danger exists for QXCI/SCIO practitioners

I agree aurelie.This is very frustrating. In my area people in need are writing off this device because they went to someone who was rather incompetent and didn't get results. Now they refuse to see anyone else with the device because of a bad first experience.I have recently had a patient in my office who was given a printout of all her 'diseases' by an operator of the device. She was in a panic. Noone should be receiving long printouts and being told that this is what is wrong with them.Another couple of people weren't even hooked up to the device even though they were sitting right there in the room. Their daughter finally convinced them to come see me.Thank goodness these three decided to give it another shot.Especially where I am, there is very INTENSE marketing of the device to just anyone. All we can do is hope that people in need reach people who are trained.aurelie <coachaurelie > wrote:

I studied these subjects for years BEFORE I bought the device, which is one reason I was interested in it. It combines many of my interests. I think doing it the other way around is a lot more difficult, because there is SO MUCH to learn. Even with a great deal of knowledge behind me I have more than enough to learn just about what the device can do, as well as much information in the matrix that I was not yet familiar with. This is a lifetime of learning, not quick fix for health. I am in disagreement in the sales pitch that I've heard that "every home should have one"--most people are not sophisticated enough to use it properly, and many people will not take the time to learn. I know people who have spent $20,000 to have them sitting unused. I totally agree we should be more than button pushers. Regarding licensing, certifications etc., I'm not sure what is the best way to handle that, but since it has become a concern the teaching available has become excellent. I especially like the programs given by Kathy , Gage Tarrant and Levi.Aurelie ce, PhD, CMT, CNHP, RSp, QBS727 232 0504Kathy <kathyqxsbcglobal (DOT) net> wrote:

Those of us who are trainers (and I wish I could say all) but at least the Masters/Advanced instructors, should be encouraging ALL students to get further education when operating this machine. Even Medical Doctors are encouraged to take classes in alternative health and the non medical practitioner should be studying not only anatomy, physiology and pathology but homeopathic, naturapathic studies in herbs, oils, back flower remedies, etc.

I agree with you this device by itself is NOT enough for anyone who owns it, but there are many out there who are advancing in their studies and should be not only rewarded for this but commended. The rest need to be encouraged.

Yours in Health,

Kathy , ND, IMUNE International Advanced Master InstructorDr Renier du Toit <natmedmweb (DOT) co.za> wrote:

A very real danger exists for the future of QXCI/SCIO Therapists/practitioners because untrained people are buying QXCI/SCIO machines, believing that they do not need any academic knowledge of pathology or remedies because the QXCI/SCIO machine is capable of infallible information. Unlike the Allopathic/orthodox medical profession, any lay person has access to the QXCI/SCIO machines. Short seminars by the brokers are regulary attended by these lay people who then have ready access to such machines. This situation reflects adversely on well-trained therapists and practitioners who, due to their knowledge of anatomy, physiology and pathology and methods of treatment, have a reference point for any illness and remedy selection made by an instrument. In this setting, dangers from the subjective factor are mini mised and an approach such as the QXCI/SCIO becomes a valuable addition to the other skills of the therapist/practitioner.

Dr Renier du Toit

Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?Check out new cars at Autos.

April 23, 2007

There is lots of support. Go to the trainings. Kathy has a great one. Cruz <jacruzn@...> wrote: Hello, I've been reading the group's messages and was amazed to read this major concern over the usage of the SCIO. I purchased one almost a year ago, I guess my enthusiasm was more than my abilities. Although my intentions were not to become a practicioner, I wanted to first help my family and later others with it. However, like I've read, there is so much information, so much

to learn that someone like myself becomes overwhelmed quickly, that discouragement sets in. So much that now I am actually considering trying to sell it. I truly believe in it and how it can help. Unfortunately, because it is sold for profit, after I bought it, I was left to my own without much support. Cruz " Dogris, Ph.D." <nicholasdogrisverizon (DOT) net> wrote: Hi, I’ve been using the QXCI/SCIO for about half a year in my practice and I have found it to be an amazing device. After reading this post I was reminded of the ongoing concern that I have about anyone being able to employ the use of the SCIO without proper training and education. For me the training was a waste of time that resulted in my walking away with a great deal of concern and anger towards the quantum alliance. If you have 20K and a pulse you can get a SCIO. There are no constraints on the user and no competency requirements. I have created a waiver in my practice stating that the device is experimental and that it has not been shown through consistent research to be reliable and valid. I have done this because of practitioners who have managed to screw up the creditability of this device. In my area I am the

only SCIO practitioner and I have been very cautious about using this device with my patients. I have taken a great deal of time to train myself up on it use so that I can provide good services. As a result of this caution I have had good outcomes with some very difficult cases. Actually amazing results when I think about it. However, there was one of my clients who had seen a practitioner who did what was posted below. They disclosed the list of pathology and scared the hell out of the person. When this person came to me they asked for the list and I explained why they were not allowed to have it. The person was angered and relieved at the same time. The need to challenge allopathic medicine is absolutely necessary in this day and age where big pharma rules as king and the alternative is not discussed in the MD’s office. However, in order to create creditability the powers that be who make decisions regarding the SCIO need to create a system that ensures ongoing competency of the SCIO user with some minimal requirements for being able to obtain the device. This will help to ensure a standard of use that will benefit us all. When I went to the training I completed all of the pre-training reading and lessons. Other than myself, maybe two or three others out of 17 did the same. Nothing was said about it and the class simply went on. That’s a problem. Dogris, Ph.D. Neuropsychologist -----Original Message-----From: qxci-english [mailto:qxci-english ] On Behalf Of Raskin DCSent: Wednesday, April 18, 2007 8:49 AMqxci-english Subject: Re: Danger exists for QXCI/SCIO practitioners I agree aurelie.This is very frustrating. In my area people in need are writing off this device because they went to someone who was rather incompetent and didn't get results. Now they refuse to see anyone else with the device because of a bad first experience.I have recently had a patient in my office who was given a printout of all her 'diseases' by an operator of the device. She

was in a panic. Noone should be receiving long printouts and being told that this is what is wrong with them.Another couple of people weren't even hooked up to the device even though they were sitting right there in the room. Their daughter finally convinced them to come see me.Thank goodness these three decided to give it another shot.Especially where I am, there is very INTENSE marketing of the device to just anyone. All we can do is hope that people in need reach people who are trained.aurelie <coachaurelie > wrote: I studied these subjects for years BEFORE I bought the device,

which is one reason I was interested in it. It combines many of my interests. I think doing it the other way around is a lot more difficult, because there is SO MUCH to learn. Even with a great deal of knowledge behind me I have more than enough to learn just about what the device can do, as well as much information in the matrix that I was not yet familiar with. This is a lifetime of learning, not quick fix for health. I am in disagreement in the sales pitch that I've heard that "every home should have one"--most people are not sophisticated enough to use it properly, and many people will not take the time to learn. I know people who have spent $20,000 to have them sitting unused. I totally agree we should be more than button pushers. Regarding licensing, certifications etc., I'm not sure what is the best way to handle that, but since it has become a concern the teaching available has

become excellent. I especially like the programs given by Kathy , Gage Tarrant and Levi.Aurelie ce, PhD, CMT, CNHP, RSp, QBS727 232 0504Kathy <kathyqxsbcglobal (DOT) net> wrote: Those of us who are trainers (and I wish I could say all) but at least the Masters/Advanced instructors, should be encouraging ALL students to get further education when operating this machine. Even Medical Doctors are encouraged to take classes in alternative health and the non medical practitioner should be studying not only anatomy, physiology and pathology but homeopathic, naturapathic studies in herbs, oils, back flower

remedies, etc. I agree with you this device by itself is NOT enough for anyone who owns it, but there are many out there who are advancing in their studies and should be not only rewarded for this but commended. The rest need to be encouraged. Yours in Health, Kathy , ND, IMUNE International Advanced Master

InstructorDr Renier du Toit <natmedmweb (DOT) co.za> wrote: A very real danger exists for the future of QXCI/SCIO Therapists/practitioners because untrained people are buying QXCI/SCIO machines, believing that they do not need any academic knowledge of pathology or remedies because the QXCI/SCIO machine is capable of infallible information. Unlike the Allopathic/orthodox

medical profession, any lay person has access to the QXCI/SCIO machines. Short seminars by the brokers are regulary attended by these lay people who then have ready access to such machines. This situation reflects adversely on well-trained therapists and practitioners who, due to their knowledge of anatomy, physiology and pathology and methods of treatment, have a reference point for any illness and remedy selection made by an instrument. In this setting, dangers from the subjective factor are minimised and an approach such as the QXCI/SCIO becomes a valuable addition to the other skills of the therapist/practitioner. Dr Renier du

Toit Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell? Check out new cars at Autos.

April 23, 2007

Dear ,My email wasn't aimed at someone like yourself. And I didn't mean to imply that only licensed medical people should buy the device.......for goodness sakes I'm not a medic!I just meant that people should have enough training at least on the device itself. Other people voiced their opinions that training in health related fields and subjects would be of value. I would agree with that. I'm not here to judge.I was just expressing my dismay at clients receiving long printouts from their reports and being given the impression that these were all 'diseases' that they had. And not even being hooked up to the device when they are sitting right next to the box.It feels like those selling the devices or who are responsible for their distribution aren't making sure that the people who buy them are properly trained.Noone should be given long printouts of their 'diseases'.I'm so

sorry if I have caused you any distress. My email wasn't meant for you. I guess I am hoping my email reached people selling the devices.You sound like a wonderful, extremely educated healer.Warmly,j6j638 <j6j638@...> wrote: I understand the opinions voiced, that only licensed medical people should buy the device, BUT there is another side. There are people like me,who have discovered this device and have an intense passion for it. In high school, I had two years of anatomy

and physiology in the college prep course, and loved it. However, I couldn't stand blood and needles, so I went into teaching. Back in 1956 the options for me seemed to be teacher, nurse, secretary, waitress, or factory worker. My guidance counselor,(not worthy of the name)just said I was smart, so go be a teacher. Ok. I did teach biology for some years and have had other experiences, too. Although I enjoyed everything I did, I felt I was missing something. Why was there no passion? What was wrong with me? I was interested in all the complementary fields--- massage, applied kinesiolagy, ayurvedic, the mind-body connection, but did not want to just pick one. I liked them all and kept reading and learning, but with no definite purpose. When I heard the executive director of my state's medical association say, in 1990, that old people have got to realize that they will die, and that

money can't be spent on them as much, but channeled to the young. Well, I could have accepted that, if I had felt that the medical system was doing the best for people. I hadn't heard about the "functional 75%", those not well, but not sick, but I knew that's where I was. By being neglected, as functional and not sick, eventually, the neglect would eventually manifest in some way. If this happened after age 56, should I be then told, sorry, too late? No way. I was angry and decided there needs to be a better way,so that the chronic and metabolic issues that rob us of our quality if life, in the functional realm, need to be addressed. I wanted to be part of the paradyme shift that would start addressing this. It was just not clear how I could be involved. It took 15 years for it to be clear. Last year I had found the EPFX- SCIO ! From that moment, I have felt a joy in my life that I will not

let go. Thank goodness, purchasing this device not restricted to just medical people. Retirement money is never enough and I had to borrow, but I had to have this. I am sure I am not alone. There are many of us who will be dedicated, study hard, thirsty for more knowledge, who will convey enthusiasm and passion for what this high tech device can do. PLEASE keep us in mind. It is easy to be elitist, and there is a basis for you feelings, but please be compassionate towards those of us who missed our calling, and have finally found it. I cannot imagine being alive without having the joy from this work. Very sincerely, Szigeti- my personal email is cj.szigetijohnsongmail > > > > A very real danger exists for the future of QXCI/SCIO Therapists/practitioners because untrained people are buying QXCI/SCIO machines, believing that they do not need any academic knowledge of pathology or remedies because the QXCI/SCIO machine is capable of

infallible information. Unlike the Allopathic/orthodox medical profession, any lay person has access to the QXCI/SCIO machines. Short seminars by the brokers are regulary attended by these lay people who then have ready access to such machines. This situation reflects adversely on well-trained therapists and practitioners who, due to their knowledge of anatomy, physiology and pathology and methods of treatment, have a reference point for any illness and remedy selection made by an instrument. In this setting, dangers from the subjective factor are minimised and an approach such as the QXCI/SCIO becomes a valuable addition to the other skills of the therapist/practitioner. > > Dr Renier du Toit >

April 23, 2007

Hi. I read your post regarding feeling being left on your own. Are you aware you can search any topic from the qxci-english@ group? I got my then QX, now EPFX-USB, in 2003, and essentially worked from a book by Suzanne Covington. It was very informative and helpful, yet I knew I needed live classes, so in 2005 I went to Kathy 's (kathyqx@...) and learned so many more ways to use this machine. Suzanne also gave a wonderful workshop in the evening at that same event. Education and a desire to further your ability is the key. All the teachers I've been with so far have been great. Kathy has 7 day classes which covers beginning, middle and intermediate classes, and because they are together, you start to see how it really comes together. Kathy

ALSO has DVDs for this class and you can view them at home in your own time, plus refresh your memory when needed. She recommends viewing them before the 7-day event to prepare for it and prepare any questions ahead of time. Her next class is in San , TX May 9-15. She ALSO has BOOKS! One book set I love is this: One is a navigational book that has pictures and explanations on how to get to, say dental. There is a refernce page number in that navigational book that refers to the how to book that is quite thick. I ran a whole dental session just from the book and wow, was it helpful. Nirvana and others have protocols, books, classes, etc. Most, not all, of my experience is with Kathy, so that's why I listed hers so prominately. I've not ever flet abadoned because you can email her or call her and she responds as soon as she can (she teaches and

travels a lot). You can tell by the emails in the group that many give of their time and attention to help anyone who asks. These materials help you learn how to assess what is needed and go where you need to go from your own experiences. Let's face it, even a basic session is pretty cool. I always do body scan, color session, the 2 recommended therapies, risk profile items such as dark field, spinal, short sarcodes, etc, plus one timed therapy. The newer software versions make all these even easier, and Kathy Blair's add-on software makes searching through the test matrix so much easier ($299 and updates). I know you probably will get inundated with many emails, but I encourage you not to give up. I spent two years "on my own" with books which gave me an opportunity to play around with it with family and friends and find all kinds of things. Going to classes and having

the above tools made it all work better for me. I'll always be going to classes because you can always learn something new each time. Good luck, Carol Cruz <jacruzn@...> wrote: Hello, I've been reading the group's messages and was amazed to read this major concern over the usage of the SCIO. I purchased one almost a year ago, I guess my enthusiasm was more than my abilities. Although my intentions were not to become a

practicioner, I wanted to first help my family and later others with it. However, like I've read, there is so much information, so much to learn that someone like myself becomes overwhelmed quickly, that discouragement sets in. So much that now I am actually considering trying to sell it. I truly believe in it and how it can help. Unfortunately, because it is sold for profit, after I bought it, I was left to my own without much support. Cruz " Dogris, Ph.D." <nicholasdogrisverizon (DOT) net> wrote: Hi, I’ve been using the QXCI/SCIO for about half a year in my practice and I have found it to be an amazing device. After reading this post I was reminded of the ongoing concern that I have about anyone being able to employ the use of the SCIO without proper training and education. For me the training was a waste of time that resulted in my walking away with a great deal of concern and anger towards the quantum alliance. If you have 20K and a pulse you can get a SCIO. There are no constraints on the user and no competency requirements. I have created a waiver in my practice stating that the device is experimental and that it has not been shown through consistent research to be reliable and valid. I have done this because of

practitioners who have managed to screw up the creditability of this device. In my area I am the only SCIO practitioner and I have been very cautious about using this device with my patients. I have taken a great deal of time to train myself up on it use so that I can provide good services. As a result of this caution I have had good outcomes with some very difficult cases. Actually amazing results when I think about it. However, there was one of my clients who had seen a practitioner who did what was posted below. They disclosed the list of pathology and scared the hell out of the person. When this person came to me they asked for the list and I explained why they were not allowed to have it. The person was angered and relieved at the same time. The need to challenge allopathic medicine is absolutely necessary in this day and age where big pharma rules as king and the alternative is not discussed in the MD’s office. However, in order to create creditability the powers that be who make decisions regarding the SCIO need to create a system that ensures ongoing competency of the SCIO user with some minimal requirements for being able to obtain the device. This will help to ensure a standard of use that will benefit us all. When I went to the training I completed all of the pre-training reading and lessons. Other than myself, maybe two or three others out of 17 did the same. Nothing was said about it and the class simply went on. That’s a problem. Dogris, Ph.D. Neuropsychologist -----Original Message-----From: qxci-english [mailto:qxci-english ] On Behalf Of

Raskin DCSent: Wednesday, April 18, 2007 8:49 AMqxci-english Subject: Re: Danger exists for QXCI/SCIO practitioners I agree aurelie.This is very frustrating. In my area people in need are writing off this device because they went to someone who was rather incompetent and didn't get results. Now they refuse to see anyone else with the device because of a bad first experience.I have recently had a patient in my office who was given a printout of all her 'diseases' by an operator of

the device. She was in a panic. Noone should be receiving long printouts and being told that this is what is wrong with them.Another couple of people weren't even hooked up to the device even though they were sitting right there in the room. Their daughter finally convinced them to come see me.Thank goodness these three decided to give it another shot.Especially where I am, there is very INTENSE marketing of the device to just anyone. All we can do is hope that people in need reach people who are trained.aurelie <coachaurelie > wrote: I studied these subjects for years BEFORE I bought the device,

which is one reason I was interested in it. It combines many of my interests. I think doing it the other way around is a lot more difficult, because there is SO MUCH to learn. Even with a great deal of knowledge behind me I have more than enough to learn just about what the device can do, as well as much information in the matrix that I was not yet familiar with. This is a lifetime of learning, not quick fix for health. I am in disagreement in the sales pitch that I've heard that "every home should have one"--most people are not sophisticated enough to use it properly, and many people will not take the time to learn. I know people who have spent $20,000 to have them sitting unused. I totally agree we should be more than button pushers. Regarding licensing, certifications etc., I'm not sure what is the best way to handle that, but since it has become a concern the teaching available has become

excellent. I especially like the programs given by Kathy , Gage Tarrant and Levi.Aurelie ce, PhD, CMT, CNHP, RSp, QBS727 232 0504Kathy <kathyqxsbcglobal (DOT) net> wrote: Those of us who are trainers (and I wish I could say all) but at least the Masters/Advanced instructors, should be encouraging ALL students to get further education when operating this machine. Even Medical Doctors are encouraged to take classes in alternative health and the non medical practitioner should be studying not only anatomy, physiology and pathology but homeopathic, naturapathic studies in herbs, oils, back flower remedies, etc.

I agree with you this device by itself is NOT enough for anyone who owns it, but there are many out there who are advancing in their studies and should be not only rewarded for this but commended. The rest need to be encouraged. Yours in Health, Kathy , ND, IMUNE International Advanced Master InstructorDr Renier du Toit <natmedmweb (DOT) co.za> wrote: A very real danger exists for the future of QXCI/SCIO Therapists/practitioners because untrained people are buying QXCI/SCIO machines, believing that they do not need any academic knowledge of pathology or remedies because the QXCI/SCIO machine is capable of infallible information. Unlike the Allopathic/orthodox medical profession, any lay person has access to the QXCI/SCIO machines. Short seminars

by the brokers are regulary attended by these lay people who then have ready access to such machines. This situation reflects adversely on well-trained therapists and practitioners who, due to their knowledge of anatomy, physiology and pathology and methods of treatment, have a reference point for any illness and remedy selection made by an instrument. In this setting, dangers from the subjective factor are minimised and an approach such as the QXCI/SCIO becomes a valuable addition to the other skills of the therapist/practitioner. Dr Renier du Toit Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?Check out new cars at Autos.

April 24, 2007

,

I don’t want to disillusion you and

I encourage you to seek training and a mentor in the process of learning the

SCIO. Like yourself, I feel overwhelmed by the sheer depth of this program,

but I have continued to wrap my mind around the concepts so that I can make

meaning out of what I am seeing in the program. Keep at it, go to training and

seek people who understand the kind of problems that you are specifically

working with on yourself and your family. Good luck,

Re: Danger

exists for QXCI/SCIO practitioners

I agree aurelie.

This is very frustrating. In my area people in need are writing off this

device because they went to someone who was rather incompetent and didn't get

results. Now they refuse to see anyone else with the device because of a

bad first experience.

I have recently had a patient in my office who was given a printout of all her

'diseases' by an operator of the device. She was in a panic. Noone

should be receiving long printouts and being told that this is what is wrong with

them.