Re: Re: Quantum (Products) devices

[Guest guest]

> Vinny, I can tell you that the $300 Quantum device (at all levels from

> Low to High) absolutely failed to give me relief from LCD.

One thing I can note here... I couldn't find a device that

would give me total relief from LCD monitors either. The

devices I use seem to work better on CRT monitors, and also when

using those monitors at lower resolutions (e.g., 1024x768

is harder to tolerate than 800x600).

Also, I take a pretty steady intake of antioxidants while

sitting in front of my monitor, which also extends my

tolerance. And not just any antioxidant, there are

just a few that I've found that are strong enough

to extend my tolerance for the computer (Mega-H and

Amrit being my favorites).

But if these don't work for people, I'd say that they

should look at removing metal dental work, and

trying various forms of detoxification.

Marc

[Guest guest]

> Also, I take a pretty steady intake of antioxidants while

> sitting in front of my monitor

Oh, I suspect that my diet is also a factor in extending

my tolerance for EMF. For example, the first thing I

eat every day is an avocado! Sounds wierd, but I think

it helps my EMF tolerance... oatmeal also seems quite

helpful (even as an oatmeal/raisin cookie!)

Also, anyone who says that they are being " fried " (as

in sunburnt) by their computer monitor is in serious

need of either antioxidants or essential fatty acids

(for the latter, I use a borage oil skin lotion from

the health food store, and apply it to my face, where

the " frying " usually occurs)

Marc

[Guest guest]

Hi folks:

Much as I have indicated in previous posts, I strongly agree with

Marc's comments re the importance of supplementing the diet with

antioxidants and also ensuring that your body is getting an adequate

intake of essential fatty acids. Even for people who are not

noticeably ES, it is a fact that most people living in modern Western

cultures, or Asians eating Westernized diets (i.e., urban dwellers of

large cities in China and Japan) are eating diets which are GROSSLY

deficient in antioxidants, minerals, trace elements and all kinds of

essential fatty acids (i.e., good fats), and which are at the same

time GROSSLY overloaded with oxidative radicals and with substances

which produce oxidative free radicals in the body once the body is

forced to ingest them.

This is why I often say to people with chornic ills that if I were in

their shoes, I would be sure ingest:

* lots of supplemental dietary antioxidants, including vitamin C,

MegaH, EM liquid, and selenium (organic forms only)

* calcium, other major elements, and trace elements, and, of

course, selenium, as mentioned above.

* good sources of raw plant fats (i.e., avocado or durian or

coconut) and good sources of raw animal fat (i.e., fatty raw meat,

fatty raw fish, raw butter, etc.)

* lots of important supplemental trace elements such as lead,

beryllium, mercury, plutonium, fluorine, uranium, thorium and

radium... wait a minute! ...what the heck did I just write? ...oh...

ohhhh.... uh oh... you may wish to ignore this bullet item! I have a

feeling I may have gone a bit overboard on this one, but I am not

sure where! >:-} :-)

* and possibly investigate detoxification products such as the

Bioray NDF formula (although EM alone seems to work well for many people...)

with care,

--Vinny

At 07:03 PM 10/11/2006, you wrote:

> > Vinny, I can tell you that the $300 Quantum device (at all levels from

> > Low to High) absolutely failed to give me relief from LCD.

>

>One thing I can note here... I couldn't find a device that

>would give me total relief from LCD monitors either. The

>devices I use seem to work better on CRT monitors, and also when

>using those monitors at lower resolutions (e.g., 1024x768

>is harder to tolerate than 800x600).

>

>Also, I take a pretty steady intake of antioxidants while

>sitting in front of my monitor, which also extends my

>tolerance. And not just any antioxidant, there are

>just a few that I've found that are strong enough

>to extend my tolerance for the computer (Mega-H and

>Amrit being my favorites).

>

>But if these don't work for people, I'd say that they

>should look at removing metal dental work, and

>trying various forms of detoxification.

>

>Marc

>

Vinny Pinto

vinny@...

phone 301-694-1249

To see my informational websites and e-mail list groups, please go to:

http://www.vinnypinto.us

[Guest guest]

Hello,

here is my opinion.

The readiation of elektrosmog sources is one thing.

The biological working of our body is another.

Many *things* which are claimed to neutralize or harmonize the radiation are

NOT doing that.

I have investigated many *things*, but measurements did not show any

alteration in the radiation levels of the elektrosmog sources.

What many *things* can do, is make an improvement of your immune system.

And when your damaged immune system gets better, of course you will feel

much better, and are the effects of the radiation sources less.

So, the many advices in diet and detoxification are the first important

things to do.

Detoxification of the enormous amount of heavy-metals in our body does

improve a lot.

(We use for that an ionic foot spa).

And then, all the gadgets will work much better.

So, be aware, that the gadgets do nothing to the elektrosmog sources, but

they only work on your own body, and its immune system.

That is also the reason, why with the same radiation levels, one person

benefits more than another person, because the immune systems differ.

100 % healthy people are not electrosensible.

Only people with a damaged immune system may become, or are already

electrosensible.

People between 40 and 60 years of age may be confronted with uncoped youth

traumas.

These may damage the immune system also.

So, first thing is to see that you get a perfect health, as possible.

Greetings,

Claessens

member Verband Baubiologie

www.milieuziektes.nl

www.milieuziektes.be

www.hetbitje.nl

checked by Norton Antivirus

Re: Re: Quantum (Products) devices

> Hi folks:

>

> Much as I have indicated in previous posts, I strongly agree with

> Marc's comments re the importance of supplementing the diet with

> antioxidants and also ensuring that your body is getting an adequate

> intake of essential fatty acids. Even for people who are not

> noticeably ES, it is a fact that most people living in modern Western

> cultures, or Asians eating Westernized diets (i.e., urban dwellers of

> large cities in China and Japan) are eating diets which are GROSSLY

> deficient in antioxidants, minerals, trace elements and all kinds of

> essential fatty acids (i.e., good fats), and which are at the same

> time GROSSLY overloaded with oxidative radicals and with substances

> which produce oxidative free radicals in the body once the body is

> forced to ingest them.

>

> This is why I often say to people with chornic ills that if I were in

> their shoes, I would be sure ingest:

> * lots of supplemental dietary antioxidants, including vitamin C,

> MegaH, EM liquid, and selenium (organic forms only)

> * calcium, other major elements, and trace elements, and, of

> course, selenium, as mentioned above.

> * good sources of raw plant fats (i.e., avocado or durian or

> coconut) and good sources of raw animal fat (i.e., fatty raw meat,

> fatty raw fish, raw butter, etc.)

> * lots of important supplemental trace elements such as lead,

> beryllium, mercury, plutonium, fluorine, uranium, thorium and

> radium... wait a minute! ...what the heck did I just write? ...oh...

> ohhhh.... uh oh... you may wish to ignore this bullet item! I have a

> feeling I may have gone a bit overboard on this one, but I am not

> sure where! >:-} :-)

> * and possibly investigate detoxification products such as the

> Bioray NDF formula (although EM alone seems to work well for many

> people...)

> with care,

> --Vinny

>

> At 07:03 PM 10/11/2006, you wrote:

>> > Vinny, I can tell you that the $300 Quantum device (at all levels from

>> > Low to High) absolutely failed to give me relief from LCD.

>>

>>One thing I can note here... I couldn't find a device that

>>would give me total relief from LCD monitors either. The

>>devices I use seem to work better on CRT monitors, and also when

>>using those monitors at lower resolutions (e.g., 1024x768

>>is harder to tolerate than 800x600).

>>

>>Also, I take a pretty steady intake of antioxidants while

>>sitting in front of my monitor, which also extends my

>>tolerance. And not just any antioxidant, there are

>>just a few that I've found that are strong enough

>>to extend my tolerance for the computer (Mega-H and

>>Amrit being my favorites).

>>

>>But if these don't work for people, I'd say that they

>>should look at removing metal dental work, and

>>trying various forms of detoxification.

>>

>>Marc

>>

>

>

> Vinny Pinto

> vinny@...

>

> phone 301-694-1249

>

> To see my informational websites and e-mail list groups, please go to:

> http://www.vinnypinto.us

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi :

Thanks for your note. . . You wrote, in part, in your recent letter

(below) the following:

~~~~~~~~~~~

The radiation of elektrosmog sources is one thing.

The biological working of our body is another.

Many *things* which are claimed to neutralize or harmonize the radiation are

NOT doing that.

I have investigated many *things*, but measurements did not show any

alteration in the radiation levels of the elektrosmog sources...

~~~~~~~~~~~

I wish to offer here a bit of fine-tuning -- from my perspective as

an electronics engineer, scientist and intuitive -- as we seem to be

touching upon a matter which causes some considerable confusion for

many people with ES/EHs and also for many otherwise-healthy people

who are interesting in acquiring " electro-protective " devices as a

prophylactic measure to ensure continued health and vitality. And,

there is even some confusion (perhaps deliberate!) about this matter

of " reducing EMF fields " on some (but only a few) of the vendor

websites which market these products.

, I agree fully with you that NONE of the great many

protective field effect or area treatment devices available on the

market actually reduce readings of the magnitude (i.e., strength) of

E-fields, H-field or B-field (magnetic field), or EMF fields on EMF

survey meters (i.e., single-field meters, EMF meters, trifield

meters, magnetometers, spectrum analyzers, etc.) Of course, it IS

true that conductive EMF shielding fabrics and metals -- or a

complete Faraday cage (!!!!) -- as sold by some vendors, can indeed

lower such measured field strengths greatly, but for the purposes of

this letter, we are not focusing on such passive shielding tools, but

rather only on field effect or area treatment devices which claim to

somehow ameliorate some or all of the harmful effects of EMF fields.

So, the reality -- much as I explain at some length about my Coherent

Space Quantum Coherence devices on my website -- is that these area

treatment devices do NOT reduce the magnitude (i.e., strength) of the

actual electric (E field), magnetic (H field or B field) or EMF field

itself, but rather, they claim to remove some or all of a subtle

quantum-level incoherent chaotic " noise " which often rides on (i.e.,

is superimposed upon, or accompanies) such fields produced by manmade

systems (i.e., the power grid, the landline phone grid, the cellular

network grid) or devices (i.e., electrical and electronic devices,

motors, etc.) Indeed, I note that a few vendors/producers of such

products -- including the Quantum Products sites (i.e.,

www.quantumproducts.com and www.natural-stress-reduction.com and the

explanations by Dr. Srivinisan and Dr. Rubik on the Clarus websites

--actually employ a language very similar to mine when describing the

possibly-harmful subtle effects of EMF fields. So, the successful

devices in this field -- that is, the ones which do succeed in part

or in full in removing this harmful chaotic quantum noise from the

manmade EMF -- DO NOT actually reduce the magnitude of the electric

fields, magnetic fields or EMF fields in themselves, but RATHER, they

reduce or eliminate the incoherent chaotic quantum-level (i.e.,

subtle energy) noise which often " rides on " such fields from manmade

systems and devices. Since this chaotic quantum-level noise often

produces what I will call " perturbations " or " disturbances " in living

organisms (i.e., people, cats, dogs, microbes, hapless space aliens,

etc.) and in manmade electronic equipment and systems, we will --

when we use one of the better area treatment devices -- often see

improvements in the viability, vitality and functioning of people,

dogs, cats, hapless space aliens and electronic equipment when they

are within the effective radius of treatment range of such a device.

And yes -- and this is where I address 's assertion that these

area treatment devices also affect people directly -- if and when our

bodies are within range of such protective devices (ahem... the ones

which work effectively, that is...!), the devices may also have a

similar cohering effect upon the quantum-level processes (i.e.,

subtle energies) in our bodies as well. And, this is where matters

can get a bit sticky, for... if the body of a person or animal has a

lot of accumulated chaotic incoherent subtle energies, along with

accrued damage from exposure to such incoherent energies over many

years, then, as these bodily energies are gradually cohered, the

person or animal may -- from my perspective -- experience some

temproary and interim cleansing symptoms, aka detoxification

symptoms, such as headaches, flu symptoms, rashes, frequent

urination, buring urine, increased body odor, diarrhea, etc., and at

times, these temporary symptoms may become rather irritating or

annoying in themselves!

Thus, we end up with the paradox that many of these protective field

effect devices appear to work quite well for persons who are already

in a good state of health and coherence, i.e., leargely-healthy

persons with only very very mild negative responses to EMF, but these

same devices may appear -- at first glance -- to be grossly

ineffective or even harmful (i.e., due to the sudden onset of

cleansing symptoms or detox symptoms) for users who have moderate to

strong ES/EHS or MCS or other chronic diseases. This is, of course,

due to the fact that these people in the latter group may not only

have deeper underlying problems in the body/mind/spirit which tend to

produce ES/EHS (or MCS, etc.) as a symptom, but due to the fact that

they bear much higher levels of inner toxins and incoherent fields,

they will also often experience some very unpleasant temporary

cleansing (detox) reactions when exposed to these devices!

And, to some degree, since none of us are perfectly healthy, and

since ALL of us who live in modern society bear some degree of levels

of inner toxicity and accumulated incoherent quantum-level

information, due to (ingestion of) modern food and water and due to

chronic lifetme exposure to manmade EMF and the chaotic fields riding

upon it, almost all of us will at times experience at least brief and

transient minor cleansing symptoms when first exposed to such

" coherence " devices which help to ameliorate the incoherent choatic

quantum-level " noise " which accompanies most manmade EMF (and even

some so-called geopathic fields from natural sources as well.)

with care,

--Vinny

At 04:12 AM 10/12/2006, you wrote:

>Hello,

>

>here is my opinion.

>

>The readiation of elektrosmog sources is one thing.

>The biological working of our body is another.

>

>Many *things* which are claimed to neutralize or harmonize the radiation are

>NOT doing that.

>I have investigated many *things*, but measurements did not show any

>alteration in the radiation levels of the elektrosmog sources.

>

>What many *things* can do, is make an improvement of your immune system.

>And when your damaged immune system gets better, of course you will feel

>much better, and are the effects of the radiation sources less.

>

>So, the many advices in diet and detoxification are the first important

>things to do.

>Detoxification of the enormous amount of heavy-metals in our body does

>improve a lot.

>(We use for that an ionic foot spa).

>

>And then, all the gadgets will work much better.

>

>So, be aware, that the gadgets do nothing to the elektrosmog sources, but

>they only work on your own body, and its immune system.

>

>That is also the reason, why with the same radiation levels, one person

>benefits more than another person, because the immune systems differ.

>

>100 % healthy people are not electrosensible.

>Only people with a damaged immune system may become, or are already

>electrosensible.

>

>People between 40 and 60 years of age may be confronted with uncoped youth

>traumas.

>These may damage the immune system also.

>

>So, first thing is to see that you get a perfect health, as possible.

>

>Greetings,

> Claessens

>member Verband Baubiologie

>www.milieuziektes.nl

>www.milieuziektes.be

>www.hetbitje.nl

>checked by Norton Antivirus

>

>

>

> Re: Re: Quantum (Products) devices

>

>

> > Hi folks:

> >

> > Much as I have indicated in previous posts, I strongly agree with

> > Marc's comments re the importance of supplementing the diet with

> > antioxidants and also ensuring that your body is getting an adequate

> > intake of essential fatty acids. Even for people who are not

> > noticeably ES, it is a fact that most people living in modern Western

> > cultures, or Asians eating Westernized diets (i.e., urban dwellers of

> > large cities in China and Japan) are eating diets which are GROSSLY

> > deficient in antioxidants, minerals, trace elements and all kinds of

> > essential fatty acids (i.e., good fats), and which are at the same

> > time GROSSLY overloaded with oxidative radicals and with substances

> > which produce oxidative free radicals in the body once the body is

> > forced to ingest them.

> >

> > This is why I often say to people with chornic ills that if I were in

> > their shoes, I would be sure ingest:

> > * lots of supplemental dietary antioxidants, including vitamin C,

> > MegaH, EM liquid, and selenium (organic forms only)

> > * calcium, other major elements, and trace elements, and, of

> > course, selenium, as mentioned above.

> > * good sources of raw plant fats (i.e., avocado or durian or

> > coconut) and good sources of raw animal fat (i.e., fatty raw meat,

> > fatty raw fish, raw butter, etc.)

> > * lots of important supplemental trace elements such as lead,

> > beryllium, mercury, plutonium, fluorine, uranium, thorium and

> > radium... wait a minute! ...what the heck did I just write? ...oh...

> > ohhhh.... uh oh... you may wish to ignore this bullet item! I have a

> > feeling I may have gone a bit overboard on this one, but I am not

> > sure where! >:-} :-)

> > * and possibly investigate detoxification products such as the

> > Bioray NDF formula (although EM alone seems to work well for many

> > people...)

> > with care,

> > --Vinny

Vinny Pinto

vinny@...

phone 301-694-1249

To see my informational websites and e-mail list groups, please go to:

http://www.vinnypinto.us

[Guest guest]

Hello Vinny,

of course I fully agree with you.

I wanted to make my point that one has to differentiate between radiation

sources on one side, and the reacting human body on the other side.

Some people do mix them together, and i my opinion that is not right.

Now, about the mumbo jumbo of all these machines.

It is quite simple.

The answer are longitudinal waves.

Tesla described them 100 years ago, but we still do not have meters to

measure them.

But they still exist.

That they are effective can be seen at:

http://www.milieuziektes.nl/Pagina164b.html

where the wheat-seed-water-test has been described.

(As done by Dietrich Gruen M.D., the developer of the BioProtect card)

Longitudinal waves go right through shieldings.

They do have an impact on the vortexes around our body.

Those vortexes can run to the right or to the left.

And longitudinal waves do have an influence on them.

Because most *scientists* do not know about them, they do not want to

discuss this.

But longitudinal waves do play an important part in Vinny's machine.

I am sure of that.

Although it cannot be proven momentarily.

Longitudinal waves can be charged by positive as well as negative

information.

When they pass through a shielding material, it can be changed.

I have found, and measured, that some materials can suck up the HF

radiation, store it till a saturation point, and then start emitting them

over time. (I mean several years.)

Silvio Hellemann wrote an intersting book: *Ständig unter Strom. Handbuch

für Elektrosensible*.

In this book, he described several gadgets and machines which helped him

with his electrosensibility.

I asked him which gadget he found the best and could recommend me.

He wrote back; *None, because they charge themselves and start emitting

after a while!*

So I would say that we call all those so-called *anti-elektrosmog* gadgets

just simply *immune boosters*.

Because we have found that by boosting the immune system (by discharging

heavy-metals for instance) the level of sensitivity to elektrosmog goes down

enormously.

Discharging heavy-metals with pills takes a long time.

With other means, for instance an ionic footbath, it goes much quicker.

So, we are two of a kind, as they say.

I mean the same kind of understanding.

I am looking into my question: *What makes electrosensibles tick?*

And I am very pissed, to see that the dutch government is willing to spend

16 million Euro in research of EM fields and health, but all they want

researched are psychological factors.

See my english issue of *het bitje* 1/2 October 2006.

Greetings,

Claessens

member Verband Baubiologie

www.milieuziektes.nl

www.milieuziektes.be

www.hetbitje.nl

checked by Norton Antivirus

Re: Re: Quantum (Products) devices

>>

>>

>> > Hi folks:

>> >

>> > Much as I have indicated in previous posts, I strongly agree with

>> > Marc's comments re the importance of supplementing the diet with

>> > antioxidants and also ensuring that your body is getting an adequate

>> > intake of essential fatty acids. Even for people who are not

>> > noticeably ES, it is a fact that most people living in modern Western

>> > cultures, or Asians eating Westernized diets (i.e., urban dwellers of

>> > large cities in China and Japan) are eating diets which are GROSSLY

>> > deficient in antioxidants, minerals, trace elements and all kinds of

>> > essential fatty acids (i.e., good fats), and which are at the same

>> > time GROSSLY overloaded with oxidative radicals and with substances

>> > which produce oxidative free radicals in the body once the body is

>> > forced to ingest them.

>> >

>> > This is why I often say to people with chornic ills that if I were in

>> > their shoes, I would be sure ingest:

>> > * lots of supplemental dietary antioxidants, including vitamin C,

>> > MegaH, EM liquid, and selenium (organic forms only)

>> > * calcium, other major elements, and trace elements, and, of

>> > course, selenium, as mentioned above.

>> > * good sources of raw plant fats (i.e., avocado or durian or

>> > coconut) and good sources of raw animal fat (i.e., fatty raw meat,

>> > fatty raw fish, raw butter, etc.)

>> > * lots of important supplemental trace elements such as lead,

>> > beryllium, mercury, plutonium, fluorine, uranium, thorium and

>> > radium... wait a minute! ...what the heck did I just write? ...oh...

>> > ohhhh.... uh oh... you may wish to ignore this bullet item! I have a

>> > feeling I may have gone a bit overboard on this one, but I am not

>> > sure where! >:-} :-)

>> > * and possibly investigate detoxification products such as the

>> > Bioray NDF formula (although EM alone seems to work well for many

>> > people...)

>> > with care,

>> > --Vinny

>

>

> Vinny Pinto

> vinny@...

>

> phone 301-694-1249

>

> To see my informational websites and e-mail list groups, please go to:

> http://www.vinnypinto.us

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi :

Yes, I agree with your points about the nature of

most human complaints/effects from electrosmog,

and I agree that the greatest cause of these

effects is what you call " longitudinal waves " and

what I call " quantum-level inocherent chaotic

noise " , and that they are the same. Some folks,

including Glenn Rein and Dr. Beverly Rick, and

Dr. Srivisnan, choose to call these fields

" subtle eneriges " , and some choose to call them

" scalar fields " , but I tend to really dislike to

use the latter term, if only becuase it has been

so badly overused and abused by so many

self-appionted " experts " (many of whom I feel are

quite deluded) over the past 20 years.

BTW, the quantum cohering materials/substances

used in my devices and also in a few lines of

devices from other vendors are NOT absorptive in

nature, in that they do not absorb harmful subtle

energies or longitudinal fields, but rather, they

appear to act as what I will call transformers or

transmuters -- they seem to transmute the ambient

chaotic fields into coherent fields, and thus,

since they are not acting as sponges (i.e.,

absorbers) they do not ever become " saturated " .

with care,

--Vinny

At 11:05 AM 10/12/2006, you wrote:

>Hello Vinny,

>

>of course I fully agree with you.

>

>I wanted to make my point that one has to differentiate between radiation

>sources on one side, and the reacting human body on the other side.

>Some people do mix them together, and i my opinion that is not right.

>

>Now, about the mumbo jumbo of all these machines.

>It is quite simple.

>The answer are longitudinal waves.

>Tesla described them 100 years ago, but we still do not have meters to

>measure them.

>But they still exist.

>That they are effective can be seen at:

>http://www.milieuziektes.nl/Pagina164b.html

>where the wheat-seed-water-test has been described.

>(As done by Dietrich Gruen M.D., the developer of the BioProtect card)

>

>Longitudinal waves go right through shieldings.

>They do have an impact on the vortexes around our body.

>Those vortexes can run to the right or to the left.

>And longitudinal waves do have an influence on them.

>

>Because most *scientists* do not know about them, they do not want to

>discuss this.

>

>But longitudinal waves do play an important part in Vinny's machine.

>I am sure of that.

>Although it cannot be proven momentarily.

>

>Longitudinal waves can be charged by positive as well as negative

>information.

>When they pass through a shielding material, it can be changed.

>

>I have found, and measured, that some materials can suck up the HF

>radiation, store it till a saturation point, and then start emitting them

>over time. (I mean several years.)

>

>Silvio Hellemann wrote an intersting book: *Ständig unter Strom. Handbuch

>für Elektrosensible*.

>In this book, he described several gadgets and machines which helped him

>with his electrosensibility.

>I asked him which gadget he found the best and could recommend me.

>He wrote back; *None, because they charge themselves and start emitting

>after a while!*

>

>So I would say that we call all those so-called *anti-elektrosmog* gadgets

>just simply *immune boosters*.

>

>Because we have found that by boosting the immune system (by discharging

>heavy-metals for instance) the level of sensitivity to elektrosmog goes down

>enormously.

>Discharging heavy-metals with pills takes a long time.

>With other means, for instance an ionic footbath, it goes much quicker.

>

>So, we are two of a kind, as they say.

>I mean the same kind of understanding.

>

>I am looking into my question: *What makes electrosensibles tick?*

>And I am very pissed, to see that the dutch government is willing to spend

>16 million Euro in research of EM fields and health, but all they want

>researched are psychological factors.

>See my english issue of *het bitje* 1/2 October 2006.

>

>

>Greetings,

> Claessens

>member Verband Baubiologie

>www.milieuziektes.nl

>www.milieuziektes.be

>www.hetbitje.nl

>checked by Norton Antivirus

>

>

> Re: Re: Quantum (Products) devices

>

>

> > Hi :

> >

> > Thanks for your note. . . You wrote, in part, in your recent letter

> > (below) the following:

> > ~~~~~~~~~~~

> > The radiation of elektrosmog sources is one thing.

> > The biological working of our body is another.

> >

> > Many *things* which are claimed to neutralize or harmonize the radiation

> > are

> > NOT doing that.

> > I have investigated many *things*, but measurements did not show any

> > alteration in the radiation levels of the elektrosmog sources...

> > ~~~~~~~~~~~

> >

> > I wish to offer here a bit of fine-tuning -- from my perspective as

> > an electronics engineer, scientist and intuitive -- as we seem to be

> > touching upon a matter which causes some considerable confusion for

> > many people with ES/EHs and also for many otherwise-healthy people

> > who are interesting in acquiring " electro-protective " devices as a

> > prophylactic measure to ensure continued health and vitality. And,

> > there is even some confusion (perhaps deliberate!) about this matter

> > of " reducing EMF fields " on some (but only a few) of the vendor

> > websites which market these products.

> >

> > , I agree fully with you that NONE of the great many

> > protective field effect or area treatment devices available on the

> > market actually reduce readings of the magnitude (i.e., strength) of

> > E-fields, H-field or B-field (magnetic field), or EMF fields on EMF

> > survey meters (i.e., single-field meters, EMF meters, trifield

> > meters, magnetometers, spectrum analyzers, etc.) Of course, it IS

> > true that conductive EMF shielding fabrics and metals -- or a

> > complete Faraday cage (!!!!) -- as sold by some vendors, can indeed

> > lower such measured field strengths greatly, but for the purposes of

> > this letter, we are not focusing on such passive shielding tools, but

> > rather only on field effect or area treatment devices which claim to

> > somehow ameliorate some or all of the harmful effects of EMF fields.

> >

> > So, the reality -- much as I explain at some length about my Coherent

> > Space Quantum Coherence devices on my website -- is that these area

> > treatment devices do NOT reduce the magnitude (i.e., strength) of the

> > actual electric (E field), magnetic (H field or B field) or EMF field

> > itself, but rather, they claim to remove some or all of a subtle

> > quantum-level incoherent chaotic " noise " which often rides on (i.e.,

> > is superimposed upon, or accompanies) such fields produced by manmade

> > systems (i.e., the power grid, the landline phone grid, the cellular

> > network grid) or devices (i.e., electrical and electronic devices,

> > motors, etc.) Indeed, I note that a few vendors/producers of such

> > products -- including the Quantum Products sites (i.e.,

> > www.quantumproducts.com and www.natural-stress-reduction.com and the

> > explanations by Dr. Srivinisan and Dr. Rubik on the Clarus websites

> > --actually employ a language very similar to mine when describing the

> > possibly-harmful subtle effects of EMF fields. So, the successful

> > devices in this field -- that is, the ones which do succeed in part

> > or in full in removing this harmful chaotic quantum noise from the

> > manmade EMF -- DO NOT actually reduce the magnitude of the electric

> > fields, magnetic fields or EMF fields in themselves, but RATHER, they

> > reduce or eliminate the incoherent chaotic quantum-level (i.e.,

> > subtle energy) noise which often " rides on " such fields from manmade

> > systems and devices. Since this chaotic quantum-level noise often

> > produces what I will call " perturbations " or " disturbances " in living

> > organisms (i.e., people, cats, dogs, microbes, hapless space aliens,

> > etc.) and in manmade electronic equipment and systems, we will --

> > when we use one of the better area treatment devices -- often see

> > improvements in the viability, vitality and functioning of people,

> > dogs, cats, hapless space aliens and electronic equipment when they

> > are within the effective radius of treatment range of such a device.

> >

> > And yes -- and this is where I address 's assertion that these

> > area treatment devices also affect people directly -- if and when our

> > bodies are within range of such protective devices (ahem... the ones

> > which work effectively, that is...!), the devices may also have a

> > similar cohering effect upon the quantum-level processes (i.e.,

> > subtle energies) in our bodies as well. And, this is where matters

> > can get a bit sticky, for... if the body of a person or animal has a

> > lot of accumulated chaotic incoherent subtle energies, along with

> > accrued damage from exposure to such incoherent energies over many

> > years, then, as these bodily energies are gradually cohered, the

> > person or animal may -- from my perspective -- experience some

> > temproary and interim cleansing symptoms, aka detoxification

> > symptoms, such as headaches, flu symptoms, rashes, frequent

> > urination, buring urine, increased body odor, diarrhea, etc., and at

> > times, these temporary symptoms may become rather irritating or

> > annoying in themselves!

> >

> > Thus, we end up with the paradox that many of these protective field

> > effect devices appear to work quite well for persons who are already

> > in a good state of health and coherence, i.e., leargely-healthy

> > persons with only very very mild negative responses to EMF, but these

> > same devices may appear -- at first glance -- to be grossly

> > ineffective or even harmful (i.e., due to the sudden onset of

> > cleansing symptoms or detox symptoms) for users who have moderate to

> > strong ES/EHS or MCS or other chronic diseases. This is, of course,

> > due to the fact that these people in the latter group may not only

> > have deeper underlying problems in the body/mind/spirit which tend to

> > produce ES/EHS (or MCS, etc.) as a symptom, but due to the fact that

> > they bear much higher levels of inner toxins and incoherent fields,

> > they will also often experience some very unpleasant temporary

> > cleansing (detox) reactions when exposed to these devices!

> >

> > And, to some degree, since none of us are perfectly healthy, and

> > since ALL of us who live in modern society bear some degree of levels

> > of inner toxicity and accumulated incoherent quantum-level

> > information, due to (ingestion of) modern food and water and due to

> > chronic lifetme exposure to manmade EMF and the chaotic fields riding

> > upon it, almost all of us will at times experience at least brief and

> > transient minor cleansing symptoms when first exposed to such

> > " coherence " devices which help to ameliorate the incoherent choatic

> > quantum-level " noise " which accompanies most manmade EMF (and even

> > some so-called geopathic fields from natural sources as well.)

> >

> > with care,

> > --Vinny

>

Vinny Pinto

vinny@...

phone 301-694-1249

To see my informational websites and e-mail list groups, please go to:

http://www.vinnypinto.us

[Guest guest]

Hello,

I am not a psycho.

Also, I do not know where you are from.

But I thought that America is the land of the *shrinks*.

Anyway, you must consider everything and try to forgive everyone.

That is the main point.

Greetings,

Claessens

member Verband Baubiologie

www.milieuziektes.nl

www.milieuziektes.be

www.hetbitje.nl

checked by Norton Antivirus

Re: Quantum (Products) devices

> In response to below:

> wrote:

>> >People between 40 and 60 years of age may be confronted with uncoped

> youthtraumas. These may damage the immune system also.

>> >

>> >So, first thing is to see that you get a perfect health, as possible.

>

>

>>

> This is, of course,

>> due to the fact that these people in the latter group may not only

>> have deeper underlying problems in the body/mind/spirit which tend to

> produce ES/EHS (or MCS, etc.) as a symptom, but due to the fact that

> they bear much higher levels of inner toxins and incoherent fields,

>>

> Above points well taken. So, I've detoxed with sence and

> Taurine, taken nutritional/mineral/oil supplements, drank Xango as an

> antioxident but have taken a break lately partly from discouragement

> that the problem continues to increase with return to increased work

> load outside the home. So, I'll go back to the above, continue

> shielding, attempt avoidance, but what about uncoped youth traumas? I

> am 42 and may have had a 'youth trauma' but I haven't considered that

> as a potential contributor to current ES status, in fact, I have always

> considered myself well-adjusted and felt as though I have dealt with

> this potential 'youth trauma' a long time ago. Can you give me more

> information about this subject and on ideas for potential trauma

> resolution if, in fact, it is not yet resolved??

> Believe in and open to learning more about body/mind/spirit

> connections/healing,

>>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

> The first thing an ES person needs to do is thoroughly assess

> his/her exposures using proper meters, then undertake remediation

> that cleans up his/her personal EM frequency environment in a

> meterable way.

Well, that's great if you spend all day stuck at home. What

about folks who are " out and about " ? What do you do at

the office? At the supermarket? At the airport? Be

miserable? Don't go there?

The " gizmos " are quite useful for enviroments where

shielding and conventional remediation aren't practical.

And the mistaken belief that " gizmos " work by the placebo

effect is about as bad as the mistaken belief that

ES does not exist.

Marc

[Guest guest]

Hi Marc:

I much agree with your reply. Thank you for stating it so well.

with care,

--Vinny

At 06:14 PM 10/12/2006, you wrote:

> > The first thing an ES person needs to do is thoroughly assess

> > his/her exposures using proper meters, then undertake remediation

> > that cleans up his/her personal EM frequency environment in a

> > meterable way.

>

>Well, that's great if you spend all day stuck at home. What

>about folks who are " out and about " ? What do you do at

>the office? At the supermarket? At the airport? Be

>miserable? Don't go there?

>

>The " gizmos " are quite useful for enviroments where

>shielding and conventional remediation aren't practical.

>And the mistaken belief that " gizmos " work by the placebo

>effect is about as bad as the mistaken belief that

>ES does not exist.

>

>Marc

Vinny Pinto

vinny@...

phone 301-694-1249

To see my informational websites and e-mail list groups, please go to:

http://www.vinnypinto.us

[Guest guest]

Hi Shivani:

I understand what you are writing, and I still disagree with the

claims which you make in your reply. My own views are based upon my

particular perspective as an electronics engineer, scientist

(graduate degree in my field; also lecturer in field, with two books

published), healer and intuitive, and on my work with over 200

persons who are self-described as, or diagnosed as, ES/EHS or MCS in

the past six years. You are, however, entitled to believe whatever

you wish. I am not here on this earth to convert other to my

particular points of view nor to any religion, doctrine or creed. So

you are free to go now in peace!

with care,

--Vinny

At 05:57 PM 10/12/2006, you wrote:

>Vinny wrote:

> Many devices or methods

>which may help less-sensitive people may seem to fail rather

>miserably when people who are quite ill with ES/EHS try to use them,

>simply due to the fact that the ES/EHS in these cases is often a

>symptom of a deeper underlying disturbance or deficiency.

>

>Shivani replies:

> Or perhaps less-sensitive people profit more from placebos. It is

>definitely not a " fact " that the ES in the cases of those not helped

>by various

>devices (that make no meterable difference in one's exposure) is " often a

>symptom of a deeper disturbance or deficiency. "

> The first thing an ES person needs to do is thoroughly assess his/her

>exposures using proper meters, then undertake remediation that

>cleans up his/her

>personal EM frequency environment in a meterable way. To neglect to do

>this, while spending money on various gizmos that make no meterable

>difference,

>makes little sense.

> I am all for improving nutrition, removing toxic metal

> fillings and root

>canals, and anything else that can be done to lower stress and improve

>general health. But it is absurd for an ES person to fail to

>assess/remediate

>his/her personal EM frequency environment. And illogical to

>presume that if

>various gizmos don't help that the fault must be in the sufferer!

> Vinny, will you please share this message with " Joe? "

> Regards,

> Shivani

> Life Energies

>

Vinny Pinto

vinny@...

phone 301-694-1249

To see my informational websites and e-mail list groups, please go to:

http://www.vinnypinto.us

[Guest guest]

> Marc, we read in your posts that you are sensitive to EM. But in all

> fairness, you're at the very low end of the sensitivity spectrum with

> all the things you're able to withstand on a day-to-day basis. But

> your comments and approach sometimes imply that you don't understand

> what it is like to have live and cope with intransigent, long-term EHS.

You must not be aware of my history. 5 years ago I had ES so

bad that I was on disability from work and was bedridden, sleeping

as much as 20 hours each day. I couldn't watch TV, I couldn't

use the phone (corded landline), I couldn't use the computer (LCD

monitor) longer than 5 minutes. I certainly wouldn't have

been able to run this discussion group.

But I tried everything I could think of to get better, and I

*did* get better. Better enough to return to work fulltime

(although that took years). Better enough to run this group.

Better enough to be told that I don't know what it's like to

have ES... :-)

Marc

[Guest guest]

Hello,

yes and no.

First of all, HOME must be good, radiation-poor.

Especially the bedroom, because there you stay most of the time.

And that is the place where the body must come to rest, and where you let

your *shields* down and are you the most vulnerable.

That is the reason why we make a difference between living/working place

with 100 uW/m2 and the bedroom with 1 uW/m2.

The Standard baubiologische Messtechnik 2003 is directed for sleeping

quarters.

So, home must be acceptable.

But one has to go out into the streets and to other places, and then the

gizmo's come to help.

And now my point.

The gismo's help against the longitudinal waves, but NOT against the

transversal waves, which we can measure and which we can shield.

It is my opinion, that first the house must be properly shielded (not all

around, but only against the most radiated walls and windows) and because

the longitudinal waves go right through the shieldings, the gizmo's then

come te work.

So it is and and.

Greetings,

Claessens

member Verband Baubiologie

www.milieuziektes.nl

www.milieuziektes.be

www.hetbitje.nl

checked by Norton Antivirus

Re: Re: Quantum (Products) devices

> Hi Marc:

>

> I much agree with your reply. Thank you for stating it so well.

>

> with care,

> --Vinny

>

> At 06:14 PM 10/12/2006, you wrote:

>> > The first thing an ES person needs to do is thoroughly assess

>> > his/her exposures using proper meters, then undertake remediation

>> > that cleans up his/her personal EM frequency environment in a

>> > meterable way.

>>

>>Well, that's great if you spend all day stuck at home. What

>>about folks who are " out and about " ? What do you do at

>>the office? At the supermarket? At the airport? Be

>>miserable? Don't go there?

>>

>>The " gizmos " are quite useful for enviroments where

>>shielding and conventional remediation aren't practical.

>>And the mistaken belief that " gizmos " work by the placebo

>>effect is about as bad as the mistaken belief that

>>ES does not exist.

>>

>>Marc

>

>

> Vinny Pinto

> vinny@...

>

> phone 301-694-1249

>

> To see my informational websites and e-mail list groups, please go to:

> http://www.vinnypinto.us

>