Re: True community & adding HBO Dosage questions

[Guest guest]

, & community,

It seems like there is an easy solution to the current identity issue. Allow

people to join and read postings anonymously. But before they are allowed to

post they must provide their true name and primary contact information to the

moderator (only). This information is verified prior to any postings. It allows

people to see what the group is about prior to giving up their true ID. It stops

the current issue. It would be similar to Internet dating websites. Members

don't know who members are but the Webmaster knows. The second half of this post

is could be entirely made up and nobody here would know the difference. If there

was a concern about if what I wrote the moderator could contact me and ask me to

substantiate my writing. I would provide the moderator where and when I was

treated. I’m elected not to share that information here because it is not

significant. But for the record it was NOT at Magic Mountain.

Why would people not want to use their real ID? There are many good/valid

reasons and it just makes some more comfortable. Take my case. I'm an adult male

who experienced a serious TBI at age 44. I was a walking zombie for 18 months.

HBO saved my life and I'll share that with anyone. But do I really want my

clients knowing I was a walking zombie for 18 months? Do I want them to know I

that I think I'm a " recovered " TBI victim? Not really. If they found out would

it bother me? No, unless they took their business elsewhere. If I had to tell my

clients to improve HBO status I absolutely would tell my client. Without HBO I

would not be here today to worry about losing their income.

Most of the improvements I’ve read about here for the last 6-months are

subjective. Here is one that is very quantitative that I wanted to share. Prior

to my accident I could complete a game of Minesweeper in 284 seconds (Thanks

Bill Gates for automatically tracking my best time.) In the 18 months after my

accident, my best time was 388 seconds. Basically, it took one-third longer to

do something simple. Subsequent to my accident, the increased time to complete

tasks was my second biggest complaint. As close as 5-hours prior to my first HBO

treatment there was no change in my status for 18 months. Then immediately after

the first 1-hour treatment there was a change. Not only did I notice that I was

humming to myself, but I was holding back my desire to skip out of the treatment

center. The change was so apparent my girlfriend noticed it within seconds

during a long distance cell call conversation. I traveled all of two blocks

before she was insisting on knowing what they did to me.

In my opinion these two are subjective in nature and I dismissed it. My

girlfriend did not. Now I wonder if she wasn’t correct. Subsequent to treatment

I’ve learned that brain scans can show a difference after 1 treatment. Why

cannot the patient also feel this change? The good news is it doesn't matter.

After the fifth treatment I knew it was work and the only questions were how

much improvement and would it be permanent. Guess what, those Minesweeper times

improved 375, 354, 325, 299, 292, and yes eventually 265, faster than before the

accident. No there is some quantitative measurable data that is hare to dismiss.

I will publicly challenge all the nay-sayers out there to explain, how a person

can be stable zombie for 18 months change nothing except for HBO treatment and

have this kind of improvement in 5-weeks that also happens to directly

corresponds to the HBO treatment and not attribute it to HBO treatments?

There are LOTS of issues regarding HBO that we could be debated but dosage seems

to be a topic that gets little attention and one that I’m VERY interested in.

Dosage likely interests me because my successful treatment was non-standard

combined with the fact that I have a difficult time understanding the current

standard protocol. ly, it makes very little sense to me especially

enlighten of my personal successful treatment. I’ll acknowledge that the current

standard is 5-days per week, 60 minute durations, at 1.5 ATA, for 40 treatments

but either 1 per day for 8 weeks OR twice per day for 4 weeks.

So now I want to challenge the HBO community/supporters like myself to a dosage

debate. Please explain:

1) Why it makes sense to be treated at 4 1/2 hours of separation? This means the

separation between the 2nd treatment of day #1 and the first dive of day #2 is

19 1/2 hours? I feel blessed that I was treated with very close to 12-hour

separation. This was difficult for the treatment center but they did it and I

appreciate it VERY much. The AMA regulates HBO as an antibiotic and the few

prescriptions I've had say take very 4, 6, 8 hours. I have not yet to seen a

prescription that says take at 8 AM and 12:30 PM only.

2) Why does it make sense to treat Monday through Friday? Last time I looked our

bodies functioned 7-days per week. If the 40 hours of separation from Friday to

Monday is good why not treat every other day? Personally, I experienced very

significant regressions over the weekends when I wasn’t getting HBO treatments.

How could these regressions be beneficial? Again, the antibiotic prescriptions

say take daily, not Monday through Friday.

3) There is a concern about oxygen toxicity. If treating 7-days per weeks is an

issue at 1.5 ATA twice daily for 60 minutes what about a lower pressure? There

appears to be evidence that pressures lower than 1.5 ATA works equally as well.

I was treated at a higher pressure but I don't believe that improved my results.

Why not lower the pressure to avoid oxygen toxicity but increase the frequency?

4) Why is 1-hour the standard treatment time? Which is better 1 treatment per

day for 60 minutes or 2 treatments per day for 30 minutes each? The dosage of

oxygen is the same but one is more concentrated. Wouldn’t uniform distribution

be better? From my personal experience as an adult TBI patient, I strongly

believe, that 24-hour separation is just too long, at least initially. I’m

basing this on the fact that I experienced my first regression less than 24

hours after my treatment. This means I would be experiencing mini regressions

between each treatment if I was treated once per day, opposed to just having

regressions over the weekend? How could these regressions regardless of daily or

weekly be good?

5) If HBO delivers oxygen throughout the body and encourages new capillary and

neuron growth wouldn’t it make sense that the ideal treatment would change as

this growth gets established? Does it make sense to treat patients the same

during week #1 as it does during week #4 or week #8? Based on my individual

experience with treatment and the regressions I experienced I would say there

was a significant difference in what I needed at treatment progressed. I noticed

a significant difference in how I responded each week of my 5-week treatment.

Clearly a changing dosage is harder to schedule but is it better?

6) Is it possible that the reason that there are two-treatment schedules

twice/day for 4 weeks and once/day for 8 weeks is because neither is correct and

that a hybrid schedule would be better? I believe my twice/day 5-week treatment

was not long enough. Unfortunately, I have know way now of knowing what long

enough would have been.

Accepting the current standard treatment is 40 treatments, for 60 minutes, at

1.5 ATA. This is 2,400 minutes of treatment at 1.5 ATA over a treatment period

of either 4 weeks with twice/daily or 8 weeks with once/daily treatments.

What would happen to results if this same dosage were divided up differently?

1) 1.50 ATA; 45 minutes

11/01/04-11/12/04 twice a day (24 treatments)

11/13/04-11/26/04 once a day; (14 treatments)

11/27/04-12/10/04 once every 36 hours (9 treatments)

12/11/04-12/24/04 every other day (7 treatments)

This is 54 treatments times 45-minutes times would be basically the same 2,430

minutes of treatment at 1.5 ATA.

2) 1.35 ATA; 60 minutes

11/01/04-11/12/04 twice a day (24 treatments)

11/13/04-11/26/04 once a day; (14 treatments)

11/27/04-12/10/04 once every 36 hours (9 treatments)

12/11/04-12/24/04 every other day (7 treatments)

This is 54 treatments times 60 minutes times this is 3,240 minutes of treatment

what pressure would give the same dosage as the current standard? Is 1.35 ATA

about right?

I don’t know the answers to any of these questions and I’m not sure that the

answers are known but it should give this community something positive at least

non-negative to focus their energy on.

I’m convinced that HBO works (at least in my case of an adult TBI) and I would

encourage people thinking about it to try it. But I’m equally doubt that the

current standard treatment protocol is optimized based on my experience and just

simple logic. So I toss this out to see what others have to say. It would be

hard to tell how many of the patients are responding on this detailed level

because of their age, condition or both. But there has to be some other people

that were “aware” even if unable to function like myself. Alternatively, those

that are in the industry as professional to help me understand why uniformly

distributed treatments both within the day and throughout the week are not more

beneficial.

rhartsoe <rhartsoe@...> wrote:

Will the real 26wkrmom@... and the real

JaniceC11945@... please step forward since thinks

that I am these people.

Also, will the real asecrecy@... and the real Ireal@

----- (I have forgotten the email address) step forward.

There were a couple more also if I can look up some old

emails.

, what kind of game is this? You are making some

serious allegations here. I hope you are fully prepared to

back them up. I do not plan on defending them on this list,

however, I am not a total idiot.

Hartsoe

> There has been a great deal of discussion these last few

> days on the hyperbaric community finally coming together

> as a true community. Many people have worked toward this

> end for several years, some have worked for many, many

> years.

> Such a utopian community exists only when relationships

> are based on mutual trust, but trust can only exist when

> all parties concerned are honest with each other, when

> everybody tells the truth about who they are and what

> they're saying is actually true.

> As the parent of a brain-injured child, I have found Truth

> to be invaluable when making decisions on what is the

> best and most appropriate care for our child. Since

> neurologists can provide us no answers, as parents, we

> have relied tremendously on the experience(s) of other

> parents who have gone before us, depending in good faith

> upon them to provide direction and guidance that we can

> rely on.

> This in turn has humbled me, and made me realize that I

> too have an awesome responsibility to always tell other

> parents the truth about what I know to be true and in

> turn to also speak when I know something is not true

> when the opposite is claimed instead. Often I try to set

> the record straight without conflict but often the

> conflict is just part of the mix. Squabbles result when

> these disagreements occur, and it's often seen as petty

> arguing, but it's not. Not really. We are all here to

> arrive at the truth of what's best for our children and

> sometimes these disagreements force the cream to rise to

> the top during this process.

> Sort of like pasteurization. You see, the truth will

> always manifest itself.

> Sadly, some six months ago, it was brought to my attention

> by a number of parents who contacted me off-list that a

> member of the listserv was using an

> alias, pretending to be someone else. As the alias, this

> person was claiming to be the mother of a brain-injured

> child who had experienced tremendous success at only one

> particular hyperbaric facility. This person even claimed

> to have been at other clinics and " her " "

> ;child " had never experienced as good results as

> had been experienced at only one particular facility. This

> person even claimed to have bought a portable Oxyhealth

> chamber and after dozens of treatments decided to sell

> the portable and go back to the one and only facility

> where " her child " had experienced the most

> improvents.

> The parents told me who the alias belonged to, and I took

> the suspect email address and did a search on the

> archived messages for both the list

> ( /messages)

> and the NeuroHBOT list

> (neurohbot/messages). I

> read through twenty or thirty messages from each list and

> came away convinced that the parents who contacted me

> were correct. What most convinced me was the number of

> times the alias used the word " crap. "

> While I have had a number of disagreements with this

> member, I cannot begin to describe to you the level of

> disappointment and betrayal I felt. So I confronted

> Hartsoe in an email (which I will post if

> neccessary), and told him I knew all about "

> ;JaniceC11945@... " , and expressed my

> disappointment. I explained that parents depend on other

> parent experiences when making critical decisions, and he

> had violated that most sacred trust. He had even taken

> advantage of that sacred trust for his own personal

> gain. Further, the #1 comment skeptical traditional

> practitioners make about those who advocate and provide

> off-label HBOT for brain-injury is that all such people

> are unscrupulous liars, and he had just provided them

> the proof. His reply to me was denial, and he never

> accepted responsibility.

> At that time I assured that if such activity

> occurred in the future I would not hesitate to fully

> disclose what I knew about JaniceC11945@.... Even

> though he denied using JaniceC11945@... as an alias,

> all posts by JaniceC11945@... immediately ceased.

>

> Then last week amidst all the flurry of activity and

> discussions about how to best help and Lief,

> someone new joined the listserv. Because

> of previous posts by spamming pornographers, all new

> subscribers are automatically put on a moderated status.

> When they make their first post I can see if they're

> legitimate or not, and I'll usually lift the moderation.

> Last Wednesday and Thursday I was out of town for

> Thanksgiving and didn't have access to the Internet.

> When I got back Friday I found a stack of pending

> messages by this one new member, waiting to be approved.

> I approved one or two. I hesitated to approve any more

> because they all sounded so much like something written by

> JaniceC11945@...--except the word " crap "

> wasn't used.

> Then, incredibly, this person also claimed to be the

> mother of a brain-injured child, and even had the gall

> to claim the child was born 14 weeks prematurely. My son

> was born almost 12 weeks early, and I can assure you I

> don't appreciate someone claiming our difficulty as an

> identity without actually experiencing the heartache. I

> don't appreciate someone so disrepecting the experience

> of truly parenting a child born prematurely who's had

> lifelong developmental disabilities. I don't appreciate

> the insult, and I know the members of this list won't

> appreciate it either.

> After all the struggle Gilbert has endured on behalf

> of Lief, I'm quite sure making light of the difficulty

> our children face will hardly be something she

> appreciates either.

> This person doesn't sign her name and is only known by the

> email address " 26wkrmom@.... " "

> ;Her " profile identity is "

> ;emlezmom. " She claims to have treated her daughter

> to 60 treatments of HBOT in July, 2004 in Bolingbrook,

> Illinois--that Illinois Medicaid paid for. 60 treatments

> is 2x a day for all 30 days of the month--Saturday and

> Sunday too.

> With a screen-capture program I have made JPEG files of

> the unapproved posts. There's definitely a

> single-purpose pattern to these posts, just like the

> posts of JaniceC11945@.... You can see the JPEGS at

>

>

http://photos./group/medicaid/lst? & .dir=/26wkr & .src=gr & .v\

iew=t & .url=http://us.f1.fs.com/groups/g_4010157/26wkr/26wkr_6thPost---1.jpg\

?bc_8VrwB8Aq7wlSE & .cx=150 & .cy=67 & .type=u

>

> I have decided to make this public to the other members of

> the group because we will never have true community

> unless we have mutual trust and respect. That trust will

> never exist unless we are all truly honest about who we

> are and what our purposes and intentions are.

> In the future, if such deceitful activity occurs again,

> the deceit will be immediately disclosed. When the

> dishonesty is revealed, it's up to individual members to

> decide if they can ever trust the deceiver again.

> --

>

>

> Freels

> 2948 Windfield Circle

> Tucker, GA 30084-6714

> 770-491-6776 (phone)

> 720-234-5757 (fax)

> mailto:dfreels@...

>

> http://www.freelanceforum.org/df

>

>

[Guest guest]

, & community,

It seems like there is an easy solution to the current identity issue. Allow

people to join and read postings anonymously. But before they are allowed to

post they must provide their true name and primary contact information to the

moderator (only). This information is verified prior to any postings. It allows

people to see what the group is about prior to giving up their true ID. It stops

the current issue. It would be similar to Internet dating websites. Members

don't know who members are but the Webmaster knows. The second half of this post

is could be entirely made up and nobody here would know the difference. If there

was a concern about if what I wrote the moderator could contact me and ask me to

substantiate my writing. I would provide the moderator where and when I was

treated. I’m elected not to share that information here because it is not

significant. But for the record it was NOT at Magic Mountain.

Why would people not want to use their real ID? There are many good/valid

reasons and it just makes some more comfortable. Take my case. I'm an adult male

who experienced a serious TBI at age 44. I was a walking zombie for 18 months.

HBO saved my life and I'll share that with anyone. But do I really want my

clients knowing I was a walking zombie for 18 months? Do I want them to know I

that I think I'm a " recovered " TBI victim? Not really. If they found out would

it bother me? No, unless they took their business elsewhere. If I had to tell my

clients to improve HBO status I absolutely would tell my client. Without HBO I

would not be here today to worry about losing their income.

Most of the improvements I’ve read about here for the last 6-months are

subjective. Here is one that is very quantitative that I wanted to share. Prior

to my accident I could complete a game of Minesweeper in 284 seconds (Thanks

Bill Gates for automatically tracking my best time.) In the 18 months after my

accident, my best time was 388 seconds. Basically, it took one-third longer to

do something simple. Subsequent to my accident, the increased time to complete

tasks was my second biggest complaint. As close as 5-hours prior to my first HBO

treatment there was no change in my status for 18 months. Then immediately after

the first 1-hour treatment there was a change. Not only did I notice that I was

humming to myself, but I was holding back my desire to skip out of the treatment

center. The change was so apparent my girlfriend noticed it within seconds

during a long distance cell call conversation. I traveled all of two blocks

before she was insisting on knowing what they did to me.

In my opinion these two are subjective in nature and I dismissed it. My

girlfriend did not. Now I wonder if she wasn’t correct. Subsequent to treatment

I’ve learned that brain scans can show a difference after 1 treatment. Why

cannot the patient also feel this change? The good news is it doesn't matter.

After the fifth treatment I knew it was work and the only questions were how

much improvement and would it be permanent. Guess what, those Minesweeper times

improved 375, 354, 325, 299, 292, and yes eventually 265, faster than before the

accident. No there is some quantitative measurable data that is hare to dismiss.

I will publicly challenge all the nay-sayers out there to explain, how a person

can be stable zombie for 18 months change nothing except for HBO treatment and

have this kind of improvement in 5-weeks that also happens to directly

corresponds to the HBO treatment and not attribute it to HBO treatments?

There are LOTS of issues regarding HBO that we could be debated but dosage seems

to be a topic that gets little attention and one that I’m VERY interested in.

Dosage likely interests me because my successful treatment was non-standard

combined with the fact that I have a difficult time understanding the current

standard protocol. ly, it makes very little sense to me especially

enlighten of my personal successful treatment. I’ll acknowledge that the current

standard is 5-days per week, 60 minute durations, at 1.5 ATA, for 40 treatments

but either 1 per day for 8 weeks OR twice per day for 4 weeks.

So now I want to challenge the HBO community/supporters like myself to a dosage

debate. Please explain:

1) Why it makes sense to be treated at 4 1/2 hours of separation? This means the

separation between the 2nd treatment of day #1 and the first dive of day #2 is

19 1/2 hours? I feel blessed that I was treated with very close to 12-hour

separation. This was difficult for the treatment center but they did it and I

appreciate it VERY much. The AMA regulates HBO as an antibiotic and the few

prescriptions I've had say take very 4, 6, 8 hours. I have not yet to seen a

prescription that says take at 8 AM and 12:30 PM only.

2) Why does it make sense to treat Monday through Friday? Last time I looked our

bodies functioned 7-days per week. If the 40 hours of separation from Friday to

Monday is good why not treat every other day? Personally, I experienced very

significant regressions over the weekends when I wasn’t getting HBO treatments.

How could these regressions be beneficial? Again, the antibiotic prescriptions

say take daily, not Monday through Friday.

3) There is a concern about oxygen toxicity. If treating 7-days per weeks is an

issue at 1.5 ATA twice daily for 60 minutes what about a lower pressure? There

appears to be evidence that pressures lower than 1.5 ATA works equally as well.

I was treated at a higher pressure but I don't believe that improved my results.

Why not lower the pressure to avoid oxygen toxicity but increase the frequency?

4) Why is 1-hour the standard treatment time? Which is better 1 treatment per

day for 60 minutes or 2 treatments per day for 30 minutes each? The dosage of

oxygen is the same but one is more concentrated. Wouldn’t uniform distribution

be better? From my personal experience as an adult TBI patient, I strongly

believe, that 24-hour separation is just too long, at least initially. I’m

basing this on the fact that I experienced my first regression less than 24

hours after my treatment. This means I would be experiencing mini regressions

between each treatment if I was treated once per day, opposed to just having

regressions over the weekend? How could these regressions regardless of daily or

weekly be good?

5) If HBO delivers oxygen throughout the body and encourages new capillary and

neuron growth wouldn’t it make sense that the ideal treatment would change as

this growth gets established? Does it make sense to treat patients the same

during week #1 as it does during week #4 or week #8? Based on my individual

experience with treatment and the regressions I experienced I would say there

was a significant difference in what I needed at treatment progressed. I noticed

a significant difference in how I responded each week of my 5-week treatment.

Clearly a changing dosage is harder to schedule but is it better?

6) Is it possible that the reason that there are two-treatment schedules

twice/day for 4 weeks and once/day for 8 weeks is because neither is correct and

that a hybrid schedule would be better? I believe my twice/day 5-week treatment

was not long enough. Unfortunately, I have know way now of knowing what long

enough would have been.

Accepting the current standard treatment is 40 treatments, for 60 minutes, at

1.5 ATA. This is 2,400 minutes of treatment at 1.5 ATA over a treatment period

of either 4 weeks with twice/daily or 8 weeks with once/daily treatments.

What would happen to results if this same dosage were divided up differently?

1) 1.50 ATA; 45 minutes

11/01/04-11/12/04 twice a day (24 treatments)

11/13/04-11/26/04 once a day; (14 treatments)

11/27/04-12/10/04 once every 36 hours (9 treatments)

12/11/04-12/24/04 every other day (7 treatments)

This is 54 treatments times 45-minutes times would be basically the same 2,430

minutes of treatment at 1.5 ATA.

2) 1.35 ATA; 60 minutes

11/01/04-11/12/04 twice a day (24 treatments)

11/13/04-11/26/04 once a day; (14 treatments)

11/27/04-12/10/04 once every 36 hours (9 treatments)

12/11/04-12/24/04 every other day (7 treatments)

This is 54 treatments times 60 minutes times this is 3,240 minutes of treatment

what pressure would give the same dosage as the current standard? Is 1.35 ATA

about right?

I don’t know the answers to any of these questions and I’m not sure that the

answers are known but it should give this community something positive at least

non-negative to focus their energy on.

I’m convinced that HBO works (at least in my case of an adult TBI) and I would

encourage people thinking about it to try it. But I’m equally doubt that the

current standard treatment protocol is optimized based on my experience and just

simple logic. So I toss this out to see what others have to say. It would be

hard to tell how many of the patients are responding on this detailed level

because of their age, condition or both. But there has to be some other people

that were “aware” even if unable to function like myself. Alternatively, those

that are in the industry as professional to help me understand why uniformly

distributed treatments both within the day and throughout the week are not more

beneficial.

rhartsoe <rhartsoe@...> wrote:

Will the real 26wkrmom@... and the real

JaniceC11945@... please step forward since thinks

that I am these people.

Also, will the real asecrecy@... and the real Ireal@

----- (I have forgotten the email address) step forward.

There were a couple more also if I can look up some old

emails.

, what kind of game is this? You are making some

serious allegations here. I hope you are fully prepared to

back them up. I do not plan on defending them on this list,

however, I am not a total idiot.

Hartsoe

> There has been a great deal of discussion these last few

> days on the hyperbaric community finally coming together

> as a true community. Many people have worked toward this

> end for several years, some have worked for many, many

> years.

> Such a utopian community exists only when relationships

> are based on mutual trust, but trust can only exist when

> all parties concerned are honest with each other, when

> everybody tells the truth about who they are and what

> they're saying is actually true.

> As the parent of a brain-injured child, I have found Truth

> to be invaluable when making decisions on what is the

> best and most appropriate care for our child. Since

> neurologists can provide us no answers, as parents, we

> have relied tremendously on the experience(s) of other

> parents who have gone before us, depending in good faith

> upon them to provide direction and guidance that we can

> rely on.

> This in turn has humbled me, and made me realize that I

> too have an awesome responsibility to always tell other

> parents the truth about what I know to be true and in

> turn to also speak when I know something is not true

> when the opposite is claimed instead. Often I try to set

> the record straight without conflict but often the

> conflict is just part of the mix. Squabbles result when

> these disagreements occur, and it's often seen as petty

> arguing, but it's not. Not really. We are all here to

> arrive at the truth of what's best for our children and

> sometimes these disagreements force the cream to rise to

> the top during this process.

> Sort of like pasteurization. You see, the truth will

> always manifest itself.

> Sadly, some six months ago, it was brought to my attention

> by a number of parents who contacted me off-list that a

> member of the listserv was using an

> alias, pretending to be someone else. As the alias, this

> person was claiming to be the mother of a brain-injured

> child who had experienced tremendous success at only one

> particular hyperbaric facility. This person even claimed

> to have been at other clinics and " her " "

> ;child " had never experienced as good results as

> had been experienced at only one particular facility. This

> person even claimed to have bought a portable Oxyhealth

> chamber and after dozens of treatments decided to sell

> the portable and go back to the one and only facility

> where " her child " had experienced the most

> improvents.

> The parents told me who the alias belonged to, and I took

> the suspect email address and did a search on the

> archived messages for both the list

> ( /messages)

> and the NeuroHBOT list

> (neurohbot/messages). I

> read through twenty or thirty messages from each list and

> came away convinced that the parents who contacted me

> were correct. What most convinced me was the number of

> times the alias used the word " crap. "

> While I have had a number of disagreements with this

> member, I cannot begin to describe to you the level of

> disappointment and betrayal I felt. So I confronted

> Hartsoe in an email (which I will post if

> neccessary), and told him I knew all about "

> ;JaniceC11945@... " , and expressed my

> disappointment. I explained that parents depend on other

> parent experiences when making critical decisions, and he

> had violated that most sacred trust. He had even taken

> advantage of that sacred trust for his own personal

> gain. Further, the #1 comment skeptical traditional

> practitioners make about those who advocate and provide

> off-label HBOT for brain-injury is that all such people

> are unscrupulous liars, and he had just provided them

> the proof. His reply to me was denial, and he never

> accepted responsibility.

> At that time I assured that if such activity

> occurred in the future I would not hesitate to fully

> disclose what I knew about JaniceC11945@.... Even

> though he denied using JaniceC11945@... as an alias,

> all posts by JaniceC11945@... immediately ceased.

>

> Then last week amidst all the flurry of activity and

> discussions about how to best help and Lief,

> someone new joined the listserv. Because

> of previous posts by spamming pornographers, all new

> subscribers are automatically put on a moderated status.

> When they make their first post I can see if they're

> legitimate or not, and I'll usually lift the moderation.

> Last Wednesday and Thursday I was out of town for

> Thanksgiving and didn't have access to the Internet.

> When I got back Friday I found a stack of pending

> messages by this one new member, waiting to be approved.

> I approved one or two. I hesitated to approve any more

> because they all sounded so much like something written by

> JaniceC11945@...--except the word " crap "

> wasn't used.

> Then, incredibly, this person also claimed to be the

> mother of a brain-injured child, and even had the gall

> to claim the child was born 14 weeks prematurely. My son

> was born almost 12 weeks early, and I can assure you I

> don't appreciate someone claiming our difficulty as an

> identity without actually experiencing the heartache. I

> don't appreciate someone so disrepecting the experience

> of truly parenting a child born prematurely who's had

> lifelong developmental disabilities. I don't appreciate

> the insult, and I know the members of this list won't

> appreciate it either.

> After all the struggle Gilbert has endured on behalf

> of Lief, I'm quite sure making light of the difficulty

> our children face will hardly be something she

> appreciates either.

> This person doesn't sign her name and is only known by the

> email address " 26wkrmom@.... " "

> ;Her " profile identity is "

> ;emlezmom. " She claims to have treated her daughter

> to 60 treatments of HBOT in July, 2004 in Bolingbrook,

> Illinois--that Illinois Medicaid paid for. 60 treatments

> is 2x a day for all 30 days of the month--Saturday and

> Sunday too.

> With a screen-capture program I have made JPEG files of

> the unapproved posts. There's definitely a

> single-purpose pattern to these posts, just like the

> posts of JaniceC11945@.... You can see the JPEGS at

>

>

http://photos./group/medicaid/lst? & .dir=/26wkr & .src=gr & .v\

iew=t & .url=http://us.f1.fs.com/groups/g_4010157/26wkr/26wkr_6thPost---1.jpg\

?bc_8VrwB8Aq7wlSE & .cx=150 & .cy=67 & .type=u

>

> I have decided to make this public to the other members of

> the group because we will never have true community

> unless we have mutual trust and respect. That trust will

> never exist unless we are all truly honest about who we

> are and what our purposes and intentions are.

> In the future, if such deceitful activity occurs again,

> the deceit will be immediately disclosed. When the

> dishonesty is revealed, it's up to individual members to

> decide if they can ever trust the deceiver again.

> --

>

>

> Freels

> 2948 Windfield Circle

> Tucker, GA 30084-6714

> 770-491-6776 (phone)

> 720-234-5757 (fax)

> mailto:dfreels@...

>

> http://www.freelanceforum.org/df

>

>

[Guest guest]

Community, I am apalled and hurt my name is my daughters name is emily ,

she was born at 26 wks gestation in Lutheran General hospital at 560 grams

delivered by Dr McCulloch(OB) and cared for Dr Benwara in the NICU for 3 months

when she was transferred to Rush Copley Medical Center. My daughters webiste can

be found at www.emilyelizabeth.net, my true miracle had a rough start at life

but her and I are none other than what we claim to be, My new home address is 15

west Crofoot street Sandwich Illinois and my new telephone number is 815 751

6324, if you wish to run a background check my address on my liscence appears as

my previous address of 595 west Barberry circle. I am a member of several

preemies groups as well as infantile spasm groups. I would attach her and I's

picture and her birth record but email attachments are not permitted. I am

sitting here at my computer unable to see the keys clearly because I am crying

so hard, I do not think a bunch of strangers could hurt me this way I came here

because I wanted to meet other people involved in getting Medicaid to cover HBOT

as my daughter suffered a stroke in utero(PVL shown at 20 weeks) and during

premature labor lost her HR and had to be delivered just to be vigorously

resucitated for 10 minutes or so to even get a heartbeat, on DOL(day of life 5)

she suffered a grade IV bilateral intraventricular hemorrage leaving most of the

left hemisphere damaged and from the PET scan it does not seem like much is

funtioning normally which is where the hypsarrhythmia is coming from (west

syndrome/infantile spasms) they said the were from a focal point and we could

resect if nothing worked, thank heavens the meds worked, I do not know if HBOT

improved her seizures or the meds did or if it just improved her infection in

her leg bone but none the less she is much better now~ As I stated before, My

daughter did not recieve HBOT for CP though her neuro referred me originally,

but it was quite a benefit to have both conditions treated. I am sorry you feel

I am someone other than " 26wkrmom " though that is not my problem I came here for

advice and ideas for getting medicaid to pay for HBOT for my daughter to go

more, I was sorely mistaken in thinking " medicaid forHBOT " would be about

getting medicaid for HBOT but rather a public scrutinizing of whether or not I

am or my daughter is who we are

Niki

-------------- Original message --------------

>

>

> , & community,

>

>

>

> It seems like there is an easy solution to the current identity issue. Allow

> people to join and read postings anonymously. But before they are allowed to

> post they must provide their true name and primary contact information to the

> moderator (only). This information is verified prior to any postings. It

allows

> people to see what the group is about prior to giving up their true ID. It

stops

> the current issue. It would be similar to Internet dating websites. Members

> don't know who members are but the Webmaster knows. The second half of this

post

> is could be entirely made up and nobody here would know the difference. If

there

> was a concern about if what I wrote the moderator could contact me and ask me

to

> substantiate my writing. I would provide the moderator where and when I was

> treated. I’m elected not to share that information here because it is not

> significant. But for the record it was NOT at Magic Mountain.

>

>

>

> Why would people not want to use their real ID? There are many good/valid

> reasons and it just makes some more comfortable. Take my case. I'm an adult

male

> who experienced a serious TBI at age 44. I was a walking zombie for 18 months.

> HBO saved my life and I'll share that with anyone. But do I really want my

> clients knowing I was a walking zombie for 18 months? Do I want them to know I

> that I think I'm a " recovered " TBI victim? Not really. If they found out would

> it bother me? No, unless they took their business elsewhere. If I had to tell

my

> clients to improve HBO status I absolutely would tell my client. Without HBO I

> would not be here today to worry about losing their income.

>

>

>

> Most of the improvements I’ve read about here for the last 6-months are

> subjective. Here is one that is very quantitative that I wanted to share.

Prior

> to my accident I could complete a game of Minesweeper in 284 seconds (Thanks

> Bill Gates for automatically tracking my best time.) In the 18 months after my

> accident, my best time was 388 seconds. Basically, it took one-third longer to

> do something simple. Subsequent to my accident, the increased time to complete

> tasks was my second biggest complaint. As close as 5-hours prior to my first

HBO

> treatment there was no change in my status for 18 months. Then immediately

after

> the first 1-hour treatment there was a change. Not only did I notice that I

was

> humming to myself, but I was holding back my desire to skip out of the

treatment

> center. The change was so apparent my girlfriend noticed it within seconds

> during a long distance cell call conversation. I traveled all of two blocks

> before she was insisting on knowing what they did to me.

> In my opinion these two are subjective in nature and I dismissed it. My

> girlfriend did not. Now I wonder if she wasn’t correct. Subsequent to

treatment

> I’ve learned that brain scans can show a difference after 1 treatment. Why

> cannot the patient also feel this change? The good news is it doesn't matter.

> After the fifth treatment I knew it was work and the only questions were how

> much improvement and would it be permanent. Guess what, those Minesweeper

times

> improved 375, 354, 325, 299, 292, and yes eventually 265, faster than before

the

> accident. No there is some quantitative measurable data that is hare to

dismiss.

>

>

>

> I will publicly challenge all the nay-sayers out there to explain, how a

person

> can be stable zombie for 18 months change nothing except for HBO treatment and

> have this kind of improvement in 5-weeks that also happens to directly

> corresponds to the HBO treatment and not attribute it to HBO treatments?

>

>

>

> There are LOTS of issues regarding HBO that we could be debated but dosage

seems

> to be a topic that gets little attention and one that I’m VERY interested in.

> Dosage likely interests me because my successful treatment was non-standard

> combined with the fact that I have a difficult time understanding the current

> standard protocol. ly, it makes very little sense to me especially

> enlighten of my personal successful treatment. I’ll acknowledge that the

current

> standard is 5-days per week, 60 minute durations, at 1.5 ATA, for 40

treatments

> but either 1 per day for 8 weeks OR twice per day for 4 weeks.

>

>

>

>

>

>

> So now I want to challenge the HBO community/supporters like myself to a

dosage

> debate. Please explain:

>

>

>

> 1) Why it makes sense to be treated at 4 1/2 hours of separation? This means

the

> separation between the 2nd treatment of day #1 and the first dive of day #2 is

> 19 1/2 hours? I feel blessed that I was treated with very close to 12-hour

> separation. This was difficult for the treatment center but they did it and I

> appreciate it VERY much. The AMA regulates HBO as an antibiotic and the few

> prescriptions I've had say take very 4, 6, 8 hours. I have not yet to seen a

> prescription that says take at 8 AM and 12:30 PM only.

>

>

>

> 2) Why does it make sense to treat Monday through Friday? Last time I looked

our

> bodies functioned 7-days per week. If the 40 hours of separation from Friday

to

> Monday is good why not treat every other day? Personally, I experienced very

> significant regressions over the weekends when I wasn’t getting HBO

treatments.

> How could these regressions be beneficial? Again, the antibiotic prescriptions

> say take daily, not Monday through Friday.

>

>

>

> 3) There is a concern about oxygen toxicity. If treating 7-days per weeks is

an

> issue at 1.5 ATA twice daily for 60 minutes what about a lower pressure? There

> appears to be evidence that pressures lower than 1.5 ATA works equally as

well.

> I was treated at a higher pressure but I don't believe that improved my

results.

> Why not lower the pressure to avoid oxygen toxicity but increase the

frequency?

>

>

>

> 4) Why is 1-hour the standard treatment time? Which is better 1 treatment per

> day for 60 minutes or 2 treatments per day for 30 minutes each? The dosage of

> oxygen is the same but one is more concentrated. Wouldn’t uniform distribution

> be better? From my personal experience as an adult TBI patient, I strongly

> believe, that 24-hour separation is just too long, at least initially. I’m

> basing this on the fact that I experienced my first regression less than 24

> hours after my treatment. This means I would be experiencing mini regressions

> between each treatment if I was treated once per day, opposed to just having

> regressions over the weekend? How could these regressions regardless of daily

or

> weekly be good?

>

>

>

> 5) If HBO delivers oxygen throughout the body and encourages new capillary and

> neuron growth wouldn’t it make sense that the ideal treatment would change as

> this growth gets established? Does it make sense to treat patients the same

> during week #1 as it does during week #4 or week #8? Based on my individual

> experience with treatment and the regressions I experienced I would say there

> was a significant difference in what I needed at treatment progressed. I

noticed

> a significant difference in how I responded each week of my 5-week treatment.

> Clearly a changing dosage is harder to schedule but is it better?

>

>

>

> 6) Is it possible that the reason that there are two-treatment schedules

> twice/day for 4 weeks and once/day for 8 weeks is because neither is correct

and

> that a hybrid schedule would be better? I believe my twice/day 5-week

treatment

> was not long enough. Unfortunately, I have know way now of knowing what long

> enough would have been.

>

>

>

> Accepting the current standard treatment is 40 treatments, for 60 minutes, at

> 1.5 ATA. This is 2,400 minutes of treatment at 1.5 ATA over a treatment period

> of either 4 weeks with twice/daily or 8 weeks with once/daily treatments.

>

>

>

> What would happen to results if this same dosage were divided up differently?

>

>

>

> 1) 1.50 ATA; 45 minutes

>

> 11/01/04-11/12/04 twice a day (24 treatments)

>

> 11/13/04-11/26/04 once a day; (14 treatments)

>

> 11/27/04-12/10/04 once every 36 hours (9 treatments)

>

> 12/11/04-12/24/04 every other day (7 treatments)

>

>

>

> This is 54 treatments times 45-minutes times would be basically the same 2,430

> minutes of treatment at 1.5 ATA.

>

>

>

>

>

> 2) 1.35 ATA; 60 minutes

>

> 11/01/04-11/12/04 twice a day (24 treatments)

>

> 11/13/04-11/26/04 once a day; (14 treatments)

>

> 11/27/04-12/10/04 once every 36 hours (9 treatments)

>

> 12/11/04-12/24/04 every other day (7 treatments)

>

>

>

> This is 54 treatments times 60 minutes times this is 3,240 minutes of

treatment

> what pressure would give the same dosage as the current standard? Is 1.35 ATA

> about right?

>

>

>

> I don’t know the answers to any of these questions and I’m not sure that the

> answers are known but it should give this community something positive at

least

> non-negative to focus their energy on.

>

>

>

> I’m convinced that HBO works (at least in my case of an adult TBI) and I would

> encourage people thinking about it to try it. But I’m equally doubt that the

> current standard treatment protocol is optimized based on my experience and

just

> simple logic. So I toss this out to see what others have to say. It would be

> hard to tell how many of the patients are responding on this detailed level

> because of their age, condition or both. But there has to be some other people

> that were “aware” even if unable to function like myself. Alternatively, those

> that are in the industry as professional to help me understand why uniformly

> distributed treatments both within the day and throughout the week are not

more

> beneficial.

>

>

>

>

>

>

> rhartsoe wrote:

>

> Will the real 26wkrmom@... and the real

> JaniceC11945@... please step forward since thinks

> that I am these people.

>

> Also, will the real asecrecy@... and the real Ireal@

> ----- (I have forgotten the email address) step forward.

>

> There were a couple more also if I can look up some old

> emails.

>

> , what kind of game is this? You are making some

> serious allegations here. I hope you are fully prepared to

> back them up. I do not plan on defending them on this list,

> however, I am not a total idiot.

>

> Hartsoe

>

>

> > There has been a great deal of discussion these last few

> > days on the hyperbaric community finally coming together

> > as a true community. Many people have worked toward this

> > end for several years, some have worked for many, many

> > years.

> > Such a utopian community exists only when relationships

> > are based on mutual trust, but trust can only exist when

> > all parties concerned are honest with each other, when

> > everybody tells the truth about who they are and what

> > they're saying is actually true.

> > As the parent of a brain-injured child, I have found Truth

> > to be invaluable when making decisions on what is the

> > best and most appropriate care for our child. Since

> > neurologists can provide us no answers, as parents, we

> > have relied tremendously on the experience(s) of other

> > parents who have gone before us, depending in good faith

> > upon them to provide direction and guidance that we can

> > rely on.

> > This in turn has humbled me, and made me realize that I

> > too have an awesome responsibility to always tell other

> > parents the truth about what I know to be true and in

> > turn to also speak when I know something is not true

> > when the opposite is claimed instead. Often I try to set

> > the record straight without conflict but often the

> > conflict is just part of the mix. Squabbles result when

> > these disagreements occur, and it's often seen as petty

> > arguing, but it's not. Not really. We are all here to

> > arrive at the truth of what's best for our children and

> > sometimes these disagreements force the cream to rise to

> > the top during this process.

> > Sort of like pasteurization. You see, the truth will

> > always manifest itself.

> > Sadly, some six months ago, it was brought to my attention

> > by a number of parents who contacted me off-list that a

> > member of the listserv was using an

> > alias, pretending to be someone else. As the alias, this

> > person was claiming to be the mother of a brain-injured

> > child who had experienced tremendous success at only one

> > particular hyperbaric facility. This person even claimed

> > to have been at other clinics and " her " "

> > ;child " had never experienced as good results as

> > had been experienced at only one particular facility. This

> > person even claimed to have bought a portable Oxyhealth

> > chamber and after dozens of treatments decided to sell

> > the portable and go back to the one and only facility

> > where " her child " had experienced the most

> > improvents.

> > The parents told me who the alias belonged to, and I took

> > the suspect email address and did a search on the

> > archived messages for both the list

> > ( /messages)

> > and the NeuroHBOT list

> > (neurohbot/messages). I

> > read through twenty or thirty messages from each list and

> > came away convinced that the parents who contacted me

> > were correct. What most convinced me was the number of

> > times the alias used the word " crap. "

> > While I have had a number of disagreements with this

> > member, I cannot begin to describe to you the level of

> > disappointment and betrayal I felt. So I confronted

> > Hartsoe in an email (which I will post if

> > neccessary), and told him I knew all about "

> > ;JaniceC11945@... " , and expressed my

> > disappointment. I explained that parents depend on other

> > parent experiences when making critical decisions, and he

> > had violated that most sacred trust. He had even taken

> > advantage of that sacred trust for his own personal

> > gain. Further, the #1 comment skeptical traditional

> > practitioners make about those who advocate and provide

> > off-label HBOT for brain-injury is that all such people

> > are unscrupulous liars, and he had just provided them

> > the proof. His reply to me was denial, and he never

> > accepted responsibility.

> > At that time I assured that if such activity

> > occurred in the future I would not hesitate to fully

> > disclose what I knew about JaniceC11945@.... Even

> > though he denied using JaniceC11945@... as an alias,

> > all posts by JaniceC11945@... immediately ceased.

> >

> > Then last week amidst all the flurry of activity and

> > discussions about how to best help and Lief,

> > someone new joined the listserv. Because

> > of previous posts by spamming pornographers, all new

> > subscribers are automatically put on a moderated status.

> > When they make their first post I can see if they're

> > legitimate or not, and I'll usually lift the moderation.

> > Last Wednesday and Thursday I was out of town for

> > Thanksgiving and didn't have access to the Internet.

> > When I got back Friday I found a stack of pending

> > messages by this one new member, waiting to be approved.

> > I approved one or two. I hesitated to approve any more

> > because they all sounded so much like something written by

> > JaniceC11945@...--except the word " crap "

> > wasn't used.

> > Then, incredibly, this person also claimed to be the

> > mother of a brain-injured child, and even had the gall

> > to claim the child was born 14 weeks prematurely. My son

> > was born almost 12 weeks early, and I can assure you I

> > don't appreciate someone claiming our difficulty as an

> > identity without actually experiencing the heartache. I

> > don't appreciate someone so disrepecting the experience

> > of truly parenting a child born prematurely who's had

> > lifelong developmental disabilities. I don't appreciate

> > the insult, and I know the members of this list won't

> > appreciate it either.

> > After all the struggle Gilbert has endured on behalf

> > of Lief, I'm quite sure making light of the difficulty

> > our children face will hardly be something she

> > appreciates either.

> > This person doesn't sign her name and is only known by the

> > email address " 26wkrmom@.... " "

> > ;Her " profile identity is "

> > ;emlezmom. " She claims to have treated her daughter

> > to 60 treatments of HBOT in July, 2004 in Bolingbrook,

> > Illinois--that Illinois Medicaid paid for. 60 treatments

> > is 2x a day for all 30 days of the month--Saturday and

> > Sunday too.

> > With a screen-capture program I have made JPEG files of

> > the unapproved posts. There's definitely a

> > single-purpose pattern to these posts, just like the

> > posts of JaniceC11945@.... You can see the JPEGS at

> >

> >

>

http://photos./group/medicaid/lst? & .dir=/26wkr & .src=gr & .v

>

iew=t & .url=http://us.f1.fs.com/groups/g_4010157/26wkr/26wkr_6thPost---1.jpg

> ?bc_8VrwB8Aq7wlSE & .cx=150 & .cy=67 & .type=u

> >

> > I have decided to make this public to the other members of

> > the group because we will never have true community

> > unless we have mutual trust and respect. That trust will

> > never exist unless we are all truly honest about who we

> > are and what our purposes and intentions are.

> > In the future, if such deceitful activity occurs again,

> > the deceit will be immediately disclosed. When the

> > dishonesty is revealed, it's up to individual members to

> > decide if they can ever trust the deceiver again.

> > --

> >

> >

> > Freels

> > 2948 Windfield Circle

> > Tucker, GA 30084-6714

> > 770-491-6776 (phone)

> > 720-234-5757 (fax)

> > mailto:dfreels@...

> >

> > http://www.freelanceforum.org/df

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

, I know how you feel. I got a PhD with my injury. (Didn't know I

had an injury until the Army shaved my head at 30 and one side is flat with

a big crease. " Mom, what happened to me? " " Oh, that happened when you were

three and your Dad beat you and crushed that side of your skull and you were

unconscious for two weeks. " Yep, fun. In my case I'm able to do many

things I couldn't do before, and never knew I could do. Nice improvement.

:-)

I wrestled with whether to tell my Congressional colleagues and my employer

that I used to have holes in my head and now I didn't (see last brain scan

in the Congressional testimony from May 2002).

You have asked excellent questions on dosing, and I know that is one of the

major topics that will be discussed in the upcoming training planned for

early next year. In the meantime, I believe part of your question is

answered on the dosing article that is on the IHMA CD. If you'll provide

your snail mail address to Anita on a private post, she'll send you a copy

if you haven't seen it. It is about 1 1/2 inches of data double sided, so I

believe you'll find many helpful answers. I'll check and see if there is an

article on this in the new 4th edition of the KK Jain " Textbook of

Hyperbaric Medicine " as well.

Bill Duncan

Re: [ ] True community & adding HBO Dosage questions

, & community,

Why would people not want to use their real ID? There are many good/valid

reasons and it just makes some more comfortable. Take my case. I'm an adult

male who experienced a serious TBI at age 44. I was a walking zombie for 18

months. HBO saved my life and I'll share that with anyone. But do I really

want my clients knowing I was a walking zombie for 18 months? Do I want them

to know I that I think I'm a " recovered " TBI victim? Not really. If they

found out would it bother me? No, unless they took their business elsewhere.

If I had to tell my clients to improve HBO status I absolutely would tell my

client. Without HBO I would not be here today to worry about losing their

income.

Most of the improvements I've read about here for the last 6-months are

subjective. Here is one that is very quantitative that I wanted to share.

Prior to my accident I could complete a game of Minesweeper in 284 seconds

(Thanks Bill Gates for automatically tracking my best time.) In the 18

months after my accident, my best time was 388 seconds. Basically, it took

one-third longer to do something simple. Subsequent to my accident, the

increased time to complete tasks was my second biggest complaint. As close

as 5-hours prior to my first HBO treatment there was no change in my status

for 18 months. Then immediately after the first 1-hour treatment there was a

change. Not only did I notice that I was humming to myself, but I was

holding back my desire to skip out of the treatment center. The change was

so apparent my girlfriend noticed it within seconds during a long distance

cell call conversation. I traveled all of two blocks before she was

insisting on knowing what they did to me.

In my opinion these two are subjective in nature and I dismissed it. My

girlfriend did not. Now I wonder if she wasn't correct. Subsequent to

treatment I've learned that brain scans can show a difference after 1

treatment. Why cannot the patient also feel this change? The good news is it

doesn't matter. After the fifth treatment I knew it was work and the only

questions were how much improvement and would it be permanent. Guess what,

those Minesweeper times improved 375, 354, 325, 299, 292, and yes eventually

265, faster than before the accident. No there is some quantitative

measurable data that is hare to dismiss.

I will publicly challenge all the nay-sayers out there to explain, how a

person can be stable zombie for 18 months change nothing except for HBO

treatment and have this kind of improvement in 5-weeks that also happens to

directly corresponds to the HBO treatment and not attribute it to HBO

treatments?

There are LOTS of issues regarding HBO that we could be debated but dosage

seems to be a topic that gets little attention and one that I'm VERY

interested in. Dosage likely interests me because my successful treatment

was non-standard combined with the fact that I have a difficult time

understanding the current standard protocol. ly, it makes very little

sense to me especially enlighten of my personal successful treatment. I'll

acknowledge that the current standard is 5-days per week, 60 minute

durations, at 1.5 ATA, for 40 treatments but either 1 per day for 8 weeks OR

twice per day for 4 weeks.

So now I want to challenge the HBO community/supporters like myself to a

dosage debate. Please explain:

1) Why it makes sense to be treated at 4 1/2 hours of separation? This means

the separation between the 2nd treatment of day #1 and the first dive of day

#2 is 19 1/2 hours? I feel blessed that I was treated with very close to

12-hour separation. This was difficult for the treatment center but they did

it and I appreciate it VERY much. The AMA regulates HBO as an antibiotic and

the few prescriptions I've had say take very 4, 6, 8 hours. I have not yet

to seen a prescription that says take at 8 AM and 12:30 PM only.

2) Why does it make sense to treat Monday through Friday? Last time I looked

our bodies functioned 7-days per week. If the 40 hours of separation from

Friday to Monday is good why not treat every other day? Personally, I

experienced very significant regressions over the weekends when I wasn't

getting HBO treatments. How could these regressions be beneficial? Again,

the antibiotic prescriptions say take daily, not Monday through Friday.

3) There is a concern about oxygen toxicity. If treating 7-days per weeks is

an issue at 1.5 ATA twice daily for 60 minutes what about a lower pressure?

There appears to be evidence that pressures lower than 1.5 ATA works equally

as well. I was treated at a higher pressure but I don't believe that

improved my results. Why not lower the pressure to avoid oxygen toxicity but

increase the frequency?

4) Why is 1-hour the standard treatment time? Which is better 1 treatment

per day for 60 minutes or 2 treatments per day for 30 minutes each? The

dosage of oxygen is the same but one is more concentrated. Wouldn't uniform

distribution be better? From my personal experience as an adult TBI patient,

I strongly believe, that 24-hour separation is just too long, at least

initially. I'm basing this on the fact that I experienced my first

regression less than 24 hours after my treatment. This means I would be

experiencing mini regressions between each treatment if I was treated once

per day, opposed to just having regressions over the weekend? How could

these regressions regardless of daily or weekly be good?

5) If HBO delivers oxygen throughout the body and encourages new capillary

and neuron growth wouldn't it make sense that the ideal treatment would

change as this growth gets established? Does it make sense to treat patients

the same during week #1 as it does during week #4 or week #8? Based on my

individual experience with treatment and the regressions I experienced I

would say there was a significant difference in what I needed at treatment

progressed. I noticed a significant difference in how I responded each week

of my 5-week treatment. Clearly a changing dosage is harder to schedule but

is it better?

6) Is it possible that the reason that there are two-treatment schedules

twice/day for 4 weeks and once/day for 8 weeks is because neither is correct

and that a hybrid schedule would be better? I believe my twice/day 5-week

treatment was not long enough. Unfortunately, I have know way now of knowing

what long enough would have been.

Accepting the current standard treatment is 40 treatments, for 60 minutes,

at 1.5 ATA. This is 2,400 minutes of treatment at 1.5 ATA over a treatment

period of either 4 weeks with twice/daily or 8 weeks with once/daily

treatments.

What would happen to results if this same dosage were divided up

differently?

1) 1.50 ATA; 45 minutes

11/01/04-11/12/04 twice a day (24 treatments)

11/13/04-11/26/04 once a day; (14 treatments)

11/27/04-12/10/04 once every 36 hours (9 treatments)

12/11/04-12/24/04 every other day (7 treatments)

This is 54 treatments times 45-minutes times would be basically the same

2,430 minutes of treatment at 1.5 ATA.

2) 1.35 ATA; 60 minutes

11/01/04-11/12/04 twice a day (24 treatments)

11/13/04-11/26/04 once a day; (14 treatments)

11/27/04-12/10/04 once every 36 hours (9 treatments)

12/11/04-12/24/04 every other day (7 treatments)

This is 54 treatments times 60 minutes times this is 3,240 minutes of

treatment what pressure would give the same dosage as the current standard?

Is 1.35 ATA about right?

I don't know the answers to any of these questions and I'm not sure that the

answers are known but it should give this community something positive at

least non-negative to focus their energy on.

I'm convinced that HBO works (at least in my case of an adult TBI) and I

would encourage people thinking about it to try it. But I'm equally doubt

that the current standard treatment protocol is optimized based on my

experience and just simple logic. So I toss this out to see what others have

to say. It would be hard to tell how many of the patients are responding on

this detailed level because of their age, condition or both. But there has

to be some other people that were " aware " even if unable to function like

myself. Alternatively, those that are in the industry as professional to

help me understand why uniformly distributed treatments both within the day

and throughout the week are not more beneficial.

rhartsoe <rhartsoe@...> wrote:

Will the real 26wkrmom@... and the real

JaniceC11945@... please step forward since thinks

that I am these people.

Also, will the real asecrecy@... and the real Ireal@

----- (I have forgotten the email address) step forward.

There were a couple more also if I can look up some old

emails.

, what kind of game is this? You are making some

serious allegations here. I hope you are fully prepared to

back them up. I do not plan on defending them on this list,

however, I am not a total idiot.

Hartsoe

> There has been a great deal of discussion these last few

> days on the hyperbaric community finally coming together

> as a true community. Many people have worked toward this

> end for several years, some have worked for many, many

> years.

> Such a utopian community exists only when relationships

> are based on mutual trust, but trust can only exist when

> all parties concerned are honest with each other, when

> everybody tells the truth about who they are and what

> they're saying is actually true.

> As the parent of a brain-injured child, I have found Truth

> to be invaluable when making decisions on what is the

> best and most appropriate care for our child. Since

> neurologists can provide us no answers, as parents, we

> have relied tremendously on the experience(s) of other

> parents who have gone before us, depending in good faith

> upon them to provide direction and guidance that we can

> rely on.

> This in turn has humbled me, and made me realize that I

> too have an awesome responsibility to always tell other

> parents the truth about what I know to be true and in

> turn to also speak when I know something is not true

> when the opposite is claimed instead. Often I try to set

> the record straight without conflict but often the

> conflict is just part of the mix. Squabbles result when

> these disagreements occur, and it's often seen as petty

> arguing, but it's not. Not really. We are all here to

> arrive at the truth of what's best for our children and

> sometimes these disagreements force the cream to rise to

> the top during this process.

> Sort of like pasteurization. You see, the truth will

> always manifest itself.

> Sadly, some six months ago, it was brought to my attention

> by a number of parents who contacted me off-list that a

> member of the listserv was using an

> alias, pretending to be someone else. As the alias, this

> person was claiming to be the mother of a brain-injured

> child who had experienced tremendous success at only one

> particular hyperbaric facility. This person even claimed

> to have been at other clinics and " her " "

> ;child " had never experienced as good results as

> had been experienced at only one particular facility. This

> person even claimed to have bought a portable Oxyhealth

> chamber and after dozens of treatments decided to sell

> the portable and go back to the one and only facility

> where " her child " had experienced the most

> improvents.

> The parents told me who the alias belonged to, and I took

> the suspect email address and did a search on the

> archived messages for both the list

> ( /messages)

> and the NeuroHBOT list

> (neurohbot/messages). I

> read through twenty or thirty messages from each list and

> came away convinced that the parents who contacted me

> were correct. What most convinced me was the number of

> times the alias used the word " crap. "

> While I have had a number of disagreements with this

> member, I cannot begin to describe to you the level of

> disappointment and betrayal I felt. So I confronted

> Hartsoe in an email (which I will post if

> neccessary), and told him I knew all about "

> ;JaniceC11945@... " , and expressed my

> disappointment. I explained that parents depend on other

> parent experiences when making critical decisions, and he

> had violated that most sacred trust. He had even taken

> advantage of that sacred trust for his own personal

> gain. Further, the #1 comment skeptical traditional

> practitioners make about those who advocate and provide

> off-label HBOT for brain-injury is that all such people

> are unscrupulous liars, and he had just provided them

> the proof. His reply to me was denial, and he never

> accepted responsibility.

> At that time I assured that if such activity

> occurred in the future I would not hesitate to fully

> disclose what I knew about JaniceC11945@.... Even

> though he denied using JaniceC11945@... as an alias,

> all posts by JaniceC11945@... immediately ceased.

>

> Then last week amidst all the flurry of activity and

> discussions about how to best help and Lief,

> someone new joined the listserv. Because

> of previous posts by spamming pornographers, all new

> subscribers are automatically put on a moderated status.

> When they make their first post I can see if they're

> legitimate or not, and I'll usually lift the moderation.

> Last Wednesday and Thursday I was out of town for

> Thanksgiving and didn't have access to the Internet.

> When I got back Friday I found a stack of pending

> messages by this one new member, waiting to be approved.

> I approved one or two. I hesitated to approve any more

> because they all sounded so much like something written by

> JaniceC11945@...--except the word " crap "

> wasn't used.

> Then, incredibly, this person also claimed to be the

> mother of a brain-injured child, and even had the gall

> to claim the child was born 14 weeks prematurely. My son

> was born almost 12 weeks early, and I can assure you I

> don't appreciate someone claiming our difficulty as an

> identity without actually experiencing the heartache. I

> don't appreciate someone so disrepecting the experience

> of truly parenting a child born prematurely who's had

> lifelong developmental disabilities. I don't appreciate

> the insult, and I know the members of this list won't

> appreciate it either.

> After all the struggle Gilbert has endured on behalf

> of Lief, I'm quite sure making light of the difficulty

> our children face will hardly be something she

> appreciates either.

> This person doesn't sign her name and is only known by the

> email address " 26wkrmom@.... " "

> ;Her " profile identity is "

> ;emlezmom. " She claims to have treated her daughter

> to 60 treatments of HBOT in July, 2004 in Bolingbrook,

> Illinois--that Illinois Medicaid paid for. 60 treatments

> is 2x a day for all 30 days of the month--Saturday and

> Sunday too.

> With a screen-capture program I have made JPEG files of

> the unapproved posts. There's definitely a

> single-purpose pattern to these posts, just like the

> posts of JaniceC11945@.... You can see the JPEGS at

>

>

http://photos./group/medicaid/lst? & .dir=/26wkr & .src=g

r & .view=t & .url=http://us.f1.fs.com/groups/g_4010157/26wkr/26wkr_6thPost

---1.jpg?bc_8VrwB8Aq7wlSE & .cx=150 & .cy=67 & .type=u

>

> I have decided to make this public to the other members of

> the group because we will never have true community

> unless we have mutual trust and respect. That trust will

> never exist unless we are all truly honest about who we

> are and what our purposes and intentions are.

> In the future, if such deceitful activity occurs again,

> the deceit will be immediately disclosed. When the

> dishonesty is revealed, it's up to individual members to

> decide if they can ever trust the deceiver again.

> --

>

>

> Freels

> 2948 Windfield Circle

> Tucker, GA 30084-6714

> 770-491-6776 (phone)

> 720-234-5757 (fax)

> mailto:dfreels@...

>

> http://www.freelanceforum.org/df

>

>