Re: [MedicaidforHDOT] Inflatable chambers & O2

[Guest guest]

Christy,

We pay $200 a treatment in a monochamber at a hospital in Texas. We're happy

also that there is one within driving distance and so far we've been able to

schedule treatments around our daughter's school day. So that's worth something

too, especially if there other children in the family. :-)

DHurd

Re: [MedicaidforHDOT] Inflatable chambers & O2

In a message dated 7/1/2003 7:34:49 PM Central Daylight Time,

FAMANSON@... writes:

> Christy,

>

> You asked the group how much; a used hbot chamber might cost and what were

> the costs ofoperation. Having gone through all of this about 3 years ago

i

> have

> an idea of what is involved.

>

>

Christy after going through this myself I can tell you also. The room

conversion and the storage place for O2 tanks as well as all permits the

fighting we

had to do get the approval, as well as the cost of chamber and installation

we

spent close to $95,000.00. We could have done it a lot cheaper and still

would have been well within guidelines. However most of my money was spent

on the

room conversion. I wanted a large room with a sitting area. I think the room

is alike 21 x 24. The chamber and installation and first month oxygen was

only

$59,000.00 and that was with a Sechrist 2500B. So the expense to me was a

lot

and if you want the best and safest system I think you will have to spend

what

we spent. We went with every bell and whistle to protect and make it as safe

as possible.

OK now let me tell you the downside of doing this. First the responsibility

lay's on your shoulders if something should ever go wrong. Finding a Dr.

that

will be willing to monitor the treatments and prescribe them for you in your

area. It is not necessary but helpful when trying to get approval in your

town

with the local fire Marshall. Another thing they had me take a safety course

and a Hyperbaric Course and I was trained at a free standing facility for

two

weeks every day for 8 hours a day. Next trying to find an Oxygen Supplier

that

will be willing to deliver to you in your area first off that will determine

what type of Oxygen you will need to get weather it be Liquid or so on. Then

getting past the inspections which was OK for us because of all the safety

courses I went through. Plus we used an awesome installer and company to go

through

the best around. The Company that you are using to install if they do not

require you go through a safety and a Hyoerbaric course that would concern

me.

Then you need to have a very large drive for the Oxygen truck to be able to

drive

up to drop off the tanks. Plus we had to go through our home owners

association to get approval from them to allow us to put it in. You have to

increase

your insurance. We had to add fire protection as well. They did not ask us

to

but we did it to make it safer. People often think man I wanna do this at

home

so we won't have to the travel and so forth and yes it has saved us time and

Money from all the travel. But do I worry about the unknown you bet. I worry

everyday. I do a daily check on everything. I check all the equipment

several

times a day keep a daily log. There are other great issues that you have to

face

also owning your own Chamber that I have not went over. It anyone thinks it

is

a cake walk it is not. These clinics are not making a fortune when treating

our kid's most think they are but they are not. It cost me around $165.00

for a

tank of Oxygen I get around 7 to 10 treatment hours. People say wow that is

only $16.50 a treatment is you get ten treatments. No, your wrong. Now

figure

in the cost of the equipment and everything you put into it.

Now $16.50 lets really look at this. Now there is now trained Dr. on site at

your home, you are performing the treatment instead of a tech. Look at the

man

hours you had to put into it to get your certification. Look at all the

other

stuff you have to do like ordering the o2 having to deal with all the other

stuff other than just treating your child. If you ask me if it was worth it

to

me. I will tell you if I had it all to do over again I would spend the

$95,000.00 investing in a clinic trying to work something out with them on a

treatment plan that way I did not have all the worries and headaches. You

guy's have

no Idea how many Hours IM reading on safety as well as Hyoerbarics In

general.

If you have the money and your going to invest in a chamber make sure it is

something your really ready to do it is a lot of work time and commitment.

Several road blocks will come.

Darin.

[Guest guest]

Prices in the USA range from $100 to $250 with most free standing centers

closer to $200 than $150. Obviously, if you go to a center that is less

expensive but have to pay lodging and meals you could have stayed home if

you have a chamber in your local community.

KP Stoller, MD, FAAP

Assistant Clinical Prof, UNM HSC Dept Pediatrics

Simply Hyperbarics

www.simplyhyperbarics.com

> Guys, thanks for all the information on the home based system. It

> really helped us realize that it probably is not worth it right now to

> invest in such a system, but I admire those that have!! We are in

> Tampa, FL and are looking at spending $225 a treatment in a monoplace

> chamber for our son. Is that an average price? I thought it was a

> little expensive, but it is local so we won't have to worry about travel

> and accomadations. Thanks again for the info! Christy

> Re: [MedicaidforHDOT] Inflatable chambers & O2

>

>

> In a message dated 7/1/2003 7:34:49 PM Central Daylight Time,

> FAMANSON@... writes:

>

> > Christy,

> >

> > You asked the group how much; a used hbot chamber might cost and

> what were the costs ofoperation. Having gone through all of this

> about 3 years ago i have

> > an idea of what is involved.

> >

> >

>

> Christy after going through this myself I can tell you also. The room

> conversion and the storage place for O2 tanks as well as all permits

> the fighting we had to do get the approval, as well as the cost of

> chamber and installation we spent close to $95,000.00. We could have

> done it a lot cheaper and still would have been well within

> guidelines. However most of my money was spent on the room

> conversion. I wanted a large room with a sitting area. I think the

> room is alike 21 x 24. The chamber and installation and first month

> oxygen was only $59,000.00 and that was with a Sechrist 2500B. So the

> expense to me was a lot and if you want the best and safest system I

> think you will have to spend what we spent. We went with every bell

> and whistle to protect and make it as safe as possible.

>

> OK now let me tell you the downside of doing this. First the

> responsibility lay's on your shoulders if something should ever go

> wrong. Finding a Dr. that will be willing to monitor the treatments

> and prescribe them for you in your area. It is not necessary but

> helpful when trying to get approval in your town with the local fire

> Marshall. Another thing they had me take a safety course and a

> Hyperbaric Course and I was trained at a free standing facility for

> two weeks every day for 8 hours a day. Next trying to find an Oxygen

> Supplier that will be willing to deliver to you in your area first

> off that will determine what type of Oxygen you will need to get

> weather it be Liquid or so on. Then getting past the inspections

> which was OK for us because of all the safety courses I went through.

> Plus we used an awesome installer and company to go through the best

> around. The Company that you are using to install if they do not

> require you go through a safety and a Hyoerbaric course that would

> concern me. Then you need to have a very large drive for the Oxygen

> truck to be able to drive up to drop off the tanks. Plus we had to go

> through our home owners association to get approval from them to

> allow us to put it in. You have to increase your insurance. We had to

> add fire protection as well. They did not ask us to but we did it to

> make it safer. People often think man I wanna do this at home so we

> won't have to the travel and so forth and yes it has saved us time and

> Money from all the travel. But do I worry about the unknown you bet.

> I worry everyday. I do a daily check on everything. I check all the

> equipment several times a day keep a daily log. There are other great

> issues that you have to face also owning your own Chamber that I have

> not went over. It anyone thinks it is a cake walk it is not. These

> clinics are not making a fortune when treating our kid's most think

> they are but they are not. It cost me around $165.00 for a tank of

> Oxygen I get around 7 to 10 treatment hours. People say wow that is

> only $16.50 a treatment is you get ten treatments. No, your wrong. Now

> figure in the cost of the equipment and everything you put into it.

>

> Now $16.50 lets really look at this. Now there is now trained Dr. on

> site at your home, you are performing the treatment instead of a

> tech. Look at the man hours you had to put into it to get your

> certification. Look at all the other stuff you have to do like

> ordering the o2 having to deal with all the other stuff other than

> just treating your child. If you ask me if it was worth it to me. I

> will tell you if I had it all to do over again I would spend the

> $95,000.00 investing in a clinic trying to work something out with

> them on a treatment plan that way I did not have all the worries and

> headaches. You guy's have no Idea how many Hours IM reading on safety

> as well as Hyoerbarics In general. If you have the money and your

> going to invest in a chamber make sure it is something your really

> ready to do it is a lot of work time and commitment. Several road

> blocks will come.

>

> Darin.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

At Miracle Mountain, the cost is $3500 which INCLUDES: housing, Sound

Harmonics (normally 1200.+), Essential Oil Massage and Training on how to

use essential oils with your child, Use of our Quadracizer Patterning

Equipment, Cranio-Sacral Therapy, Free rides on our Miniature railroad, Free

rides on our specially trained miniature UK Shetland ponies, a free trip to

Greenfield Buffet Dinner, and lots of love and prayer. Oh yes, it includes

40 sessions of HBOT. If you fly in, we can arrange for free flights with

Miracle Flights and we pick you up at the airport. If you need to go for

groceries or shopping, you can usually go with another client or we can loan

you a mini van.

In the case of hardship cases, we have grants available through Beacon

Ministries. If you have a brain injured child and you want hbot for your

child and feel their is absolutely no way you can make it happen, contact me

before you decide it will not happen.

Hartsoe

www.miraclemountain.org

Re: [MedicaidforHDOT] Inflatable chambers & O2

> >

> >

> > In a message dated 7/1/2003 7:34:49 PM Central Daylight Time,

> > FAMANSON@... writes:

> >

> > > Christy,

> > >

> > > You asked the group how much; a used hbot chamber might cost and

> > what were the costs ofoperation. Having gone through all of this

> > about 3 years ago i have

> > > an idea of what is involved.

> > >

> > >

> >

> > Christy after going through this myself I can tell you also. The room

> > conversion and the storage place for O2 tanks as well as all permits

> > the fighting we had to do get the approval, as well as the cost of

> > chamber and installation we spent close to $95,000.00. We could have

> > done it a lot cheaper and still would have been well within

> > guidelines. However most of my money was spent on the room

> > conversion. I wanted a large room with a sitting area. I think the

> > room is alike 21 x 24. The chamber and installation and first month

> > oxygen was only $59,000.00 and that was with a Sechrist 2500B. So the

> > expense to me was a lot and if you want the best and safest system I

> > think you will have to spend what we spent. We went with every bell

> > and whistle to protect and make it as safe as possible.

> >

> > OK now let me tell you the downside of doing this. First the

> > responsibility lay's on your shoulders if something should ever go

> > wrong. Finding a Dr. that will be willing to monitor the treatments

> > and prescribe them for you in your area. It is not necessary but

> > helpful when trying to get approval in your town with the local fire

> > Marshall. Another thing they had me take a safety course and a

> > Hyperbaric Course and I was trained at a free standing facility for

> > two weeks every day for 8 hours a day. Next trying to find an Oxygen

> > Supplier that will be willing to deliver to you in your area first

> > off that will determine what type of Oxygen you will need to get

> > weather it be Liquid or so on. Then getting past the inspections

> > which was OK for us because of all the safety courses I went through.

> > Plus we used an awesome installer and company to go through the best

> > around. The Company that you are using to install if they do not

> > require you go through a safety and a Hyoerbaric course that would

> > concern me. Then you need to have a very large drive for the Oxygen

> > truck to be able to drive up to drop off the tanks. Plus we had to go

> > through our home owners association to get approval from them to

> > allow us to put it in. You have to increase your insurance. We had to

> > add fire protection as well. They did not ask us to but we did it to

> > make it safer. People often think man I wanna do this at home so we

> > won't have to the travel and so forth and yes it has saved us time and

> > Money from all the travel. But do I worry about the unknown you bet.

> > I worry everyday. I do a daily check on everything. I check all the

> > equipment several times a day keep a daily log. There are other great

> > issues that you have to face also owning your own Chamber that I have

> > not went over. It anyone thinks it is a cake walk it is not. These

> > clinics are not making a fortune when treating our kid's most think

> > they are but they are not. It cost me around $165.00 for a tank of

> > Oxygen I get around 7 to 10 treatment hours. People say wow that is

> > only $16.50 a treatment is you get ten treatments. No, your wrong. Now

> > figure in the cost of the equipment and everything you put into it.

> >

> > Now $16.50 lets really look at this. Now there is now trained Dr. on

> > site at your home, you are performing the treatment instead of a

> > tech. Look at the man hours you had to put into it to get your

> > certification. Look at all the other stuff you have to do like

> > ordering the o2 having to deal with all the other stuff other than

> > just treating your child. If you ask me if it was worth it to me. I

> > will tell you if I had it all to do over again I would spend the

> > $95,000.00 investing in a clinic trying to work something out with

> > them on a treatment plan that way I did not have all the worries and

> > headaches. You guy's have no Idea how many Hours IM reading on safety

> > as well as Hyoerbarics In general. If you have the money and your

> > going to invest in a chamber make sure it is something your really

> > ready to do it is a lot of work time and commitment. Several road

> > blocks will come.

> >

> > Darin.

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Dear Ed:

Reimers also did all the engineering and set up for the Lufkin Hyperbaric

Center. He is a super guy!! I wish you all the best in getting Sacramento

opened. Tammy

[Guest guest]

Christy,

There area few clinics that can even get below $150/HBOT. But, they tend

to be more rural based where they can inherently avoid some of the extra

safety costs and urban wages. Thus, they inherently require travel.

An example is the Chico HBOT center run by Mitch Hoggart. They are only

100 (?) miles from Sacramento, but Chico is much less developed. Also,

they have a multiplace chamber so they can operate at lower costs on

several levels (multiplace chambers are less expensive to buy and operate

once they reach minimal patient levels). I think they charge $135/session.

But, from Sacramento, you would still have to overnight to be

practical. Thus, even at 2 sessions per day, it could become more expensive.

RE: $225. It sounds high, but, a operating a good and capable center is

expensive.

Reimbursement is the only answer for all these challenges for parents and

patients.

Best Wishes,

Ed Nemeth

At 06:09 AM 7/2/2003, you wrote:

>Guys, thanks for all the information on the home based system. It really

>helped us realize that it probably is not worth it right now to invest in

>such a system, but I admire those that have!! We are in Tampa, FL and are

>looking at spending $225 a treatment in a monoplace chamber for our

>son. Is that an average price? I thought it was a little expensive, but

>it is local so we won't have to worry about travel and

>accomadations. Thanks again for the info!

>Christy

> Re: [MedicaidforHDOT] Inflatable chambers & O2

>

>

> In a message dated 7/1/2003 7:34:49 PM Central Daylight Time,

> FAMANSON@... writes:

>

> > Christy,

> >

> > You asked the group how much; a used hbot chamber might cost and what

> were

> > the costs ofoperation. Having gone through all of this about 3 years

> ago i

> > have

> > an idea of what is involved.

> >

> >

>

> Christy after going through this myself I can tell you also. The room

> conversion and the storage place for O2 tanks as well as all permits

> the fighting we

> had to do get the approval, as well as the cost of chamber and

> installation we

> spent close to $95,000.00. We could have done it a lot cheaper and still

> would have been well within guidelines. However most of my money was

> spent on the

> room conversion. I wanted a large room with a sitting area. I think the

> room

> is alike 21 x 24. The chamber and installation and first month oxygen

> was only

> $59,000.00 and that was with a Sechrist 2500B. So the expense to me was

> a lot

> and if you want the best and safest system I think you will have to

> spend what

> we spent. We went with every bell and whistle to protect and make it as

> safe

> as possible.

>

> OK now let me tell you the downside of doing this. First the

> responsibility

> lay's on your shoulders if something should ever go wrong. Finding a

> Dr. that

> will be willing to monitor the treatments and prescribe them for you in

> your

> area. It is not necessary but helpful when trying to get approval in

> your town

> with the local fire Marshall. Another thing they had me take a safety

> course

> and a Hyperbaric Course and I was trained at a free standing facility

> for two

> weeks every day for 8 hours a day. Next trying to find an Oxygen

> Supplier that

> will be willing to deliver to you in your area first off that will

> determine

> what type of Oxygen you will need to get weather it be Liquid or so on.

> Then

> getting past the inspections which was OK for us because of all the safety

> courses I went through. Plus we used an awesome installer and company

> to go through

> the best around. The Company that you are using to install if they do not

> require you go through a safety and a Hyoerbaric course that would

> concern me.

> Then you need to have a very large drive for the Oxygen truck to be

> able to drive

> up to drop off the tanks. Plus we had to go through our home owners

> association to get approval from them to allow us to put it in. You

> have to increase

> your insurance. We had to add fire protection as well. They did not ask

> us to

> but we did it to make it safer. People often think man I wanna do this

> at home

> so we won't have to the travel and so forth and yes it has saved us

> time and

> Money from all the travel. But do I worry about the unknown you bet. I

> worry

> everyday. I do a daily check on everything. I check all the equipment

> several

> times a day keep a daily log. There are other great issues that you

> have to face

> also owning your own Chamber that I have not went over. It anyone

> thinks it is

> a cake walk it is not. These clinics are not making a fortune when

> treating

> our kid's most think they are but they are not. It cost me around

> $165.00 for a

> tank of Oxygen I get around 7 to 10 treatment hours. People say wow

> that is

> only $16.50 a treatment is you get ten treatments. No, your wrong. Now

> figure

> in the cost of the equipment and everything you put into it.

>

> Now $16.50 lets really look at this. Now there is now trained Dr. on

> site at

> your home, you are performing the treatment instead of a tech. Look at

> the man

> hours you had to put into it to get your certification. Look at all the

> other

> stuff you have to do like ordering the o2 having to deal with all the

> other

> stuff other than just treating your child. If you ask me if it was

> worth it to

> me. I will tell you if I had it all to do over again I would spend the

> $95,000.00 investing in a clinic trying to work something out with them

> on a

> treatment plan that way I did not have all the worries and headaches.

> You guy's have

> no Idea how many Hours IM reading on safety as well as Hyoerbarics In

> general.

> If you have the money and your going to invest in a chamber make sure

> it is

> something your really ready to do it is a lot of work time and commitment.

> Several road blocks will come.

>

> Darin.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

,

This is an incredible value.

Especially the " lots of love and prayer " . This is the best " healing agent "

yet!

Keep up the good work!

Warm Regards,

Ed Nemeth

At 08:23 AM 7/2/2003, you wrote:

>At Miracle Mountain, the cost is $3500 which INCLUDES: housing, Sound

>Harmonics (normally 1200.+), Essential Oil Massage and Training on how to

>use essential oils with your child, Use of our Quadracizer Patterning

>Equipment, Cranio-Sacral Therapy, Free rides on our Miniature railroad, Free

>rides on our specially trained miniature UK Shetland ponies, a free trip to

>Greenfield Buffet Dinner, and lots of love and prayer. Oh yes, it includes

>40 sessions of HBOT. If you fly in, we can arrange for free flights with

>Miracle Flights and we pick you up at the airport. If you need to go for

>groceries or shopping, you can usually go with another client or we can loan

>you a mini van.

>

>In the case of hardship cases, we have grants available through Beacon

>Ministries. If you have a brain injured child and you want hbot for your

>child and feel their is absolutely no way you can make it happen, contact me

>before you decide it will not happen.

>

> Hartsoe

>www.miraclemountain.org

>

>

> Re: [MedicaidforHDOT] Inflatable chambers & O2

> > >

> > >

> > > In a message dated 7/1/2003 7:34:49 PM Central Daylight Time,

> > > FAMANSON@... writes:

> > >

> > > > Christy,

> > > >

> > > > You asked the group how much; a used hbot chamber might cost and

> > > what were the costs ofoperation. Having gone through all of this

> > > about 3 years ago i have

> > > > an idea of what is involved.

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > Christy after going through this myself I can tell you also. The room

> > > conversion and the storage place for O2 tanks as well as all permits

> > > the fighting we had to do get the approval, as well as the cost of

> > > chamber and installation we spent close to $95,000.00. We could have

> > > done it a lot cheaper and still would have been well within

> > > guidelines. However most of my money was spent on the room

> > > conversion. I wanted a large room with a sitting area. I think the

> > > room is alike 21 x 24. The chamber and installation and first month

> > > oxygen was only $59,000.00 and that was with a Sechrist 2500B. So the

> > > expense to me was a lot and if you want the best and safest system I

> > > think you will have to spend what we spent. We went with every bell

> > > and whistle to protect and make it as safe as possible.

> > >

> > > OK now let me tell you the downside of doing this. First the

> > > responsibility lay's on your shoulders if something should ever go

> > > wrong. Finding a Dr. that will be willing to monitor the treatments

> > > and prescribe them for you in your area. It is not necessary but

> > > helpful when trying to get approval in your town with the local fire

> > > Marshall. Another thing they had me take a safety course and a

> > > Hyperbaric Course and I was trained at a free standing facility for

> > > two weeks every day for 8 hours a day. Next trying to find an Oxygen

> > > Supplier that will be willing to deliver to you in your area first

> > > off that will determine what type of Oxygen you will need to get

> > > weather it be Liquid or so on. Then getting past the inspections

> > > which was OK for us because of all the safety courses I went through.

> > > Plus we used an awesome installer and company to go through the best

> > > around. The Company that you are using to install if they do not

> > > require you go through a safety and a Hyoerbaric course that would

> > > concern me. Then you need to have a very large drive for the Oxygen

> > > truck to be able to drive up to drop off the tanks. Plus we had to go

> > > through our home owners association to get approval from them to

> > > allow us to put it in. You have to increase your insurance. We had to

> > > add fire protection as well. They did not ask us to but we did it to

> > > make it safer. People often think man I wanna do this at home so we

> > > won't have to the travel and so forth and yes it has saved us time and

> > > Money from all the travel. But do I worry about the unknown you bet.

> > > I worry everyday. I do a daily check on everything. I check all the

> > > equipment several times a day keep a daily log. There are other great

> > > issues that you have to face also owning your own Chamber that I have

> > > not went over. It anyone thinks it is a cake walk it is not. These

> > > clinics are not making a fortune when treating our kid's most think

> > > they are but they are not. It cost me around $165.00 for a tank of

> > > Oxygen I get around 7 to 10 treatment hours. People say wow that is

> > > only $16.50 a treatment is you get ten treatments. No, your wrong. Now

> > > figure in the cost of the equipment and everything you put into it.

> > >

> > > Now $16.50 lets really look at this. Now there is now trained Dr. on

> > > site at your home, you are performing the treatment instead of a

> > > tech. Look at the man hours you had to put into it to get your

> > > certification. Look at all the other stuff you have to do like

> > > ordering the o2 having to deal with all the other stuff other than

> > > just treating your child. If you ask me if it was worth it to me. I

> > > will tell you if I had it all to do over again I would spend the

> > > $95,000.00 investing in a clinic trying to work something out with

> > > them on a treatment plan that way I did not have all the worries and

> > > headaches. You guy's have no Idea how many Hours IM reading on safety

> > > as well as Hyoerbarics In general. If you have the money and your

> > > going to invest in a chamber make sure it is something your really

> > > ready to do it is a lot of work time and commitment. Several road

> > > blocks will come.

> > >

> > > Darin.

> > >

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

Liability is everything these days. I hear you on that issue.

Many physicians in many states are leaving medicine due to liability.

At 08:39 PM 7/1/2003, you wrote:

>In a message dated 7/1/2003 9:14:20 PM Central Daylight Time,

>nemeth@... writes:

>

> > You know you really have almost enough together to have a modest

> > clinic. And, your detailed and cautious nature is exactly what is needed

> > to do this safely and in a manner that is helpful to kids.

> >

> > But, to open your chamber to others really opens a can of worms and costs.

> > re: liability, acting as a clinic, etc.

> >

> > I know I would be terrified of the liability if I allowed someone to use a

> > chamber in my house.... but, then I would also be empassioned enough to

> > allow it to happen.

> >

> > I just hope Caitlyn is doing well!

> >

> > Warm Regards and Blessings,

> >

> >

>

>Ed, I would never open my home to treat another Child because of the

>liability. Never. For one that would be wrong of me. Plus the liabilty

>factor is a big

>Issue. Yes, What I put in my home is equivalent to a small clinic. We really

>went overboard but I felt it was the only way. We recently added therapy

>tables with a wedge system for therapy and therapy ball's. We are in the

>process of

>getting the Neuropulse. I didn't want anyone to ever come to the house and

>see a partially done JOB. I can say that the company I used was one of the

>most

>professional Company's in the field of Hyperbarics. I respect them very

>highly. They provided me with full blueprints to provide to the Fire

>Marshall. In

>fact it was one of there requirements for me to take a safety and operation

>course. Ed, I have a very soft heart as well. It kill's me seeing Kids that

>can't be treated but I know I have to protect Katlyn that is why I treat

>her only.

>If there were no legal issues involved and no Liability on my part to treat

>others I still don't know if I would. For one I don't have a Dr. on hand

>although I have been trained and IM very comfortable in treating. I

>personally feel

>the Mono Place using 100% oxygen should be monitored in clinic with a Dr.

>near

>by. Katlyn treat's here at home but we are less than five minutes from her

>Dr. and a major hospital. We see regularly for ear check ups and other

>issues to

>monitor her. This is just a precautionary measure. At Neubauers you see him

>after every ten treatments they way we are treating now 15 to 20 treatments

>every two months apart or longer we see him after every block of 20 for a

>Check

>up. Some may take that as extreme. However I can't help that. I also keep

>a log

>of every treatment. As well as a daily Log on Kaltyn. Ed, just knowing what I

>meant through trying to get this Chamber in at the house I admire you for

>your work with your clinic. I worked with the company for over a year

>before we

>ever got to start working on installing our chamber. The stuff I had to do

>was

>unreal. Oneday it will be standard practice for HBOT to be given and we wont

>need home chambers. Till then we are still fighting the battle.

>

>Darin

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Rheimers has also carried the ball through my Sacramento " Fire Marshall " mess.

At 08:55 PM 7/1/2003, you wrote:

>I personally would recommend Reimer System's when thinking of a Chamber. They

>are excellent and wonderful to work with. And are very professional in there

>installations.

>

>Darin

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Also

Christy:

There is a place in Winter Park..............which would be about an hour for

you.......they have monoplace and advertise 100.00 a treatment............I

am calling tomorrow.........that is alot closer for me..............I am in the

Panhandle of Florida and took Mom to San before........

They have a Mc nearby too..............they also advertise if

familys of three come at the same time it is reduced to 60.00 per

treatment..........I am calling tomorrow and getting the details.........I will

post it if

you want...........I cannot afford 200.00 a treatment

Dee Dee and Bridget

[Guest guest]

I sure do miss your church there .

Tell Pastor Chuck Mama and I say hello.

Dee Dee and Bridget

[Guest guest]

I already contacted the Winter Park location and I was told that the doctors are

spliting up and they will be closing the location in August. I will try them

back as well to double check. I was pretty dissappointed!!

Re: [MedicaidforHDOT] Inflatable chambers & O2

Also

Christy:

There is a place in Winter Park..............which would be about an hour for

you.......they have monoplace and advertise 100.00 a treatment............I

am calling tomorrow.........that is alot closer for me..............I am in

the

Panhandle of Florida and took Mom to San before........

They have a Mc nearby too..............they also advertise if

familys of three come at the same time it is reduced to 60.00 per

treatment..........I am calling tomorrow and getting the details.........I

will post it if

you want...........I cannot afford 200.00 a treatment

Dee Dee and Bridget

[Guest guest]

It's true the Dr called me to cancel my scheduled HBO for my son that was

supposed to start in August.

From: Wozniak <cwoznia1@...>

Reply-medicaid

Date: Thu, 03 Jul 2003 09:18:42 -0400

medicaid

Subject: Re: [MedicaidforHDOT] Inflatable chambers & O2

I already contacted the Winter Park location and I was told that the doctors

are spliting up and they will be closing the location in August. I will try

them back as well to double check. I was pretty dissappointed!!

Re: [MedicaidforHDOT] Inflatable chambers & O2

Also

Christy:

There is a place in Winter Park..............which would be about an hour

for

you.......they have monoplace and advertise 100.00 a treatment............I

am calling tomorrow.........that is alot closer for me..............I am in

the

Panhandle of Florida and took Mom to San before........

They have a Mc nearby too..............they also advertise if

familys of three come at the same time it is reduced to 60.00 per

treatment..........I am calling tomorrow and getting the details.........I

will post it if

you want...........I cannot afford 200.00 a treatment

Dee Dee and Bridget

[Guest guest]

Did they give you a reason on why they were closing? Or if they would be opening

up anywhere else??

Re: [MedicaidforHDOT] Inflatable chambers & O2

Also

Christy:

There is a place in Winter Park..............which would be about an hour

for

you.......they have monoplace and advertise 100.00 a treatment............I

am calling tomorrow.........that is alot closer for me..............I am in

the

Panhandle of Florida and took Mom to San before........

They have a Mc nearby too..............they also advertise if

familys of three come at the same time it is reduced to 60.00 per

treatment..........I am calling tomorrow and getting the details.........I

will post it if

you want...........I cannot afford 200.00 a treatment

Dee Dee and Bridget

[Guest guest]

Christy and Dee Dee:

Winter Park's HBOT facility is closing. We were hoping to go there

so that we could combine HBOT with Conductive Education but recently

found the HBOT-portion of the clinic is closing so that the doc can

concentrate on her internal med practice.

Lynn

> Also

>

> Christy:

>

> There is a place in Winter Park..............which would be about

an hour for

> you.......they have monoplace and advertise 100.00 a

treatment............I

> am calling tomorrow.........that is alot closer for

me..............I am in the

> Panhandle of Florida and took Mom to San before........

>

> They have a Mc nearby too..............they also

advertise if

> familys of three come at the same time it is reduced to 60.00 per

> treatment..........I am calling tomorrow and getting the

details.........I will post it if

> you want...........I cannot afford 200.00 a treatment

>

> Dee Dee and Bridget

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

A loss to HBOT for Peds.

At 07:18 AM 7/3/2003, you wrote:

>Christy and Dee Dee:

>

>Winter Park's HBOT facility is closing. We were hoping to go there

>so that we could combine HBOT with Conductive Education but recently

>found the HBOT-portion of the clinic is closing so that the doc can

>concentrate on her internal med practice.

>

>Lynn

>

>

> > Also

> >

> > Christy:

> >

> > There is a place in Winter Park..............which would be about

>an hour for

> > you.......they have monoplace and advertise 100.00 a

>treatment............I

> > am calling tomorrow.........that is alot closer for

>me..............I am in the

> > Panhandle of Florida and took Mom to San before........

> >

> > They have a Mc nearby too..............they also

>advertise if

> > familys of three come at the same time it is reduced to 60.00 per

> > treatment..........I am calling tomorrow and getting the

>details.........I will post it if

> > you want...........I cannot afford 200.00 a treatment

> >

> > Dee Dee and Bridget

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

I am totally bummed.............okay I talked to the physican who runs a

center in ville...........he seemed very knowledgeable........has a cp

child himself.........................

He was listed on the MUMS site..................usually is 150.00 a

treatment.........he too has mono and multiplace and said if we get others

together the

price is reduced..........there is a bed and breakfast that will give a

break.........Lighthouse Inn......for 20.00 a night and is handicapp

accessible.............looks like I will go to ville........I was gonna

compare the

two.

Dee Dee and Bridget

[Guest guest]

Too bad

Hey let's all go to ville and save some money...............I want to

go in August as well!

Dee Dee and Bridget

I am great at negotiating.....a deal

[Guest guest]

Thanks Lynn

Let's get a group for ville.............then we can get a price cut.

I spoke with the doc for an hour a couple of weeks ago..........Dr

Murray............he started HBO because of his son............seemed very

sincere.........doesn't advertise much........has mono and multi.......

[Guest guest]

To those of you out there using high pressure O2, if you are using a hood

tent or using O2 to compress a mono, buy a new low pressure regulator and

purchase liquid O2. It is lots cheaper for the O2 and less tanks to pay

rental on.

Love to all,

Rose

Re: [MedicaidforHDOT] Inflatable chambers & O2

> Christy,

>

> You asked the group how much; a used hbot chamber might cost and what were

> the costs ofoperation. Having gone through all of this about 3 years ago

i have

> an idea of what is involved.

>

> First your physician's cooperation will prove helpful for he will need to

> write a prescription for the liquid oxygen, after your installation is

complete.

>

> You may have noted two or three among us sell used chambers. Steve

Reimers

> sometimes has used chambers as does Spencer per se phone is 815 439

9606.

> Steve Reimers phone is 703 866 5490. Steve Reimers s an engineer and

> Manufactures chambers. His plant is Springfield, Va.

>

> The prices of used chambers runs from about $15,000.00 to 50,000.00 I

paid

> Tom Fox $42,000.00 for a lease purchase arrangement and made the mistake

of

> trying to get it refinanced through an agent in California and wound up

allegedly

> owing twice what the chamber cost from Tom Fox in Dothan, Alabama. So

> Christy try to be careful with financial work and keep every item in

writing. Too

> many of my arrangements were made on the telephone. The fax or e-mail can

save

> you thousands in case you encounter loan sharks along the way. Every

> contract or agreement needs to be in writing.

>

> My transportation cost from Dothan. Alabama to Locust Grove, VA was

$800.00

>

> If you get a monoplace such; as mine, a Secrist, you willneed to build a

> concrete slab ;on which to place the large liquid oxygen cylinders. This

slab can

> be just outside the room where you place the chamber. You will need an

oxygen

> plumber, the type who installs oxygen in hospitals. This work requires an

> expert and they don't come cheap. Someone like Dave Spencer or Steve

Reimer can

> tell you exactly what you need for the hook up, but it will cost $12,000.

to

> $20,000. depending on your good fortune with the installers. Not very

many

> pipes and valves but expensive.

>

> Once you are hooked up with liquid oxygen delivered to your slab, at least

> two cylinders but preferably four to keep you running for about 3 weeks.

The

> oxygen here in Virginia costs about $650.00 with each reload, $450.00 for

the 4

> cylinders and about $200.00 for rental of the cylinders and delivery

charges

> and tax.

>

> The you will need a Tech to run the chamber, perhaps someone trained by

the

> navy Diving School or other military facilities. The Air Force has a

great

> Tech school in Texas.

>

> All the foregoing are costs for a used monoplace chamber.

>

> Now I am taking a serious look at the portables or milder pressure

equipment.

> The gamow bags and there are others. They range in price from $10,000.

to

> $20,000 and hopefully the upcoming Neubauer Conference will sort this all

out,

> about the portables. I hear the Air Force transported 30 to Afghanistan

to be

> used for Air Mountain Sickness and I have been told 60 were transported to

> Iraq and I'm still trying to verify details. Hope and Trust the foregoing

proves

> helpful. Captain A. Manson, USN Ret.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

> Guys, thanks for all the information on the home based system. It really

helped us realize that it probably is not worth it right now to invest in

such a system, but I admire those that have!!

Christy,

Talk about scaremongering!!! This takes the cake. Now we're trying to

scare people out of getting their own chamber because it cost more than the

centers. Hogwash!!! These people have chambers in their homes and are

trying to talk you out of it. It is not that bad. I guess if you are a

pre-Madonna and need a elaborate system with bells and whistles that are not

necessary than you should go pay someone 250 for a treatment. But this can

be done and in the end if you are smart you can spend mountains less than

what it will cost you at the centers and do it at home with out disrupting

your family life. We go in when we want and sit and watch TV, I mostly read

a book. But I get to be at home with my family and have done over 700

treatments with our 13 year old who is now able to understand and say

complete sentences. 700 X's 100 is 70,000. (That's not counting travel

expenses) And we are not finished. We did 200 + with my mom 2 years after

her stroke and she is walking and still kicking. My sister had a heart

attack (long story) anyway she is not dead and the doctors said it was a

miracle!! My sister-in-law is in a wheel chair and has had wounds for 15

years they are almost all gone (we are doing it at 1.7 ata). My brothers

kid does not have autism anymore. My mother-in-law's Macular Degeneration

is in remission. Our chamber has paid for itself many times over and I feel

good being to help our families!!! We have about 65,000 in ours but you can

get it cheaper than that.

Now I lost my computer a while back so I don't have my list of what to do.

But for starters call Diver's Supply #1-888-221-8120 they sell steel, multi

place chambers cheaper than the mono place ones. (They had no web site when

I bought mine) Yes you will need some training. I'm sure Hartsoe

can get you in touch with his guy or you can go to Dick in Key Largo and

take his course. He will teach you how to be safe and give you an excellent

understanding of what you are doing. You will need a plumber to braze your

air lines and it will be necessary to talk to your fire chief in your town.

They can not tell you " no " . They can make you put things where they want

it. It all can be done and it's not that bad. It's 3 to 6 months of crazy

then sit back and watch the miracle.

Love to all,

Rose

Re: [MedicaidforHDOT] Inflatable chambers & O2

>

>

> In a message dated 7/1/2003 7:34:49 PM Central Daylight Time,

> FAMANSON@... writes:

>

> > Christy,

> >

> > You asked the group how much; a used hbot chamber might cost and what

were

> > the costs ofoperation. Having gone through all of this about 3 years

ago i

> > have

> > an idea of what is involved.

> >

> >

>

> Christy after going through this myself I can tell you also. The room

> conversion and the storage place for O2 tanks as well as all permits the

fighting we

> had to do get the approval, as well as the cost of chamber and

installation we

> spent close to $95,000.00. We could have done it a lot cheaper and still

> would have been well within guidelines. However most of my money was

spent on the

> room conversion. I wanted a large room with a sitting area. I think the

room

> is alike 21 x 24. The chamber and installation and first month oxygen

was only

> $59,000.00 and that was with a Sechrist 2500B. So the expense to me was

a lot

> and if you want the best and safest system I think you will have to

spend what

> we spent. We went with every bell and whistle to protect and make it as

safe

> as possible.

>

> OK now let me tell you the downside of doing this. First the

responsibility

> lay's on your shoulders if something should ever go wrong. Finding a Dr.

that

> will be willing to monitor the treatments and prescribe them for you in

your

> area. It is not necessary but helpful when trying to get approval in

your town

> with the local fire Marshall. Another thing they had me take a safety

course

> and a Hyperbaric Course and I was trained at a free standing facility

for two

> weeks every day for 8 hours a day. Next trying to find an Oxygen

Supplier that

> will be willing to deliver to you in your area first off that will

determine

> what type of Oxygen you will need to get weather it be Liquid or so on.

Then

> getting past the inspections which was OK for us because of all the

safety

> courses I went through. Plus we used an awesome installer and company to

go through

> the best around. The Company that you are using to install if they do

not

> require you go through a safety and a Hyoerbaric course that would

concern me.

> Then you need to have a very large drive for the Oxygen truck to be able

to drive

> up to drop off the tanks. Plus we had to go through our home owners

> association to get approval from them to allow us to put it in. You have

to increase

> your insurance. We had to add fire protection as well. They did not ask

us to

> but we did it to make it safer. People often think man I wanna do this

at home

> so we won't have to the travel and so forth and yes it has saved us time

and

> Money from all the travel. But do I worry about the unknown you bet. I

worry

> everyday. I do a daily check on everything. I check all the equipment

several

> times a day keep a daily log. There are other great issues that you have

to face

> also owning your own Chamber that I have not went over. It anyone thinks

it is

> a cake walk it is not. These clinics are not making a fortune when

treating

> our kid's most think they are but they are not. It cost me around

$165.00 for a

> tank of Oxygen I get around 7 to 10 treatment hours. People say wow that

is

> only $16.50 a treatment is you get ten treatments. No, your wrong. Now

figure

> in the cost of the equipment and everything you put into it.

>

> Now $16.50 lets really look at this. Now there is now trained Dr. on

site at

> your home, you are performing the treatment instead of a tech. Look at

the man

> hours you had to put into it to get your certification. Look at all the

other

> stuff you have to do like ordering the o2 having to deal with all the

other

> stuff other than just treating your child. If you ask me if it was worth

it to

> me. I will tell you if I had it all to do over again I would spend the

> $95,000.00 investing in a clinic trying to work something out with them

on a

> treatment plan that way I did not have all the worries and headaches.

You guy's have

> no Idea how many Hours IM reading on safety as well as Hyoerbarics In

general.

> If you have the money and your going to invest in a chamber make sure it

is

> something your really ready to do it is a lot of work time and

commitment.

> Several road blocks will come.

>

> Darin.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I met him at the symposioum and he was very sincere and knowledgable gave me

some great ideas of things to do with my daughter. I would definately consider

going to his facility. very nice man indeed.

[Guest guest]

Rose,

Not everyone needs 700 treatments.... some children / families only nee 40

or 80. Every person / family has to evaluate their strategy under their

own circumstances and needs.

Further, not everyone will be able to manage their child's changing HBOT

care in a home based system.

But, people like you do demonstrate that a home based system is viable and

beneficial. This is important for many families who will be using that

many HBOT's.

Ed

At 08:33 AM 7/10/2003, you wrote:

> > Guys, thanks for all the information on the home based system. It really

>helped us realize that it probably is not worth it right now to invest in

>such a system, but I admire those that have!!

>Christy,

>Talk about scaremongering!!! This takes the cake. Now we're trying to

>scare people out of getting their own chamber because it cost more than the

>centers. Hogwash!!! These people have chambers in their homes and are

>trying to talk you out of it. It is not that bad. I guess if you are a

>pre-Madonna and need a elaborate system with bells and whistles that are not

>necessary than you should go pay someone 250 for a treatment. But this can

>be done and in the end if you are smart you can spend mountains less than

>what it will cost you at the centers and do it at home with out disrupting

>your family life. We go in when we want and sit and watch TV, I mostly read

>a book. But I get to be at home with my family and have done over 700

>treatments with our 13 year old who is now able to understand and say

>complete sentences. 700 X's 100 is 70,000. (That's not counting travel

>expenses) And we are not finished. We did 200 + with my mom 2 years after

>her stroke and she is walking and still kicking. My sister had a heart

>attack (long story) anyway she is not dead and the doctors said it was a

>miracle!! My sister-in-law is in a wheel chair and has had wounds for 15

>years they are almost all gone (we are doing it at 1.7 ata). My brothers

>kid does not have autism anymore. My mother-in-law's Macular Degeneration

>is in remission. Our chamber has paid for itself many times over and I feel

>good being to help our families!!! We have about 65,000 in ours but you can

>get it cheaper than that.

>Now I lost my computer a while back so I don't have my list of what to do.

>But for starters call Diver's Supply #1-888-221-8120 they sell steel, multi

>place chambers cheaper than the mono place ones. (They had no web site when

>I bought mine) Yes you will need some training. I'm sure Hartsoe

>can get you in touch with his guy or you can go to Dick in Key Largo and

>take his course. He will teach you how to be safe and give you an excellent

>understanding of what you are doing. You will need a plumber to braze your

>air lines and it will be necessary to talk to your fire chief in your town.

>They can not tell you " no " . They can make you put things where they want

>it. It all can be done and it's not that bad. It's 3 to 6 months of crazy

>then sit back and watch the miracle.

>Love to all,

>Rose

>

> Re: [MedicaidforHDOT] Inflatable chambers & O2

> >

> >

> > In a message dated 7/1/2003 7:34:49 PM Central Daylight Time,

> > FAMANSON@... writes:

> >

> > > Christy,

> > >

> > > You asked the group how much; a used hbot chamber might cost and what

>were

> > > the costs ofoperation. Having gone through all of this about 3 years

>ago i

> > > have

> > > an idea of what is involved.

> > >

> > >

> >

> > Christy after going through this myself I can tell you also. The room

> > conversion and the storage place for O2 tanks as well as all permits the

>fighting we

> > had to do get the approval, as well as the cost of chamber and

>installation we

> > spent close to $95,000.00. We could have done it a lot cheaper and still

> > would have been well within guidelines. However most of my money was

>spent on the

> > room conversion. I wanted a large room with a sitting area. I think the

>room

> > is alike 21 x 24. The chamber and installation and first month oxygen

>was only

> > $59,000.00 and that was with a Sechrist 2500B. So the expense to me was

>a lot

> > and if you want the best and safest system I think you will have to

>spend what

> > we spent. We went with every bell and whistle to protect and make it as

>safe

> > as possible.

> >

> > OK now let me tell you the downside of doing this. First the

>responsibility

> > lay's on your shoulders if something should ever go wrong. Finding a Dr.

>that

> > will be willing to monitor the treatments and prescribe them for you in

>your

> > area. It is not necessary but helpful when trying to get approval in

>your town

> > with the local fire Marshall. Another thing they had me take a safety

>course

> > and a Hyperbaric Course and I was trained at a free standing facility

>for two

> > weeks every day for 8 hours a day. Next trying to find an Oxygen

>Supplier that

> > will be willing to deliver to you in your area first off that will

>determine

> > what type of Oxygen you will need to get weather it be Liquid or so on.

>Then

> > getting past the inspections which was OK for us because of all the

>safety

> > courses I went through. Plus we used an awesome installer and company to

>go through

> > the best around. The Company that you are using to install if they do

>not

> > require you go through a safety and a Hyoerbaric course that would

>concern me.

> > Then you need to have a very large drive for the Oxygen truck to be able

>to drive

> > up to drop off the tanks. Plus we had to go through our home owners

> > association to get approval from them to allow us to put it in. You have

>to increase

> > your insurance. We had to add fire protection as well. They did not ask

>us to

> > but we did it to make it safer. People often think man I wanna do this

>at home

> > so we won't have to the travel and so forth and yes it has saved us time

>and

> > Money from all the travel. But do I worry about the unknown you bet. I

>worry

> > everyday. I do a daily check on everything. I check all the equipment

>several

> > times a day keep a daily log. There are other great issues that you have

>to face

> > also owning your own Chamber that I have not went over. It anyone thinks

>it is

> > a cake walk it is not. These clinics are not making a fortune when

>treating

> > our kid's most think they are but they are not. It cost me around

>$165.00 for a

> > tank of Oxygen I get around 7 to 10 treatment hours. People say wow that

>is

> > only $16.50 a treatment is you get ten treatments. No, your wrong. Now

>figure

> > in the cost of the equipment and everything you put into it.

> >

> > Now $16.50 lets really look at this. Now there is now trained Dr. on

>site at

> > your home, you are performing the treatment instead of a tech. Look at

>the man

> > hours you had to put into it to get your certification. Look at all the

>other

> > stuff you have to do like ordering the o2 having to deal with all the

>other

> > stuff other than just treating your child. If you ask me if it was worth

>it to

> > me. I will tell you if I had it all to do over again I would spend the

> > $95,000.00 investing in a clinic trying to work something out with them

>on a

> > treatment plan that way I did not have all the worries and headaches.

>You guy's have

> > no Idea how many Hours IM reading on safety as well as Hyoerbarics In

>general.

> > If you have the money and your going to invest in a chamber make sure it

>is

> > something your really ready to do it is a lot of work time and

>commitment.

> > Several road blocks will come.

> >

> > Darin.

> >

> >

> >