Guest guest Posted June 18, 2008 Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 --- In thyroid treatment , " jenny stenning " <jennystenning@...> thanks for that i thought she may have been able to buy over the counter like in Spain and Portugal you can purchase most drugs that way dont know about thyroid meds though and Spain is cheaper than here. In Portugal drugs are expensive . >I thought she might of been able to get 3 grains over there.Guess ill have to order 1 grain as i am on 3 1/2 now its so unfair how much more expensive it will be but it is worth it to feel this well thanks once again Marie > > > ----- > Subject: armour thyroid > but could she > purchase some Armour without prescription over there and bring it back > for me in higher grains hopefully. Marie > > > ------------------------------------ > > Messages are not a substitute for professional medical advice. Always > consult with a suitably qualified practitioner before changing > medication. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 19, 2008 Report Share Posted June 19, 2008 Hi Marie My order from inhouse turned up yesterday took nearly 3 weeks but then customs got thier hands on it. So if you order now you should get it in time. Ali x > > Hi all have just upped my armour to 3 1/2 grains and no side effects > but my concern is the shortage of armour i have enough for 4 weeks then > i am up the creek like every one else. (I have a niece who is a > genetic engineer in Baltimore due to come back and take up a job in > Aberdeen working with whales )nothing to do with this but could she > purchase some Armour without prescription over there and bring it back > for me in higher grains hopefully. Marie > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 19, 2008 Report Share Posted June 19, 2008 Hi Marie, Have you thought of trying the Nature-Throid IPS also stock -it's much cheaper. I used it for a while a few years ago and didn't notice any difference from Armour, though it does have different fillers if that is a concern for you. Subject: Re: armour thyroid Guess ill have to order 1 grain as i am on 3 1/2 now its so unfair how much more expensive it will be but it is worth it to feel this well thanks once again Marie > > > ----- ------------------------------------ Messages are not a substitute for professional medical advice. Always consult with a suitably qualified practitioner before changing medication. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 24, 2008 Report Share Posted June 24, 2008 I have noticed some changes in how I feel lately too. I have had to change my dosages - went from 240 mgs to 2 - 120 mgs (felt fine) to now 4 - 60 mgs because of the recall. It is when I got to the 60 mgs that I started to feel really tired all the time. I don't know if it is the armour but I have heard that the reason why the higher dosages are not out yet is that they are waiting on FDA approval post mfgr changes. I don't know if they changed the formulation for the lower pills. I was stable on 4 grs. UGH! Armour Thyroid >I have been using Armour Thyroid for several years. Just with this > last bottle, I have begun having migraines which I have correlated > with ingesting 1/2 of the 60mg pill. I believe it is either rancid or > that they have changed the formula. I would like to know if others > have had any adverse reactions to this product. Puts me between a rock > and a hard place as I need it for treatment of Hashimoto's > Thyroiditis. But can't imagine taking something which is making me ill. > Savvy > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 24, 2008 Report Share Posted June 24, 2008 Here is the phone number for Forest Labs : 1-800-947-5227. If you call, ask for Pam. Hoping to learn how this formula might have changed over time. Or could it be rancid? Does have polyethelene glycol in it, it seems. Plus Titanium Dioxide. Plus the various other excipients they use. I think it is contaminated, but can't be sure. Just know I get migraines from this pill! Savvy > > I have noticed some changes in how I feel lately too. I have had to change > my dosages - went from 240 mgs to 2 - 120 mgs (felt fine) to now 4 - 60 mgs > because of the recall. It is when I got to the 60 mgs that I started to > feel really tired all the time. I don't know if it is the armour but I have > heard that the reason why the higher dosages are not out yet is that they > are waiting on FDA approval post mfgr changes. I don't know if they changed > the formulation for the lower pills. I was stable on 4 grs. UGH! > > > > > Armour Thyroid > > > >I have been using Armour Thyroid for several years. Just with this > > last bottle, I have begun having migraines which I have correlated > > with ingesting 1/2 of the 60mg pill. I believe it is either rancid or > > that they have changed the formula. I would like to know if others > > have had any adverse reactions to this product. Puts me between a rock > > and a hard place as I need it for treatment of Hashimoto's > > Thyroiditis. But can't imagine taking something which is making me ill. > > Savvy > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 24, 2008 Report Share Posted June 24, 2008 I have talked to Pam. I actually started the whole potency mess with the 4 grains back in October. I was the first to report an issue with tanking thyroid levels. When I told them I was a thyca patient they freaked and had me talk to the FDA adverse reaction reports dept. I know Pam very well. I am not reporting another thing. I will see Dr. Brownstein on 7/2 and get my labs then. If they are dropping I will find out then and then deal with it if necessary. There are just too many variables in my life now to definitively tie it to Armour - like I could last time. Armour Thyroid >> >> >> >I have been using Armour Thyroid for several years. Just with > this >> > last bottle, I have begun having migraines which I have > correlated >> > with ingesting 1/2 of the 60mg pill. I believe it is either > rancid or >> > that they have changed the formula. I would like to know if > others >> > have had any adverse reactions to this product. Puts me between > a rock >> > and a hard place as I need it for treatment of Hashimoto's >> > Thyroiditis. But can't imagine taking something which is making > me ill. >> > Savvy >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------------ >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 24, 2008 Report Share Posted June 24, 2008 This is interesting, I had not heard of a recall of armour. I had asked my doc to change me to Armour about 2 months ago, had been taking 12.5 mcg of cytomel for years. He prescribed 1 grain (60 mg?) of Armour, and I felt worse so I just went back to the cytomel. Is it only the 60 mg pill that may be contaminated? That's what I was using. I can't tell if it was just the Armour or something else, since my neighbor sprayed an herbicide and I've also been reacting to that. JIll Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 24, 2008 Report Share Posted June 24, 2008 My kids take 60 mgs plus a 30 mg tablet. There was a recall on all 3,4 and 5 grain tablets last November ('07). Steph Re: Re: Armour Thyroid > This is interesting, I had not heard of a recall of armour. I had asked > my doc to change me to Armour about 2 months ago, had been taking 12.5 > mcg of cytomel for years. He prescribed 1 grain (60 mg?) of Armour, > and I felt worse so I just went back to the cytomel. Is it only the 60 > mg pill that may be contaminated? That's what I was using. > > I can't tell if it was just the Armour or something else, since my > neighbor sprayed an herbicide and I've also been reacting to that. > JIll > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 24, 2008 Report Share Posted June 24, 2008 Thanks for the information, Steph. Jill ladybugsandbees wrote: > > My kids take 60 mgs plus a 30 mg tablet. There was a recall on all 3,4 > and > 5 grain tablets last November ('07). > > Steph > > Re: Re: Armour Thyroid > > > This is interesting, I had not heard of a recall of armour. I had asked > > my doc to change me to Armour about 2 months ago, had been taking 12.5 > > mcg of cytomel for years. He prescribed 1 grain (60 mg?) of Armour, > > and I felt worse so I just went back to the cytomel. Is it only the 60 > > mg pill that may be contaminated? That's what I was using. > > > > I can't tell if it was just the Armour or something else, since my > > neighbor sprayed an herbicide and I've also been reacting to that. > > JIll > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 24, 2008 Report Share Posted June 24, 2008 Savvy, You could be alergic to the Armour. Which you can get cleared with an NAET practioner in your area to clear it if that is the problem. Are you also taking Iodine in some form, Celtic sea salt loading, vit C, selenuim ?? Armour Thyroid I have been using Armour Thyroid for several years. Just with this last bottle, I have begun having migraines which I have correlated with ingesting 1/2 of the 60mg pill. I believe it is either rancid or that they have changed the formula. I would like to know if others have had any adverse reactions to this product. Puts me between a rock and a hard place as I need it for treatment of Hashimoto's Thyroiditis. But can't imagine taking something which is making me ill.Savvy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 24, 2008 Report Share Posted June 24, 2008 DR Brownstein has me on Nature-throid and said it is the same as Armour. Wouldn't it be easier to be on that, rather than, always having this mess with Armour? Just wondering. Janie > >> > >> I have noticed some changes in how I feel lately too. I have had > > to change > >> my dosages - went from 240 mgs to 2 - 120 mgs (felt fine) to now > > 4 - 60 mgs > >> because of the recall. It is when I got to the 60 mgs that I > > started to > >> feel really tired all the time. I don't know if it is the armour > > but I have > >> heard that the reason why the higher dosages are not out yet is > > that they > >> are waiting on FDA approval post mfgr changes. I don't know if > > they changed > >> the formulation for the lower pills. I was stable on 4 grs. UGH! > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> Armour Thyroid > >> > >> > >> >I have been using Armour Thyroid for several years. Just with > > this > >> > last bottle, I have begun having migraines which I have > > correlated > >> > with ingesting 1/2 of the 60mg pill. I believe it is either > > rancid or > >> > that they have changed the formula. I would like to know if > > others > >> > have had any adverse reactions to this product. Puts me between > > a rock > >> > and a hard place as I need it for treatment of Hashimoto's > >> > Thyroiditis. But can't imagine taking something which is making > > me ill. > >> > Savvy > >> > > >> > > >> > ------------------------------------ > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 24, 2008 Report Share Posted June 24, 2008 They are not interchangeable. I tried it and tanked in 8 days. My daughter tried it and tanked in 4. Steph Armour Thyroid >> >> >> >> >> >> >I have been using Armour Thyroid for several years. Just with >> > this >> >> > last bottle, I have begun having migraines which I have >> > correlated >> >> > with ingesting 1/2 of the 60mg pill. I believe it is either >> > rancid or >> >> > that they have changed the formula. I would like to know if >> > others >> >> > have had any adverse reactions to this product. Puts me between >> > a rock >> >> > and a hard place as I need it for treatment of Hashimoto's >> >> > Thyroiditis. But can't imagine taking something which is making >> > me ill. >> >> > Savvy >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > ------------------------------------ >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 24, 2008 Report Share Posted June 24, 2008 So they are not the same? Could that be why I felt more energy at first but now am soooo tired all the time? Still trying to figure out this tired thing. I am tired of being tired. Janie > >> >> > >> >> I have noticed some changes in how I feel lately too. I have had > >> > to change > >> >> my dosages - went from 240 mgs to 2 - 120 mgs (felt fine) to now > >> > 4 - 60 mgs > >> >> because of the recall. It is when I got to the 60 mgs that I > >> > started to > >> >> feel really tired all the time. I don't know if it is the armour > >> > but I have > >> >> heard that the reason why the higher dosages are not out yet is > >> > that they > >> >> are waiting on FDA approval post mfgr changes. I don't know if > >> > they changed > >> >> the formulation for the lower pills. I was stable on 4 grs. > > UGH! > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> Armour Thyroid > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> >I have been using Armour Thyroid for several years. Just with > >> > this > >> >> > last bottle, I have begun having migraines which I have > >> > correlated > >> >> > with ingesting 1/2 of the 60mg pill. I believe it is either > >> > rancid or > >> >> > that they have changed the formula. I would like to know if > >> > others > >> >> > have had any adverse reactions to this product. Puts me between > >> > a rock > >> >> > and a hard place as I need it for treatment of Hashimoto's > >> >> > Thyroiditis. But can't imagine taking something which is making > >> > me ill. > >> >> > Savvy > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > ------------------------------------ > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 24, 2008 Report Share Posted June 24, 2008 No it happens when you switch from Armour to Naturethyroid. I never had energy doing that just slowly got more tired. I won't take long because T4 has a half life of 6 days so you will feel it soon. I'll bet yours is something else. Armour Thyroid >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >I have been using Armour Thyroid for several years. Just > with >> >> > this >> >> >> > last bottle, I have begun having migraines which I have >> >> > correlated >> >> >> > with ingesting 1/2 of the 60mg pill. I believe it is either >> >> > rancid or >> >> >> > that they have changed the formula. I would like to know if >> >> > others >> >> >> > have had any adverse reactions to this product. Puts me > between >> >> > a rock >> >> >> > and a hard place as I need it for treatment of Hashimoto's >> >> >> > Thyroiditis. But can't imagine taking something which is > making >> >> > me ill. >> >> >> > Savvy >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > ------------------------------------ >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 13, 2009 Report Share Posted February 13, 2009 Afshin from International Pharmacy has now contacted me to give me the latest up-to-date information about Armour thyroid and International Pharmacy. Luv - Sheila _______________________________ I am now certain that armour 2 grain will be available the week of February 20th. I have added it to the site now. I have also lowered the price of lower strengths of armour a little. Demand has gone down and I no longer have to buy from New Jersey at additional cost and shipping fee to supplement my local supply. I have plenty of supply of the higher strengths of armour on hand. RLC Lab still has no release date for the 2 and 3 grain Nature-Throid or Westhroid. Regards, afshin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 13, 2009 Report Share Posted February 13, 2009 Thats great news as I was waiting for the 2 grains to come in so will order some soon. Thanks sheila Afshin from International Pharmacy has now contacted me to give me thelatest up-to-date information about Armour thyroid and InternationalPharmacy.Regards,afshin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 It's definitely available in Belgium at the pharmacies listed on this site: http://www.geocities.com/thyroide/pharm-Belgique.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 I have never really done any real research into this, but what I do know is that Armour is available within the UK with a prescription as mentioned in the letter from the MHRA for those people who don't do well on levothyroxine only. Armour is also available in Belgium at the pharmacies listed in the link you sent enkai. I do know that many people in Paris pop over to Belgium to get their Armour thyroid without a problem. Thyroid extract is also is also available in Canada called “Thyroid USP” and is produced by Erfa Pharmaceutical, and in Australia natural thyroid extract is also available. I heard that Stenlake Pharmacy in Australia get their thyroid powder from America where all thyroid powder comes from because it is absolutely consistent. Ar you out there P at the moment, and able to help us on this one? Many doctors realise it is the best treatment, but because it is a natural product, it is not patentable - so no money can be made and those 'responsible' for teaching about hypothyroid therapy do encourage students to stay away from natural thyroid extract insisting that it is 'dangerous " despite it having been used safely and effectively for over 100 years. The NHS need to make money - though it would be nice to have the knowledge that they need to make patients well as number one priority. I understand that in the Netherlands, they have at least one pharmacy importing Armour Thyroid via the Broda organisation.Broda hold the marketing rights for Armour Thyroid, USP. The Dutch I understand can go over the border and buy Armour Thyroid (with prescription) in a pharmacy in Antwerp in Belgium. They can buy it cheaper in Belgium than the Netherlands. All the desiccated thyroid powder used in the Netherlands used to come from Kastrup in Denmark, but they now get it from America, where everybody gets their thyroid powder. A prescription to purchase thyroid extract in the Netherland is required. Can anybody else throw any light on the natural thyroid extract situation in other countries please, but especially about Armour Thyroid, Nature Throid and West throid. luv - Sheila It's definitely available in Belgium at the pharmacies listed on this site: http://www.geocities.com/thyroide/pharm-Belgique.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 8, 2009 Report Share Posted April 8, 2009 These guys ought to get their facts. Why would the FDA approve a medication in which there were " potency issues in different batches " ? Why would the MHRA tell UK medical practitioners they can prescribe Armour Thyroid within the NHS for those patients who do not do well on levothyroxine, if there were " potency issues in different batches " . This is the ugly rumour the BTA (along with drug reps from the makers of levothyroxine) are trying to spread around to stop people getting Armour Thyroid. The T4 and T3 in every tablet of Armour is standardised to the United States Specifications (USP) required by the FDA. If the T4 and T3 were NOT standardised, Armour thyroid would indeed, be a very dangerous drug, and neither the FDA or the MHRA would have approved its use. How crazy are these people. Perhaps you need to pass this on to him enkai. Luv - Sheila STEVEN L. RICHHEIMER AND CHARLOTTE B. JENSEN Received February 14, 1985, from the Quality Control Laboratory, Pharmaceutical Basics, Inc., Denver, CO 80223. Accepted for publication November 14, 1985. Abstract Liothyronine and levothyroxine were quantitatively determined in samples of commercial thyroid tablets and bulk powders. Samples were first hydrolyzed using a bacterial protease and then analyzed by high-performance liquid chromatography. Various hydrolysis conditions were investigated. The liothyronine and levothyroxine contents of commercial tablets and bulk powders were found to be 8-11 mcg and 25-43 mcg, respectively, per 65 mg of thyroid. The stability of the iodothyronines in thyroid tablets was also investigated. The U.S.P. method[1] for the high-performance liquid chromatographic (HPLC) determination of liothyronine (T3) and levothyroxine (T4) obtained from enzymatic digestion of desiccated thyroid and thyroid tablets is based on that of Rees- and Larsen.[2] These authors reported that 65 mg (1 grain) of thyroid tablets contained —12 mcg of liothyronine (T3) and 64 mcg of levothyroxine (T4), determining the iodothyronine contents by radioimmunoassay (RIA) instead of HPLC. Other investigators have reported considerably lower recoveries of liothyronine (T3) and levothyroxine (T4) following enzymatic digestion of desiccated thyroid and thyroid tablets[3-8] Initial attempts to reproduce the results of Rees- and Larsen[2] using the proposed HPLC method of analysis on a variety of thyroid tablets and bulk material gave liothyronine (T3) and levothyroxine (T4) recoveries of only -50-60 of those reported. Chromatographic difficulties were encountered using the cyano column specified, and the small incubation volume (0.55 mL) made it impossible to |obtain adequate hydrolysis on most tablets in which the proportion of excipients to desiccated thyroid was large. Hence, studies were undertaken to determine the optimum conditions for the hydrolysis and chromatography of liothyronine (T3) and levothyroxine (T4) present in commercially available thyroid tablets. As a result of the studies which are 'reported here and studies performed collaboratively at other laboratories (Armour Pharmaceutical Co., Eli Lilly Pharmaceutical Co., and the National Center for Drug Analysis, Food and Drug Administration), the Pharmacopeial Convention made revisions in USP XXI via the Second Interim Revision Announcement.9 Limits of 8.1—9..9mg of liothyronine (T3) and 32.3-43.7 mg levothyroxine (T4) per 65 mg (1I grain) were adopted. Experimental Section Reagents and Materials—U.S.P. reference standards of levothyroxine and liothyronine were used undried. Moisture content was determined by the Karl Fischer titration method, and a correction was made. L-3,3',5'-triiodothyronine (T3, reverseT3, or iso-T3, Calbiochem-Behring Corp., San Diego, CA) was used as received. Bacterial protease derived from Streptomyces griseus was obtained from two sources (Pronase, catalog #53702, Calbiochem-Behring ;Corp.; Bacterial Protease, catalog #P5147, Sigma Chemical Co., St. ;Louis, MO). Reagents used were analytical reagent grade, and acetonitrile was HPLC grade. Iodine assays were done by potentiometric titration using silver nitrate and an iodide-sensing electrode.[10] Thyroid tablets were obtained from several manufacturers (Pharmaceutical Basics, Inc., Denver, CO; Armour Pharmaceutical Co., Scotsdale, AZ; Eli Lilly Co., Indianapolis, IN), and bulk thyroid was either full strength (-0.8 iodine, American Laboratories, Inc., Omaha, NE) or cut with lactose to 0.2 iodine content (Pharmaceutical Basics, Inc., Denver, CO). Apparatus—The high-performance liquid chromatograph (HPLC) (model 5500, Varian Instruments, Palo Alto, CA) was equipped with a variable-wavelength detector (Varian model UV-200), column heater, auto sampler (Varian model 8000), and auto injector (model 7126, Rheodyne Corp., Cotati, CA) with a 200-L loop. Data was handled by a chromatographic data system equipped with a 144K memory, disk storage, and a printer plotter (Varian, Vista 402). A commercially available 4 mm ID x 30 cm octadecylsilane column (A-Bondapak-Cia, Waters Associates, Milford, MA) was used. Chromatographic Conditions—The mobile phase was a mixture of 28 acetonitrile and 72 of a 1:200 mixture of phosphoric acid in water. The percentage of acetonitrile was increased to about 35 when a spherical 5-/nm Cig column packing was used. The flow rate was either 1.5 or 2.0 mL per minute, the column temperature was 34°C, and the detector was set at 225 nm. Proteolytic Enzyme Solution—A pH 8.4 reducing buffer solution was prepared containing 0.11 M NaCI, 0.04 M Tris buffer, and 0.05 M methimazole. The pH was adjusted to 8.4 ± 0.05 with 6 M HC1. On the day of use the proteolytic enzyme was dissolved in the reducing buffer to prepare a solution containing —150 protease units per milliliter (1 unit liberates a digestion product equivalent to 25 µg of tyrosine per minute). Stock Standard Solutions—Levothyroxine (95 mg) was dissolved in 100 mL of a 500:500:1 mixture of water:acetonitrile:ammonia hydroxide. Similarly, liothyronine (22.5 mg) was dissolved in 25.0 mL of the same mixture. A working combination stock solution was then prepared by combining 4.0 mL of the levothyroxine stock and 1.0 mL of the liothyronine stock and diluting to 10.0 mL with a 1:1 mixture of acetonitrile and water. This combination stock was stable for -2 months when stored at 4°C in the dark. Working Standard—On the day of use, the combination stock was diluted 1:50 with the reducing buffer solution. Then, 2.0 mL of enzyme deactivating solution (1:100 phosphoric acid:acetonitrile) was added to 5.0 mL of the diluted standard. The final concentrations of liothyronine (T3) and levothyroxine (T4) were -1.3 mcg/mL and 5.4 mcg/mL, respectively. Recovery Standard—The combination stock standard was diluted 1:50 with proteolytic enzyme solution instead of reducing buffer and treated in the same manner as the samples. Sample Preparation—An accurately weighed portion of powder equivalent to 65 mg (1 grain) of thyroid (proportionately less was used if the iodine content was greater than 0.2) was transferred to a screw-capped culture tube, 5.0 mL of proteolytic enzyme solution was added, and the contents were mixed well. The tubes were placed in an incubator maintained at 37 ± 1°C, and the contents were agitated after 4-8 h and again after 20-24 h. At the end of the incubation period (28 h); 2.0 mL of enzyme deactivating solution was added, and the tubes were mixed well, and centrifuged at about 2000 rpm for 5-10 min. Some samples required filtration through a 0.45-/xm membrane filter in order to clarify the sample. Results and Discussion Chromatography—Table 1 shows a typical chromatogram obtained for a 65-mg thyroid tablet. The small peak at 14 min had the same retention time as L-,3',5'-triiodothyronine CIV, 1). The approximate amount of 1 was found to be about 1.0-1.6 /zg/65 mg of thyroid. The presence of 1 in thyroid has also been reported by other investigators,4-7 and its presence in samples precluded the use of 1 as a convenient internal standard. 0022-3549/86/0200-0215$01.00/0 © 1986, American Pharmaceutical Association Journal of Pharmaceutical Sciences/215 Vol. 75, No. 2, February 1986 OPEN FORUM Liothyronine and Levothyroxine in Armour Thyroid The current United States Pharmacopeia (U.S. Pharmacopeia) method[1] for the analysis of liothyronine (T3) and levothyroxine (T4) in desiccated thyroid requires a proteolytic enzymatic digestion followed by a high-performance liquid chromatographic assay. These procedures were validated through a collaborative study at four laboratories[2] in which one-grain thyroid tablets from three manufacturers were assayed in triplicate on five consecutive days. The final results of this study were submitted to the U.S. Pharmacopeia to assist them in establishing both the analytical procedures and the specifications for thyroid tablets, U.S.P. In the February, 1986 issue of the Journal of Pharmaceutical Sciences, Richheimer and Jensen of Pharmaceutical Basics[3] published further data developed on thyroid products manufactured by Armour, Lilly, and Pharmaceutical Basics. The Pharmaceutical Basics data suggest that the Armour product failed to meet the current U.S. Pharmacopeia specifications for T3 (i.e., 8.1-9.9 µg/grain). Not included in the publication were the original data that were obtained from all the participating laboratories, including Pharmaceutical Basics, Inc. (PBI), and submitted to the U.S. Pharmacopeia. These results formed the basis for the current U.S. Pharmacopeia specifications for T3 and T4 in natural thyroid. The original results obtained for the Armour product (Lot 1516), as well as PBI published data, are shown in Table I. It can be clearly seen that with the exception of the second set of results provided by Pharmaceutical Basics, the Armour 1-grain (65 mg) thyroid product contains levels of liothyronine and levothyroxine that are well within the limits specified by the U.S. Pharmacopeia. It is interesting to note that the overall composite values for liothyronine and levothyroxine are quite similar to the mean values of the two sets of results from Pharmaceutical Basics. Additionally, the precision of the assay as demonstrated by Armour, Eli Lilly, and the FDA was significantly better than that obtained by Pharmaceutical Basics for their first analysis and for levothyroxine in the second set of data. The above results should serve to correct any misrepresentations (implied or otherwise) reported previously (see below) regarding the liothyronine and levothyroxine content in Armour thyroid medications and the nature of the collaborative study for the U.S. Pharmacopeia. As determined by Armour Pharmaceutical Company and other participating laboratories, the liothyronine and levothyroxine content in Armour thyroid is well within the specifications set by the U.S. Pharmacopeia. The precision of the assay procedure as determined by Armour, Eli Lilly, and the FDA is considerably better than that reported by Pharmaceutical Basics. Table 1 — Liothyronine (T3) and Levothyroxine (T4) Content in Thyroid tablets Laboratory Analysis Liothyronine (T3) Levothyroxine (T4) Mean Range RSD Mean Range RSD Table 1 — Liothyronine (T3) and Levothyroxine (T4) Content in Thyroid tablets Laboratory Analysis Liothyronine (T3) Levothyroxine (T4) Mean Range RSD Mean Range RSD Armour0 Eli Lilly FDA PBI (1) PBI (III) Composite PBI—Mean 14 15 13 13 8.88 8.58 8.60 9.51 7.96 8.71 8.74 8.58 - 9.04 8.33 - 8.76 7.73 - 9.65 8.57 - 11.21 7.27 - 8.56 1.81 2.99 6.43 7.9 5.3 37.68 37.30 39.47 40.90 36.66 38.30 38.78 36.62 - 38.32 35.6 - 38.2 38.19 - 40.50 34.16 - 45.48 33.53 - 44.27 1.39 3.26 3.30 9.9 8.1 1. US Pharmacopeia, 21st rev.; U.S. Pharmacopeial Convention: Rockville, MD, 1985; pp 1893-1895 2. Armour Pharmaceutical Company, Eli Lilly Pharmaceutical Company, The National Center for Drug Analysis (FDA), and Pharmaceutical Basics, Inc. 3. Richheimer, S. L.; Jensen, C. B. J. Pharm. Sci. 1986, 75, 215-217. KARL R. BLUMBERG WILLIAM J. MAYER DILIP K. PARIKH LORNE A. SCHNELL Armour Pharmaceutical Company P.O. Box 511 Kankakee, IL 60901 Received October 22, 1986. Accepted for publication February 3, 1987. ALL OF THE FOREGOING EXTRACTS WERE TAKEN FROM THE MONOGRAPH ON ARMOUR THYROID USP AND WERE UNDERTAKEN AS A RESPONSE TO THE FOLLOWING REPORT Response to " Liothyronine and Levothyroxine in Armour Thyroid " We originally conducted the collaborative study to determine the levothyroxine (T4) and liothyronine (T3) content of thyroid tablets from three different manufacturers in late September 1984. Because of a deadline we had to send these results to R. Gamick at Armour Pharmaceutical Co. even though we were not happy with the results; that is, the T4 and T3 levels we found were 10-15% higher than we had gotten before and others had reported. As a result of this, we initiated a study to determine the cause of this anomaly and found that our standard stock solution had undergone extensive degradation (probably from being inappropriately stored at room temperature for several days). We then repeated the study using fresh standards and reported these new results directly to the U.S. Pharmacopeia on October 19, 1984, with instructions to disregard the previous data we had obtained. This second set of data is what is reported in our paper in the February 1986 issue of the Journal of Pharmaceutical Sciences. To the best of our knowledge this set of data was in the hands of the U.S. Pharmacopeia Committee on Revision when they decided upon the final specifications for thyroid tablets. STEVEN L RICHHEIMER CHARLOTTE D. JENSEN Quality Control Laboratory Pharmaceutical Basics, Inc. Denver, CO 80223 a. USP XXl specification: 8.1 to 9.9 mcg/65mg (1 grain) b. USP specification: 32.3 to 43.7mcg/65mg (1 grain) c.Lot 1516; 1-grain, tablets. d. pharmaceutical basics, Inc e. reference 3 From: thyroid treatment [mailto:thyroid treatment ] On Behalf Of enkai111 Sent: 08 April 2009 00:50 thyroid treatment Subject: Re: Armour Thyroid found this person from Sweden commenting about Armour in Sweden..... Mikael Jansson said... You guys in the US are lucky. In Sweden, you have to beg to even get T3 (synthetic form, of course), and the main treatment is levothyroxine. To get Armour Thyroid, you have to apply for a *license* with the Swedish equivalent to the FDA, and even then, you have to have been on medication for a year w/ stable values, but residual symptoms for a sub-functioning thyroid. The common argument against is that the T4-to-T3 ratio is too high (which is why you take one in the morning, and one in the afternoon, duh...), as well as non-standardised doses. The latter claim was recently changed to " potency issues in different batches " . Well, it is my understanding that levothyroxin also suffers from this, at laest judging from the past problems with Synthroid in the US. But perhaps the main problem is that Nycomed, the company producing the most common medication (Levaxin), seem to be unhealthily tight with the endocrinologists. Plus, of course, hypothyroidism being listed in the MDs guidebooks as being something easy to treat with synthetic T4 replacement... http://heartscanblog.blogspot.com/2009/01/bargains-for-armour-thyroid.html No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.0.238 / Virus Database: 270.11.44/2044 - Release Date: 04/07/09 17:53:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 8, 2009 Report Share Posted April 8, 2009 Hi Sheila, In addition, the bioavailability was in doubt for Levothyroxine. They have subsequently been asked to tighten up the bioavailability for Levothyroxine to plus/minus 5% of the stated dose. The manufacturers of Levothryoxine are obviously behind this latest push to get Armour off the market since it's bioavailability isn't in doubt, but they maintain (spuriously) that it is. Whilst we're on the subject of false beliefs and false statements:- Why would a 'rogue' protein like calcitonin be such an obscure and trivial protein if it didn't do anything and then, of course, there's the salmon calcitonin (patent covered?) that doesn't treat anything in particular? The let's pretend we don't know anything about calcitonin, whilst damning the use of Armour (for containing any in the first place). Sometimes, profound ignorance is covered up by conspiratorial silence (else that's for other motives ~ not just 'commercial confidentiality'). The paradox, that they would want to maintain the 'fibs' that drug reps put about, is also significant ~ in a criminal sense. Gouging the NHS, and by inference gouging the patients, who have to put up with the inconvenient side-effects (denied by refusal to submit yellow form ADRs ... reps maintain they're not ADRs). It's not as though we aren't aware of what's going on......the magnitude of a criminal conspiracy is just that, unbelievable until you dig deeper.....then you discover that the entire system is being systematically corrupted to the knowledge of the major Journal Editors ~ belatedly shamed into doing something about it, through the very brazenness with which it has been perpetrated. The latest withdrawals of papers (21) by Reuben et al to name but some. best wishesBob >> These guys ought to get their facts. Why would the FDA approve a medication in which there were "potency issues in different batches"? Why would the MHRA tell UK medical practitioners they can prescribe Armour Thyroid within the NHS for those patients who do not do well on levothyroxine, if there were "potency issues in different batches". This is the ugly rumour the BTA (along with drug reps from the makers of levothyroxine) are trying to spread around to stop people getting Armour Thyroid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 8, 2009 Report Share Posted April 8, 2009 Does anybody know how we can find out how many woman are taking Armour in the UK alone? Luv - Sheila I am fascinated with what you find out Bob. Hi Sheila, In addition, the bioavailability was in doubt for Levothyroxine. They have subsequently been asked to tighten up the bioavailability for Levothyroxine to plus/minus 5% of the stated dose. The manufacturers of Levothryoxine are obviously behind this latest push to get Armour off the market since it's bioavailability isn't in doubt, but they maintain (spuriously) that it is. Whilst we're on the subject of false beliefs and false statements:- Why would a 'rogue' protein like calcitonin be such an obscure and trivial protein if it didn't do anything and then, of course, there's the salmon calcitonin (patent covered?) that doesn't treat anything in particular? The let's pretend we don't know anything about calcitonin, whilst damning the use of Armour (for containing any in the first place). Sometimes, profound ignorance is covered up by conspiratorial silence (else that's for other motives ~ not just 'commercial confidentiality'). The paradox, that they would want to maintain the 'fibs' that drug reps put about, is also significant ~ in a criminal sense. Gouging the NHS, and by inference gouging the patients, who have to put up with the inconvenient side-effects (denied by refusal to submit yellow form ADRs ... reps maintain they're not ADRs). It's not as though we aren't aware of what's going on......the magnitude of a criminal conspiracy is just that, unbelievable until you dig deeper.....then you discover that the entire system is being systematically corrupted to the knowledge of the major Journal Editors ~ belatedly shamed into doing something about it, through the very brazenness with which it has been perpetrated. The latest withdrawals of papers (21) by Reuben et al to name but some. best wishes Bob > > These guys ought to get their facts. Why would the FDA approve a medication in which there were " potency issues in different batches " ? Why would the MHRA tell UK medical practitioners they can prescribe Armour Thyroid within the NHS for those patients who do not do well on levothyroxine, if there were " potency issues in different batches " . This is the ugly rumour the BTA (along with drug reps from the makers of levothyroxine) are trying to spread around to stop people getting Armour Thyroid. No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.0.238 / Virus Database: 270.11.46/2046 - Release Date: 04/07/09 17:53:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 8, 2009 Report Share Posted April 8, 2009 > > Can somebody let me know just which countries Armour is available in beside > the USA please. You might need to do a little searching. > > Luv - Sheila > A little while ago I did a search for dessicated thyroid in Argentina, as my son is out there at present. On an ex-pat site it said that there had been some available but that now it has totally disappeared leaving only thyroxine. Ex-pat sites are good for info like this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 8, 2009 Report Share Posted April 8, 2009 Thank you Janet - I think they are trying to get it banned world-wide. luv - Sheila > > Can somebody let me know just which countries Armour is available in beside > the USA please. You might need to do a little searching. > > Luv - Sheila > A little while ago I did a search for dessicated thyroid in Argentina, as my son is out there at present. On an ex-pat site it said that there had been some available but that now it has totally disappeared leaving only thyroxine. Ex-pat sites are good for info like this. No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.0.238 / Virus Database: 270.11.46/2046 - Release Date: 04/07/09 17:53:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 8, 2009 Report Share Posted April 8, 2009 ''Thank you Janet - I think they are trying to get it banned world-wide''. Yes Shiela, and doing a darned good job of it too. They cannot have assertive ex-sick people can they? They might realise they have lost most of their life to inferior medication. lotsa luv Dawnx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 8, 2009 Report Share Posted April 8, 2009 What I cant get my head around is that Forrest just dont do anything about the attempts to bury their product....they just ignore it all. jennyfreeman > Thank you Janet - I think they are trying to get it banned world-wide. > > > > luv - Sheila > > > > > > > > Can somebody let me know just which countries Armour is available in > beside > > the USA please. You might need to do a little searching. > > > > Luv - Sheila > > > A little while ago I did a search for dessicated thyroid in Argentina, as my > son is out there at present. On an ex-pat site it said that there had been > some available but that now it has totally disappeared leaving only > thyroxine. Ex-pat sites are good for info like this. > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.238 / Virus Database: 270.11.46/2046 - Release Date: 04/07/09 > 17:53:00 > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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