raw milk

[Guest guest]

Raw milk does have casein. The advantage of raw milk is that its

bacteria are more intact thatn in pasteurised milk. This means it

spoils more quickly, but it also means that it can be turned into

kefir and SCD-legal yoghurt which seem to be easily absorbed by many

ASD kids.

We are currently using powdered goats milk. This has been hydrolyzed

(see recent postings) and is easily absorbed by our son providing we

add a couple of enzymes.

The next step is to buy a yoghurt maker and culture SCD-legal yoghurt

using raw goats milk. I shold be able to report on the results in a

couple of weeks.

Steve

> I`m just curious if anyone whose kids can`t have dairy has tried

raw milk and

> what happened. I have a few friends who use raw milk. (Their kids

aren`t

> autistic). Apparently it is entirely different from any regular

milk. Would

> it still have casein in it and would it be a problem? Even with

the enzymes,

> my son can`t seem to handle a lot of milk products. I know it could

be the

> phenols, but I`m just curious if anyone has tried this instead of

regular

> milk. If so, I`d like to hear your story-good or bad. Thanks.

> Debbie in PA

[Guest guest]

I tried raw goat's milk. It was not a success. Sorry. And I tried several

times!

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 5/2/03 3:32:38 am, mrrva@... writes:

> Marti knows a couple good goats ;-)

>

A whole herd! pastured on organically kept grass in Wales. Fabulous milk

with a high butterfat content that lends itself easily to homemade cheese,

which i'm sure you will also be making along with your own candles.....

Marti

[Guest guest]

Hi Prue,

Let me know how it goes... which enzyme are you giving with it?

Thanks

Truly,

a

I have found organic, unhomogenised milk and it is yummy! Am trying

Harry on it so we will see how he goes. I gave the enzymes with it

and am hoping for the best!

> Prue

[Guest guest]

Ok-I am really close to starting the SCD diet this weekend

Here are my concerns...up until now we have been gfcf no rice, no potatoes

and no corn and no fruit ,no fruit juice and no sugar and vinegar of any

kind.

I am really nervous about adding the honey in our diet and fruit.I will

probably hold off on the vinegar and casein. We are taking out the quinoa,

tapioca flour and arrowroot flour and replacing with almond, pecan, filbert

etc. Are canned beans ok with no sugar? I can't remember.

What kind of behavior or symptoms should I expect while adding these in?

I bought some elli's apple cider. I am nervous...but my kids are

excited to have fruit back in their life. I bought some apples to bake for

them tomorrow am. I just hope our tummies can handle all of this.

Carolyn

[Guest guest]

With the SCD diet, you certainly don't have to eat honey. It's just

that sugar is not allowed. And again, you certainly don't have to eat

fruits. It's just that they are allowed (fresh fruit). Canned beans

are not allowed, simply because you have no real idea, if anything has

been added to them. Canned foods are mostly disallowed for that very

reason. Labels often leave things out.

Re: Re: raw milk

Ok-I am really close to starting the SCD diet this weekend

Here are my concerns...up until now we have been gfcf no rice, no

potatoes

and no corn and no fruit ,no fruit juice and no sugar and vinegar of any

kind.

I am really nervous about adding the honey in our diet and fruit.I will

probably hold off on the vinegar and casein. We are taking out the

quinoa,

tapioca flour and arrowroot flour and replacing with almond, pecan,

filbert

etc. Are canned beans ok with no sugar? I can't remember.

What kind of behavior or symptoms should I expect while adding these in?

I bought some elli's apple cider. I am nervous...but my kids are

excited to have fruit back in their life. I bought some apples to bake

for

them tomorrow am. I just hope our tummies can handle all of this.

Carolyn

[Guest guest]

I wish we could get it in Florida. I've read about raw milk--it appears to be

a wonderful thing.

[Guest guest]

Go to realmilk.com/where2.html, there are a few sources. Not

tried any myself.

On Thu, 13 Nov 2003 07:15:20 EST JCKRPF@... writes:

> I wish we could get it in Florida. I've read about raw milk--it

> appears to be

> a wonderful thing.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/13/03 11:11:09 AM Eastern Standard Time,

cbroyles5@... writes:

> realmilk.com/where2.html,

Thank you. I just heard that in Florida you can have raw milk if you own part

of the farm--hence these cow-share programs. Where there's a will, there's a

way

[Guest guest]

We tried raw milk with my son (2) and he didn't have any problems

with it. And he didn't need it with any enzymes or anything.

Unfortunately, his drinking it was short lived. I think he didn't

like the texture as he was used to rice milk.

I've been drinking it since we stopped nursing a month ago. I was

never a huge milk person and couldn't drink it straight. I *love*

the raw milk. It has such a creamy, mild flavor. It doesn't give me

any stomach issues at all, either. It is all I will drink now.

Hope that helps.

Truly,

a

> Has anyone on this list used raw milk with their kids? Any

benefits?

[Guest guest]

I mentioned in " ph " thread that the body ecology diet uses raw

dairy/colostrum for autistic kids with good results or so they say.

I myself began drinking raw dairy last week. I think I was allergic

to the milk. It tasted great though. The colostrum, however, is even

better and my body seems to love it. I think I am addicted or

something. I have to order more on Monday as I am craving it. It

comes from happy cows eating organic grass. Its truly a " live "

food. Most of our food is not, even if organic, it is not freshly

picked from the ground, but stored and shipped and stored again.

[Guest guest]

My son has been drinking the raw goat's milk for almost a year now.

My brother hadn't been by to see him in a few months, and he was amazed

at the difference. I know he had rapid catch up growth, I could tell

that from the clothes he had outgrown. There was much more too, he

doesn't look so fragile anymore. His gait has vastly improved.

He doesn't cover his ears as much as before, but he still continues

with those pesky ear infections. I think the most noticeable of all

the differences is the running stopped. It stopped almost to the

day that we began the raw goat's milk. If not that he is non-verbal

would be my greatest complaint, next would be that he was a 'runner'.

Everything I had tried with behavioral therapy or nutritional

supplements failed. If I just took him out the front door, I had

to have a lock on his arm, or he would run. It had gotten worst because

he was older and bigger and I just couldn't pick him up and carry him

any longer. I use to hate the long walk back to the car from school,

he would fight me the whole way. And I would never consider putting

this child on a bus. I couldn't even begin to tell you how many nights

I had nightmares of him getting hit by a car, or something happening to

him while I wasn't in his care.

After we began him on the milk the running just stopped. I remember

giving him a little extra distance just to see if it was safe. The first

real test to see if he would wander off came while we were on vacation

on the Disney Cruise boat. My husband and I let go of him, and he was

following us. Off came a ton a people when two elevators opened at

once, and it separated us from him. I admit I got panicky, but I could

see him through the crowd, and when he saw me, he made his way through.

It is a moment that I will always remember. Best, Carlton

JCKRPF@... wrote:

> In a message dated 11/13/03 11:11:09 AM Eastern Standard Time,

> cbroyles5@... writes:

>

>

>> realmilk.com/where2.html,

>

>

> Thank you. I just heard that in Florida you can have raw milk if you own part

> of the farm--hence these cow-share programs. Where there's a will, there's a

> way

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

-

Hi -

Is your son on Pep? If so, for how long before you introduced the

goat's milk? Thanks!

Cyndi K.

-- In , Carlton

<carltonl@c...> wrote:

> My son has been drinking the raw goat's milk for almost a

year now.

> My brother hadn't been by to see him in a few months, and he

was amazed

> at the difference. I know he had rapid catch up growth, I could

tell

> that from the clothes he had outgrown. There was much more

too, he

> doesn't look so fragile anymore. His gait has vastly improved.

> He doesn't cover his ears as much as before, but he still

continues

> with those pesky ear infections. I think the most noticeable of

all

> the differences is the running stopped. It stopped almost to the

> day that we began the raw goat's milk. If not that he is

non-verbal

> would be my greatest complaint, next would be that he was a

'runner'.

> Everything I had tried with behavioral therapy or nutritional

> supplements failed. If I just took him out the front door, I had

> to have a lock on his arm, or he would run. It had gotten worst

because

> he was older and bigger and I just couldn't pick him up and

carry him

> any longer. I use to hate the long walk back to the car from

school,

> he would fight me the whole way. And I would never consider

putting

> this child on a bus. I couldn't even begin to tell you how many

nights

> I had nightmares of him getting hit by a car, or something

happening to

> him while I wasn't in his care.

> After we began him on the milk the running just stopped. I

remember

> giving him a little extra distance just to see if it was safe. The

first

> real test to see if he would wander off came while we were on

vacation

> on the Disney Cruise boat. My husband and I let go of him, and

he was

> following us. Off came a ton a people when two elevators

opened at

> once, and it separated us from him. I admit I got panicky, but I

could

> see him through the crowd, and when he saw me, he made

his way through.

> It is a moment that I will always remember. Best,

Carlton

>

> JCKRPF@a... wrote:

>

> > In a message dated 11/13/03 11:11:09 AM Eastern Standard

Time,

> > cbroyles5@j... writes:

> >

> >

> >> realmilk.com/where2.html,

> >

> >

> > Thank you. I just heard that in Florida you can have raw milk if

you own part

> > of the farm--hence these cow-share programs. Where

there's a will, there's a

> > way

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Cyndi, Yes, he was taking those, but before we started the raw milk.

I probably should keep him on those, but I just keep forgetting to

give them to him. He probably could be doing a lot better with

the extra enzymes, but I have gotten lazy, after a decade of using

various supplements. I think I just got burn out giving him so much

each day. I should go back. Best, Carlton

CYNDITK wrote:

> -

> Hi -

> Is your son on Pep? If so, for how long before you introduced the

> goat's milk? Thanks!

> Cyndi K.

>

>

>

>

> -- In , Carlton

> <carltonl@c...> wrote:

>

>> My son has been drinking the raw goat's milk for almost a

>

> year now.

>

>>My brother hadn't been by to see him in a few months, and he

>

> was amazed

>

>>at the difference. I know he had rapid catch up growth, I could

>

> tell

>

>>that from the clothes he had outgrown. There was much more

>

> too, he

>

>>doesn't look so fragile anymore. His gait has vastly improved.

>> He doesn't cover his ears as much as before, but he still

>

> continues

>

>>with those pesky ear infections. I think the most noticeable of

>

> all

>

>>the differences is the running stopped. It stopped almost to the

>>day that we began the raw goat's milk. If not that he is

>

> non-verbal

>

>>would be my greatest complaint, next would be that he was a

>

> 'runner'.

>

>> Everything I had tried with behavioral therapy or nutritional

>>supplements failed. If I just took him out the front door, I had

>>to have a lock on his arm, or he would run. It had gotten worst

>

> because

>

>>he was older and bigger and I just couldn't pick him up and

>

> carry him

>

>>any longer. I use to hate the long walk back to the car from

>

> school,

>

>>he would fight me the whole way. And I would never consider

>

> putting

>

>>this child on a bus. I couldn't even begin to tell you how many

>

> nights

>

>>I had nightmares of him getting hit by a car, or something

>

> happening to

>

>>him while I wasn't in his care.

>> After we began him on the milk the running just stopped. I

>

> remember

>

>>giving him a little extra distance just to see if it was safe. The

>

> first

>

>>real test to see if he would wander off came while we were on

>

> vacation

>

>>on the Disney Cruise boat. My husband and I let go of him, and

>

> he was

>

>>following us. Off came a ton a people when two elevators

>

> opened at

>

>>once, and it separated us from him. I admit I got panicky, but I

>

> could

>

>>see him through the crowd, and when he saw me, he made

>

> his way through.

>

>> It is a moment that I will always remember. Best,

>

> Carlton

>

>>JCKRPF@a... wrote:

>>

>>

>>>In a message dated 11/13/03 11:11:09 AM Eastern Standard

>

> Time,

>

>>>cbroyles5@j... writes:

>>>

>>>

>>>

>>>>realmilk.com/where2.html,

>>>

>>>

>>>Thank you. I just heard that in Florida you can have raw milk if

>

> you own part

>

>>>of the farm--hence these cow-share programs. Where

>

> there's a will, there's a

>

>>>way

>>>

>>>

>>>

[Guest guest]

Wow ,

That's a fantastic story! It's so inspiring and gives so much hope

to hear the stories of others. Thanks so much for sharing!

Jaci

>

> > In a message dated 11/13/03 11:11:09 AM Eastern Standard Time,

> > cbroyles5@j... writes:

> >

> >

> >> realmilk.com/where2.html,

> >

> >

> > Thank you. I just heard that in Florida you can have raw milk if

you own part

> > of the farm--hence these cow-share programs. Where there's a

will, there's a

> > way

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Jaci, Thank you, I believe what happened to my son was partly due to the

fact that I didn't breast feed him, but gave him infant formula. Then

when he was given the thimerosal containing vaccine, the antiseptic

effects of thimerosal killed his defense bacteria. And since he had

no dietary sources of probiotic bacteria he became ill.

Here is an interesting paper that I read yesterday. See below

Best, Carlton

http://mercola.com/2000/oct/22/infant_formula.htm

Infant Formula Fortification Protocol

by Sally Fallon and Enig

A mother's breast milk is nature's perfect and complete food for babies

and can't even come close to being reproduced. With so many substances

known to be present in breastmilk, but unable to be replicated in

breastmilk substitutes (formula), plus all of the as-yet unidentified

constituents, it should come as no great surprise that children today

are suffering from a vast myriad of illnesses and disorders.

The human brain is infinitely more sophisticated than the world's

fastest computer, yet many people naively think that this wondrous organ

can be perfectly constructed without any regard to the " raw materials "

required. Building a properly functioning brain requires the right

materials, just as building a computer would. Imagine trying to build a

computer from scratch, without any microchips. Or trying to build a

house without any lumber, bricks, steel, or other materials.

However, while there is no way to create a formula equal to breastmilk,

there are steps that can be taken to improve somewhat upon the standard

formulas that are available.

One of the nutritional areas that are woefully inadequate with formulas

is in regards to their fatty acid content. With all of the anti-fat

propaganda going on these days, most people don't realize the critical

importance of fat, especially with infants. Not only is the quantity

important, but the quality and breakdown of the types of fat supplied as

well.

After all, the brain is 60% lipid (fat). Of this fat, approximately 12 %

is arachidonic acid (AA) and 17% is docosahexaenoic acid (DHA).

Many people have heard about the benefits and importance of the omega-3

fatty acids DHA and EPA, found primarily in fish.

The importance of DHA in the infants' diet recently prompted many

countries (not including the US) to allow formula producers to fortify

their products with DHA, as well as AA. Currently, DHA/AA enhanced

formulas are available, although not mandatory, throughout most of Europe.

Unfortunately, this small step still does not provide infants the

nutrients they desperately require, due to several problems.

First of all, the DHA added to the formulas, obtained from microalgae,

is highly oxidized (approximately 30%).

Additionally, DHA and AA are not the sole fat constituents of

breastmilk. Fortifying with them is a step in the right direction, but

still leaves out plenty of important substances.

In an effort to help people provide their infants with the best possible

nutrition, we often instruct mothers to " create " fortified formulas. But

of course we insist that mothers breastfeed if at all possible or even

obtain fresh breastmilk from a lactating friend or relative, if they

have adopted a baby, or can't breastfeed for some reason.

For the infant to remain as healthy as possible, he must obtain a proper

balance of all the essential fats, which is difficult to impossible,

especially when you are changing mother nature and trying to create a

formula.

However, below is a basic fat fortification protocol, which attempts to

come as close as possible to " the real thing " :

* Carlson's Cod Liver Oil - one cc per ten pounds of body weight

* Organic egg yolk - 1 yolk daily added at four months of age

* Organic cream ideally non-pasteurized and non-homogenized -- If

you are unable to find a local dairy farmer who will cooperate with you

please try this link: http://www.realmilk.com/where.html.

* Omega Nutrition pure sesame, walnut, safflower, sunflower, oils

(rotate with above) - 1 T daily

* One teaspoon high quality coconut oil. This oil needs to be

heated to 76 degrees to become a liquid.

Supplemental oils like fish oils can't be added to bottles because they

will adhere to the sides, so it is necessary to administer directly into

the mouth. But base oils as safflower, sunflower and sesame can be

blended into the formula.

It is important, if not breastfeeding, to use one of the commercially

available formulas as a " base " from which to fortify the infant's diet.

Although some people might be tempted to create their own homemade

formula, I don't recommend this approach, as it is just too dangerous

that something could be inadvertently left out or added in too great a

quantity. A mistake could cost an infant his life.

Nutramagen or Alimentum can be used as a base infant formula and

'doctored up' with nutritional perks. Both of these formulas are

acceptable in regard to the 'allergic' aspect, and are the ones usually

used when children cannot tolerate anything. Of course, they are also

the most expensive.

FORTIFIED COMMERCIAL FORMULA

Makes about 35 ounces

This stopgap formula can be used in emergencies, or when the

ingredients for homemade formula are unavailable.

1 cup Mead low-iron, milk-based powdered formula,

Nutramigen or Alimentum are best and better tolerated but are more expensive

29 ounces filtered water (3 5/8 cups)

1 large egg yolk from an organic egg, cooked 3 1/2 minutes (See

recipe for egg yolk, below)

1 teaspoon cod liver oil

Place all ingredients in a blender or food processor and blend

thoroughly. Place 6-8 ounces in a very clean glass bottle. (Store the

rest in a very clean glass jar in the refrigerator for the next

feedings.) Attach a clean nipple to the bottle and set in a pan of

simmering water until formula is warm but not hot to the touch, shake

well and feed to baby. (Never heat formula in a microwave oven!)

If your baby is premature, one additional area of fortification is in

the area of free amino acids, most notably taurine. This nutrient is

also critical for infant development and is found in human milk but not

in cow's milk. Although many formulas add some taurine, it has been

shown that formula-fed infants have lower levels of taurine in their

blood than breastfed infants do, even when the formula is has added taurine.

Contrary to the advice given by some, soy milk, almond milk, or carrot

juice, even if organic and homemade, are most definitely NOT ACCEPTABLE

SUBSTITUTES FOR BREASTMILK, or even for formula.

For those mothers who are breastfeeding, it is important to realize that

the essential fatty acid content of her breast milk coincides with what

she eats. Therefore, her diet is very important for the health of her

baby. One of the most important things that a breastfed mother can do is

to avoid foods containing trans fats, such as margarine and anything

with hydrogenated or partially hydrogenated oils.

While one can't guarantee that taking the steps outlined above will

completely eliminate problems such as ADD/ADHD and other behavioral

problems, developmental problems, autism, visual difficulties, and

others, I believe that it is a strong possibility that it could help to

reduce their incidence, although it is important to always remember that

BREAST IS BEST.

PLEASE recognize that soy formula is an unmitigated disaster for infants

and should never be used.

It is high in:

* manganese

* aluminum

* phytoestrogens that will harm your baby

For more information please read the links below.

Alternatively a raw milk formula can be made:

MILK-BASED FORMULA From Weston Price Foundation

Makes 36 ounces

Our milk-based formula takes account of the fact that human milk is

richer in whey, lactose, vitamin C, niacin, and long-chain

polyunsaturated fatty acids compared to cow’s milk but leaner in casein

(milk protein). The addition of gelatin to cow’s milk formula will make

it more digestible for the infant. Use only truly expeller-expressed

oils in the formula recipes, otherwise they may lack vitamin E.

The ideal milk for baby, if he cannot be breastfed, is clean, whole

raw milk from old-fashioned cows, certified free of disease, that feed

on green pasture. For sources of good quality milk, see www.realmilk.com

or contact a local chapter of the Weston A. Price Foundation.

If the only choice available to you is commercial milk, choose

whole milk, preferably organic and unhomogenized, and culture it with a

piima or kefir culture to restore enzymes (available from G.E.M.

Cultures 707-964-2922).

2 cups whole milk, preferably unprocessed milk from pasture-fed

cows

1/4 cup homemade liquid whey (See recipe for whey, below)

4 tablespoons lactose (available from The Apothecary 301-530-1112)

1 teaspoon bifidobacterium infantis (available from Natren

800-992-3323)

2 or more tablespoons good quality cream (not

ultrapasteurized), more if you are using milk from Holstein cows

1 teaspoon cod liver oil (available from Radiant Life

888-593-8333)

1 teaspoon expeller-expressed sunflower oil

1 teaspoon extra virgin olive oil

2 teaspoons coconut oil (available from Radiant Life)

2 teaspoons Frontier brand nutritional yeast flakes

2 teaspoons gelatin (available from Radiant Life)

1 7/8 cups filtered water

1/4 teaspoon acerola powder

Add gelatin to water and heat gently until gelatin is dissolved.

Place all ingredients in a very clean glass or stainless steel container

and mix well. To serve, pour 6 to 8 ounces into a very clean glass

bottle, attach nipple and set in a pan of simmering water. Heat until

warm but not hot to the touch, shake bottle well and feed baby. (Never,

never heat formula in a microwave oven!) Note: If you are using the

Lact-Aid, mix all ingredients well in a blender.)

Variation: Goat Milk Formula

Although goat milk is rich in fat, it must be used with caution in

infant feeding as it lacks folic acid and is low in vitamin B12, both of

which are essential to the growth and development of the infant.

Inclusion of nutritional yeast to provide folic acid is essential. To

compensate for low levels of vitamin B12, add 2 teaspoons frozen organic

raw chicken liver, finely grated to the batch of formula. Be sure to

begin egg-yolk feeding at four months.

Related Articles:

Soy Formulas and the Effects of Isoflavones on the Thyroid

Experts Dispute JAMA Soy Infant Formula Study

Soy Milk Is Safe! That Is What the Formula Industry Says

Australian Pediatric Soy Protein Formula Policy

How Safe is Soy Infant Formula?

Soy Formula Exposes Infants To High Hormone Levels

Soy Baby Formula Linked to Behavioral Problems

Infant Formula Increase Diabetes Risk

Cow's Milk May Lead to Diabetes

Milk Increases Risk of Type 1 Diabetes

Supplemented Formula Ups Infant Intelligence

DHA Improves Vision in Preterm Infants

Fish Oil Important For ALL Infants

Is DHA The Secret Of Breast Milk's Success?

Breastfeeding Linked To Higher IQ

Fish or EPA/DHA Supplements May Help Protect Vision

The Role of Taurine in Infant Nutrition

Return to Table of Contents #176

Jaci Wiley wrote:

> Wow ,

>

> That's a fantastic story! It's so inspiring and gives so much hope

> to hear the stories of others. Thanks so much for sharing!

>

> Jaci

>

>

>

>>

>>

>>>In a message dated 11/13/03 11:11:09 AM Eastern Standard Time,

>>>cbroyles5@j... writes:

>>>

>>>

>>>

>>>>realmilk.com/where2.html,

>>>

>>>

>>>Thank you. I just heard that in Florida you can have raw milk if

>

> you own part

>

>>>of the farm--hence these cow-share programs. Where there's a

>

> will, there's a

>

>>>way

>>>

>>>

>>>

[Guest guest]

kefir is very yeasty and not a good idea imo.

> I know many can't handle dairy, but a nutritionist just informed me

he has seen those with dairy issues be able to handle raw milk. I

also understand only 3 states even sell raw milk, but California is

one of them. My daughter is dairy sensitive, the IGE blood tests

show no problem but her IGE tests show a problem. And most

importantly she usually has bad behavior and headaches from it. I

tried the raw milk tonight just a little and didn't see any bad

reaction. Just wondering if others have tried this? As for raw

milk, it appears to be like a wonderful source of enzymes and all

sorts of good stuff.

> Another thing he raved about was kefir made from the raw milk. Has

anyone tried this?

> Thanks,

> Kari

>

>

[Guest guest]

>>>As for raw milk, it appears to be like a wonderful source of

enzymes and all sorts of good stuff.

Right you are! Kari, how does this compare to giving non-raw milk and

Peptizyde for dairy? Just wondering. Haven't tried kefir (probably

won't either, so report on it if you try it).

.

[Guest guest]

I guess I thought of kefir as being similar to cultured milk/yogurt like. Is

it, or is it totally different? Yeasty with a serious yeast infection doesn't

sound right.

Thanks for the tip,

Kari

Re: Raw Milk

kefir is very yeasty and not a good idea imo.

[Guest guest]

, Good yeast, well good probiotic bacteria fights off bad

bacteria. Now I know you know that? It is survival of the fittest,

if your body is filled with harmful bacteria, you are not going to feel

too good. Here is an excellent site to learn more about kefir,

there is even kefir for those that want to stay dairy free.

Dom's Kefir in-site:

http://users.chariot.net.au/~dna/kefirpage.html

Best, Carlton

andrew wrote:

> kefir is very yeasty and not a good idea imo.

>

>

>

>>I know many can't handle dairy, but a nutritionist just informed me

>

> he has seen those with dairy issues be able to handle raw milk. I

> also understand only 3 states even sell raw milk, but California is

> one of them. My daughter is dairy sensitive, the IGE blood tests

> show no problem but her IGE tests show a problem. And most

> importantly she usually has bad behavior and headaches from it. I

> tried the raw milk tonight just a little and didn't see any bad

> reaction. Just wondering if others have tried this? As for raw

> milk, it appears to be like a wonderful source of enzymes and all

> sorts of good stuff.

>

>>Another thing he raved about was kefir made from the raw milk. Has

>

> anyone tried this?

>

>>Thanks,

>>Kari

>>

>>

[Guest guest]

kefir is a relatively uncontrolled yeast/bacteria biofilm culture(the

grains are biofilm) not too dissimilar to what goes on in the gut imo.

so the problem is yeast spores and yeast alcohols and that

sort of thing, same as fermented veges.

yogurt is a bacteria only culture.

> I guess I thought of kefir as being similar to cultured milk/yogurt

like. Is it, or is it totally different? Yeasty with a serious

yeast infection doesn't sound right.

> Thanks for the tip,

> Kari

> Re: Raw Milk

>

>

> kefir is very yeasty and not a good idea imo.

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

, It is, however controlled, it is controlled by ph stability.

All of the strains that dominate kefir are host friendly.

you say 'yogurt is a bacteria only culture'

would you send one soldier to fight a war?

Best, Carlton

andrew wrote:

> kefir is a relatively uncontrolled yeast/bacteria biofilm culture(the

> grains are biofilm) not too dissimilar to what goes on in the gut imo.

>

> so the problem is yeast spores and yeast alcohols and that

> sort of thing, same as fermented veges.

>

> yogurt is a bacteria only culture.

>

>

>

>

>>I guess I thought of kefir as being similar to cultured milk/yogurt

>

> like. Is it, or is it totally different? Yeasty with a serious

> yeast infection doesn't sound right.

>

>>Thanks for the tip,

>>Kari

>> Re: Raw Milk

>>

>>

>> kefir is very yeasty and not a good idea imo.

>>

>>

>>

>>

[Guest guest]

Hi everyone,

Has anyone had any luck introducing raw milk to their child without

using the enzymes? I have tried both the raw milk, goat's milk and yogurt

with the AFP enzyme, but seems to get really bad stomach problems with

it. I'm wondering if because she has been off of dairy for 7/8 years, maybe

she could be lactose intolerant too? I'm just guessing here. Any ideas???

[Guest guest]

Have you tried the milk with an AFP and Zyme Prime (or something with

lactase in it)?

Are the stomach aches a problem with just the AFP and no dairy? The

other thing to try would be diary as part of a meal (if you didn't do

that already).

.

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

My original question was has anyone tried giving yogurt or raw milk

without the enzymes? I tried giving the brand suggested on this list

(Stonyhill farms???), just a little with some AFP, but would have

behavioral meltdowns that looked like they were stomach related. I've been

afraid to try some without the enzymes. I gave it to her as part of her

snack, with other snack foods, not a heavy meal like dinner. can

tolerate pizza with the enzymes, AFP and Zyme without any problems.

Re: raw milk

Have you tried the milk with an AFP and Zyme Prime (or something with

lactase in it)?

Are the stomach aches a problem with just the AFP and no dairy? The

other thing to try would be diary as part of a meal (if you didn't do

that already).

.