Beet Kvass

[Guest guest]

The lids will only bulge if there is a really airtight seal, which you

may not have. Actually I think it's not a good idea to seal the lids.

Some folks have had the jars burst. Mason jars were not designed to

have high internal pressure.

It's " done " though, when you say it's done. Usually people let kvass

go 2 days, but it depends on the temperature.

On Wed, Jan 14, 2009 at 8:50 AM, Kathy Stockdale

<whoismyfarmer@...> wrote:

> HI All

>

> Trying to pay attention to details this time.... after 3 days of fermenting

> my beet kvass has lots of small bubbles rising to the top when I tip the

> jar, but the lids are not buldging; I can press the lid down. Can I

> consider it made or must the lids buldge as well as bubbles rise?

>

> Thanks

>

> Kathy in Ohio

>

>

[Guest guest]

Thank you, . I will proceed with confidence! : )

Kathy in Ohio

--- In nutrition , "

[Guest guest]

Plastic lids usually allow enough pressure out to prevent bulging.

If it bulges, release the pressure or your jar could explode. As to

just 3 days, I have found that if I leave my beets out 5 to 7 days

(using whey) before refrigerating, they taste much better. I do

about 5-7 days depending on temp, then refrigerate for several weeks

before eating. I guess if you are just drinking the liquid, 3 days

is fine but I like to eat the beets too.

Patty

>

> HI All

>

> Trying to pay attention to details this time.... after 3 days of

fermenting

> my beet kvass has lots of small bubbles rising to the top when I

tip the

> jar, but the lids are not buldging; I can press the lid down. Can I

> consider it made or must the lids buldge as well as bubbles rise?

>

> Thanks

>

> Kathy in Ohio

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Thank you. I am determined to get good at fermenting. Yet, I am so afraid

of it. I have been doing yogurt/kefir about 6 months now. Currently making

a cheesecake from homemade viili cream cheese. I added goat whey and Viili

into the mix for fun instead of sour cream. It turned out great, more like

a custard cheesecake!

Still there are days when I just want to throw them all away. Germs! For

some of us, it is hard to overcome that “Germ’s” propaganda. I have started

a Kombucha batch for the 3rd time. I do it for several days and it begins

to look like a space alien has taken over the mix. And, out it goes!!! I

did figure out that part of the alien is a baby mother. Also, I’m

fermenting carrots and kraut. I have tossed out one jar of kraut already, I

cracked the jar somehow. Out it went. I usually toss out, sometimes

without tasting. I tasted the beet kvass and drank ¼ cup. I think I will

be ok with that. Did not taste bad at all.

Yesterday after several days, I saw that my fermented veggies have lost most

of their water. Should I toss? I just added plain filtered water to the

jar. The kraut jar has veggies in it that have grayed and lost their

brightness. The carrot/ginger/rosemary/tiny bit of garlic mix has orange

bits floating on them. I think it is ok. The ginger and rosemary don’t

look as good. I think I do need to order some dunkers to feel save. I do

have small bits of coral a friend gave me. She found them on the beach.

Would they work until I order dunkers. I feel the way I seal the jars is

not all that right. I don’t like the metal or plastic touching the brine

water. How many have those fancy lids that off-gas? Donna Gates sells them

I think? They are expensive, are they any good?

Shari

Use it up, wear it out

make it do or do without

[Guest guest]

Beet Kvass

Thank you. I am determined to get good at fermenting. Yet, I am so afraid

of it. I have been doing yogurt/kefir about 6 months now. Currently making

a cheesecake from homemade viili cream cheese. I added goat whey and Viili

into the mix for fun instead of sour cream. It turned out great, more like

a custard cheesecake!

Still there are days when I just want to throw them all away. Germs! For

some of us, it is hard to overcome that " Germ's " propaganda. I have started

a Kombucha batch for the 3rd time. I do it for several days and it begins

to look like a space alien has taken over the mix. And, out it goes!!! I

did figure out that part of the alien is a baby mother. Also, I'm

fermenting carrots and kraut. I have tossed out one jar of kraut already, I

cracked the jar somehow. Out it went. I usually toss out, sometimes

without tasting. I tasted the beet kvass and drank ¼ cup. I think I will

be ok with that. Did not taste bad at all.

Yesterday after several days, I saw that my fermented veggies have lost most

of their water. Should I toss? I just added plain filtered water to the

jar. The kraut jar has veggies in it that have grayed and lost their

brightness. The carrot/ginger/rosemary/tiny bit of garlic mix has orange

bits floating on them. I think it is ok. The ginger and rosemary don't

look as good. I think I do need to order some dunkers to feel save. I do

have small bits of coral a friend gave me. She found them on the beach.

Would they work until I order dunkers. I feel the way I seal the jars is

not all that right. I don't like the metal or plastic touching the brine

water. How many have those fancy lids that off-gas? Donna Gates sells them

I think? They are expensive, are they any good?

Shari

Use it up, wear it out

make it do or do without

[Guest guest]

Hi Shari,

What are dunkers?

Susie from Oregon

Beet Kvass

Thank you. I am determined to get good at fermenting. Yet, I am so afraid

of it. I have been doing yogurt/kefir about 6 months now. Currently making

a cheesecake from homemade viili cream cheese. I added goat whey and Viili

into the mix for fun instead of sour cream. It turned out great, more like

a custard cheesecake!

Still there are days when I just want to throw them all away. Germs! For

some of us, it is hard to overcome that " Germ's " propaganda. I have started

a Kombucha batch for the 3rd time. I do it for several days and it begins

to look like a space alien has taken over the mix. And, out it goes!!! I

did figure out that part of the alien is a baby mother. Also, I'm

fermenting carrots and kraut. I have tossed out one jar of kraut already, I

cracked the jar somehow. Out it went. I usually toss out, sometimes

without tasting. I tasted the beet kvass and drank ¼ cup. I think I will

be ok with that. Did not taste bad at all.

Yesterday after several days, I saw that my fermented veggies have lost most

of their water. Should I toss? I just added plain filtered water to the

jar. The kraut jar has veggies in it that have grayed and lost their

brightness. The carrot/ginger/rosemary/tiny bit of garlic mix has orange

bits floating on them. I think it is ok. The ginger and rosemary don't

look as good. I think I do need to order some dunkers to feel save. I do

have small bits of coral a friend gave me. She found them on the beach.

Would they work until I order dunkers. I feel the way I seal the jars is

not all that right. I don't like the metal or plastic touching the brine

water. How many have those fancy lids that off-gas? Donna Gates sells them

I think? They are expensive, are they any good?

Shari

Use it up, wear it out

make it do or do without

[Guest guest]

I think we've all been through that. We've really had it beat into our heads

that germs are bad, bad, bad.

If it helps any, you have several trillion of them in your gut and all over

your skin, and in your mouth. A few more are very unlikely to hurt anything.

Only a few species cause major problems.

It helps if you have a dog or chickens. Or even a cat. They eat all kinds of

awful stuff. And survive just fine.

Still, most of us HAVE had food poisoning at some point or another, so we

are paranoid. Here are some things that help me:

1. You have a REALLY GOOD chemistry set built into your body. Most ordinary

people can do, say, fancy wine tasting with a little bit of training. Your

body knows when something is " off " . In general, if you smell something and

it smells tasty, it's probably fine.

2. The one really problematic germ is clostridium, which causes botulism.

Clostridium doesn't grow well when there is any competition: the ferment

recipes are such that they produce lots of competition for clostridium, and

if you look at the CDC website, you'll see it's mainly a problem in

home-canned foods with no salt or acid (green beans, fish), garlic heads

stored in oil, or certain kinds of fish ferments. It's not something you

need to worry about in kraut or kvass etc. Personally I don't make ferments

that don't have one of: salt, acid, or a starter culture.

3. The other germs, like listeria, are mainly a problem for things like

reheated leftovers. The fermenting process actually kills listeria, so an

old stinky cheese is safer than a fresh one.

4. There has been very little reporting of illness from fermenting on this

group. Actually I can't recall any, even from the people who tasted " bad

ferments " . Our family has never gotten ill from a ferment, though I have

made us sick a couple of times from stuff like undercooked turkey that was

reheated. However, since we've been doing more fermenting and have changed

our diet, we haven't actually had any bacterial " food poisoning " from any

source.

5. I keep some fallback medicine handy anyway! I have a bottle of bentonite

(Pascalite brand: but likely any bentonite will work) in the kitchen, and I

carry it with me when I travel. 1/4 tsp. of bentonite has worked for

anything I've had (I get sick from accidentally eating gluten) and also for

relatives who travel a lot. Pepto Bismol also works for dysbiosis (bad

bacteria).

It helps also if you just have ONE TINY taste the first time. You can

usually get your head around that, and there is an issue, sometimes, of

" getting used to " a ferment. The first time I had kefir it felt like WW3 was

going on in my gut: I wasn't sick, just very very bubbly.

Also, some ferments are pretty strong tasting. Most people don't just eat

chunk after chunk of cheese: they put it on a hamburger. Most kimchi you

really can't eat by itself: it would be like eating plain mustard. I have

seen people eat kraut plain, but I don't: I dump it over some potatoes and

cook it together, then serve it with some good roast sausage on top. So

while you are getting used to them, use them in recipes, as toppings, or

with other things, like you did with the viili! (Viili can make a good creme

fraiche too: way better than storebought, and cheap too. Just mix some viili

with some cream and let it set for a day or three. Use instead of sour cream

as a topping: most people love it).

And go slow. Most of us, me included, tried way too many ferments at once

and got overloaded. Better to do ONE and get used to it, or decide you don't

like it and try the next one.

A ferment going dry isn't likely to hurt anything, unless it gets moldy. You

can tell if it's moldy though: it smells like mold, and it's fuzzy on top.

Some kinds of mold, like the white mold that grows on brie, are ok to eat,

and others are not good to eat, but in any case they can generally just be

removed. Sometimes (before I started making Dunkers) I had the top leaves of

cabbage go dry on my kraut, and I just tossed them and ate the rest. I don't

think they were toxic though, just not appetizing. You can use ANY piece of

ceramic to hold down your kraut though: just look for something the right

size. Like, a small glass bottle (the kind cosmetic creams come in

sometimes?). Or a pyrex condiment cup. Or a paperweight or ashtray. Or go to

Value Village and find some kitchen thingy the right size. Just fold over a

piece of salted cabbage for the " top " (or use lettuce, grape leaves, kale:

anything big and leafy and nontoxic).

Coral might work, but I think it will dissolve in the acid. Coral is mostly

calcium carbonate, and it dissolves in acid, which will also neutralize the

acid in your ferment, which might make it go slimy. Someone had good

results with a quartz crystal, but my problem with quartz is that it's

sometimes found near lead deposits, so you'd want to be sure it is ONLY

quartz. I used a rock from my yard once, but it was full of iron and turned

the whole ferment orange. Very possibly plastic is safer than some random

rock. Ceramic these days is tested though, no matter what it's used for, so

it's a generally safe bet.

I use plain plastic lids. I don't think having an outgasser buys you much

for kraut, though I have some from beer-making (you DO need them if you make

beer! Beer makes a lot of foamy stuff and you can't really make it well in a

jar). The lid doesn't touch the ferment though, if you hold the ferment down

with a spacer of some kind.

If you really want an outgasser, you can buy them from your local homebrew

store for $2 and glue one to a lid (or drill a hole of the right size and

shove it in).

Anyway, hope this helps! Most of us started out where you are at right now,

and now we have kitchens that look like a mad scientist's laboratory.

On Wed, Jun 23, 2010 at 3:37 PM, Fieber <pfieber@...> wrote:

>

> Beet Kvass

>

>

>

> Thank you. I am determined to get good at fermenting. Yet, I am so afraid

> of it. I have been doing yogurt/kefir about 6 months now. Currently making

> a cheesecake from homemade viili cream cheese. I added goat whey and Viili

> into the mix for fun instead of sour cream. It turned out great, more like

> a custard cheesecake!

>

> Still there are days when I just want to throw them all away. Germs! For

> some of us, it is hard to overcome that " Germ's " propaganda. I have

> started

> a Kombucha batch for the 3rd time. I do it for several days and it begins

> to look like a space alien has taken over the mix. And, out it goes!!! I

> did figure out that part of the alien is a baby mother. Also, I'm

> fermenting carrots and kraut. I have tossed out one jar of kraut already,

> I

> cracked the jar somehow. Out it went. I usually toss out, sometimes

> without tasting. I tasted the beet kvass and drank ¼ cup. I think I will

> be ok with that. Did not taste bad at all.

>

> Yesterday after several days, I saw that my fermented veggies have lost

> most

> of their water. Should I toss? I just added plain filtered water to the

> jar. The kraut jar has veggies in it that have grayed and lost their

> brightness. The carrot/ginger/rosemary/tiny bit of garlic mix has orange

> bits floating on them. I think it is ok. The ginger and rosemary don't

> look as good. I think I do need to order some dunkers to feel save. I do

> have small bits of coral a friend gave me. She found them on the beach.

> Would they work until I order dunkers. I feel the way I seal the jars is

> not all that right. I don't like the metal or plastic touching the brine

> water. How many have those fancy lids that off-gas? Donna Gates sells them

> I think? They are expensive, are they any good?

>

> Shari

>

> Use it up, wear it out

>

> make it do or do without

>

>

> ----

>

[Guest guest]

Thank you for your reply. I am trying too much. I have beet kvass, I am

drinking that. Not bad. How long does it keep? I know it should be gone

before it goes bad. If not, how long?

When making fermentations, do you boil the jar and equipment? Can I just use

the dishwasher?

Shari

--- In nutrition ,