Re: Re: Miso...

[Guest guest]

G'day ,

>I started making my own spore by just letting the koji ripen to the

>point it is growing green fuzz. I use this green spore in new

>batches--just grind it up and add a bit of rice flour to it until it's

>the same color as the spore you buy.

Much like with tempeh spore.

>I never even considered it might

>not work--just seemed reasonable to me since I dislike having to buy

>new spore when I can make my own easier and cheaper.

This is the route I was originally planning, but the easier route given

in How to Cook with Miso is to just reserve some koji and use that (i.e.

not letting it sporulate, just using what's going already as a starter).

I can see how the latter method could become unviable after a period, as

it could be prone to infection from other microbes - other moulds,

lactic acid bacteria and yeasts. With the sporulation method, you can

see from the colour where there is foreign mould (i.e. something other

than A. oryzae) and avoid that patch. Harder with the largely white rice

koji, which could be teaming with bacteria and yeasts munching on all

those nice sugars.

>I would be interested in hearing whether anybody has experienced

> " fizzed out " spore after continuing to make their own.

Me too. I've reserved a little koji for starting the next batch with, so

would be interested to hear about this.

--

Ross McKay, Toronto, NSW Australia

" Let the laddie play wi the knife - he'll learn "

- The Wee Book of Calvin

[Guest guest]

I love black beans. One of our local breakfast restaurants offers the choice

of hash browns, grits, or black beans with breakfast. I always take the

black beans. I love a nice thick black bean soup or just simmered whole with

cumin and chilies.

I know it's somewhat off topic, but could you share a recipe for a

traditional black bean preparation that you like?

Re: Miso...

> Hello Ross,

>

> <<find them utterly boring next to such wonders as lima beans, black-eyed

> peas, borlotti beans, adzuki beans, urad beans, mung beans (especially

> sprouted) and chickpeas.>>

>

> I'm Cuban, so I must add black beans to the list. YUM!!! Out of this world

> delicious and don't quote me on this, but might be leading the pack

> nutritionally (or at least I like to think so). Certainly leading the pack

> with flavor.

>

> Of course, I have a billy goat stomach, having been raised on a broad

> daily variety of beans, except interestingly enough, Cuban cuisine does

> not include soybeans.

>

> Millie

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

G'day Millie,

>I'm Cuban, so I must add black beans to the list. YUM!!! [...]

Of course, I very much like a good chili black bean too! Please note

that the list I gave was a much reduced list of what's typically in my

cupboard - point being that most beans are tastier than soy!

>Of course, I have a billy goat stomach, having been raised on a broad

>daily variety of beans, except interestingly enough, Cuban cuisine does

>not include soybeans.

That could be more from culture than anything, however.

I'm with - please do share your black bean recipe! I cook up a

bastardised version of one off the Wikibooks cookbook, but would love to

hear about an authentic Cuban dish.

--

Ross McKay, Toronto, NSW Australia

" Read beans and rice, I could eat a plate twice " - Spearhead

[Guest guest]

asked for a black bean dish

it is not fermented but i thought i would share this

black bean stew i made recently to use as an enchilada

filling

chop:

1 large carrot

1 large onion

4 large cloves garlic

1 pablano pepper

1 red bell pepper

1 serrano pepper

1 jalapeno pepper (more if you want it spicier)

and saute in olive oil with some sea salt

add 1 tsp cumin, 1 tsp paprika, 1 and 1/2 tsp oregano

saute till vegetables are softened, remove from heat,

add juice of 2 limes and put aside

soak 1 cup black beans overnight, then place in pot

with water and simmer till soft, about 1 hour. Add the

pepper mixture to the beans and simmer a couple

minutes. season (w/ sea salt, and lime) if necessary

to balance the spices and add fresh cilantro

enjoy!

phil

Philip Gelb

shakuhachi player, teacher

vegetarian chef

http://philipgelb.com

http://myspace.com/inthemoodforfood

http://myspace.com/philipgelb

[Guest guest]

Phill, black bean paste [or salted black bean for black bean sauce] is a

fermented product, it is a salt ferment similar to miso. That may go

well in your recipe. Just an idea.

Be-well,

Dom

Philip Gelb typed:

> asked for a black bean dish

> it is not fermented but i thought i would share this

> black bean stew i made recently to use as an enchilada

> filling

>

> chop:

> 1 large carrot

> 1 large onion

> 4 large cloves garlic

> 1 pablano pepper

> 1 red bell pepper

> 1 serrano pepper

> 1 jalapeno pepper (more if you want it spicier)

> and saute in olive oil with some sea salt

> add 1 tsp cumin, 1 tsp paprika, 1 and 1/2 tsp oregano

> saute till vegetables are softened, remove from heat,

> add juice of 2 limes and put aside

>

> soak 1 cup black beans overnight, then place in pot

> with water and simmer till soft, about 1 hour. Add the

> pepper mixture to the beans and simmer a couple

> minutes. season (w/ sea salt, and lime) if necessary

> to balance the spices and add fresh cilantro

>

> enjoy!

>

> phil

>

> Philip Gelb

> shakuhachi player, teacher

> vegetarian chef

> http://philipgelb.com

> http://myspace.com/inthemoodforfood

> http://myspace.com/philipgelb

[Guest guest]

Dominic N Anfiteatro wrote:

>Phill, black bean paste [or salted black bean for black bean sauce] is a

>fermented product, it is a salt ferment similar to miso. That may go

>well in your recipe. Just an idea.

NB: there's black bean paste and black bean paste...

Some pastes given the name black bean paste in English are pastes that

have gone black through the aging process, and are actually made from

soybeans or mung beans.

But you knew that...

--

Ross McKay, Toronto, NSW Australia

" Let the laddie play wi the knife - he'll learn "

- The Wee Book of Calvin

[Guest guest]

Patty wrote:

> Dom, the special diet I'm on says NO peanuts due to the fact that the

> entire US supply of peanuts is now contaminated with aflatoxin

Patty, where did this information come from? I've heard stuff like this

before, and someone who is in the industry responded that it is NOT true,

and that they go to great lengths to inspect peanuts in the US to make sure

they are NOT contaminated. I was worried because I eat a lot of peanuts,

and give peanut butter to my dogs daily, as a treat.

and the K9's

[Guest guest]

I heard peanuts were the most likely nut to be affected by toxins in the

groundwater; almonds are supposed to be much safer. That's why everyone

eats almond butter, isn't it?

Patty wrote:

>

> > Dom, the special diet I'm on says NO peanuts due to the fact that the

> > entire US supply of peanuts is now contaminated with aflatoxin

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Patty and Jasmine,

This was a big thing here in Australia in the early 1980s. A large

health food outlet I used to work at, had peanuts sourced with no

aflatoxin, and were labeled as such in big letters. Do you know where

USA peanuts are grown?

My understanding is that these toxins are produced due to poor storage

conditions of peanuts. Have you ever seen photos of large pyramids of

peanuts! This is how the nuts are stored before packaging in some

countries, possibly in the larger peanut growing areas of the world. You

can image what can occur in the center of those large mounds if the

peanuts are not dried well enough. Molds and certain organisms are

responsible for mycotoxin and aflatoxin production.

Aflatoxin in corn is completely destroyed by preparing massa [for

traditional tortillas]-- by cooking maize in the traditional manner. And

that is by cooking dry maize with lye water-- a solution of calcium

hydroxide or wood ash lye [or both]. I think this would be true for

cooking peanuts contaminated with aflatoxin. But why would one want to

go to all that bother?

For interest, and in case one only had peanuts to live on, since these

need to be cooked first for tempeh making, if aflatoxin is a concern,

then I would suggest cooking the raw peanuts in lye solution, followed

by rinsing well with fresh water to remove excess lye from the nuts, and

then do a final few minutes cooking in an acid solution. Then inoculate

with tempeh spores and ferment per tempeh making method.

I know of 2 folks who cook any cereal grain that may acquire aflatoxin

such as corn with lime lye as above, before preparing other dishes with

the grains or before eating. These two folks in particular were having

some pretty bad reactions to the grains before moving on to this method,

and they suggested it may have been due to some toxin other than

mycotoxin or aflatoxin in the cereal grain.

I'm just throwing around ideas, and to show that where there's a way,

there's a will to corrupt, and where there's that will, there's a way

around it with no will of our own. [????]

Be-well,

Dom

On 10/16/2007 2:28:32 AM, Jasmine (purejasmine@...) wrote:

> I heard peanuts were the most likely nut to be affected by toxins in the

> groundwater; almonds are supposed to be much safer.

> That's why everyone

> eats almond butter, isn't it?

Patty wrote:

> > > Dom, the special diet I'm on says NO peanuts due to the fact that the

entire US supply of peanuts is now contaminated with aflatoxin

[Guest guest]

Patty, I just replied both yourself and Jasmin in a single post, and

once again when I've been at the PC for a little too long and not

thinking clearly enough.

In any case, if you really do miss your peanut butter, and you have a

genuine aflatoxin concern and no other source for clean peanuts that you

can afford or what ever it may be, then I am reasonably certain that

cooking the nuts first as I suggested for massa, should destroy the

aflatoxin. I know for a fact that this is true for cooking aflatoxin

laced maize, there's a full research paper I have on it. I acquired the

full research paper some years ago, when I was preparing tortilla with

tempeh as dry toasted chips with gomashio on a small commercial scale.

I do not think that tempeh fermentation alone will remove aflatoxin.

Although I did read some research in this regard many years ago, I can

not recall exactly what the conclusion was. I would not trust the tempeh

process to remove the toxin, as I would with cooking the nuts with lye

water.

This is how I would go about it. Cook raw peanuts in a solution of 1%

w/v slaked lime [calcium hydroxide and water-- must be food grade

calcium hydroxide which is not cheap. I paid $25 for a food grade 500gm

calcium hydroxide from a local chem-supplier]. Cook the peanuts for 30

minutes in lye water, then drain. Rinse and wash the peanuts well,

rubbing the nuts in the hands to remove excess lye, doing so until the

water is left clean. You could dry the nuts and grind for a peanut

butter, or first dry toast to make peanut butter. Lots of work involved,

but it may produce some wonderful peanut butter.

It would be calcium enriched, as is the case for traditional tortillas

prepared with maize cooked in a solution of " slaked lime " [traditionally

prepared by collecting lime stone which is continually burnt for 7 days

on large mounds of wood, adding the burnt lime stone to a water bath---

the white sediment is slaked lime].

Be-well,

Dom

Patty typed:

> Dom, the special diet I'm on says NO peanuts due to the fact that the

> entire US supply of peanuts is now contaminated with aflatoxin (except

> possibly organic Valencia). Would fermenting deactivate this toxin? I

> love peanuts/peanut butter and really miss it. Almond butter is just

> too darn expensive.

[Guest guest]

G'day Isao,

>Using a stainless net strainer does not help ?

>Tea strainer maybe...

I might have to. The cup I just had wasn't so bad, though.

I don't normally strain my miso soups - when I make it with a commercial

doenjang, I get bits of bean at the bottom of the cup, which is fine.

--

Ross McKay, Toronto, NSW Australia

" Let the laddie play wi the knife - he'll learn "

- The Wee Book of Calvin