questions about baker's and natural yeasts

[Guest guest]

A member of another list posed the following questions. The group is geared

toward the book Nourishing Traditions. I would be thankful for any help with

answers.

1. Baker's yeast - is it OK to use it in already soaked breads or is it

always a little bit " bad " ? If so, then why?

2. " Natural yeasts " (for bread making), made from grapes, apples or even

kombucha - are these any different from baker's yeast from a chemical point of

view or are they just as good/bad?

Thanks in advance for any comments. Carol

[Guest guest]

I am in no way an expert, but I think it is like this:

There are hundreds of different yeasts and bacteria that will ferment

(yoghurtbacteria for example )bacteria and if you can beat it back.

Bakers yeast is just as natural as other yeasts, but is usually of

the microorganism named candida

Other yeasts/bacteria can propably also be bad if we eat too muh of

it, despite the fact they grow naturally on various plants. So does

Candida.

Practical answer: some " natural " yeasts picked up from plants and not

via a factory are good, some are bad. I guess this is partly

personal, depending on your own flora.

But I think most of those that have been used for fermenting

traditionally propably are better for us than bakers yeast.

If you use both bakers yeast and yeast picked up from the grain from

oaking, you can risk that the bakers yeast " take over " the whole

fermenting process. There is also a difference in how the different

yeasts eat and thereby break down the grains. Sour dough is easier to

digest because it is more broken down already before we put it in out

mouth.

Use different water/fresher grains7 a bit salt maybe? To aid the

yeast growing on the grains.

Any comments?

Tove

Den 2. jan. 2007 kl. 02.44 skrev Carol Saunders:

> A member of another list posed the following questions. The group

> is geared toward the book Nourishing Traditions. I would be

> thankful for any help with answers.

>

> 1. Baker's yeast - is it OK to use it in already soaked breads

> or is it always a little bit " bad " ? If so, then why?

>

>

> 2. " Natural yeasts " (for bread making), made from grapes, apples or

> even kombucha - are these any different from baker's yeast from a

> chemical point of view or are they just as good/bad?

>

>

> Thanks in advance for any comments. Carol

>

[Guest guest]

Baker's yeast is Saccharomyces cerevisiae, not Candidia. I'm not certain

that the strain in baker's yeast (or brewer's yeast, for that matter) is any

better or worse for health than wild yeasts, but you are right that it is

very vigorous and tends to take over ferments. There are so many different

types of environmental yeasts that can enter a ferment that it's difficult

to generalize about their effect...but they can make for some *interesting*

flavors and results

Re: questions about baker's and natural yeasts

>I am in no way an expert, but I think it is like this:

>

> There are hundreds of different yeasts and bacteria that will ferment

> (yoghurtbacteria for example )bacteria and if you can beat it back.

> Bakers yeast is just as natural as other yeasts, but is usually of

> the microorganism named candida

> Other yeasts/bacteria can propably also be bad if we eat too muh of

> it, despite the fact they grow naturally on various plants. So does

> Candida.

>

> Practical answer: some " natural " yeasts picked up from plants and not

> via a factory are good, some are bad. I guess this is partly

> personal, depending on your own flora.

> But I think most of those that have been used for fermenting

> traditionally propably are better for us than bakers yeast.

>

> If you use both bakers yeast and yeast picked up from the grain from

> oaking, you can risk that the bakers yeast " take over " the whole

> fermenting process. There is also a difference in how the different

> yeasts eat and thereby break down the grains. Sour dough is easier to

> digest because it is more broken down already before we put it in out

> mouth.

>

> Use different water/fresher grains7 a bit salt maybe? To aid the

> yeast growing on the grains.

>

> Any comments?

>

> Tove

>

>

>

>

> Den 2. jan. 2007 kl. 02.44 skrev Carol Saunders:

>

>> A member of another list posed the following questions. The group

>> is geared toward the book Nourishing Traditions. I would be

>> thankful for any help with answers.

>>

>> 1. Baker's yeast - is it OK to use it in already soaked breads

>> or is it always a little bit " bad " ? If so, then why?

>>

>>

>> 2. " Natural yeasts " (for bread making), made from grapes, apples or

>> even kombucha - are these any different from baker's yeast from a

>> chemical point of view or are they just as good/bad?

>>

>>

>> Thanks in advance for any comments. Carol

>>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Thank you!

Tove

Den 2. jan. 2007 kl. 16.33 skrev SeaDruid:

> Baker's yeast is Saccharomyces cerevisiae, not Candidia. I'm not

> certain

> that the strain in baker's yeast (or brewer's yeast, for that

> matter) is any

> better or worse for health than wild yeasts, but you are right that

> it is

> very vigorous and tends to take over ferments. There are so many

> different

> types of environmental yeasts that can enter a ferment that it's

> difficult

> to generalize about their effect...but they can make for some

> *interesting*

> flavors and results

>

>

[Guest guest]

If you read the old cookbooks, cooks used to " catch " yeast

from the air and use that for bread making. The problem

was, some yeast tastes better than others, so they would

try to dry the " best " yeast to save in case they killed thier

ongoing sponge.

Baker's yeast isn't *the* best tasting yeast, but it's pretty

good. From a culinary perspective, the biggest problem

with it is that it doesn't allow lactobacilli, which DO add some

great flavor. The " artisan " breads use a teeeeeny bit of

baker's yeast, no salt, and a 24 hour rise, to get the LAB

flavor.

From a dietary standpoint, a LOT of people react to baker's

yeast, probably because they encountered it with wheat

gluten, which many people react to.

Personally, I prefer kefir yeast ... it's of a sort that happens

to be very good for you, but the other bacteria etc. happen

to be of a mix that is really, really tasty in my book! Plus

it's amazingly convenient. Add some kefir (or kefir beer, if

you don't do casein) to some dough and prepare for some

great bread or crackers. Dom's website has the details, I think.

But in a pinch, I've used baker's yeast to make some great

cider ...

--

On 1/2/07, SeaDruid <seaorca@...> wrote:

>

> Baker's yeast is Saccharomyces cerevisiae, not Candidia. I'm not certain

> that the strain in baker's yeast (or brewer's yeast, for that matter) is

> any

> better or worse for health than wild yeasts, but you are right that it is

> very vigorous and tends to take over ferments. There are so many different

> types of environmental yeasts that can enter a ferment that it's difficult

> to generalize about their effect...but they can make for some

> *interesting*

> flavors and results

>

>

> Re: questions about baker's and natural yeasts

>

>

> >I am in no way an expert, but I think it is like this:

> >

> > There are hundreds of different yeasts and bacteria that will ferment

> > (yoghurtbacteria for example )bacteria and if you can beat it back.

> > Bakers yeast is just as natural as other yeasts, but is usually of

> > the microorganism named candida

> > Other yeasts/bacteria can propably also be bad if we eat too muh of

> > it, despite the fact they grow naturally on various plants. So does

> > Candida.

> >

> > Practical answer: some " natural " yeasts picked up from plants and not

> > via a factory are good, some are bad. I guess this is partly

> > personal, depending on your own flora.

> > But I think most of those that have been used for fermenting

> > traditionally propably are better for us than bakers yeast.

> >

> > If you use both bakers yeast and yeast picked up from the grain from

> > oaking, you can risk that the bakers yeast " take over " the whole

> > fermenting process. There is also a difference in how the different

> > yeasts eat and thereby break down the grains. Sour dough is easier to

> > digest because it is more broken down already before we put it in out

> > mouth.

> >

> > Use different water/fresher grains7 a bit salt maybe? To aid the

> > yeast growing on the grains.

> >

> > Any comments?

> >

> > Tove

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Den 2. jan. 2007 kl. 02.44 skrev Carol Saunders:

> >

> >> A member of another list posed the following questions. The group

> >> is geared toward the book Nourishing Traditions. I would be

> >> thankful for any help with answers.

> >>

> >> 1. Baker's yeast - is it OK to use it in already soaked breads

> >> or is it always a little bit " bad " ? If so, then why?

> >>

> >>

> >> 2. " Natural yeasts " (for bread making), made from grapes, apples or

> >> even kombucha - are these any different from baker's yeast from a

> >> chemical point of view or are they just as good/bad?

> >>

> >>

> >> Thanks in advance for any comments. Carol

> >>

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Where could I get more information on kefir yeast?

PAUL

----- Original Message -----

From:

[Guest guest]

Google on " kefir yeast " ... the info I came across though, had

to do with S. boulardii, which people have been using independently

of kefir, but it turns out to be a yeast in kefir. Which might

explain why kefir is so healing to so many people.

http://www.dairyscience.info/kalpna.htm

It's hard to say exactly what strains are in which kefir,

because it's homegrown and each culture can vary a bit.

Dom's site is widely regarded as the best kefir resource

though:

http://users.sa.chariot.net.au/~dna/kefirpage.html

--

On 1/2/07, Fieber <pfieber@...> wrote:

>

>

>

> Where could I get more information on kefir yeast?

>

> PAUL

> ----- Original Message -----

> From: