Physical Therapy

[Guest guest]

Re: Physical Therapy

> I asked because I'm 61 and my (now fired) OS told me I was " too young " for

a TKR.

My suggestion for an OS like that; Tell him fine, then give me a solution

with the same pain resolution success rate as TKR. Tell him you want your

pain-free life from 60 to 80 years old, and not from 65 to 85 years old,

with literal hell from 60-65 years old.

Mike

[Guest guest]

My new OS would do a TKR but he wanted to try cutting out the torn-away portion

of the meniscus first & smoothing down the chondromalacia places. (Did that 3

months ago. Am still working on my VMO to stop the lateral patellar tracking,

which irritates the CP. I don't have a lot of self-discipline so it's hard to

make myself do the exercises.)

Ann

Re: Physical Therapy

> I asked because I'm 61 and my (now fired) OS told me I was " too young " for

a TKR.

My suggestion for an OS like that; Tell him fine, then give me a solution

with the same pain resolution success rate as TKR. Tell him you want your

pain-free life from 60 to 80 years old, and not from 65 to 85 years old,

with literal hell from 60-65 years old.

Mike

[Guest guest]

Re: Physical Therapy

> My new OS would do a TKR but he wanted to try cutting out the torn-away

portion of the meniscus first & smoothing down the chondromalacia places.

(Did that 3 months ago. Am still working on my VMO to stop the lateral

patellar tracking, which irritates the CP. I don't have a lot of

self-discipline so it's hard to make myself do the exercises.)

I am also going back to my local OS on Tuesday. I will let him do a scope

and scrape.........but no lateral release.........or TTT.

Mike

MT

[Guest guest]

Re: Physical Therapy

> Ok, I am just outside of Portland and work about a

> mile from OHSU.

>

> I don't remember if you mentioned what you've had for

> previous treatment but going from PT to total knee

> replacements seems kind of radical, but then I don't

> know your situation.

>

> Are you have both done at the same time?

I am not having either one done " now " . " Maybe " after another 1-3 years of

more conservative measures---including glucosamine, better sleep medications

so I can get a good night's sleep, physical therapy, possibly a simply scope

and maybe scrape, and the proper NSAID.

Mike

[Guest guest]

Re: Physical Therapy

> What groups are they trying to put you in?

For starters, I am not 39. For another, I am not afraid to try surgery,

even agressive surgery, but only if that surgery has a good track record. I

don't believe a person has to suffer to the point of almost complete

disability, or not even be able to sleep at night because of pain. I

believe I should have a hand in deciding what line of treatment is best for

me, and not leave that decision totally to my doctor or generally accepted

practices of a region of the United States.

Mike

MT

[Guest guest]

I had a successful lat. release in '95. My troubles started up again in '99

after I got a job where I had to sit w/my feet under a desk all day (shortened

the IT bands).

One thing that does concern me with repeated surgery is something someone

brought up the other day -- scar tissue forming where they put the 3 scopes

through your tissues, and causing pain later. Someone (maybe , the MD on

the ITBS list) said he didn't think massaging injured tissues could prevent

scarring but it seems like a good idea, in case it does work.

I think a TTT is extremely radical and should only be done if all else fails.

I'm not saying it doesn't work, but it seems to me that if the kneecap is out of

alignment to that extent, the problem is elsewhere, like the feet or the Q

angle, or weak tendons/ligaments (prolotherapy).

Ann

Re: Physical Therapy

> My new OS would do a TKR but he wanted to try cutting out the torn-away

portion of the meniscus first & smoothing down the chondromalacia places.

(Did that 3 months ago. Am still working on my VMO to stop the lateral

patellar tracking, which irritates the CP. I don't have a lot of

self-discipline so it's hard to make myself do the exercises.)

I am also going back to my local OS on Tuesday. I will let him do a scope

and scrape.........but no lateral release.........or TTT.

Mike

MT

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

Re: Physical Therapy

> What's a TTT? I've seen that acronym mentioned but

> not sure what it stands for.

Tibial Turbicle Transfer. A longer surgery to recover from than TKR. Two

OSs recommended that for me.

Mike

MT

[Guest guest]

To

Hang in there with therapy, I have been doing water therapy for two

mths now and they still want me to continue for the next two mths. I

don't have sciatic , but weekness in the hip joint. I did have

sciatic pain about 10 yrs ago but my job was dog grooming and

involved a lot bending and lifting. I am also fused from T5-L4 with

harrington rod. I quit dog grooming and continued with therapy, it

took mths but I recoverd.

Good luck to you

Franca

> I've written earlier about sciatic pain, but a few weeks ago I went

> for facet injections which the pain docs thought would help. Well,

> they didn't, and now I'm told that since they did not help, that

the

> procedure was considered diagnostic for showing the pain is not

> facet pain!

>

> Anyway, now I've been told that I'm fused from T5-L4. The L4-L5

and

> below are free, except for stenosis, some arthritic changes, and

the

> sciatica. So I'm now in PT at 3 times a week until whenever. My

> insurance pays 80% for unlimited visits, so this will be occupying

> my time for awhile. My PT is a sharp gal who is also trained in

> osteopathic medicine, we get along very well which works for me.

To

> quote her, " I've seen what some of the docs around here have

> attempted in so-called revisions, and you had better be crawling on

> your hands and knees before you let them touch you. " Enough said,

> so I'm praying that I'll find some relief and strength in PT and

> continued weight loss.

>

> Take care all of you. We all need prayers!

>

>

[Guest guest]

,

I'm so sorry the injections didn't help. I've had those injections before and

they're no fun.

Any way the PT can back up her statemenets by giving you the names of some of

the patients who have had revisions? Or how about which docs operated on them.

In my journey, I've noticed lots of docs claim they can do teh revision

surgery. When in fact, they cannot perform it as well as some other docs (spine

surgeons who do ONLY spine surgeries) in bigger cities.

Just a thought.

xoxo's

[Guest guest]

Wait...one more thing.

I used to be totally against revision. But now I have considered the one things

that is pertinent to anybody's decision...if I DID wait until I was walking on

my hands and knees...how much irreversible damage would have been done to me?

Would it have been worth it to wait or prolong the revision? These are some of

the questions I have for my doc.

xoxo's

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 5/17/2004 3:30:54 PM Central Standard Time, treprice2000@... writes:

What you describe is not physical therapy. Anyone can watch you and count. It does not take a MA in physical therapy to do that. You or your insurance company is paying rather a large sum for this person to come to your house and count reps.

______

Have to agree. Some home care PT's get paid even though they do short visits. If I were you, I would ask to see the amount of time the therapist is putting on the paper you sign for starters, and read the note to see if it is accurate as well. "Repetitive exercises" are not covered by Medicare or insurances since they are "non-skilled".

y (P.T.)

[Guest guest]

You say this about your therapist:

" All he is doing is coming over to my home and going over the

> same exercises that he went over with me a week ago. "

How many weeks have lapsed since your surgery? Has anyone considered

outpatient therapy (where you would go to a facility that has

equipment and staff to advance you)? Is it up to you to decide

whether to continue at-home therapy?

Typically at-home therapy is used for those who are home-bound and

cannot get out at all. This describes many post-op hip patients for

a couple of weeks so it would be warranted for that period of time.

The exercises done by patients at that stage also don't require

sophisticated equipment; mine required a rolled up towel and a

plastic garbage bag!

What you describe is not physical therapy. Anyone can watch you and

count. It does not take a MA in physical therapy to do that. You or

your insurance company is paying rather a large sum for this person

to come to your house and count reps.

>

> > Well, the results are in on the poll I started about number of

> > physical therapy appts AFTER hospital and in-home. I was shocked

at

> > the high percentage (>60%) who had none. Just curious what people

> > think the reason for that is? Insurance doesn't pay for it?

Doctors

> > don't understand value? Other?

> Although I didn't vote because I'm in the midst of recovery, I have

an

> opinion on this especially since it is fresh in my mind. My PT has

asked me

> not to cancel him as I can do what he is doing with me without his

> assistance. All he is doing is coming over to my home and going

over the

> same exercises that he went over with me a week ago. Since I know

them,

> there is really no reason for him to come over except that he

doesn't want

> to be canceled. He doesn't bring weights. He doesn't show me

anything new.

> I do the same set of exercises in the morning without his

assistance. I

> walk about a half mile right now every day (guesstimating two

blocks) and I

> even did another set of exercises last night before bed. So that

made 3

> sets in one day.

>

> The thing that I really needed was a good rehab and as I told you,

mine was

> horrible except for the PT. It was those first few weeks that to

me were

> the toughest. Ie. How to get in and out of a bathtub, how to climb

stairs,

> how to get in and out of bed, how to put on a pair of socks, how to

pick

> something up off the floor etc etc.

> In His Love,

> Vera

[Guest guest]

Vera: What is your range of motion? Can you straigthen your knee

completely, and flex more that 90degreees? If you are out walking,

you are not really homebound, and need to go on to out patient therapy,

if you need more, for strengthening and more range of motion.

Good luck, Marilyn

Vera Berry wrote:

On 5/17/04 5:31 AM, "Joint Replacement "

<Joint Replacement > wrote:

> Well, the results are in on the poll I started about number of

> physical therapy appts AFTER hospital and in-home. I was shocked

at

> the high percentage (>60%) who had none. Just curious what

people

> think the reason for that is? Insurance doesn't pay for it?

Doctors

> don't understand value? Other?

Although I didn't vote because I'm in the midst of recovery, I have an

opinion on this especially since it is fresh in my mind. My PT has

asked me

not to cancel him as I can do what he is doing with me without his

assistance. All he is doing is coming over to my home and going over

the

same exercises that he went over with me a week ago. Since I know them,

there is really no reason for him to come over except that he doesn't

want

to be canceled. He doesn't bring weights. He doesn't show me anything

new.

I do the same set of exercises in the morning without his assistance. I

walk about a half mile right now every day (guesstimating two blocks)

and I

even did another set of exercises last night before bed. So that made 3

sets in one day.

The thing that I really needed was a good rehab and as I told you, mine

was

horrible except for the PT. It was those first few weeks that to me

were

the toughest. Ie. How to get in and out of a bathtub, how to climb

stairs,

how to get in and out of bed, how to put on a pair of socks, how to pick

something up off the floor etc etc.

In His Love,

Vera

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 5/18/2004 7:02:55 AM Central Standard Time, richardbeebe97303@... writes:

getting out to a Physical Therapist;they're absolutely correct; I can't believe so many people didn't havesomeone to go to;

_____

Its my understanding that many of the MDs have decided that therapy doesn't help that much. Obviously, that sounds stupid to me.....but it wouldn't be the first time they got something silly into their collective heads. Can remember when half of them wouldn't let their patients use rolling walkers "because they would run away from them".

y

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/11/2004 11:19:42 AM Pacific Standard Time, christinehrph@... writes:

[Guest guest]

,

Unless he has weakness in his limbs I don't see how PT would be of any benefit while he is in a cast. was in PT to stretch and strenghten his back muscles, which cannot be done while he is wearing a cast. I have also noticed that everytime we get his cast removed his back is still pretty strong, we will keep our fingers crossed this time because he has been in it for 3 1/2 months.

Crista

[Guest guest]

hi christine,

when i was in erie after lucas' first cast, the pt there said

to forgo pt until lucas was out of the cast. then get back

into it because he would need it then in order to strengthen

muscles he hadn't been using. i was actually quite glad about

that since lucas was not cooperating with the new pt from

early intervention. the old pt was much better at getting

lucas to " play " in such a way that got him to strengthen or

stretch certain back muscles. this other pt basically grabbed

his arms and made him do it. oh well . . .

deshea, lucas & ruby

hi all

My PT wants to con't to see Adan while in his Cast to work on

activites and delvopment and is excited to see this treatment

anyone else doing PT in a cast?

and Adan

[Guest guest]

,

I totally understand. is top heavy and falls often. He does fall on his head while he is sitting if he is mad which is pretty funny. No serious head injuries though, he falls in slow motion it seems because he must know that he will get hurt if he throws a fit!

LOL

Crista

[Guest guest]

AHHHH to be a fly on the wall... Adan has had some pretty funny tantrums also I wonder what he will be like when he has the cast on

I re-read my e-mails after they are sent and the spelling is always correct until give me a copy and I read it again there is a always something I overlooked from my crappy typing skills ,,,to you all I can spell I promise I just do things too fast...LOLcristab@... wrote:

,I totally understand. is top heavy and falls often. He does fall on his head while he is sitting if he is mad which is pretty funny. No serious head injuries though, he falls in slow motion it seems because he must know that he will get hurt if he throws a fit!LOLCrista __________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

When you get back form SLC let's talk let me know when your back....

ChrisitneAmy on <_amos@...> wrote:

,You can call me whenever you need to here is my phone# 1-970-308-2691 I would love to talk to you aboutthe PT and other issues. Talk to you soonAmy and Jaeden--- <christinehrph@...>wrote:> Hi Amy > Thanks for your reply> I think I am going to con't doing PT there is so> much I do not know and to have them is good for> developmental issues.You never really know> everything and it is good to get a PT opinion. What> I really like is how excited she got about learning> about the casting so we will see> Yes I love to talk to fellow members of the group> it is always so nice to talk to some one else going> thru these issues and I am so much better on the> Phone ( I always cut typing in high school)> So let

me know and I can call you whenever> > Our appt is on Dec 15 thru the 19 and I am nervous> because the entire procedure is "new " to us so I> would love t get some pro's advice> I tried to get an appt for next week but I guess he> is really booked so as long as it is whitin the> month I am grateful> > My hubby is so excited to go to snowbird to go> boarding on Sat so you never now west coasters we> may end up moving out there. We hear the snow is> great for skiing/boarding> I hope to talk to you soon> > and Adan> > Amy on <_amos@...> wrote:> ,> my son Jaeden is doing PT in his cast. They work on> him being able to get off the floor in his cast> which> is a very hard thing to do and also work on trying> to> keep his muscle tone on the muscles that

are under> the> cast. My PT is wonderful and has adjusted very well> with working with the cast. I hope all goes well> with> you two. Are you going to SLC this coming week. We> are so if you want to know more you can talk to me> in> person. Let me know?> Amy> --- christinehrph <christinehrph@...> wrote:> > > > > hi all> > > > My PT wants to con't to see Adan while in his Cast> > to work on > > activites and delvopment and is excited to see> this> > treatment> > anyone else doing PT in a cast?> > > > and Adan> > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Do you ? > Check out the

new Front Page. > www. > > > >

[Guest guest]

,

I just got back from SLC. Jaeden's casting went well

he was throwing up so they made us stay until he went

12 hours without throwing up. We finally got to go

home to day. Horray!!! I am so glad to be home.

Talk to you soon

Amy and Jaeden

--- <christinehrph@...>

wrote:

> When you get back form SLC let's talk let me know

> when your back....

> Chrisitne

>

> Amy on <_amos@...> wrote:

> ,

> You can call me whenever you need to here is my

> phone

> # 1-970-308-2691 I would love to talk to you about

> the PT and other issues.

> Talk to you soon

> Amy and Jaeden

> --- <christinehrph@...>

> wrote:

>

> > Hi Amy

> > Thanks for your reply

> > I think I am going to con't doing PT there is so

> > much I do not know and to have them is good for

> > developmental issues.You never really know

> > everything and it is good to get a PT opinion.

> What

> > I really like is how excited she got about

> learning

> > about the casting so we will see

> > Yes I love to talk to fellow members of the group

> > it is always so nice to talk to some one else

> going

> > thru these issues and I am so much better on the

> > Phone ( I always cut typing in high school)

> > So let me know and I can call you whenever

> >

> > Our appt is on Dec 15 thru the 19 and I am nervous

> > because the entire procedure is " new " to us so I

> > would love t get some pro's advice

> > I tried to get an appt for next week but I guess

> he

> > is really booked so as long as it is whitin the

> > month I am grateful

> >

> > My hubby is so excited to go to snowbird to go

> > boarding on Sat so you never now west coasters we

> > may end up moving out there. We hear the snow is

> > great for skiing/boarding

> > I hope to talk to you soon

> >

> > and Adan

> >

> > Amy on <_amos@...> wrote:

> > ,

> > my son Jaeden is doing PT in his cast. They work

> on

> > him being able to get off the floor in his cast

> > which

> > is a very hard thing to do and also work on trying

> > to

> > keep his muscle tone on the muscles that are under

> > the

> > cast. My PT is wonderful and has adjusted very

> well

> > with working with the cast. I hope all goes well

> > with

> > you two. Are you going to SLC this coming week.

> We

> > are so if you want to know more you can talk to me

> > in

> > person. Let me know?

> > Amy

> > --- christinehrph <christinehrph@...> wrote:

> >

> > >

> > > hi all

> > >

> > > My PT wants to con't to see Adan while in his

> Cast

> > > to work on

> > > activites and delvopment and is excited to see

> > this

> > > treatment

> > > anyone else doing PT in a cast?

> > >

> > > and Adan

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > __________________________________

> > Do you ?

> > Check out the new Front Page.

> > www.

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

I can only speak for myself, but I do quite well when I do my

exercises and am in a great amount of pain (from weak back muscles)

when I don't. I had PT after my last fusion and have continued the

home exercises after the PT sessions have stopped. They aren't my

favorite thing to do but they are quite necessary.

> ... I was wondering if any of you " flatbackers " (like

> me) have had their doctors recommened physical therapy for their

> pains. I have been referred twice (at two different times several

> years apart) for physical therapy, and it does seem to help--for

> awhile--and then the pain comes back. But perhaps that's because I

> don't follow through and continue the exercises long-term.

[Guest guest]

Hi Carol V. Physical therapy really did help me and it

got me off pain medications. I highly recommend it.

When my PT ended, I even joined the local gym and used

the treadmill and recumbant (<sp?) bicycle - along

with continuing to do the stretches and core

strengthening exercises I was given. As for surgery, I

choose to have it last year for various reasons. It

was rough. But I am almost 6 months post-op and am

thankful I did it. I am also going to physical therapy

now and take no pain medications. I wish you good luck

in your search for a doctor. Keep us posted on how you

make out. Take care -Kathi in NJ

--- Carol <dcvaughan@...> wrote:

>

>

> Thank you all for your responses to my posts last

> week. I am trying

> to get into a local Orthopedist, but someday I'm

> sure will have to

> see Dr. Hu or Dr. Berven at UCSF. However, one

> question came into my

> mind yesterday and I was wondering if any of you

> " flatbackers " (like

> me) have had their doctors recommened physical

> therapy for their

> pains. I have been referred twice (at two different

> times several

> years apart) for physical therapy, and it does seem

> to help--for

> awhile--and then the pain comes back. But perhaps

> that's because I

> don't follow through and continue the exercises

> long-term. I just

> wanted some responses from some others if physical

> therapy had been

> of any help to them--especially long term, or does

> it do no good for

> us " flatbackers " long term? Do we just all have to

> face future

> surgery, or are there other alternatives for the

> pain?

>

> As a side thought I read someone's description of

> surgery and how

> she's in horrible pain now and some screws have come

> loose and had to

> be taken out--now I'm wondering whether I should

> ever consider

> surgery in the future or just plan to be in a wheel

> chair and live on

> chronic pain medication? What a choice!!

> Indeed--Scoliosis does

> suck!!

>

> Carol V.

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Carol V.

Before I had the flatback diagnosis and thought most of what was

going on was in my hip my local orth prescribed vioxx and PT.

Alot of what the PT did was core strengthening stuff....but to be

honest, working with her coincided with the onset of the beginning

of the most severe symptoms and pain onset. In retrospect, I think

that it is possible that working on the swiss ball and a couple

other moves might have actually pushed ol' L-5 over the edge..but

that was just me. It did drive me to find and set up an appointment

with a qualified revision surgeon, pain is a great motivator.

At that point I was offered epidurals as interim care and long term

relief solution was surgery...which I had 7 weeks ago. The only

excercise recommended in the interim was swimming, which I did. I

definely felt that my swim program (actually I didn't do much

swimming...mostly working out in the deep end with an aqua-jogger)

did alot for establishing and maintaining abdominal, paraspinal and

quadricep strength (also cardio endurance)........good muscles to

have in shape pending the recovery phase of flatback revision

surgery.

When I spoke with my surgeon regarding when I could resume a water

workout during recovery he said that in the water was the only place

where the spine was supported on all axis.

Maybe your local ortho can at least guide you in selecting an

appropriate hydro-therapy program if you happen to be lucky enough

to have one. I wasn't so lucky, but I spoke with the intructor of an

Aqua Aerobics class about my situation and then took her class once

to see if it was right. I didn't care for the class, I had to modify

too much, so the instructor lent me the Aqua Jogger video and after

a study of that I figured out what was going to work for me, and it

seems to have worked for me.

As always, consult with your doctor and remember to listen to your

body! Good luck, Cam

[Guest guest]

-I´m also 6 months postop and was told not to do anything except

walk. What kind of stretching and core strengthening do you do and

for what part of the body?- And what does the PT do with you? Thanks.

- In , K Sutton

<suttoncgnj@y...> wrote:

> Hi Carol V. Physical therapy really did help me and it

> got me off pain medications. I highly recommend it.

> When my PT ended, I even joined the local gym and used

> the treadmill and recumbant (<sp?) bicycle - along

> with continuing to do the stretches and core

> strengthening exercises I was given. As for surgery, I

> choose to have it last year for various reasons. It

> was rough. But I am almost 6 months post-op and am

> thankful I did it. I am also going to physical therapy

> now and take no pain medications. I wish you good luck

> in your search for a doctor. Keep us posted on how you

> make out. Take care -Kathi in NJ

>

> --- Carol <dcvaughan@s...> wrote:

> >

> >

> > Thank you all for your responses to my posts last

> > week. I am trying

> > to get into a local Orthopedist, but someday I'm

> > sure will have to

> > see Dr. Hu or Dr. Berven at UCSF. However, one

> > question came into my

> > mind yesterday and I was wondering if any of you

> > " flatbackers " (like

> > me) have had their doctors recommened physical

> > therapy for their

> > pains. I have been referred twice (at two different

> > times several

> > years apart) for physical therapy, and it does seem

> > to help--for

> > awhile--and then the pain comes back. But perhaps

> > that's because I

> > don't follow through and continue the exercises

> > long-term. I just

> > wanted some responses from some others if physical

> > therapy had been

> > of any help to them--especially long term, or does

> > it do no good for

> > us " flatbackers " long term? Do we just all have to

> > face future

> > surgery, or are there other alternatives for the

> > pain?

> >

> > As a side thought I read someone's description of

> > surgery and how

> > she's in horrible pain now and some screws have come

> > loose and had to

> > be taken out--now I'm wondering whether I should

> > ever consider

> > surgery in the future or just plan to be in a wheel

> > chair and live on

> > chronic pain medication? What a choice!!

> > Indeed--Scoliosis does

> > suck!!

> >

> > Carol V.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

> __________________________________________________

>