Re: Re: I am new to this group and looking for answers....

[Guest guest]

Karolyn,

I want to keep this adult and I'm not going to attack your opinions, or you. You've been straight with me and I will be with you.

The alternative treatments may have a place but they are not a cure. No one here has said they've cleared HCV out of their system with any alternative method. Some have claimed, without any proof, that they have lowered viral load. That isn't eradicating the virus is it?

I didn't say anyone was stupid and don't believe you are. I am not here to cast insults at strangers. I am here because I care about our community, the HCV one, and came here to learn - share - support people with HCV.

I simply suggested that if there was this "cure" that medical science would have found it, studied it, etc. You can't be saying the NIH has no interest in curing HCV? That doctors want to sell us poison because they received some expensive chicken dinners? The American Society of Liver Disease isn't interested in curing HCV? Doctors are not?

As far as "who said interferon is a "cure" as you said in a previous post?" I can point to a great many people that have eradicated HCV, with sustained SVR, using peglyated interferon and ribavarin. They are undectable after years, fibrosis reversed -- recent studies point to interferon reversing cirrhosis. The studies are there to back that my claims at various websites. This is all public record information isn't it?

I believe the question comes down to whether or not you believe doctors are evil, that drug companies are Satanic etc. I can't convince anyone that Dr. So and So is a good person. I know the drug companies rob us blind with the cost of these drugs. That isn't my point at all ...

Anyway, enough of my discourse.

Thanks for commenting and I appreciate your thoughts.

[Guest guest]

It doesn't take much to throw a stone-- has an attitude, period. He is some kind of a redneck who's against anything that isn't put out by mainstream medicine or endorsed by the mainstream media. I'm sure he can't wait for the war either. A person like that is likely to agree with anything fed to him by the media, and go blindly into it, thereby conforming to authority. It's a pretty commom but dangerous attitude shared by many of the "sheep" of this world, blindly following the shepherd, along with the rest of the herd. It's too bad when some newbie is influenced by the likes of this creep, and goes running scared to his doc for some tx cocktail, rather than nourish his body with liver healing herbs and foods. Better to put a buck in the pharmer's pocket, believes. Better to let a doc with little knowledge of the consequences pump some poison into you. 's a rep for the pharm co's--otherwise why would he argue so vehemently against something that obvious works so well for so many people? Many in this group and others I belong to are testament to the good health we maintain on our alternative protocols. Are we all liars, meaning to dupe innocent and unsuspecting newbies and rob them of their chance at being "cured"?. Hardly. Yes, Karolyn, one should definitely get a second opinion when the 1st one is that one pump poison into one's body. Yes, I think I'd look rather hard (and did) for an alternative to that route........In health, Satya

[ ] Re: I am new to this group and looking for answers....

, You have made a good point about getting several opinions; however, in all seriousness, #1 how many of us can afford this? and #2 How many doctors know more than a thimbleful about alternative cures other than Milk Thistle? that's why it is up to us to do our OWN research, so we don't take things that are bad for the liver. I didn't just start taking supplements willy nilly without thought and research. I keep getting the feeling that you are classifying all of us who believe in alternative methods as Stupid, and I do resent that. I understand where you are coming from, and that is, dear , because I have an open mind; however, that is no reason to blast methods that people appear to be having success with. Here is an excerpt from an email from a friend suffering the aftereffects of interferon treatment, including heart problems:"I'm passing blood in my stool. I'm cramping and my legs and toes are stinging. When I rub them...they are extremely tender to the touch. This is crazy and it's not pleasant at all. I really do believe it's not just the heart alone, but because I was on treatment. I talk to others who say they didn't really experience anything as side effects until about 3 years afterward...some a little sooner and some up to 5 years after. Who knows for sure how each body reacts. I suppose in some the damage of the treatment is slower showing up and in others, much faster. I do know you can't shoot poison into the body for a period of time and not expect the damage to show up some time along the line. I really believe that Karolyn. Before treatment, things were a lot different. You couldn't slow me down...I wasn't sick...after treatment, everything changed in my life. So when I tell people to really consider it before they jump on the bandwagon, I and my family and friends can attest to that considerable thought should be given before going into it." And who said interferon is a "cure" as you said in a previous post?Love & Blessings to you. Karolyn> ,> > Go to several doctors, get several opinions -- see what they say about these "alternative" cures and use common sense.> > It is all summed up in one sentence: if they worked there would be NO more HCV on this planet. None.> > These herbs, nature's own poison, can do harm to your liver. Ask any doctor.> > Best,> >

[Guest guest]

Hi group, It's quite a stretch when someone infers that people who espouse the benefits of natural medicine atomatically believe that all doctors are "evil" and "Satanic". However, I believe it is a fact that if someone is in the BUSINESS of western medicine that they naturally promote the taking of pharmaceutical drugs, which is in their financial interest (and that of the pharm co's), and which has listed on the side of its packaging a myriad of devastating side effects, some life-threatening (and yet they promote this crap as medicine). This practice seems to naturally go against the oath they have taken "to harm none". Therefore the whole thing smacks of hypocricy, greed, and fraud. I guess THAT'S what it all comes down to........ hmmmmmmm.....I'm trying to picture my doc in a robe dancing around the sabbat circle fire, barking at the moon.....thanks for the laugh......in health, Satya

Re: [ ] Re: I am new to this group and looking for answers....

Karolyn,

I want to keep this adult and I'm not going to attack your opinions, or you. You've been straight with me and I will be with you.

The alternative treatments may have a place but they are not a cure. No one here has said they've cleared HCV out of their system with any alternative method. Some have claimed, without any proof, that they have lowered viral load. That isn't eradicating the virus is it?

I didn't say anyone was stupid and don't believe you are. I am not here to cast insults at strangers. I am here because I care about our community, the HCV one, and came here to learn - share - support people with HCV.

I simply suggested that if there was this "cure" that medical science would have found it, studied it, etc. You can't be saying the NIH has no interest in curing HCV? That doctors want to sell us poison because they received some expensive chicken dinners? The American Society of Liver Disease isn't interested in curing HCV? Doctors are not?

As far as "who said interferon is a "cure" as you said in a previous post?" I can point to a great many people that have eradicated HCV, with sustained SVR, using peglyated interferon and ribavarin. They are undectable after years, fibrosis reversed -- recent studies point to interferon reversing cirrhosis. The studies are there to back that my claims at various websites. This is all public record information isn't it?

I believe the question comes down to whether or not you believe doctors are evil, that drug companies are Satanic etc. I can't convince anyone that Dr. So and So is a good person. I know the drug companies rob us blind with the cost of these drugs. That isn't my point at all ...

Anyway, enough of my discourse.

Thanks for commenting and I appreciate your thoughts.

[Guest guest]

I take offense at being called a "newbie" as if I don't have a brain with the ability to make an informed decision. I think I will look elsewhere for support and answers to my questions since this seems to be the place to debate traditional vs. alternative treatments. What really turned me off from this group was the person who posted 's name, address and phone number. That was totally unnecessary. I wish you all the best of luck. Hopefully, because I inadvertently used my full name while setting up my email some weirdo doesn't come knocking at my door. I have enough to deal with.

[ ] Re: I am new to this group and looking for answers....

, You have made a good point about getting several opinions; however, in all seriousness, #1 how many of us can afford this? and #2 How many doctors know more than a thimbleful about alternative cures other than Milk Thistle? that's why it is up to us to do our OWN research, so we don't take things that are bad for the liver. I didn't just start taking supplements willy nilly without thought and research. I keep getting the feeling that you are classifying all of us who believe in alternative methods as Stupid, and I do resent that. I understand where you are coming from, and that is, dear , because I have an open mind; however, that is no reason to blast methods that people appear to be having success with. Here is an excerpt from an email from a friend suffering the aftereffects of interferon treatment, including heart problems:"I'm passing blood in my stool. I'm cramping and my legs and toes are stinging. When I rub them...they are extremely tender to the touch. This is crazy and it's not pleasant at all. I really do believe it's not just the heart alone, but because I was on treatment. I talk to others who say they didn't really experience anything as side effects until about 3 years afterward...some a little sooner and some up to 5 years after. Who knows for sure how each body reacts. I suppose in some the damage of the treatment is slower showing up and in others, much faster. I do know you can't shoot poison into the body for a period of time and not expect the damage to show up some time along the line. I really believe that Karolyn. Before treatment, things were a lot different. You couldn't slow me down...I wasn't sick...after treatment, everything changed in my life. So when I tell people to really consider it before they jump on the bandwagon, I and my family and friends can attest to that considerable thought should be given before going into it." And who said interferon is a "cure" as you said in a previous post?Love & Blessings to you. Karolyn> ,> > Go to several doctors, get several opinions -- see what they say about these "alternative" cures and use common sense.> > It is all summed up in one sentence: if they worked there would be NO more HCV on this planet. None.> > These herbs, nature's own poison, can do harm to your liver. Ask any doctor.> > Best,> >

[Guest guest]

s name address and phone has been posted before, when he infuriated another poster, he claimed not to care and so I merely demonstrated this point again to scott who was accusing me of hiding behind my initials.

-

[ ] Re: I am new to this group and looking for answers....

, You have made a good point about getting several opinions; however, in all seriousness, #1 how many of us can afford this? and #2 How many doctors know more than a thimbleful about alternative cures other than Milk Thistle? that's why it is up to us to do our OWN research, so we don't take things that are bad for the liver. I didn't just start taking supplements willy nilly without thought and research. I keep getting the feeling that you are classifying all of us who believe in alternative methods as Stupid, and I do resent that. I understand where you are coming from, and that is, dear , because I have an open mind; however, that is no reason to blast methods that people appear to be having success with. Here is an excerpt from an email from a friend suffering the aftereffects of interferon treatment, including heart problems:"I'm passing blood in my stool. I'm cramping and my legs and toes are stinging. When I rub them...they are extremely tender to the touch. This is crazy and it's not pleasant at all. I really do believe it's not just the heart alone, but because I was on treatment. I talk to others who say they didn't really experience anything as side effects until about 3 years afterward...some a little sooner and some up to 5 years after. Who knows for sure how each body reacts. I suppose in some the damage of the treatment is slower showing up and in others, much faster. I do know you can't shoot poison into the body for a period of time and not expect the damage to show up some time along the line. I really believe that Karolyn. Before treatment, things were a lot different. You couldn't slow me down...I wasn't sick...after treatment, everything changed in my life. So when I tell people to really consider it before they jump on the bandwagon, I and my family and friends can attest to that considerable thought should be given before going into it." And who said interferon is a "cure" as you said in a previous post?Love & Blessings to you. Karolyn> ,> > Go to several doctors, get several opinions -- see what they say about these "alternative" cures and use common sense.> > It is all summed up in one sentence: if they worked there would be NO more HCV on this planet. None.> > These herbs, nature's own poison, can do harm to your liver. Ask any doctor.> > Best,> >

[Guest guest]

, this reply was attached to the post I wrote--just wanted to let you know that newbies come thru here every day to ask questions--I definitely was not referring to you in particular when mentioning newbies. Also, "newbie" just means new at researching treatment for hep c, in my understanding--please, no insult intended. I'm always calling myself a newbie when it comes to using a computer... Hope you don't leave....In health, Satya ps. was being pretty abusive at the time someone posted his personal info. I believe it was done in a desperate attempt at getting him to back off.....I health, Satya

[ ] Re: I am new to this group and looking for answers....

, You have made a good point about getting several opinions; however, in all seriousness, #1 how many of us can afford this? and #2 How many doctors know more than a thimbleful about alternative cures other than Milk Thistle? that's why it is up to us to do our OWN research, so we don't take things that are bad for the liver. I didn't just start taking supplements willy nilly without thought and research. I keep getting the feeling that you are classifying all of us who believe in alternative methods as Stupid, and I do resent that. I understand where you are coming from, and that is, dear , because I have an open mind; however, that is no reason to blast methods that people appear to be having success with. Here is an excerpt from an email from a friend suffering the aftereffects of interferon treatment, including heart problems:"I'm passing blood in my stool. I'm cramping and my legs and toes are stinging. When I rub them...they are extremely tender to the touch. This is crazy and it's not pleasant at all. I really do believe it's not just the heart alone, but because I was on treatment. I talk to others who say they didn't really experience anything as side effects until about 3 years afterward...some a little sooner and some up to 5 years after. Who knows for sure how each body reacts. I suppose in some the damage of the treatment is slower showing up and in others, much faster. I do know you can't shoot poison into the body for a period of time and not expect the damage to show up some time along the line. I really believe that Karolyn. Before treatment, things were a lot different. You couldn't slow me down...I wasn't sick...after treatment, everything changed in my life. So when I tell people to really consider it before they jump on the bandwagon, I and my family and friends can attest to that considerable thought should be given before going into it." And who said interferon is a "cure" as you said in a previous post?Love & Blessings to you. Karolyn> ,> > Go to several doctors, get several opinions -- see what they say about these "alternative" cures and use common sense.> > It is all summed up in one sentence: if they worked there would be NO more HCV on this planet. None.> > These herbs, nature's own poison, can do harm to your liver. Ask any doctor.> > Best,> >

[Guest guest]

Satya,

Geez, I am in the phone book and my email address shows what ISP I use. Posting my address merely made me laugh and shake my head in disbelief. I could have made up a moniker and came in through 50 different methods if I wanted to: I work as a network anlayst (no jokes on the anal part of that word please) on huge nationwide WANs and telecommunications networks. I work on routers, switches, hubs, VPNs, firewalls, etc. I know how to find out where IP addresses originate. Do you know what a sniffer is? I don't mean a nose sniffer. Do you really believe I was trying to hide as scott_gaulke@...? I encourage anyone who feels like stopping over to see me or my family to do so ... honestly. We can debate the merits of medicine over a Ribavarin cocktail.

People took me as abusive because they were offended because they like getting high. I simply said smoking isn't good for any liver, that is could cause Hepatoma. Telling someone to smoke a little ganja is like telling them to play Russian Roulette. Liver cancer isn't a fun thing to get and once you get it all the marijuana on the planet isn't going to make you forget you have it.

I am a person with HCV, that wants to be cured and see all of you, ALL of you, also get cured. If getting cured involved baying at the moon, lathered in mud, dressed as a goat, with a pyramid over my head while praying to Gaia, I'd be right there with you. The trouble is that some of you are advocating 'medicines' for people without being doctors, based on anecdotes. You are advocating, and maybe selling, things that could harm them. If your cures worked we would all be cured. Period. People who suck new people into this scam should be prosecuted, by the law, for fraud. It is a criminal act to suggest taking this or that will cure them of HCV when it won't. People go to jail for it every single day. It is also a moral crime.

Some people come here thinking "gee, a support group" and walk into a nest of frauds selling false hopes to sick people.

Traditional medicine has cured many breast cancer patients, tens of thousands of them. The same with other cancer treatments. Prostate cancer in men is one of them: if caught early, by traditional medicine, cures it. My grandmother was cured of cancer by traditional medicine. My uncle had heart surgery by traditional medicine and is alive today beause of it. One of my best friends had breast cancer, now she is cured of it -- western traditional medicine cured her. Doctors who want to save lives cured her.

What a few of you folks do is blame the ENTIRE western medical community for not curing HCV because they received a couple of dinners from the people that produce Pegasys or whatever. That's a ridiculous idea. It is simply ludicrous and I am baffled that any adult would even suggest it. It is the wildest conspiracy theory I've heard and I've worked for Lyndon LaRouche for 21 years.

As far as me being with for war: no, I am passionately against the war and act on it. Take a stroll over to this website http://www.larouchepub.com/ and see how I work to stop Bush from launching genocide on the Iraqi people. I work with Ramsey (http://www.iacenter.org/rcun.htm or http://www.votetoimpeach.org/), LBJ's Attorney General. I know the man personally. He's LaRouche's attorney and I have a very good one too. :-) I've run for US Congress and State Assembly. I am a FDR Democrat. I am not a conservative (those labels are meaningless anyway). I'd work with anyone to stop the US from attacking Iraq. I believe Bush is a lunatic advised by criminals. That anti-war enough for you?

You've misjudged me and that's okay. I am not angry with you but I am distured and angered that you're advocating false hopes, and maybe some of you selling false 'cures' to people that are very sick. That needs to stop.

I am alive, and as long as I remain alive I am going to help people as much as I can. Helping them involves pointing out that these fraudulent cures you try to swindle them into, without you having any medical expertise or training, will harm them.

Gaulke

2615 N. 63rd St.

Wauwatosa, WI 53213

414-873-6206 (no calls after 11 PM please)

Re: [ ] Re: I am new to this group and looking for answers....

, this reply was attached to the post I wrote--just wanted to let you know that newbies come thru here every day to ask questions--I definitely was not referring to you in particular when mentioning newbies. Also, "newbie" just means new at researching treatment for hep c, in my understanding--please, no insult intended. I'm always calling myself a newbie when it comes to using a computer... Hope you don't leave....In health, Satya ps. was being pretty abusive at the time someone posted his personal info. I believe it was done in a desperate attempt at getting him to back off.....I health, Satya

[Guest guest]

I did say smoking would harm your liver. That is constructive.

I also asked for solid proof of your "cure" for HCV so I can be cured too.

I believe you love reading my email or you'd just delete them.

Re: [ ] Re: I am new to this group and looking for answers....

I haven't heard one, NOT ONE constructive piece of advise out of you yet. Because you have no knowledge, nothing to offer but BS. You never even ASK any questions.