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And the Republicans have contributed to the general welfare? How, by giving tax

cuts to the wealthy that don't need them?

Roni

<>Just because something

isn't seen doesn't mean it's

not there<>

From: <res075oh@...>

Subject: Re: Cows, Geopolitics, and Big Business Re: Re: Thy

hypothyroidism

Date: Tuesday, April 7, 2009, 2:05 PM

You're living in a fantasy land, .  The proposed energy [carbon] tax

alone will be an additional tax of hundreds of billions of dollars on

_everybody_.  Everything you consume uses energy if you don't grow

it/produce it yourself [and then it still uses some].  This tax will

disproportionally effect those at the bottom, because they must spend a

higher percentage of their incomes on necessities.

I don't know Steve's net worth, but I'll bet it's a heck of a lot more

than mine.  Or probably yours.

Sometime just for fun look at the proportion of US income taxes paid by

the top 5%.  And the bottom 50%.

It's not capitalists and free market people who " look down " on the lower

income segments.  Rather they are the ones who want those people to have

the opportunity to better their situation.  Liberals/Democrats depend

upon the lower class remaining destitute and dependent upon the

unfulfillable promises they make in order to get the votes to promote

their lifestyle of the powerful and rich without actually contributing

anything to the general welfare.

..

..

>

>       Posted by: " " kennio@...

>   

   <mailto:kennio@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20Cows%2C%20Geopolitics%2C%20and%20\

Big%20Business%20Re%3A%20%5Bhypothyroidism%5D%20Re%3A%20Thy>

>         Kennio <Kennio>

>

>

>         Tue Apr 7, 2009 1:57 am (PDT)

>

> " Socialism makes the entire problem larger and more intractable while the

> government rapes those who are on their way to achieving the American

> dream of financial independence.

> "

> American dream... American fantasy. Thats the problem with people like

> you have this fantasy that one day YOU will be rich, so preserving the

> privileges of the rich are important to you even if it is working

> against your own self interests. Its mind boggling.

> You actually admire those at the TOP milking the system... and even

> when they flaunt it; the loopholes and the corporate welfare, the

> hundreds of millions in salary.

> Its a fantasy you really need to get over. The rich flourished under

> the current system and I'm sure they will survive the proposed 3% tax

> increase. I guess we'll just have to put up with the huge drop in

> philanthropy. You paint them as incredibly generous when their taxes

> are lower...(more of your " rich man " fantasy). I think the last 8

> years shows that they get incredibly GREEDY when things are going

> their way.

> You focus at the people at the bottom who you think of as dirt and

> seeth at how they are milking the system by getting a single digit

> slice of the pie. All the while the top 5 percent just raped us in the

> ass for generational wealth... they robbed your children and your

> grandchildren and STILL managed to keep you focused on those you see

> as beneath you who rob you of crumbs comparatively.

> I guess some people need that... people beneath them and a fantasy

> world to aspire to.

------------------------------------

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wrote:

> Your argument supports that we in the upper income tax brackets

> have to shoulder the burden a while... the little guy dies if we

> don't.

I don't think so. The people who should have lost money are the

investors in the credit default swaps. They were wealthy, have an

obligation to understand their investments, and were in a position to

take risks. Stock holders and bond holders in banks also have an

obligation to understand their risks. Then the banks started to have

problems, the losers should have been the wealthy investors, not the tax

payers. No taxes should ever be foisted on anyone to pay for the

failures of the rich to manage their own investment risks. There should

have been no government bailouts and bankruptcy should have been par for

the course. The ideal that the people should pay for the incompetent of

the largest institutions is a fallacy. The bankruptcy of Lehman

Brothers is going smoothly with assets being sold off in a timely and

not a rushed fashion. The banks that were wise managers were forced

into taking government freebies since there competitive position would

be compromised by poorly managed banks being allowed to continue to

operate and compete with them. What should have happened is that poorly

managed banks should have failed and their assets sold off to the wise

managed banks.

> We are on shaky ground right now and a 3% tax increase is the

> least I can do. It IS a matter of patriotism.

We are not on shaky ground. If taxes were to be cut, government

revenues would go up. If a point of sales tax were to be created and

all other taxes eliminated, many companies would quickly relocated back

to the USA, 10s of millions of jobs would be created and market forces

would drive wages dramatically higher.

--

Steve - dudescholar4@...

Take World's Smallest Political Quiz at

http://www.theadvocates.org/quiz.html

" If a thousand old beliefs were ruined on our march

to truth we must still march on. " --Stopford

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You and Steve are speaking from a conservative out of touch mentality

compared to the parents and single parents out there that are struggling to

survive in a economy that has not provided a living wage in decades that can

not keep up with the rates of inflation. Our economy has been a 2 person

wage earners for a long time. The majority of Americans and defiantly the

lower income brackets of this society can not make it on a single salary.

The cost of living is killing families in this country and if wasn't for

welfare, WIC, and other social service programs they would be dead. They

are not milking the system. They rely on the system now more than ever.

Charities can not keep up with the demand, because people with money are not

contributing their fair share to society and the number of poor people are

rising due to the last 8 years of felony behavior on the part of greedy

wall street felons. Food banks literally don't have enough food to go

around and many of the smaller regional charities are going broke trying to

keep up with the demand.

If we did not have the government social services , poor people would be

more screwed than they are. Not everyone can afford to get an education and

not everyone has the means to get to a job that maybe 50 miles away from

their home, because our public transportation system is broke. What about

the desperately poor areas of this country , the inner cities slums, they

are born into poverty and they will most likely die in poverty because there

is not enough money out there to bring them out of poverty.

You are going to tell them they can't or shouldn't accept governmental aid

so they can feed their families?

It is criminal that in a country as wealthy as ours, that we still have

desperate poverty and homelessness.

-- Re: Cows, Geopolitics, and Big Business Re: Re:

> Thyroid Doctor in the Los Angeles / Orange County area

>

>

> Nancie Barnett wrote:

> > Tell that to the poor women who because we have no socialized child care

> in

> > this country, can't afford to find work and care for their kids at the

> same

> > time. It is a catch 22 situation for them.

>

> Aside for women who have been raped, random sex and failure to plan

> should be something other people should pay for and or have any

> responsibility for.

>

> > Yes, there are some who milk the system but there are infinitely

> more who

> > desperately need welfare, wic and food stamps and without them would

> starve

> > along with their kids.

>

> When charities were funded by individuals, people tended to get back on

> their feet since they knew the help was not for a lifetime.

>

> > Additionally, welfare has changed and now they can not stay on the

> program

> > indefinitely. There is a limit to the time you can be on welfare. Most

> > states limit it to 5 years.

>

> IN 5 years one could get a Master's degree but people milk the system to

> the end and then wonder what they are going to do.

>

> > The AFDC program underwent a significant change under

> Republican-sponsored

> > legislation in 1996 which was signed by President Clinton. States were

> given

> > far greater latitude in designing their family welfare programs.

>

> And this kind of thing should ONLY be a state program designed or not

> according to the electorate of each state. The FED was never granted

> those rights.

>

> > As the new

> > name implies, TANF can no longer be a lifelong program. All states are

> > required to limit benefits after the expiration of a specified

> period of

> > time.

>

> Here we have the FEDs telling the states how to run the states business.

> Naughty.

>

> >

> > Under most state plans, all benefits will be terminated after five

> > years. Each program requires virtually all adult participants to

> > participate in work programs. If not working within two years,

> recipients

> > must perform community service as a condition of receiving benefits.

> >

> > http://www.newsbatch.com/welfare.htm

> <http://www.newsbatch.com/welfare.htm>

> >

> > Communism is the bad end of socialism. As my professor at UCSB said,

> it is

> > socialism gone bad.

>

> I am indifferent to your claims about your professor. He is irrelevant.

>

>

>

> --

>

> Steve - dudescholar4@... <mailto:dudescholar4%40basicmail.net>

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Where does the constitution state that citizens MUST contribute their

life blood for the ephemeral " general welfare " ? No one should have to

pay more for government goods and services than another. If I drive a

car on the public roads so many miles a year, I produce only so much

wear and tear on the roads regardless of my income. The police work no

harder for me, most likely less hard, the courts cost no more to manage

my business, probably less, etc. Police by the way not protect homes

since those homes sill get robed. Owners have to provide locks and

security themselves to protect their homes and contents.

Steve

Roni Molin wrote:

> And the Republicans have contributed to the general welfare? How, by giving

tax cuts to the wealthy that don't need them?

>

>

> Roni

> <>Just because something

> isn't seen doesn't mean it's

> not there<>

>

>

>

>

> From: <res075oh@...>

> Subject: Re: Cows, Geopolitics, and Big Business Re: Re: Thy

> hypothyroidism

> Date: Tuesday, April 7, 2009, 2:05 PM

>

>

> You're living in a fantasy land, . The proposed energy [carbon] tax

> alone will be an additional tax of hundreds of billions of dollars on

> _everybody_. Everything you consume uses energy if you don't grow

> it/produce it yourself [and then it still uses some]. This tax will

> disproportionally effect those at the bottom, because they must spend a

> higher percentage of their incomes on necessities.

>

> I don't know Steve's net worth, but I'll bet it's a heck of a lot more

> than mine. Or probably yours.

>

> Sometime just for fun look at the proportion of US income taxes paid by

> the top 5%. And the bottom 50%.

>

> It's not capitalists and free market people who " look down " on the lower

> income segments. Rather they are the ones who want those people to have

> the opportunity to better their situation. Liberals/Democrats depend

> upon the lower class remaining destitute and dependent upon the

> unfulfillable promises they make in order to get the votes to promote

> their lifestyle of the powerful and rich without actually contributing

> anything to the general welfare.

>

>

> .

> .

>

>> Posted by: " " kennio@...

>>

<mailto:kennio@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20Cows%2C%20Geopolitics%2C%20and%20Big\

%20Business%20Re%3A%20%5Bhypothyroidism%5D%20Re%3A%20Thy>

>> Kennio <Kennio>

>>

>>

>> Tue Apr 7, 2009 1:57 am (PDT)

>>

>> " Socialism makes the entire problem larger and more intractable while the

>> government rapes those who are on their way to achieving the American

>> dream of financial independence.

>> "

>> American dream... American fantasy. Thats the problem with people like

>> you have this fantasy that one day YOU will be rich, so preserving the

>> privileges of the rich are important to you even if it is working

>> against your own self interests. Its mind boggling.

>> You actually admire those at the TOP milking the system... and even

>> when they flaunt it; the loopholes and the corporate welfare, the

>> hundreds of millions in salary.

>> Its a fantasy you really need to get over. The rich flourished under

>> the current system and I'm sure they will survive the proposed 3% tax

>> increase. I guess we'll just have to put up with the huge drop in

>> philanthropy. You paint them as incredibly generous when their taxes

>> are lower...(more of your " rich man " fantasy). I think the last 8

>> years shows that they get incredibly GREEDY when things are going

>> their way.

>> You focus at the people at the bottom who you think of as dirt and

>> seeth at how they are milking the system by getting a single digit

>> slice of the pie. All the while the top 5 percent just raped us in the

>> ass for generational wealth... they robbed your children and your

>> grandchildren and STILL managed to keep you focused on those you see

>> as beneath you who rob you of crumbs comparatively.

>> I guess some people need that... people beneath them and a fantasy

>> world to aspire to.

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

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Again, I think charity should be up to non-profit. The government system

is broken, I know first hand. Blaming anyone but greedy CEO's and those in

congress who blocked regulating Freddie and Fanny is ridiculous. We are

basically rewarding those people with money for their irresponsible actions.

How about we give every person who file bankruptcy a hundrend grand and say

here this will help you get back on your feet?

CW

Traveling? Know someone who is? Use my travelocity site www.travelfhtm

com/crystalwright

-- Re: Cows, Geopolitics, and Big Business Re: Re:

> Thyroid Doctor in the Los Angeles / Orange County area

>

>

> Nancie Barnett wrote:

> > Tell that to the poor women who because we have no socialized child care

> in

> > this country, can't afford to find work and care for their kids at the

> same

> > time. It is a catch 22 situation for them.

>

> Aside for women who have been raped, random sex and failure to plan

> should be something other people should pay for and or have any

> responsibility for.

>

> > Yes, there are some who milk the system but there are infinitely

> more who

> > desperately need welfare, wic and food stamps and without them would

> starve

> > along with their kids.

>

> When charities were funded by individuals, people tended to get back on

> their feet since they knew the help was not for a lifetime.

>

> > Additionally, welfare has changed and now they can not stay on the

> program

> > indefinitely. There is a limit to the time you can be on welfare. Most

> > states limit it to 5 years.

>

> IN 5 years one could get a Master's degree but people milk the system to

> the end and then wonder what they are going to do.

>

> > The AFDC program underwent a significant change under

> Republican-sponsored

> > legislation in 1996 which was signed by President Clinton. States were

> given

> > far greater latitude in designing their family welfare programs.

>

> And this kind of thing should ONLY be a state program designed or not

> according to the electorate of each state. The FED was never granted

> those rights.

>

> > As the new

> > name implies, TANF can no longer be a lifelong program. All states are

> > required to limit benefits after the expiration of a specified

> period of

> > time.

>

> Here we have the FEDs telling the states how to run the states business.

> Naughty.

>

> >

> > Under most state plans, all benefits will be terminated after five

> > years. Each program requires virtually all adult participants to

> > participate in work programs. If not working within two years,

> recipients

> > must perform community service as a condition of receiving benefits.

> >

> > http://www.newsbatch.com/welfare.htm

> <http://www.newsbatch.com/welfare.htm>

> >

> > Communism is the bad end of socialism. As my professor at UCSB said,

> it is

> > socialism gone bad.

>

> I am indifferent to your claims about your professor. He is irrelevant.

>

>

>

> --

>

> Steve - dudescholar4@... <mailto:dudescholar4%40basicmail.net>

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Some see racism in the views of those with whom they disagree; others

see Nazism or other pejoratives. Whatever, it's in the mind of the

beholder rather than in the mind of the beheld.

Those who are REALLY raping this country are the politicians who are

dumping hundreds of billions to trillions of dollars into their favorite

pork barrel projects under the guise of " rescuing the country " . If you

think they and their crooked cronies will not benefit to the tune of

untold billions you are dreaming. I'd much rather see an entrepreneur

such as Steve making something out of this mess that benefits a lot of

people than see the former group benefit to the extent that they will.

Perhaps your story is true; I don't know. But there is a lot of

dissonance in it. Your tone comes across much more of whining than does

Steve's and your charges of greediness and contempt for the less

fortunate are not supported by anything I've read.

..

..

>

> Posted by: " " kennio@...

>

<mailto:kennio@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20Cows%2C%20Geopolitics%2C%20and%20Big\

%20Business%20Re%3A%20%5Bhypothyroidism%5D%20Re%3A%20Thy>

> Kennio <Kennio>

>

>

> Tue Apr 7, 2009 11:34 am (PDT)

>

> Oh, my god. You're the landlord from hell. A king with contempt for

> his subjects.

>

> I grew up with nothing and dreaming of having everything. I taught

> myself computers in the early 80's and then taught word processing at

> business colleges for a while. I became a consultant and eventually

> designed and installed computer departments for Nickelodeon Animation

> in Los Angeles and New York city. I ended up staying there for a

> number of years in a management position. See my name on all the

> Sponge Bob cartoons.

>

> I was involved in southern California real estate in the late 80's and

> didn't make out too well by the time the market collapsed. Around 1995

> I got back into it on the side. For 12 years I bought and sold houses

> here in the Hollywood Hills. I quit Nickelodeon in '05 and made

> millions flipping homes. I saw all the signs of impending collapse and

> liquidated in 2007. I warned anyone that would listen (very few wanted

> to hear it) that it was time to cash out and wait. I made it out

> unscathed and retired at 45 and have just traveled the world the last

> couple years.

>

> I do not feel I need a tax break. Sure its hard writing a check for

> several hundred thousand to the IRS... I feel your pain. But really,

> how much more money to you need? You want the obscene wealth of a

> fortune 500 CEO? That was attained by pillaging your children's future

> as you sat admirably by and watched. That kind of greed will get paid

> for in another life... both figuratively and literally.

>

> Brains are obviously hard wired differently. YOU get money and get

> greedy and contemptuous of the unwashed public. I get money and I

> don't see a problem raising my taxes 3% to make my contribution to

> help fix the mess we are in. Anything else would be unpatriotic. I had

> the opportunity. I deserve to pay more... the system worked for me

> just like it should. I am grateful and to not be grateful is shameless.

>

> I always find thinly veiled racism at the core of all of these types

> of arguments especially when the white collar criminal milking the

> system from the top doesn't raise a blip on the whiners radar.

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No; we are supposed to be a nation with " freedom of religion " . Which

incidentally also implies freedom FROM any religion we do not choose to

follow. Here we can choose whatever creation myth that appeals to us

and it is none of the government's business. It's rather strange that

you wish to apply the writing of some ancient book in which you do not

even believe. But you might note that supposedly Jesus said " The poor

you have...always " or similar. IOW you CAN'T fix that situation.

The fact is that the wealthy _already_ pay a highly disproportionate

percentage of taxes, so _any_ increase is reprehensible. I happen to

think that YOU could better invest whatever portion of your wealth to

the benefit of the less fortunate than could the government. Well run

charities may provide up to 90% or more of dollars given to benefit

clients, while the government and other assorted chiselers may provide

less than 10%. Give whatever you want, it's YOUR money. If you think

the government is the most efficient, honest and effective tool to

redistribute your wealth then have at it. They will accept donations.

..

..

>

> Posted by: " " kennio@...

>

<mailto:kennio@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20Cows%2C%20Geopolitics%2C%20and%20Big\

%20Business%20Re%3A%20%5Bhypothyroidism%5D%20Re%3A%20Thy>

> Kennio <Kennio>

>

>

> Tue Apr 7, 2009 12:37 pm (PDT)

>

> I thought we were a Christian country?? Well read your bible and see

> what Jesus says about YOUR money and the poor. You're supposed to be

> giving it all away. I'm not religious in the least, btw... just

> baffled how middle Americans (republicans) and others (Joe the

> plumber) are easily riled up about those making over $250K being taxed

> more and about ME getting taxed more when it doesn't affect them. I

> can afford it... don't worry about me... really.

>

> A 3% tax increase to the wealthy is stealing to you? REALLY? Strange.

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No; it's neither the fault of the poor nor the rich. Although those who

caused the problem are typically rich compared to me and the average

citizen. It's the fault of the US Congress and laws passed back as far

as 1977 that began to change the criteria of obtaining a mortgage from

being the ability to pay it back to something more politically correct.

Following hundreds of millions of dollars of lawsuits against lenders

who attempted to use the old, obsolete criteria of loan repayment

ability instead of skin color or some other politically correct crap it

gradually came to be that ability to repay was almost totally tossed

out. Not just for some favored minority, but for everybody. My wife

and I were approved almost instantly for an UNDOCUMENTED loan of over

$400,000 and we ARE NOT wealthy [we backed away from the deal for other

reasons].

A lot of what you say about the present situation is IMHO correct. I

just disagree with you on how/why we got here, and the best way to get

out. Taxing the " rich " is typically as productive as was the infamous

tax on the wealthy who could afford multi-million dollar yachts of

several years back. I hope you know what a fiasco that was.

You're probably right about taxes increasing. But another possibility

is massive inflation, to the extent that it will probably literally

impoverish millions of retirees. Lots of pensions have no increase

built in at all, you know. Even worse would be tax increases PLUS

massive inflation. I don't see how we can possibly avoid the massive

inflation, given the trillions of dollars the government is throwing at

our present problem. Most of which produces little if any increase in

consumer goods and services. Economics 101 says that a massive influx

of dollars chasing the same goods and services equates to massive inflation.

I think you're wrong about the timing of the real estate recovery, and

the signs I see suggest that now is a very good time to buy. You can

presently buy MANY houses for less than the appraised value of the lot.

I'm in central Florida, one of the places very hard hit and I know that

numbers of local sales have turned around already.

..

..

>

> Posted by: " " kennio@...

>

<mailto:kennio@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20Cows%2C%20Geopolitics%2C%20and%20Big\

%20Business%20Re%3A%20%5Bhypothyroidism%5D%20Re%3A%20Thy>

> Kennio <Kennio>

>

>

> Tue Apr 7, 2009 1:22 pm (PDT)

>

> No one is talking about charity or the poor really. We are screwed

> right now. We are just about owned by China and are printing money as

> if it is really an option. The country is on the ropes. Taxes must

> increase... those of us that make more and benefitted the most... owe

> more. It's simple and I am resigned to it. YOU are getting confused,

> the POOR people who take advantage are not the cause the current near

> collapse of the U.S. it is the fault of the RICH. The greedy, greedy

> rich.

>

> BTW, you do not buy a home while prices are continuing to fall. The

> new government programs that are offering artificially low interests

> rates are just more of the same of what started this whole bubble.

> Continuing low interest will guarantee market stagnation in the long

> run. They're just propping up still high property prices. Now, only

> time will level out values. As cycles go it will be at least 7 to 10

> years before we see substantial property value increases.

>

> I'll start looking to jump back in for a personal residence in the

> next 18 months hopefully... I waited out the collapse in an apartment.

> I watch real estate markets in Europe and Asia and they are about a

> year behind us in the collapse.

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Keep proving my point. Republicans without money (bizarre mindset) often

support the greedy rich guy because they fantisize about being one themselves.

Support tax breaks for the wealthy because they in their minds they just might

be able to benefit one day... Joe the plumber is the perfect example of that

phenomenon. One would think IQ plays a part here.

The dissonance you feel is that someone with money has a heart and isnt' all

about hoarding it. I have plenty of money. I make my money off interest on my

savings now and even though that has been cut in half lately I live just fine.

I'm not going to sit here and pretend that I bust my ass for my money... I DID

but now I don't. I don't work at all for my money anymore.

I DO know where all the money was just sucked out of this country and it went UP

not DOWN. If you are foolish enough to reject a tax break and worry that the

rich won't like you for having them shoulder the responsibility for a while then

that is your prerogative. You need to see reality... greed is not good.

I see it as we are just recovering from a near 8 year coup of the US by

extremists. Rampant cronyism and the nations high honors given for blind

support of the bush agenda... every level of government being stacked with

inexperienced appointees who pledged alligence to bush...not the country. We

came awfully close to what it was to live in Nazi Germany. There needs to be

abuse of power and war crime trials held in this country over what happened

here.

When it is all over we are left a broken looted nation with no one held

accountable. Just old SS soldiers wandering around (like you) secretly raging

about what might have been... not knowing who to be mad at. You have what is

called the Stockholm syndrome most likely.

" Stockholm syndrome is a psychological response sometimes seen in abducted

hostages, in which the hostage shows signs of loyalty to the hostage-taker,

regardless of the danger or risk in which they have been placed. "

Snap out of it.

________________________________

From: <res075oh@...>

hypothyroidism

Sent: Wednesday, April 8, 2009 11:19:14 AM

Subject: Re: Cows, Geopolitics, and Big Business Re: Re: Thy

Some see racism in the views of those with whom they disagree; others

see Nazism or other pejoratives. Whatever, it's in the mind of the

beholder rather than in the mind of the beheld.

Those who are REALLY raping this country are the politicians who are

dumping hundreds of billions to trillions of dollars into their favorite

pork barrel projects under the guise of " rescuing the country " . If you

think they and their crooked cronies will not benefit to the tune of

untold billions you are dreaming. I'd much rather see an entrepreneur

such as Steve making something out of this mess that benefits a lot of

people than see the former group benefit to the extent that they will.

Perhaps your story is true; I don't know. But there is a lot of

dissonance in it. Your tone comes across much more of whining than does

Steve's and your charges of greediness and contempt for the less

fortunate are not supported by anything I've read.

..

..

>

> Posted by: " " kennio (DOT) com

> <mailto:kennio (DOT) com?Subject=%20Re% 3A%20Cows% 2C%20Geopolitics

%2C%20and% 20Big%20Business %20Re%3A% 20%5Bhypothyroid ism%5D%20Re% 3A%20Thy>

> Kennio <http://profiles. / Kennio>

>

>

> Tue Apr 7, 2009 11:34 am (PDT)

>

> Oh, my god. You're the landlord from hell. A king with contempt for

> his subjects.

>

> I grew up with nothing and dreaming of having everything. I taught

> myself computers in the early 80's and then taught word processing at

> business colleges for a while. I became a consultant and eventually

> designed and installed computer departments for Nickelodeon Animation

> in Los Angeles and New York city. I ended up staying there for a

> number of years in a management position. See my name on all the

> Sponge Bob cartoons.

>

> I was involved in southern California real estate in the late 80's and

> didn't make out too well by the time the market collapsed. Around 1995

> I got back into it on the side. For 12 years I bought and sold houses

> here in the Hollywood Hills. I quit Nickelodeon in '05 and made

> millions flipping homes. I saw all the signs of impending collapse and

> liquidated in 2007. I warned anyone that would listen (very few wanted

> to hear it) that it was time to cash out and wait. I made it out

> unscathed and retired at 45 and have just traveled the world the last

> couple years.

>

> I do not feel I need a tax break. Sure its hard writing a check for

> several hundred thousand to the IRS... I feel your pain. But really,

> how much more money to you need? You want the obscene wealth of a

> fortune 500 CEO? That was attained by pillaging your children's future

> as you sat admirably by and watched. That kind of greed will get paid

> for in another life... both figuratively and literally.

>

> Brains are obviously hard wired differently. YOU get money and get

> greedy and contemptuous of the unwashed public. I get money and I

> don't see a problem raising my taxes 3% to make my contribution to

> help fix the mess we are in. Anything else would be unpatriotic. I had

> the opportunity. I deserve to pay more... the system worked for me

> just like it should. I am grateful and to not be grateful is shameless.

>

> I always find thinly veiled racism at the core of all of these types

> of arguments especially when the white collar criminal milking the

> system from the top doesn't raise a blip on the whiners radar.

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I think the 2nd and 3rd are really in a weak position. Let them know

that unless they settle for 10 cents on the dollar, you are going to

walk away from the short sale (and plan to do exactly that), the bank is

going to foreclose, and they will get Nada. You're offering them 10%

which is 10% more than they will get if the 1st forecloses.

Steve

wrote:

> In the Tampa vicinity housing sales have turned around but prices are

> still very low. Repo's and short sales are available for less than 50%

> of recent sales; often less than the appraised value of the lot alone.

> AFAIK there's not much available in good financing though. We've been

> trying to close on a short sale now for under 100k that sold for 200k a

> couple of years ago; and in an upscale neighborhood where the typical

> sales presently are still 50% higher than that. But there are a couple

> of 2nd/3rd mortgages that are complicating things so my wife is ready to

> invite the bank to take a flying leap.

>

> It would not be to flip, though. It would be a rental for a time and

> then a winter Florida home for us. Our present home is much too large

> for us, and she wants one in Ohio for the summer [her relatives live there].

>

>

> .

> .

>

>> Posted by: " " kennio@...

>>

<mailto:kennio@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20Cows%2C%20Geopolitics%2C%20and%20Big\

%20Business%20Re%3A%20%5Bhypothyroidism%5D%20Re%3A%20Thy>

>> Kennio <Kennio>

>>

>>

>> Tue Apr 7, 2009 5:51 pm (PDT)

>>

>> NOW is not a good time to flip houses unless you are very experienced

>> and/or doing a lot of them at once. I am not flipping house now I

>> don't need the stress for such a small profit margin. Home prices here

>> in Los Angeles dropped 2.5% a month for the last 12 months and we're

>> still heading down. Pity the poor bastard that get suckered into any

>> of these low interest rates and buys now.

--

Steve - dudescholar4@...

Take World's Smallest Political Quiz at

http://www.theadvocates.org/quiz.html

" If a thousand old beliefs were ruined on our march

to truth we must still march on. " --Stopford

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Not necessarily true... There are wealthy companies that are doing business

on the USA soil and still are not paying their fair share in taxes. That

attitude is pandering to the kidnappers. The USA has been taken hostage with

that attitude and the end result is these mega rich corporations are not

paying their fair share in taxes.

-- Re: Cows, Geopolitics, and Big Business Re: Re:

Thy

Once again: It's not a matter of need. It is a matter of owning what

you earn, whether it's a lot or not.

..

..

> Posted by: " Roni Molin " matchermaam@...

> <mailto:matchermaam@

com?Subject=%20Re%3A%20Cows%2C%20Geopolitics%2C%20and%20Big%20Business%20Re%3

%20%5Bhypothyroidism%5D%20Re%3A%20Thy>

> matchermaam <matchermaam>

>

>

> Tue Apr 7, 2009 5:06 pm (PDT)

>

> And the Republicans have contributed to the general welfare? How, by

> giving tax cuts to the wealthy that don't need them?

>

> Roni

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" Toxic assets " actually refer to the securities or bonds [or whatever]

created that are backed by the mortgages. These securities were

marketed as being extremely safe, with a very low default rate of a tiny

percentage at most. When the default rate went to several percent that

changed the whole picture of the value of these assets. Now with a loss

ratio of several times the expected rate the securities could not find

buyers at any price; despite the fact that [at least early on] more than

90% of the mortgages were current.

Banks must by law have a certain level of assets compared to

liabilities. Assets that cannot be sold at any price are essentially

worthless, even in the present case where 80 to 90% of the underlying

mortgages are good investments. So the value of the assets of the banks

fell below the requirements of the law, and they were/are in deep trouble.

..

..

>

> Posted by: " Nancie Barnett " deifspirit@...

>

<mailto:deifspirit@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20Cows%2C%20Geopolitics%2C%20and%20B\

ig%20Business%20Re%3A%20%5Bhypothyroidism%5D%20Re%3A%20Thy>

> aspenfairy1 <aspenfairy1>

>

>

> Tue Apr 7, 2009 9:25 pm (PDT)

>

> No, but I heard about it on NPR on my ipod. I also learned all about how

> some investors are buying up some of the toxic assets [ foreclosure homes]

> and either selling them back to the homeowners at a different mortgage

> rate

> or renting it to them so at least they can stay in their homes.

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AMEN!!! Steve for president!

..

..

>

> Posted by: " Steve " dudescholar4@...

>

<mailto:dudescholar4@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20Cows%2C%20Geopolitics%2C%2\

0and%20Big%20Business%20Re%3A%20%5Bhypothyroidism%5D%20Re%3A%20Thy>

> dudescholar <dudescholar>

>

>

> Tue Apr 7, 2009 7:16 pm (PDT)

>

>

>

> wrote:

>

> > Your argument supports that we in the upper income tax brackets

> > have to shoulder the burden a while... the little guy dies if we

> > don't.

>

> I don't think so. The people who should have lost money are the

> investors in the credit default swaps. They were wealthy, have an

> obligation to understand their investments, and were in a position to

> take risks. Stock holders and bond holders in banks also have an

> obligation to understand their risks. Then the banks started to have

> problems, the losers should have been the wealthy investors, not the tax

> payers. No taxes should ever be foisted on anyone to pay for the

> failures of the rich to manage their own investment risks. There should

> have been no government bailouts and bankruptcy should have been par for

> the course. The ideal that the people should pay for the incompetent of

> the largest institutions is a fallacy. The bankruptcy of Lehman

> Brothers is going smoothly with assets being sold off in a timely and

> not a rushed fashion. The banks that were wise managers were forced

> into taking government freebies since there competitive position would

> be compromised by poorly managed banks being allowed to continue to

> operate and compete with them. What should have happened is that poorly

> managed banks should have failed and their assets sold off to the wise

> managed banks.

>

> > We are on shaky ground right now and a 3% tax increase is the

> > least I can do. It IS a matter of patriotism.

>

> We are not on shaky ground. If taxes were to be cut, government

> revenues would go up. If a point of sales tax were to be created and

> all other taxes eliminated, many companies would quickly relocated back

> to the USA, 10s of millions of jobs would be created and market forces

> would drive wages dramatically higher.

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Your argument reminds me of the liberal screams that millions of

children would die in the streets if Clinton signed into law the bills

limiting welfare. It didn't happen, so SOMEBODY was out of touch.

People can and will take care of themselves once the idea that someone

else should take care of them so they don't have to hold a job or get an

education is removed. If you doubt that's true do a bit of research and

tell me what happens to the totally destitute and broke Asian immigrants

who come to this country. Or just read Sowell's book RACE AND

CULTURE. It will be a real eye opener for any true liberal. WARNING!

It's not politically correct worth a $#!t; but the facts are compelling.

It is actually welfare and the belief in an entitlement to the fruits of

someone else's labor that is killing so many people and condemning

countless others to a life unfit for a human being. We would actually

have FEWER deaths if we eliminated ALL welfare and let those die who

could not provide for themselves; however, that IS NOT a solution I

would support. I believe we have a moral duty to take care of those who

cannot take care of themselves; but even then I believe private

charities can do a much better job of it than the government. Private

local charities tend to kick your @$$ out if you're a worthless druggie

or such who prefers to not work.

..

..

>

> Posted by: " Nancie Barnett " deifspirit@...

>

<mailto:deifspirit@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20Cows%2C%20Geopolitics%2C%20and%20B\

ig%20Business%20Re%3A%20%5Bhypothyroidism%5D%20Re%3A%20Thy>

> aspenfairy1 <aspenfairy1>

>

>

> Tue Apr 7, 2009 7:18 pm (PDT)

>

> You and Steve are speaking from a conservative out of touch mentality

> compared to the parents and single parents out there that are

> struggling to

> survive in a economy that has not provided a living wage in decades

> that can

> not keep up with the rates of inflation. Our economy has been a 2 person

> wage earners for a long time. The majority of Americans and defiantly the

> lower income brackets of this society can not make it on a single salary.

> The cost of living is killing families in this country and if wasn't for

> welfare, WIC, and other social service programs they would be dead. They

> are not milking the system. They rely on the system now more than ever.

> Charities can not keep up with the demand, because people with money

> are not

> contributing their fair share to society and the number of poor people are

> rising due to the last 8 years of felony behavior on the part of greedy

> wall street felons. Food banks literally don't have enough food to go

> around and many of the smaller regional charities are going broke

> trying to

> keep up with the demand.

> If we did not have the government social services , poor people would be

> more screwed than they are. Not everyone can afford to get an

> education and

> not everyone has the means to get to a job that maybe 50 miles away from

> their home, because our public transportation system is broke. What about

> the desperately poor areas of this country , the inner cities slums, they

> are born into poverty and they will most likely die in poverty because

> there

> is not enough money out there to bring them out of poverty.

> You are going to tell them they can't or shouldn't accept governmental aid

> so they can feed their families?

> It is criminal that in a country as wealthy as ours, that we still have

> desperate poverty and homelessness.

>

> -- Re: Cows, Geopolitics, and Big Business Re: Re:

> Thy

>

> Hmmm, I thought he had a pretty good handle on it. With what part do

> you disagree?

>

>

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I've seen the current situation before in about 1984. The unemployment was

worse, and the companies were all jumping on the bandwagon laying off people

whether they needed to or not, just to drop their outlay. People were a whole

lot less savvy then, and the banks were paying decent interest rates so the

stocks weren't as scary. The administration can't afford to let the country

fall. Don't worry. It will all come together. Americans have a very short

attention span and all this doom and gloom is no fun to focus on.

Roni

<>Just because something

isn't seen doesn't mean it's

not there<>

From: <res075oh@...>

Subject: Re: Cows, Geopolitics, and Big Business Re: Re: Thy

hypothyroidism

Date: Wednesday, April 8, 2009, 9:28 PM

Once again:  It's not a matter of need.  It is a matter of owning what

you earn, whether it's a lot or not.

..

..

>       Posted by: " Roni Molin " matchermaam@...

>   

   <mailto:matchermaam@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20Cows%2C%20Geopolitics%2C%20a\

nd%20Big%20Business%20Re%3A%20%5Bhypothyroidism%5D%20Re%3A%20Thy>

>         matchermaam <matchermaam>

>

>

>         Tue Apr 7, 2009 5:06 pm (PDT)

>

> And the Republicans have contributed to the general welfare? How, by

> giving tax cuts to the wealthy that don't need them?

>

> Roni

------------------------------------

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I'm on your team . I don't believe in condos even though in my situation it

would be

nice. Maintenance taken care of and a lovely apartment. However the maintenance

fees are always too much, and keep going up, and there is no deduction for them.

The price of the condo, however, goes up slower than a house.

Roni

<>Just because something

isn't seen doesn't mean it's

not there<>

From: <res075oh@...>

Subject: Re: Cows, Geopolitics, and Big Business Re: Re: Thy

hypothyroidism

Date: Wednesday, April 8, 2009, 9:39 PM

Be very careful with condo's.  First, make sure the monthly fee

[whatever it's called] is sufficient to pay the maintenance and so on

that it must cover; AND that it does not raise your monthly outlay

beyond what you can reasonably spare.  Second:  Make sure that there are

not a lot of vacancies, which will equate to a lot of fees not collected

which translates to even higher fees for those remaining.  And make sure

that there are not a lot of delinquencies among those present.  Finally,

you probably might not want to buy where a large percentage of residents

are renters, or allowed to be renters; but that's a value judgment that

would not apply to all cases.  Look at the books and make sure the

required reserves are there.

Condo's are _very inexpensive_ locally now.

..

..

>

>       Posted by: " Roni Molin " matchermaam@...

>   

   <mailto:matchermaam@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20Cows%2C%20Geopolitics%2C%20a\

nd%20Big%20Business%20Re%3A%20%5Bhypothyroidism%5D%20Re%3A%20Thy>

>         matchermaam <matchermaam>

>

>

>         Tue Apr 7, 2009 5:09 pm (PDT)

>

> Where are you finding these houses for 20K and 40K? You can't even get

> a condo for those prices in the Seattle area.

>

> Roni

------------------------------------

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Nice work if you can get it. I'd love to be a snow bird.

Roni

<>Just because something

isn't seen doesn't mean it's

not there<>

From: <res075oh@...>

Subject: Re: Cows, Geopolitics, and Big Business Re: Re: Thy

hypothyroidism

Date: Wednesday, April 8, 2009, 9:55 PM

In the Tampa vicinity housing sales have turned around but prices are

still very low.  Repo's and short sales are available for less than 50%

of recent sales; often less than the appraised value of the lot alone. 

AFAIK there's not much available in good financing though.  We've been

trying to close on a short sale now for under 100k that sold for 200k a

couple of years ago; and in an upscale neighborhood where the typical

sales presently are still 50% higher than that.  But there are a couple

of 2nd/3rd mortgages that are complicating things so my wife is ready to

invite the bank to take a flying leap.

It would not be to flip, though.  It would be a rental for a time and

then a winter Florida home for us.  Our present home is much too large

for us, and she wants one in Ohio for the summer [her relatives live there].

..

..

>

>       Posted by: " " kennio@...

>   

   <mailto:kennio@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20Cows%2C%20Geopolitics%2C%20and%20\

Big%20Business%20Re%3A%20%5Bhypothyroidism%5D%20Re%3A%20Thy>

>         Kennio <Kennio>

>

>

>         Tue Apr 7, 2009 5:51 pm (PDT)

>

> NOW is not a good time to flip houses unless you are very experienced

> and/or doing a lot of them at once. I am not flipping house now I

> don't need the stress for such a small profit margin. Home prices here

> in Los Angeles dropped 2.5% a month for the last 12 months and we're

> still heading down. Pity the poor bastard that get suckered into any

> of these low interest rates and buys now.

------------------------------------

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Is that the best you can argue? I would never dream of calling you a name

just because I disagree with you.

Val

Posted by: " "

You want to approve hunting of illegals from helicopters don't you? Nutjob.

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If I recall right democrats took over a couple years after Bush's election.

Having a republican president doesn't give us a republican country. Duh

CW

Traveling? Know someone who is? Use my travelocity site www.travelfhtm

com/crystalwright

-- Re: Cows, Geopolitics, and Big Business Re: Re:

Thy

You've had things your way for 8 years. It bankrupted the country. Nows the

time to pay up or get out. Funny thing is that you're probably one of those

that is getting a tax break and Fox news has you raging with false info

anyway. Joe the plumber anyone?

On Apr 9, 2009, at 3:43 PM, " Valarie " <val@...> wrote:

Nancie, I think it is wonderful that you are a liberal. I admire how much

you care for people and animals. We need more people like you. IMHO, you

are free to give away anything that belongs to YOU; that is, the fruit of

your labors. You, however, are not free to confiscate the fruits of MY

labors to give to YOUR causes.

Val

Posted by: " Nancie Barnett "

<mailto:deifspirit@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20Cows%2C%20Geopolitics%2C%20and

%20Big%20Business%20Re%3A%20%5Bhypothyroidism%5D%20Re%3A%20Thy>

deifspirit@... <aspenfairy1> aspenfairy1

Yes, I am a liberal democrat and I am damn proud of it! I will never stop

caring about people who are in need and I will never stop advocating for

them or for the animals.

I am proud to say that I have worked with the Kennedy's and the 's and

the shrivers.

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See, you just gave a wonderful example of how the people who really need a bit

of help don't get it, and instead it's set up to keep people in the " system " .

I've been saying this

all along.

Roni

<>Just because something

isn't seen doesn't mean it's

not there<>

From: cindy.seeley <cindy.seeley@...>

Subject: Cows, Geopolitics, and Big Business Re: Re: Thy

hypothyroidism

Date: Thursday, April 9, 2009, 4:01 PM

My husband and I are prime examples of the falsehood of that!  We moved from

poverty level to middle class!  Two of our kids are well on their way to

upper-middle class, with no doubt in my mind that they'll rise above

that...unless of course, the 'share the wealth' liberals get their way...in

which case, they'll cut back the work they do and spend more of THEIR time,

doing other things, like spending more time with their kids, fishing, gardening,

vacationing...whatever!  And as a result, more people will lose their jobs,

because there just isn't any motivating factor involved in taking away what

edge.  It only took me 3 weeks (thanks to corporations holding back that first

paycheck) to figure out the break-over, when Uncle Sam stopped taking nearly

half my paycheck and began taking it all, and like all the others who'd gone

before me (lots of warnings from co-workers who'd already 'been there, done

that'), I cut back the number of hours I

worked...and as a result, I had more time with my family and doing the things

that I wanted to do, besides 'sell my life'...doing the things that were really

important to me.

Having also experienced 'poverty', I've had ample opportunity to hear the

conversations of the majority (absolutely not all, which is really sad, because

the ones who really do need the help get a bad rap because of the ones who

really are gaming the system) of welfare women, who were angry because they were

being required to participate in a program to help them go to college and find

jobs, while the government paid for everything.  Those who had children under

the age of 3 or were pregnant (both of which included me) were there

voluntarily.  For those whose children were 3 or over, it was mandatory.  Prior

to the social workers coming into the room, well over 80% of these women were

discussing that they were just going to get pregnant, making them exempt from

the program...comments like, 'this is B...S...', 'I'll show them', 'they aren't

going to take away my benefits', 'all we've got to do is just get pregnant

again, and besides, we'll get bigger

checks and more foodstamps', etc.

What was really sad about this whole thing was, prior to receiving the notice

regarding this meeting, I had gone through the whole routine...college entrance

exam (the testing facilitator pulled me aside and told me I was the first one

who had ever maxed that test!), acceptance application & letter of acceptance

and had scraped together all but the last $65 I needed to get started the coming

semester (including the sponsor support the college had also been able to

assemble on my behalf)...  At that meeting, the social workers had passed around

several clipboards for everyone to sign-in that they were there.  I was denied

that $65 assistance that would have gotten me started immediately, because my

name happened to be on the sheet that they placed on the bottom of the stack, so

I would be one of the last to participate.  While I, a willing participant,

already doing everything that I could to try to improve myself, and ready to go

was denied, they were

going through the process of forcing women, who didn't want to participate and

had every intention of disqualifying themselves, as soon as possible, from their

mandatory participation, instead.  When I asked how soon my name would be coming

up, they told me my name was about half-way down the last page so it would be at

least 2, if not 3 years, before I reached the top of the list.  Well, no thanks

to them, I did enter college, exactly a year and four months later, WITHOUT any

support from that government program.

> >

> >

> > From: Valarie <val@>

> > Subject: Re: Cows, Geopolitics, and Big Business Re: Re:

Thy

> > hypothyroidism

> > Date: Thursday, April 9, 2009, 8:56 AM

> >

> >

> > Really?  Revenues increased considerably.  What didn't work?

> >

> > Val

> >

> >

> > <hypothyroidism/message/46638;_ylc=X3oDMTJxbGY

> > yMTczBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzE0NTY2NARncnBzcElkAzE3MDkyNTEwODIEbXNnSWQDNDY

> > 2MzgEc2VjA2Rtc2cEc2xrA3Ztc2cEc3RpbWUDMTIzOTI2MDkxMw--> 

> >

> >

> > Posted by: " "

> >

> >

> > Yeah, right. We just tried the tax cuts for 8 years. IT DIDN'T WORK.

> >

> >

> >

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Guest guest

No, Bush began his administration in January of 2001. Democrats did not take

over

the majority till May 2007. His administration ended January 2009, so that is

only 20 months that they have been the majority under Bush, and Bush vetoed

legislation and/or issued signing statement with each bill passed.

 

 

http://democrats.senate.gov/journal/entry.cfm?id=275134

Roni

<>Just because something

isn't seen doesn't mean it's

not there<>

Nancie, I think it is wonderful that you are a liberal. I admire how much

you care for people and animals. We need more people like you. IMHO, you

are free to give away anything that belongs to YOU; that is, the fruit of

your labors. You, however, are not free to confiscate the fruits of MY

labors to give to YOUR causes.

Val

Posted by: " Nancie Barnett "

<mailto:deifspirit@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20Cows%2C%20Geopolitics%2C%20and

%20Big%20Business%20Re%3A%20%5Bhypothyroidism%5D%20Re%3A%20Thy>

deifspirit@... <aspenfairy1> aspenfairy1

Yes, I am a liberal democrat and I am damn proud of it! I will never stop

caring about people who are in need and I will never stop advocating for

them or for the animals.

I am proud to say that I have worked with the Kennedy's and the 's and

the shrivers.

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Guest guest

But the point I was trying to make was that this stupid system, which Bush ran

for 8 years, could have been giving people the little bit of help they needed to

get them over a rough spot, instead of forcing them to become destitute and then

keeping them in the system by their ridiculous rules and regulations. I do

believe the system needs reform, as to when and how much help someone gets. The

give to little too late, and that's how people stay in the system. Yes there are

people who abuse the system, but if they had been helped before they got " stuck "

in it, and before they spent a long time without working, I think the government

would have spent less, and the people would have done more. That's just my

opinion.

Roni

<>Just because something

isn't seen doesn't mean it's

not there<>

From: cindy.seeley <cindy.seeley@...>

Subject: Cows, Geopolitics, and Big Business Re: Re: Thy

hypothyroidism

Date: Thursday, April 9, 2009, 4:30 PM

I realize that--a couple posts back is when I actually decided that you and I

probably agree on more things than we disagree...  Shoot...quite frequently, my

husband and I don't even agree when it comes to politics...we've been known to

cancel each other's vote on more than one occasion... ;-)

> > >

> > >

> > > From: Valarie <val@>

> > > Subject: Re: Cows, Geopolitics, and Big Business Re: Re:

Thy

> > > hypothyroidism

> > > Date: Thursday, April 9, 2009, 8:56 AM

> > >

> > >

> > > Really?  Revenues increased considerably.  What didn't work?

> > >

> > > Val

> > >

> > >

> > >

<hypothyroidism/message/46638;_ylc=X3oDMTJxbGY

> > >

yMTczBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzE0NTY2NARncnBzcElkAzE3MDkyNTEwODIEbXNnSWQDNDY

> > > 2MzgEc2VjA2Rtc2cEc2xrA3Ztc2cEc3RpbWUDMTIzOTI2MDkxMw--> 

> > >

> > >

> > > Posted by: " "

> > >

> > >

> > > Yeah, right. We just tried the tax cuts for 8 years. IT DIDN'T WORK.

> > >

> > >

> > >

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Guest guest

Um yes he did. He paid everything that was required of him.

Plus, since he left his taxes to his CPA he didn't think he needed to check

them over since he trusted his tax advisor, obliviously a mistake, He did

not KNOW that he owed back taxes until the IRS notified him of such. Plus,

there is no statue of limitations for the IRS, they can go after as many

years as they want.

I wonder how many people on this list ever made a mistake on their taxes or

had their tax advisor made a mistake? Or how many people in your

neighborhood? Or how may in the last 8 years of that felonious

administration?

-- Cows, Geopolitics, and Big Business Re: Re: Thy

He also didn't pay the late fees and penalties any of the rest of us would

have had to pay!

>

> Nancie, Tax cheat Geitner paid back taxes for two years. He did not pay

all

> of them because the statute of limitations had run out on two other years.

> Cheat? He didn't admit a thing until he was caught.

>

> Val

>

> Posted by: " Nancie Barnett "

>

>

>

> At least he corrected it and admitted it.

>

>

>

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cindy

I made 100,000.00 dollars last year and I got 300.00 dollars. My friend made

50,000 and still only got 300.00 and my other friend made 40,000 and also

only got 300.00. The only people who got more were Married or joint filers.

-- Re: Cows, Geopolitics, and Big Business Re:

Re: Thy

> > hypothyroidism

> > Date: Thursday, April 9, 2009, 8:56 AM

> >

> >

> > Really? Revenues increased considerably. What didn't work?

> >

> > Val

> >

> >

> > <http://groups. / group/hypothyroi dism/message/ 46638;_ylc=

X3oDMTJxbGY

> > yMTczBF9TAzk3MzU5Nz E1BGdycElkAzE0NT Y2NARncnBzcElkAz E3MDkyNTEwODIEbX

NnSWQDNDY

> > 2MzgEc2VjA2Rtc2cEc2 xrA3Ztc2cEc3RpbW UDMTIzOTI2MDkxMw -->

> >

> >

> > Posted by: " "

> >

> >

> > Yeah, right. We just tried the tax cuts for 8 years. IT DIDN'T WORK.

> >

> >

> >

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If politicians weren't so invested in getting reelected, and paying back favors

for helping them accomplish that, then maybe they might actually be able to

serve the people, which is what they get elected to do in the first place.

Roni

<>Just because something

isn't seen doesn't mean it's

not there<>

From: cindy.seeley <cindy.seeley@...>

Subject: Cows, Geopolitics, and Big Business Re: Re: Thy

hypothyroidism

Date: Thursday, April 9, 2009, 6:09 PM

Unfortunately, many 'policies' during the Bush administration, were carry-over

from the prior administration...just like much of what the current

administration is committing us to for the next 10 years at a minimum, although

Obama only has the potential to be president for 8 of those 10 years, so whoever

follows, regardless of political affiliation, is going to be stuck with those

policies, regardless of whether they are good or bad, for at least the first 2

years of his/her administration.

And before comes running in with the Kool-aid, calling me a 'Bush' lover, I

was every bit as critical of that administration as I am of the current one!  I

just happened to have been born into a period in American history where I've had

to vote for the lesser of the evils for several elections in a row now!

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > From: Valarie <val@>

> > > > Subject: Re: Cows, Geopolitics, and Big Business Re:

Re: Thy

> > > > hypothyroidism

> > > > Date: Thursday, April 9, 2009, 8:56 AM

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Really?  Revenues increased considerably.  What didn't work?

> > > >

> > > > Val

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

<hypothyroidism/message/46638;_ylc=X3oDMTJxbGY

> > > >

yMTczBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzE0NTY2NARncnBzcElkAzE3MDkyNTEwODIEbXNnSWQDNDY

> > > > 2MzgEc2VjA2Rtc2cEc2xrA3Ztc2cEc3RpbWUDMTIzOTI2MDkxMw--> 

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Posted by: " "

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Yeah, right. We just tried the tax cuts for 8 years. IT DIDN'T WORK.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

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