Re: Re: Fw: [thyroidless] Dr Jefferies - Safe Uses of Cortisol

[Guest guest]

Strange that cortisol is used to get the T3 into the cells and yet high cortisol

suppresses natural T4 to T3 conversion. Go figure.

________________________________

From: cindy.seeley <cindy.seeley@...>

hypothyroidism

Sent: Sunday, March 22, 2009 6:26:08 PM

Subject: Re: Fw: [thyroidless] Dr Jefferies - Safe Uses

of Cortisol

Hi Roni!

This article is discussing side-effects of pharmacological doses. The book

Darla is referring to by Dr. Jefferies is discussing cortisol (hydrocortisone)

in physiological dosages...very, very different. The physiological doses are

only recommended after saliva testing that determines that there is even a need.

Without saliva testing, it would be unadvisable and possibly even dangerous...

for example, my blood serum cortisol test showed that in the afternoon, my

cortisol levels are double the upper limit. I am hoping that since T3 uses

cortisol to get to the cells that my increased Armour dosage will get my

cortisol levels down to where they should be. This seems to be happening since

my temps are no longer shooting up in the afternoons, but I haven't confirmed

this with lab tests yet.

> http://www.vitamins -supplements. org/hormones/ cortisol. php

>

>

> Roni

> <>Just because something

> isn't seen doesn't mean it's

> not there<>

>

>

>

>

> From: Gracia <circe@...>

> Subject: Fw: [thyroidless] Dr Jefferies - Safe Uses

of Cortisol

> hypothyroidism

> Date: Sunday, March 22, 2009, 9:28 AM

>

>

>

>

>

> Ok, opened my new book and I haven't even gotten through the

> acknowledgments and have already found a couple of interesting things.

>

> 1) Dr Jefferies calls Cortisol the most promising therapeutic agents

> of all time.

>

> 2) Cortisol has helped patients with crippling rheumatoid arthritis,

> lupus, scleroderma, bronchial asthma, hay fever, eczema, and some

> types of leukemia. There is even convincing evidence that it can

> improve resistance to the common cold and influenza.

>

> But the thing that I thought was important when talking to some docs

> that think this is outdated information. (I have heard some say this)

>

> 3)The 3rd eddition was written in 2004. So ppbbbffff to those doctors.

>

> More to come.

>

> Darla :-)

>

>

>

>

>

>

> ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -

>

>

>

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8:59 AM

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

blood testing for cortisol is inaccurate. I did blood, saliva and 24 hr

urine and got 3 completely different values---normal, high and low.

Gracia

Hi Roni!

This article is discussing side-effects of pharmacological doses. The book

Darla is referring to by Dr. Jefferies is discussing cortisol (hydrocortisone)

in physiological dosages...very, very different. The physiological doses are

only recommended after saliva testing that determines that there is even a need.

Without saliva testing, it would be unadvisable and possibly even

dangerous...for example, my blood serum cortisol test showed that in the

afternoon, my cortisol levels are double the upper limit. I am hoping that since

T3 uses cortisol to get to the cells that my increased Armour dosage will get my

cortisol levels down to where they should be. This seems to be happening since

my temps are no longer shooting up in the afternoons, but I haven't confirmed

this with lab tests yet.

> http://www.vitamins-supplements.org/hormones/cortisol.php

>

>

>

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17:51:00

[Guest guest]

When you got three different values on three different tests, what made you

decide

which one was accurate?

Roni

<>Just because something

isn't seen doesn't mean it's

not there<>

From: Gracia <circe@...>

Subject: Re: Re: Fw: [thyroidless] Dr Jefferies - Safe

Uses of Cortisol

hypothyroidism

Date: Sunday, March 22, 2009, 7:37 PM

  blood testing for cortisol is inaccurate.  I did  blood, saliva and 24 hr

urine and got 3 completely different values---normal, high and low.   

  Gracia

  Hi Roni!

  This article is discussing side-effects of pharmacological doses. The book

Darla is referring to by Dr. Jefferies is discussing cortisol (hydrocortisone)

in physiological dosages...very, very different. The physiological doses are

only recommended after saliva testing that determines that there is even a need.

Without saliva testing, it would be unadvisable and possibly even

dangerous...for example, my blood serum cortisol test showed that in the

afternoon, my cortisol levels are double the upper limit. I am hoping that since

T3 uses cortisol to get to the cells that my increased Armour dosage will get my

cortisol levels down to where they should be. This seems to be happening since

my temps are no longer shooting up in the afternoons, but I haven't confirmed

this with lab tests yet.

 

  > http://www.vitamins-supplements.org/hormones/cortisol.php

  >

  >

  >

 

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17:51:00

[Guest guest]

Actually, my thyroid MD who is trained in natural medicine, Prudence Hall,

says the most accurate is the 24 hour urine test, Not the salvia test,

because there are proteins in your salvia that bind with the cortisol thus

making the test inaccurate.

-- Re: Fw: [thyroidless] Dr Jefferies - Safe

Uses of Cortisol

Actually Gracia, blood testing for cortisol is not the best method, not

because it is inaccurate, in and of itself. The inaccuracy comes to bear

when the timing is disregarded. Mine, however, was not. It was based on

expected ranges at 3:00 pm draw and drawn at 3:00 pm. Also, the results

matched the symptoms I was experiencing. Blood serum testing for cortisol

only provides a 'snapshot' of the moment, whereas saliva (the most accurate)

provides multiple snapshots throughout the entire cycle. The 24 hour urine

test averages the entire cycle, therefore a person can be low in the morning

and high in the afternoon, but end up appearing to be normal as the low/high

effects cancel each other out. As I think I mentioned before, one should NOT

supplement cortisol without first having a complete saliva panel done,

because without this, one would not know how much, nor when throughout the

day, they needed to supplement.

>

>

> blood testing for cortisol is inaccurate. I did blood, saliva and 24 hr

urine and got 3 completely different values---normal, high and low.

> Gracia

[Guest guest]

I think cortisol is what the body makes and cortisone is what they give you.

They're pretty much the same thing though.

Roni

<>Just because something

isn't seen doesn't mean it's

not there<>

From: <res075oh@...>

Subject: Re: Fw: [thyroidless] Dr Jefferies - Safe Uses

of Cortisol

hypothyroidism

Date: Monday, March 23, 2009, 2:00 PM

Where is the cortisol in the body that the body reacts to?  Personally I

would suspect in the cells, and it gets to the cells from the blood.

Cortisol in the urine is what the body is dumping.  I don't know exactly

to what cortisol in saliva relates to.

I don't think you can get a measurement of cortisol in cells with the

normal means but there's lots I don't know.

Lastly, is the correct term cortisol or cortisone???

..

..

>

>       Posted by: " Gracia " circe@...

>   

   <mailto:circe@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20Fw%3A%20%5Bthyroidless%5D%20Dr\

%20%20Jefferies%20-%20Safe%20Uses%20of%20Cortisol>

>         graciabee <graciabee>

>

>

>         Sun Mar 22, 2009 7:38 pm (PDT)

>

>

> blood testing for cortisol is inaccurate. I did blood, saliva and 24

> hr urine and got 3 completely different values---normal, high and low.

> Gracia

>

> Hi Roni!

> This article is discussing side-effects of pharmacological doses. The

> book Darla is referring to by Dr. Jefferies is discussing cortisol

> (hydrocortisone) in physiological dosages...very, very different. The

> physiological doses are only recommended after saliva testing that

> determines that there is even a need. Without saliva testing, it would

> be unadvisable and possibly even dangerous...

> for example, my blood serum cortisol test showed that in the

> afternoon, my cortisol levels are double the upper limit. I am hoping

> that since T3 uses cortisol to get to the cells that my increased

> Armour dosage will get my cortisol levels down to where they should

> be. This seems to be happening since my temps are no longer shooting

> up in the afternoons, but I haven't confirmed this with lab tests yet.

>

------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

You can take phosphaditylserine to lower cortisol.

On Mar 23, 2009, at 8:23 AM, " cindy.seeley " <cindy.seeley@...> wrote:

, you may just have hit on something that I've been trying to process and

decide what my next step should be...I think I'll just take a wait and see

attitude for the time being, now! Thanks... I was not aware that high cortisol

also suppresses natural T4 to T3 conversion.

>

> Strange that cortisol is used to get the T3 into the cells and yet high

cortisol suppresses natural T4 to T3 conversion. Go figure.

[Guest guest]

I question the " high cortisol " theory. if you give your body what it needs,

everything settles down.

Gracia

, you may just have hit on something that I've been trying to process and

decide what my next step should be...I think I'll just take a wait and see

attitude for the time being, now! Thanks... I was not aware that high cortisol

also suppresses natural T4 to T3 conversion.

>

> Strange that cortisol is used to get the T3 into the cells and yet high

cortisol suppresses natural T4 to T3 conversion. Go figure.

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18:51:00

[Guest guest]

?? I have never heard this. I don't have weight gain on cortisol. this is

the mythology of cortisol I guess.

Gracia

Yes, but even people with totally destroyed/absent adrenals have side effects

from small replacement doses of cortisol: e.g. weight gain.

Marla

>

> Hi Roni!

> This article is discussing side-effects of pharmacological doses. The book

Darla is referring to by Dr. Jefferies is discussing cortisol (hydrocortisone)

in physiological dosages...very, very different. The physiological doses are

only recommended after saliva testing that determines that there is even a need.

Without

> >

>

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18:51:00

[Guest guest]

I have never heard of a test which tells you how much and when to supplement

cortef. all the peeps I know go by symptoms and use Jefferies as their guide.

cortef 2.5/5/7.5mg 4X a day.

Gracia

Actually Gracia, blood testing for cortisol is not the best method, not

because it is inaccurate, in and of itself. The inaccuracy comes to bear when

the timing is disregarded. Mine, however, was not. It was based on expected

ranges at 3:00 pm draw and drawn at 3:00 pm. Also, the results matched the

symptoms I was experiencing. Blood serum testing for cortisol only provides a

'snapshot' of the moment, whereas saliva (the most accurate), provides multiple

snapshots throughout the entire cycle. The 24 hour urine test averages the

entire cycle, therefore a person can be low in the morning and high in the

afternoon, but end up appearing to be normal as the low/high effects cancel each

other out. As I think I mentioned before, one should NOT supplement cortisol

without first having a complete saliva panel done, because without this, one

would not know how much, nor when throughout the day, they needed to supplement.

>

>

> blood testing for cortisol is inaccurate. I did blood, saliva and 24 hr

urine and got 3 completely different values---normal, high and low.

> Gracia

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[Guest guest]

Roni

<>Just because something

isn't seen doesn't mean it's

not there<>

From: Gracia <circe@...>

Subject: Re: Re: Fw: [thyroidless] Dr Jefferies - Safe

Uses of Cortisol

hypothyroidism

Date: Monday, March 23, 2009, 3:47 PM

??  I have never heard this.   I don't have weight gain on cortisol.   this is

the mythology of cortisol I guess.

Gracia

  Yes, but even people with totally destroyed/absent adrenals have side effects

from small replacement doses of cortisol: e.g. weight gain.

  Marla

 

  >

  > Hi Roni!

  > This article is discussing side-effects of pharmacological doses. The book

Darla is referring to by Dr. Jefferies is discussing cortisol (hydrocortisone)

in physiological dosages...very, very different. The physiological doses are

only recommended after saliva testing that determines that there is even a need.

Without

  > >

  >

 

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18:51:00

[Guest guest]

Well, I didn't go by symptoms when I supplemented cortisol, but by my

lab work. I cannot tell at all if I'm taking cortisol or not by any

signs or symptoms. If I miss a dose, I don't notice. If I take extra

for any reason, I don't notice any difference.

Most of the people on the NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS don't own a

copy of Jefferies. I do own a copy but haven't read it yet so it's

definitely not my guide.

Based on saliva tests, I stated on Cortisol and ramped up to 45 mg along

with T3. I keep having to reduce my T3 since it appears my rt3 is being

flushed out, I've cut back from 110 mcg/day of T3 all the way back to 0

two days ago. I also think I need to cut back on my cortisol so I'm

ramping down from a current 35 mg/day over the next 8 weeks down to 0.

I'm adrenals are likely in good shape now.

I'm of the opinion that my rt3 problem is resolved, I might not need T3

or any thyroid med of any kind if I only use a little support like

L-tyrosine and/or coconut oil daily.

Since T3 did lower my cholesterol, I'll be checking that in a week or so

to see where it stands with RT3 out of the way.

I also am of the opinion that cortisol blood, 24 hour urin, and saliva

all have the potential to be accurate within the realm of their

posibilities. Blood ranges need to based on time of blood draw. Right

now that's not true. The lows of the afternoon and highs of the morning

are used for the high/low range which means if your low but get blood

work drawn at 8:00 AM, your low status will not show up because it will

be compared to the normal low of the afternoon. If you cortisol is high

and you get your blood drawn in the afternoon, it will be compared with

the high of the morning which is much higher than the afternoon and you

will be considered normal.

So, if you are having a blood cortisol done AND you think you will be

high, go right when the lab opens since that will be highest reading for

the day with respect to the lab's hours. If you think you will be low,

go just before the lab closes since that will be your lowest point with

respect to the lab's hours.

24 hour urine testing most likely will not show people who are too high

or too low for some parts of the day. In other words, it a coarser test

than a multiple test saliva test and will get only people who are low or

high for most or all of the day.

Saliva testing 4 samples is more likely to give a useful result, but

took two sets of 4 samples for two different labs on the very same day

with samples within minutes of each other and got 4 readings that were

all low at one lab and only 2 readings that were low at the other with 2

readings normal. Go figure.

Blood work with ranges set for the time of blood draw have the potential

to be the most accurate but so far, those ranges are still broad enough

to encompasses the entire day. There is an AM/PM cortisol draw but

again, those ranges are still to wide. When one goes in to be tested

can have to much of an impact on the outcome.

Steve

Gracia wrote:

> I have never heard of a test which tells you how much and when to supplement

cortef. all the peeps I know go by symptoms and use Jefferies as their guide.

cortef 2.5/5/7.5mg 4X a day.

> Gracia

>

> Actually Gracia, blood testing for cortisol is not the best method, not

because it is inaccurate, in and of itself. The inaccuracy comes to bear when

the timing is disregarded. Mine, however, was not. It was based on expected

ranges at 3:00 pm draw and drawn at 3:00 pm. Also, the results matched the

symptoms I was experiencing. Blood serum testing for cortisol only provides a

'snapshot' of the moment, whereas saliva (the most accurate), provides multiple

snapshots throughout the entire cycle. The 24 hour urine test averages the

entire cycle, therefore a person can be low in the morning and high in the

afternoon, but end up appearing to be normal as the low/high effects cancel each

other out. As I think I mentioned before, one should NOT supplement cortisol

without first having a complete saliva panel done, because without this, one

would not know how much, nor when throughout the day, they needed to supplement.

>

>

>

> >

> >

> > blood testing for cortisol is inaccurate. I did blood, saliva and 24 hr

urine and got 3 completely different values---normal, high and low.

> > Gracia

--

Steve - dudescholar4@...

Take World's Smallest Political Quiz at

http://www.theadvocates.org/quiz.html

" If a thousand old beliefs were ruined on our march

to truth we must still march on. " --Stopford

[Guest guest]

Nancie,  24-hour urine doesn't give the 4 diurnal snapshots to show

levels and rhythm at particular points in the day, as done

by saliva testing. Cortisol has a diurnal rhythm which is missed

in 24 hr collections. 

From: Nancie Barnett <deifspirit@...>

Subject: Re: Re: Fw: [thyroidless] Dr Jefferies - Safe

Uses of Cortisol

hypothyroidism

Cc: HypothyroidManagement

Date: Monday, March 23, 2009, 2:12 PM

Actually, my thyroid MD who is trained in natural medicine, Prudence Hall,

says the most accurate is the 24 hour urine test, Not the salvia test,

because there are proteins in your salvia that bind with the cortisol thus

making the test inaccurate.

[Guest guest]

Not according to my physician whose speciality is Natural medicine. I think

she knows her stuff and I defer to her. The point is that the salvia has

proteins in it and those proteins bind to the cortisol which interferes with

the results. Ergo you are getting skewed results.

-- Re: Re: Fw: [thyroidless] Dr Jefferies -

Safe Uses of Cortisol

hypothyroidism

Cc: HypothyroidManagement

Date: Monday, March 23, 2009, 2:12 PM

Actually, my thyroid MD who is trained in natural medicine, Prudence Hall,

says the most accurate is the 24 hour urine test, Not the salvia test,

because there are proteins in your salvia that bind with the cortisol thus

making the test inaccurate.

[Guest guest]

the key to getting well starts with iodine which is a very big deal. find a

doc who understands how to use iodine and how to use hormones and which tests

are actually accurate.

Gracia

This has also been my observations from reading on the adrenal support boards,

where they discuss physiologic dosing of cortisol. I've also observed that many

who have this result have identified additional deficiencies as well, that when

corrected, resulted in their ability to finally start losing the extra weight.

>

> Yes, but even people with totally destroyed/absent adrenals have side

effects from small replacement doses of cortisol: e.g. weight gain.

> Marla

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09:19:00

[Guest guest]

Hi venizia-

I am not sure. It depends if the PCP believes in natural medicine. The lab

that it was sent to, was not a local lab. It was I believe in Washington

state. Prudence hall told me that not too many local labs do this kind of

testing and that is why she send it out of state.

I posted the name a while back on the list, so I will have to try and find

that email. I don't have any of the paperwork anymore. But, I am due to go

in to recheck my labs for the new year. I could find out then.

There is a book called " From Fatigued to Fantastic " by Teitelbaum, MD

that talks about

Fibro and chronic fatigue. I recommend that either your sister get it or

both of you get it. I have the book because I too have fibro and chronic

fatigue and lupus.

Here is the direct link at amazon.com

http://www.amazon

com/Fatigued-Fantastic--Teitelbaum/dp/1583332898/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8

s=books & qid=1238009353 & sr=8-1

hugs,

nancie

-- Re: Fw: [thyroidless] Dr Jefferies - Safe

Uses of Cortisol

Nancie,

Will primary care doctors do the 24 hr urine? Or do they feel the same way

about it as the saliva test? I have a sister that has ALL the symptoms of

adrenal fatigue and cannot get her doctor to take her seriously. I am so

frustrated with her because she will not even try to find a doctor that will

listen to her. She even agrees that she probably has adrenal fatigue. She

looks like death warmed over. She is not sleeping at night. She says she

struggles to stay awake until around 11pm so maybe she will sleep during the

night but will then wake at 3:00am EVERY night. I do not know what to do to

convince her she needs to look into this further. I am really concerned for

her. She is also one who suffers from hypoT and fibromyalgia.

Venizia

..

[Guest guest]

Where is Prudence Hall located? You say she is an MD and a holistic doctor?

Roni

<>Just because something

isn't seen doesn't mean it's

not there<>

From: venizia1948 <nelsonck@...>

Subject: Re: Fw: [thyroidless] Dr Jefferies - Safe Uses

of Cortisol

hypothyroidism

Date: Wednesday, March 25, 2009, 1:40 PM

Thanks Nancie.

Venizia

>

> Hi venizia-

> I am not sure. It depends if the PCP believes in natural medicine. The lab

> that it was sent to, was not a local lab. It was I believe in Washington

> state. Prudence hall told me that not too many local labs do this kind of

> testing and that is why she send it out of state.

> I posted the name a while back on the list, so I will have to try and find

> that email. I don't have any of the paperwork anymore. But, I am due to go

> in to recheck my labs for the new year. I could find out then.

> There is a book called " From Fatigued to Fantastic " by Teitelbaum, MD

> that talks about

> Fibro and chronic fatigue.  I recommend that either your sister get it or

> both of you get it. I have the book because I too have fibro and chronic

> fatigue and lupus.

> Here is the direct link at amazon.com

> http://www.amazon

> com/Fatigued-Fantastic--Teitelbaum/dp/1583332898/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8

> s=books & qid=1238009353 & sr=8-1

> 

> hugs,

> nancie

> -------Original Message-------

>

------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

But, it doesn't. Prudence used to use the salvia cortisol tests and the 24

hour urine tests, but she found that the salvia test results were not

accurate and so she researched it and found out why; that the salvia has

proteins in it that bind to the cortisol. This causes the cortisol to be

unavailable to the lab regents which makes the results skewed. Now all she

uses is the 24 hour urine tests.

-- Re: Fw: [thyroidless] Dr Jefferies - Safe

Uses of Cortisol

I don't know about medical science, but coming from an applied science

(electronics/electrical) background, when there is a skew involved, that is

taken into account in the calculations...science being what it is, I would

think this would apply to medical science as well.

>

> Actually, my thyroid MD who is trained in natural medicine, Prudence Hall,

> says the most accurate is the 24 hour urine test, Not the salvia test,

> because there are proteins in your salvia that bind with the cortisol thus

> making the test inaccurate.

[Guest guest]

She is located in Santa , Ca.

http://www.thehallcenter.com

She is a MD who specializes in natural medicine.

-- Re: Fw: [thyroidless] Dr Jefferies - Safe

Uses of Cortisol

hypothyroidism

Date: Wednesday, March 25, 2009, 1:40 PM

Thanks Nancie.

Venizia

>

> Hi venizia-

> I am not sure. It depends if the PCP believes in natural medicine. The lab

> that it was sent to, was not a local lab. It was I believe in Washington

> state. Prudence hall told me that not too many local labs do this kind of

> testing and that is why she send it out of state.

> I posted the name a while back on the list, so I will have to try and find

> that email. I don't have any of the paperwork anymore. But, I am due to go

> in to recheck my labs for the new year. I could find out then.

> There is a book called " From Fatigued to Fantastic " by Teitelbaum,

MD

> that talks about

> Fibro and chronic fatigue. I recommend that either your sister get it or

> both of you get it. I have the book because I too have fibro and chronic

> fatigue and lupus.

> Here is the direct link at amazon.com

> http://www.amazon

>

com/Fatigued-Fantastic--Teitelbaum/dp/1583332898/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8

> s=books & qid=1238009353 & sr=8-1

>

> hugs,

> nancie

> -------Original Message-------

>

------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

The best test for Cortisol is saliva done 4X in a day, that has been proven

over and over again.

Mia

_____

From: hypothyroidism

[mailto:hypothyroidism ] On Behalf Of Nancie

Barnett

Sent: Tuesday, March 24, 2009 1:11 AM

hypothyroidism

Subject: Re: Re: Fw: [thyroidless] Dr Jefferies -

Safe Uses of Cortisol

Not according to my physician whose speciality is Natural medicine. I think

she knows her stuff and I defer to her. The point is that the salvia has

proteins in it and those proteins bind to the cortisol which interferes

with

the results. Ergo you are getting skewed results.

[Guest guest]

Nope, not true, I was on 40mg of cortisol and lost a lot of weight! Now I

take 20mg and am still losing weight and I have NO side effects whatsoever

on cortisol, except I can breath now and I don't have to take asthma and

allergy medicines anymore!! Woo-Hoo - now that is a great side effect!!

Mia

Yes, but even people with totally destroyed/absent adrenals have side

effects from small replacement doses of cortisol: e.g. weight gain.

Marla

[Guest guest]

A 24 hour urine test is good if you are trying to determine total cortisol,

but most of us have other issues, like now cortisol in the morning, but

HIGH cortisol at night, which keeps us up late at night, so that is why the

saliva is much more accurate. I did both on me and I am SO glad that I did,

I found out that my evening cortisol was very high and that explained a lot

for me.

Mia

_____

From: hypothyroidism

[mailto:hypothyroidism ] On Behalf Of Nancie

Barnett

Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2009 9:09 PM

hypothyroidism

Subject: Re: Re: Fw: [thyroidless] Dr Jefferies -

Safe Uses of Cortisol

But, it doesn't. Prudence used to use the salvia cortisol tests and the 24

hour urine tests, but she found that the salvia test results were not

accurate and so she researched it and found out why; that the salvia has

proteins in it that bind to the cortisol. This causes the cortisol to be

unavailable to the lab regents which makes the results skewed. Now all she

uses is the 24 hour urine tests.

[Guest guest]

How did you correct your evening-high cortisol?

From: Mia Harrod <miaharrod@...>

Subject: RE: Re: Fw: [thyroidless] Dr Jefferies - Safe

Uses of Cortisol

hypothyroidism

Date: Wednesday, March 25, 2009, 7:20 PM

A 24 hour urine test is good if you are trying to determine total cortisol,

but most of us have other issues, like now cortisol in the morning, but

HIGH cortisol at night, which keeps us up late at night, so that is why the

saliva is much more accurate. I did both on me and I am SO glad that I did,

I found out that my evening cortisol was very high and that explained a lot

for me.

Mia

_____

From: hypothyroidism

[mailto:hypothyroidism ] On Behalf Of Nancie

Barnett

Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2009 9:09 PM

hypothyroidism

Subject: Re: Re: Fw: [thyroidless] Dr Jefferies -

Safe Uses of Cortisol

But, it doesn't. Prudence used to use the salvia cortisol tests and the 24

hour urine tests, but she found that the salvia test results were not

accurate and so she researched it and found out why; that the salvia has

proteins in it that bind to the cortisol. This causes the cortisol to be

unavailable to the lab regents which makes the results skewed. Now all she

uses is the 24 hour urine tests.

[Guest guest]

That is not correct. I have the results and they broken down to 8 hour

segments. One for the AM, the afternoon and the evening.

I also once again defer to my physician who is a MD Trained in Natural

Medicine and she knows what she is talking about....

-- Re: Re: Fw: [thyroidless] Dr Jefferies -

Safe Uses of Cortisol

But, it doesn't. Prudence used to use the salvia cortisol tests and the 24

hour urine tests, but she found that the salvia test results were not

accurate and so she researched it and found out why; that the salvia has

proteins in it that bind to the cortisol. This causes the cortisol to be

unavailable to the lab regents which makes the results skewed. Now all she

uses is the 24 hour urine tests.

[Guest guest]

I guess we will have to agree to disagree. I defer to my physician who is a

MD trained in natural medicine. She knows her stuff.

-- Re: Re: Fw: [thyroidless] Dr Jefferies -

Safe Uses of Cortisol

Not according to my physician whose speciality is Natural medicine. I think

she knows her stuff and I defer to her. The point is that the salvia has

proteins in it and those proteins bind to the cortisol which interferes

with

the results. Ergo you are getting skewed results.

[Guest guest]

I was a very active lucid dreamer too. Its been quite a while though.

________________________________

From: <res075oh@...>

hypothyroidism

Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2009 10:10:28 PM

Subject: Re: Fw: [thyroidless] Dr Jefferies - Safe Uses

of Cortisol

Research at sleep labs show that while some people claim to never dream

if they are awakened at various times and immediately questions there is

basically _always_ some kind of dreams or mentation going on. What

actually happens is that in those who don't remember dreams the

conversion from short term to long term memory does not occur, so the

dreams are forgotten.

The fact is you are probably _never_ actually unconscious when you

sleep. What happens is that when you go to sleep you transition from a

subjective mental state that is created from data input from the

objective universe to a subjective mental state in which the input is

created within the brain. Although external stimuli may be included.

Since the critical faculty tends to be disabled at such times our dreams

can be totally bizarre, while the brain does the best it can to make

some kind of " story " to fit the often disjointed and chaotic input.

I have personally done a lot of experimenting with lucid dreams and the

hypnogogic state and have used the latter to go directly from the awake

state to the asleep/dreaming state with no loss of consciousness or of

my train of thought many dozens or hundreds of times. Unfortunately I

can no longer do so.

I would suspect that in your case something has happened that

facilitates the conversion of short term memory to long term memory, so

you now remember your dreams.

..

..

>

> Posted by: " cindy.seeley " cindy.seeley@ gmail.com

> <mailto:cindy.seeley@ gmail.com?Subject=%20Re% 3A%20Fw%3A%

20%5Bthyroidless %5D%20Dr% 20% 20Jefferies% 20-%20Safe% 20Uses%20of%

20Cortisol>

> cindy.seeley <http://profiles. / cindy.seeley>

>

>

> Wed Mar 25, 2009 5:54 am (PDT)

>

> Some of these people on the adrenal board do supplement iodine as part

> of their regimen, and do find that it is helping them. My husband and

> I have started iodine as well (with my doctor's approval), but so far,

> I haven't noticed any improvement in either of us. If anything, I am

> tireder after taking it. I fall asleep within a couple hours after I

> take it if I don't stay on my feet and keep moving, which my back

> won't take. I had hoped that the iodine supplementation would

> eventually allow me to reduce my thyroid meds, but so far, it's not

> looking like that is going to happen...then again, they say sleep is

> when our bodies do the most healing, so maybe I just need to go with

> the flow and sleep a lot allowing my body to heal all it needs to.

> After years of no dreams, since the increase in thyroid meds, I

> finally started dreaming again. In the last 24 hours, I dreamed a lot!

> I didn't start supplementing the iodine until I had worked my way up

> on the Armour, so we're in our 2nd month...so far, with no detox

> symptoms either, but I also started us with support supplements at the

> same time.

>